A commonsense solution to the Redskins team name controversy
August 24th, 2014 at 1:43:19 AM
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This occurred to me the other day in a blinding flash of insight.
The Redskins can keep their team name. All they have to do is change their mascot to: a potato.
The Washington Redskin Potatoes. We will mash you!
The Redskins can keep their team name. All they have to do is change their mascot to: a potato.
The Washington Redskin Potatoes. We will mash you!
August 24th, 2014 at 2:02:13 AM
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I've been thinking the same thing for weeks. Nothing wrong with potatoes but it could get messy. Next thing they know some potatoe company sues them maybe for damaging their tater business or something stupid.
I am a robot.
August 24th, 2014 at 2:15:26 AM
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There is no name controversy.
The name is the Washington Redskins.
There are no doubts that that is what the name is.
There are only some nutcases who want to go around telling other people what there names should be. And what history books should read.
I really don't see how Redskins is offensive to Injuns.
I think there should be greater concern for the term "Washington" which could get linked with the other "Washington" and that would be offensive to all Americans.
The name is the Washington Redskins.
There are no doubts that that is what the name is.
There are only some nutcases who want to go around telling other people what there names should be. And what history books should read.
I really don't see how Redskins is offensive to Injuns.
I think there should be greater concern for the term "Washington" which could get linked with the other "Washington" and that would be offensive to all Americans.
August 24th, 2014 at 2:33:05 AM
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Quote: FleaStiffThere is no name controversy.
The name is the Washington Redskins.
There are no doubts that that is what the name is.
There are only some nutcases who want to go around telling other people what there names should be. And what history books should read.
I really don't see how Redskins is offensive to Injuns.
I think there should be greater concern for the term "Washington" which could get linked with the other "Washington" and that would be offensive to all Americans.
Relax, dude, this was tongue-in-cheek.
What "there" names should be??? Also...I didn't know history books could read...
August 24th, 2014 at 8:28:58 AM
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Quote: FleaStiffI really don't see how Redskins is offensive to Injuns.
Well said, paleface.
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August 24th, 2014 at 11:43:54 AM
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LOL, you've no idea how pale! And living in Florida, that is really bad. Whereas you, with your New Amsterdam weather, at least have an excuse.Quote: DJTeddyBearWell said, paleface.
We use alot of terms but its very shallow. Even with all the violence, many White women had no desire to be "released" or to rejoin white society since they were treated better by Indians than by white men and white laws. Some Indian tribes required courtship for each of the four seasons before there could be a marriage. Many Indian tribes lived fairly peaceably such as by hunting and fishing. Most of the early settlers adopted Indian values and Indian ways. And I don't even know if Indians actually ever said Palefaces or not. So much comes to us via Hollywood and that is a detour that detracts from the truth.
August 24th, 2014 at 12:20:50 PM
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Or its kind of like abused women. She thought they would change.Quote: FleaStiff
We use alot of terms but its very shallow. Even with all the violence, many White women had no desire to be "released" or to rejoin white society .
or they might have all been fatties.
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
August 24th, 2014 at 1:42:32 PM
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Quote: FleaStiffThere is no name controversy.
The name is the Washington Redskins.
There are no doubts that that is what the name is.
There are only some nutcases who want to go around telling other people what there names should be. And what history books should read.
I really don't see how Redskins is offensive to Injuns.
I think there should be greater concern for the term "Washington" which could get linked with the other "Washington" and that would be offensive to all Americans.
So you think an expansion team could be named the Black Skins? How about if the league goes international? The Japan Slanty Eyes sound good to you?
Just because something has been a certain way for a period of time doesn't mean it right for current standards. Is slavery still ok?
I know, Cardinals might be offended by that name. Or Cowboys could be offended by the Dallas name. But if you live in reality, they aren't. History and tradition mean nothing. If the Washington franchise was offered enough money, the best stadium and a big enough tv deal to move to another location, they would. Tradition is only in affect when it's on the side of who using it.
ZCore13
I am an employee of a Casino. Former Table Games Director,, current Pit Supervisor. All the personal opinions I post are my own and do not represent the opinions of the Casino or Tribe that I work for.
August 24th, 2014 at 2:35:48 PM
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They were 3-13 and managed to finish dead last in the entire NFC. If they changed their name to DrawingDead I'd be offended. If they adopted a potato theme with a hash brown mascot named Herb, I think the State of Idaho should sue them.
Suck dope, watch TV, make up stuff, be somebody on the internet.
August 24th, 2014 at 2:38:41 PM
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" A racially offensive epithet used towards Native Americans. " = Injun
I really don't see how Redskins is offensive to Injuns. = Two insults for the price of one !
I really don't see how Redskins is offensive to Injuns. = Two insults for the price of one !
Shed not for her
the bitter tear
Nor give the heart
to vain regret
Tis but the casket
that lies here,
The gem that filled it
Sparkles yet
August 24th, 2014 at 2:45:55 PM
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Quote: Zcore13Just because something has been a certain way for a period of time doesn't mean it right for current standards. Is slavery still ok?
Should we also change the state name of Oklahoma? The name literally means Red People. Who cares that it was a chief who suggested the name, it was in the past, right? We wouldn't want to offend anybody...
I got a plan, we take all your picks we reverse them like one of those twilight zone episodes where everything is the opposite. You say "black" we go white.
August 24th, 2014 at 2:49:48 PM
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"VCUSkyhawk" Is that Sioux for he who shits in his hat ? Just asking.
Shed not for her
the bitter tear
Nor give the heart
to vain regret
Tis but the casket
that lies here,
The gem that filled it
Sparkles yet
August 24th, 2014 at 2:52:35 PM
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Quote: Buzzard"VCUSkyhawk" Is that Sioux for he who shits in his hat ? Just asking.
LOL. Didn't you get suspended for that one in the past. I remember when you said it I thought it was hilarious. You must be older. My dad would sometimes say "So, what you are telling me is 'To go shit in my hat'". I have never heard anybody outside you and my dad use that phrase.
I got a plan, we take all your picks we reverse them like one of those twilight zone episodes where everything is the opposite. You say "black" we go white.
August 24th, 2014 at 2:59:52 PM
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Hey, you seemed to know about the origin of Oklahoma. As I always say, DON"T take it personal. I was simply asking a question. I never thought you would take it that way. I sincerely apologize to your hat for any misunderstanding.
BABS, get your finger off that NUKE button.
BABS, get your finger off that NUKE button.
Shed not for her
the bitter tear
Nor give the heart
to vain regret
Tis but the casket
that lies here,
The gem that filled it
Sparkles yet
August 24th, 2014 at 3:03:20 PM
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I didn't take it that way. Please dont nuke him.
I got a plan, we take all your picks we reverse them like one of those twilight zone episodes where everything is the opposite. You say "black" we go white.
August 24th, 2014 at 3:12:36 PM
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Quote: VCUSkyhawkI have never heard anybody outside you and my dad use that phrase.
That line is included in what was my little old grandmother's favorite joke. She died in 1977 at the age of 82. Guess I shouldn't post the joke here.
August 24th, 2014 at 3:14:49 PM
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Sounds like my kinda gal !
Shed not for her
the bitter tear
Nor give the heart
to vain regret
Tis but the casket
that lies here,
The gem that filled it
Sparkles yet
August 24th, 2014 at 3:15:31 PM
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Geez, I hate always being the Black Hat. Buzz, just mask the swear, and we're good. It's just a saying; I heard it growing up, myself. Doesn't make it PC these days. But it's also not an insult in and of itself.
If the House lost every hand, they wouldn't deal the game.
August 24th, 2014 at 3:19:32 PM
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Quote: beachbumbabsGeez, I hate always being the Black Hat. Buzz, just mask the swear, and we're good. It's just a saying; I heard it growing up, myself. Doesn't make it PC these days. But it's also not an insult in and of itself.
" But it's also not an insult in and of itself. " But Babs , did you not give me a suspension for that very thing ? Or did I dream that? Been dreaming a lot about you lately...SIGH
Shed not for her
the bitter tear
Nor give the heart
to vain regret
Tis but the casket
that lies here,
The gem that filled it
Sparkles yet
August 24th, 2014 at 3:27:13 PM
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Quote: Buzzard" But it's also not an insult in and of itself. " But Babs , did you not give me a suspension for that very thing ? Or did I dream that? Been dreaming a lot about you lately...SIGH
I thought I told you in the thread. You called in the napalm on yourself by making it clear you meant to insult the person and were willing to take the consequences. Here, as I read it, you are making a joke AND a wry reference to that event, but neglecting to mask your swear word, as you well know Mike has asked that we do.
If the House lost every hand, they wouldn't deal the game.
August 24th, 2014 at 3:40:53 PM
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Quote: VCUSkyhawkShould we also change the state name of Oklahoma? The name literally means Red People. Who cares that it was a chief who suggested the name, it was in the past, right? We wouldn't want to offend anybody...
And poopoo and shit mean the same thing. One is ok to say in most cases and one is much less ok and not even allowed on broadcast tv. We are not playing the synonym game. Redskins is offensive to some Indians as would Blackskins to another group.
Change happens in every aspect of life. If you (or I) don't adapt you get left behind or end up looking ignorant.
ZCore13
I am an employee of a Casino. Former Table Games Director,, current Pit Supervisor. All the personal opinions I post are my own and do not represent the opinions of the Casino or Tribe that I work for.
August 24th, 2014 at 3:53:07 PM
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Quote: Zcore13Redskins is offensive to some Indians
The vast MINORITY. And that there is my point of contention . How long do we allow the minority to dictate what we are and are not allowed to say?
Oh, and are you really saying "Red People" and "Redskin" are so vastly different that one is ok and one is NOT? Come on buddy, give me a break.
I got a plan, we take all your picks we reverse them like one of those twilight zone episodes where everything is the opposite. You say "black" we go white.
August 24th, 2014 at 4:04:28 PM
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Hey, next time you see a group of young black men walking down the street, shout " Hey N****S, where you going ? " and like see what happens !
Shed not for her
the bitter tear
Nor give the heart
to vain regret
Tis but the casket
that lies here,
The gem that filled it
Sparkles yet
August 24th, 2014 at 4:06:08 PM
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Actually Babs, it was his hat that I was insulting. I had no idea his hat was a member.
Shed not for her
the bitter tear
Nor give the heart
to vain regret
Tis but the casket
that lies here,
The gem that filled it
Sparkles yet
August 24th, 2014 at 4:08:05 PM
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Quote: VCUSkyhawkThe vast MINORITY. And that there is my point of contention . How long do we allow the minority to dictate what we are and are not allowed to say?
Oh, and are you really saying "Red People" and "Redskin" are so vastly different that one is ok and one is NOT? Come on buddy, give me a break.
where do you get your information that it's a vast minority?I work for a tribe and have a lot of contact with other tribal members and I'm pretty sure almost all of them would have a problem if I said good morning red skin.
ZCore13
I am an employee of a Casino. Former Table Games Director,, current Pit Supervisor. All the personal opinions I post are my own and do not represent the opinions of the Casino or Tribe that I work for.
August 24th, 2014 at 4:11:33 PM
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Quote: BuzzardHey, next time you see a group of young black men walking down the street, shout " Hey N****S, where you going ? " and like see what happens !
N----- is completely different in terms of a disparaging comment and I think you know it. (Edited by mod. This board does not tolerate that word, and quite a few others, unmasked. Please consider this a warning, and take a look at the rules before you post again.)
I got a plan, we take all your picks we reverse them like one of those twilight zone episodes where everything is the opposite. You say "black" we go white.
August 24th, 2014 at 4:18:30 PM
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I know several NA who would disagree with that. Robert Running Bear for one.
Shed not for her
the bitter tear
Nor give the heart
to vain regret
Tis but the casket
that lies here,
The gem that filled it
Sparkles yet
August 24th, 2014 at 4:20:58 PM
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Quote: BuzzardI know several NA who would disagree with that. Robert Running Bear for one.
And I can find a majority of NA that have no problem with it.
I got a plan, we take all your picks we reverse them like one of those twilight zone episodes where everything is the opposite. You say "black" we go white.
August 24th, 2014 at 4:26:33 PM
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Quote: VCUSkyhawkAnd I can find a majority of NA that have no problem with it.
\
There are people who like being pissed on too. May I ?
Shed not for her
the bitter tear
Nor give the heart
to vain regret
Tis but the casket
that lies here,
The gem that filled it
Sparkles yet
August 24th, 2014 at 4:26:33 PM
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Quote: VCUSkyhawk(Edited by mod. This board does not tolerate that word, and quite a few others, unmasked. Please consider this a warning, and take a look at the rules before you post again.)
I will abide by the rules, however I find fear of a word to be a bit disturbing. Carlin addressed this word specifically and I 100% agree.
I got a plan, we take all your picks we reverse them like one of those twilight zone episodes where everything is the opposite. You say "black" we go white.
August 24th, 2014 at 4:28:34 PM
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Buzz, it is apparent you and I will not see eye to eye on this, and that is fine. You can go on living your life in fear of pissing off a small number of people, I will speak as I see fit.
I honestly do my best to try not to offend people, but people are too damn sensitive now a days.
I honestly do my best to try not to offend people, but people are too damn sensitive now a days.
I got a plan, we take all your picks we reverse them like one of those twilight zone episodes where everything is the opposite. You say "black" we go white.
August 24th, 2014 at 4:31:21 PM
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My Dad told me never be afraid of anyone who turns their back or goes to sleep. If you are trying your best, then you best is not good enough.
Shed not for her
the bitter tear
Nor give the heart
to vain regret
Tis but the casket
that lies here,
The gem that filled it
Sparkles yet
August 24th, 2014 at 4:31:36 PM
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Quote: BuzzardHey, next time you see a group of young black men walking down the street, shout " Hey N****S, where you going ? " and like see what happens !
Nah, if I just wait they will be calling each other the same name.
All animals are equal, but some are more equal than others
August 24th, 2014 at 4:34:17 PM
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Quote: BuzzardMy Dad told me never be afraid of anyone who turns their back or goes to sleep. If you are trying your best, then you best is not good enough.
I have no idea what this is suppose to mean. Is this another old timer phrase like shitting in one's hat?
I got a plan, we take all your picks we reverse them like one of those twilight zone episodes where everything is the opposite. You say "black" we go white.
August 24th, 2014 at 4:40:17 PM
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Quote: AZDuffmanNah, if I just wait they will be calling each other the same name.
Well, then it should be ok for them to call you a MF by that logic.
Shed not for her
the bitter tear
Nor give the heart
to vain regret
Tis but the casket
that lies here,
The gem that filled it
Sparkles yet
August 24th, 2014 at 4:43:35 PM
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Quote: VCUSkyhawkI will abide by the rules, however I find fear of a word to be a bit disturbing. Carlin addressed this word specifically and I 100% agree.
My personal agreement with what you say has nothing to do with how this site is administered.
If the House lost every hand, they wouldn't deal the game.
August 24th, 2014 at 4:47:54 PM
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Quote: beachbumbabs
My personal agreement with what you say has nothing to do with how this site is administered.
Understood. While I do not agree with the rule, like many have said, this is the Wiz's house and I will abide by his rules.
I got a plan, we take all your picks we reverse them like one of those twilight zone episodes where everything is the opposite. You say "black" we go white.
August 24th, 2014 at 5:00:02 PM
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Would it be only words if somebody called you a B++++, Babs. I think not.
Shed not for her
the bitter tear
Nor give the heart
to vain regret
Tis but the casket
that lies here,
The gem that filled it
Sparkles yet
August 24th, 2014 at 6:20:13 PM
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Quote: BuzzardWould it be only words if somebody called you a B++++, Babs. I think not.
You completely don't understand, do you Buzz? The point is that they are only words. It is about the CONTEXT. If BBB had a friend that she was friendly with and in a playful manner called her a B*tch, she may not mind. If I, somebody she doesn't know from Adam called her one in anger there is a problem...do you see yet?
I got a plan, we take all your picks we reverse them like one of those twilight zone episodes where everything is the opposite. You say "black" we go white.
August 24th, 2014 at 6:44:26 PM
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What is a nice way to call someone a Dumb MF, or a chink, or a kike ?
Shed not for her
the bitter tear
Nor give the heart
to vain regret
Tis but the casket
that lies here,
The gem that filled it
Sparkles yet
August 24th, 2014 at 6:54:40 PM
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Quote: BuzzardWhat is a nice way to call someone a Dumb MF, or a chink, or a kike ?
Buzz, do you see how in the first scenario that you modified the word, adding to the context. I will at times nicely at times say to a friend "What's up MF". You modified the word.
I do not have a thought on the other two. However, as somebody previously stated, I don't see fist fights breaking out when two black folks call each other N-----. They understand context, you do not. It is fine, no need to further argue the point when you don't understand the issue.
I got a plan, we take all your picks we reverse them like one of those twilight zone episodes where everything is the opposite. You say "black" we go white.
August 24th, 2014 at 7:04:48 PM
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Quote: BuzzardWhat is a nice way to call someone a Dumb MF, or a chink, or a kike ?
And another thing, why is chink and kike ok unfiltered, but N----- is not?
I got a plan, we take all your picks we reverse them like one of those twilight zone episodes where everything is the opposite. You say "black" we go white.
August 24th, 2014 at 8:38:54 PM
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Quote: VCUSkyhawkAnd another thing, why is chink and kike ok unfiltered, but N----- is not?
Actually, they're not ok; I'm trying to give you guys a little room to discuss this in the abstract. You brought George Carlin in; I'm going to add to that what Whoopi Goldberg said, which is very similar to your point.
(Paraphrasing) These words have power just because they are taboo, and derogatory towards a group of people. The only way to take the sting out is to use them, especially those of that group, as a non-code-word reference. The offense is not in the word; it's in the reasons a person uses them. The words are just indications of a person's values and upbringing.
Or better yet, just don't use them. Don't acknowledge and thereby legitimize the hatred and condescension of the person who does, unless and until the underlying meaning has been neutralized. My answer to Buzz would be, "Yeah, that's me. Your point is?"
But on this board, where the intent of the owner is professional discussion of gaming, there is barely a legitimate use for any of them (occasional demographics discussions, carefully phrased), and he simply doesn't want them on here. Any more than you would use them in the workplace, in church, or for attribution (if you had to use your real name and identifiable info to post on here).
If the House lost every hand, they wouldn't deal the game.
August 24th, 2014 at 10:30:05 PM
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I am done. Move this to DT Just found out the owner of the Washington team is on a first name basis with all Native Americans.
But his rabbi wants to rename the team the K**** and the cheerleaders the Jewish B******
ALL DONE Bye bye for now BABS
But his rabbi wants to rename the team the K**** and the cheerleaders the Jewish B******
ALL DONE Bye bye for now BABS
Shed not for her
the bitter tear
Nor give the heart
to vain regret
Tis but the casket
that lies here,
The gem that filled it
Sparkles yet
August 25th, 2014 at 2:38:40 AM
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Quote: BuzzardWell, then it should be ok for them to call you a MF by that logic.
I don't get it? My friends and me don't call each other MF.
All animals are equal, but some are more equal than others
August 25th, 2014 at 7:29:52 AM
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Quote: Zcore13......I work for a TRIBE and have a lot of contact with other tribal members and I'm pretty sure almost all of them would have a problem if I said good morning red skin.
ZCore13
I think that you just solved the problem of what the Washington team should change their name to.
They should now be called the Washington TRIBE.
August 25th, 2014 at 7:43:32 AM
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I still think they'll be offended by the "Washington" part. Maybe move the Redskins back to Boston and rename them the Boston Tribe? Wait, Boston already has a football team. Nevermind, just drop the city from the name.Quote: FatGeezus
They should now be called the Washington TRIBE.
August 29th, 2014 at 9:39:18 PM
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Quote: onenickelmiracleI've been thinking the same thing for weeks. Nothing wrong with potatoes but it could get messy. Next thing they know some potatoe company sues them maybe for damaging their tater business or something stupid.
Or if they ever get "mashed" in a Super "Bowl"!
August 29th, 2014 at 10:54:07 PM
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Quote: beachbumbabsDon't acknowledge and thereby legitimize the hatred and condescension of the person who [uses racist epithets], unless and until the underlying meaning has been neutralized.
How do you explain the use, for example, of the word "nigger" between two African-American men when greeting each other in terms of "hatred" or interracial "condescension"? Or is that an example of what you might call "neutralized" usage?
Quote: beachbumbabsBut on this board, where the intent of the owner is professional discussion of gaming....
Then why are there "Spanish Word of the Day" and "Hot Blonde of the Day" features?
Quote: beachbumbabs...occasional demographics discussions, carefully phrased....
Does "careful phrasing" and merely "discussing demographically" (i.e., "just sayin'") make racial epithets alright?
Quote: beachbumbabsAny more than you would use them in the workplace....
Depends where you work and especially on what level or in what context such usage might take place, although more and more, the aforementioned "N-bomb" is actually used in a non-ethnic way as a pronoun or substitute for "guy" or "thing", especially a lost object: "Damn it, I know I put that nigger (e.g. black-handled phone, scissors, etc.) round here somewhere." More and more, the racial (not racist) term used among, as well as referring to, black men is ninjas, especially in lyric. This raises the question of whether it's legitimate, in society in general, to bark about "racist" language when new replacements, made out of once-friendly words, are being coined all the time.
Having said all that, I come here, as you said, to discuss gaming, especially development and math, with like-minded individuals of high-caliber intellect, wit, and composition skills comparable to my own, any one of whom could be a kraut, like myself.
Just sayin'.
August 30th, 2014 at 9:26:44 AM
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I was talking about what Whoopi (and Carlin) said, so any interpretation I might make is second-hand, but yes, I think their point was to neutralize the language by using it among themselves, and eventually everyone. Labels are a tough thing, semantically; look at the evolution of such words as "gay", "retarded", lots of others over the last 200 years or less. "Gay" 100 years ago meant happy and carefree. "Retarded" was factual to mean slow or mentally impaired, without bias, as recently as 30 years ago.
Those threads date back years, though there's no "Hot Blonde of the Day". Both, in part, led to the creation of the Diversity Tomorrow site, some 2 years after this site was opened, when Mike wanted to move some of the more volatile and off-topic conversations away from this forum.
No, "just sayin'" and the like doesn't particularly excuse unacceptable language. It's more the context of the discussion and the intent of the poster. And it's not something that can be stated in absolutes.
Since you're approaching your 3rd anniversary here, I doubt any of that is news to you. And it's my take on how the site is to be administered. Other mods may have a different POV. I also come here to discuss and learn about gaming, so I'm going back to that; I think we've gotten as far as we might productively on this topic.
Those threads date back years, though there's no "Hot Blonde of the Day". Both, in part, led to the creation of the Diversity Tomorrow site, some 2 years after this site was opened, when Mike wanted to move some of the more volatile and off-topic conversations away from this forum.
No, "just sayin'" and the like doesn't particularly excuse unacceptable language. It's more the context of the discussion and the intent of the poster. And it's not something that can be stated in absolutes.
Since you're approaching your 3rd anniversary here, I doubt any of that is news to you. And it's my take on how the site is to be administered. Other mods may have a different POV. I also come here to discuss and learn about gaming, so I'm going back to that; I think we've gotten as far as we might productively on this topic.
If the House lost every hand, they wouldn't deal the game.
