Casino Careers ?
December 4th, 2009 at 4:17:03 PM
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Someone asked for a thread for those contemplating casino careers:
I am a bettor. Not a dealer. My math is too slow and my patience is utterly lacking.
Actually, I think some might find it very enjoyable. However, dealers must always smile and always just Dummy Up and Deal. They work under constant surveillance by humans, cameras and computers. They work in a smoke filled atmosphere and in some break-in joints they work downwind of some "fleas" who pay insufficient attention to personal hygienne. They work for tips and often have to rely on what management tells them the tokes totaled. They share tips usually and that means each dealer thinks he is carrying all the others who are only deadweight and don't know how to really earn tips. The casino has unfettered discretion to schedule dealers at empty tables, thus lowering the tips earned. Dealers generally work all weekends and holidays. Christmas, New Years Eve, Thanksgiving ... all of them. Schedules often change abruptly.
Some craps dealers and Blackjack dealers make a fortune compared to what their previous jobs were such as fast food or the like. But Wall Street types consider the casino to be an asset to be milked and all jobs are in jeopardy at all times. You will note that the recent turn down in the economy resulted in massive layoffs rather than massive belt tightening by senior executives.
Noise, smoke, constant supervision, constant surveillance (even in the employee break room and employee cafeteria), constant "music", frequent insults from sore losers. Yet some people like it. Poker dealers get to sit down and often can work fairly short shifts. Other dealers stand. ALL day they stand! Some dealers like the go home and forget work. Some dealers like the instant feedback. No lengthy projects. Deal a hand, take the losers, pay the winners. The dice roll, you take the losing bets and you pay the winners. You do it in the order you've been told. You keep your hands the way you've been told to keep them. You don't even sneeze except according to procedures. And if a girl has to brush the hair away from her eyes, she has to clap her hands before and afterwards.
Some people enjoy it. I would have gone crazy doing it. (Ofcourse I would never have actually been hired, since I can barely figure out two plus two ... well, almost).
I am a bettor. Not a dealer. My math is too slow and my patience is utterly lacking.
Actually, I think some might find it very enjoyable. However, dealers must always smile and always just Dummy Up and Deal. They work under constant surveillance by humans, cameras and computers. They work in a smoke filled atmosphere and in some break-in joints they work downwind of some "fleas" who pay insufficient attention to personal hygienne. They work for tips and often have to rely on what management tells them the tokes totaled. They share tips usually and that means each dealer thinks he is carrying all the others who are only deadweight and don't know how to really earn tips. The casino has unfettered discretion to schedule dealers at empty tables, thus lowering the tips earned. Dealers generally work all weekends and holidays. Christmas, New Years Eve, Thanksgiving ... all of them. Schedules often change abruptly.
Some craps dealers and Blackjack dealers make a fortune compared to what their previous jobs were such as fast food or the like. But Wall Street types consider the casino to be an asset to be milked and all jobs are in jeopardy at all times. You will note that the recent turn down in the economy resulted in massive layoffs rather than massive belt tightening by senior executives.
Noise, smoke, constant supervision, constant surveillance (even in the employee break room and employee cafeteria), constant "music", frequent insults from sore losers. Yet some people like it. Poker dealers get to sit down and often can work fairly short shifts. Other dealers stand. ALL day they stand! Some dealers like the go home and forget work. Some dealers like the instant feedback. No lengthy projects. Deal a hand, take the losers, pay the winners. The dice roll, you take the losing bets and you pay the winners. You do it in the order you've been told. You keep your hands the way you've been told to keep them. You don't even sneeze except according to procedures. And if a girl has to brush the hair away from her eyes, she has to clap her hands before and afterwards.
Some people enjoy it. I would have gone crazy doing it. (Ofcourse I would never have actually been hired, since I can barely figure out two plus two ... well, almost).
December 4th, 2009 at 4:22:36 PM
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And then ofcourse there is technology.
Slot machines don't get wages, don't ask for benefits, don't get sick and don't unionize.
Other games are probably at risk for robots, though bettors tend to still like people. Some casinos have "virtual reality" blackjack dealers. Yet no matter how many dealers are getting layed off, the Vegas dealer schools keep churning out additional crops of graduates.
Is it a dying industry? Not yet apparently. Is it going to decline as Online gambling eventually gets legalized? Probably... but who knows when that will really take place?
Slot machines don't get wages, don't ask for benefits, don't get sick and don't unionize.
Other games are probably at risk for robots, though bettors tend to still like people. Some casinos have "virtual reality" blackjack dealers. Yet no matter how many dealers are getting layed off, the Vegas dealer schools keep churning out additional crops of graduates.
Is it a dying industry? Not yet apparently. Is it going to decline as Online gambling eventually gets legalized? Probably... but who knows when that will really take place?
December 4th, 2009 at 4:47:35 PM
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Quote: FleaStiffOther games are probably at risk for robots, though bettors tend to still like people. Some casinos have "virtual reality" blackjack dealers. Yet no matter how many dealers are getting layed off, the Vegas dealer schools keep churning out additional crops of graduates.
Is it a dying industry? Not yet apparently. Is it going to decline as Online gambling eventually gets legalized? Probably... but who knows when that will really take place?
I've tried the BJ machines. They're not bad, but I have little patience with them. No matter how well made they are, they always seem to take forever to deal, pay, etc. a human dealer probably takes as long, or longer, but I have more patience for people than for machines. besides you can chat with the dealer while he takes time to deal.
A plus for the casinos is the machine woulnd't make mistakes. That would work great for craps, too, considering the more complex bets available.
I think the future is more mixed. I don't play roulette, but I've seen tables where a person spins the ball but the players bet on individual screens. That's a great idea, as payments are handled faster, there is no confusion of players' chips and no need to sweep losing bets and such.
A half-virtual craps table with real dice and a stickman would work just as well (no boxman, as you'd insert bills in the machine and play virtual chips.
Of course, you'd then have people whose job descriptions would be: spin the wheel, drop the ball, retrieve the dice and if the mahcine has any problems call tech support.
Donald Trump is a fucking criminal
December 5th, 2009 at 12:09:16 AM
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Personally I hate playing online table games. While we do have roulette machines (connected to a real table) and mini-bac machines at our casino, I really don't think the bots will ever take over. Here in Canada we went through a big round of layoffs early in the year but the players are coming back now and we need competent dealers more than ever. It may not pay like Vegas but if you need a job, come up North.
December 5th, 2009 at 8:22:47 AM
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Casino gambling jobs are NOT going to die out anytime soon because it's a legal vice. If something is evil, you can be absolutely sure the crowd will go with the idea. Also, the general public is stupid enough to drop their hard earned cash on mathematically unfavorable games the way they have been for thousands of years. When casinos make efforts to make table games more technological, those efforts are known to crash and burn because of nostalgia, distrust in machines, and the desire for a decent game that doesn't deal too many hands at one.
December 5th, 2009 at 11:07:15 AM
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People will always like face to face contact when playing, especially poker. I dont think this will ever really change.
As to the person saying you need to be great at maths to work in a casino - not true. Its more memory than maths.
I would also like to know how good the standard of most dealer scools in Vegas is.
As to the person saying you need to be great at maths to work in a casino - not true. Its more memory than maths.
I would also like to know how good the standard of most dealer scools in Vegas is.
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December 5th, 2009 at 11:49:11 AM
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Yes, its usually a matter of the dealer memorizing keys to calculate payoffs rapidly and then handling any breakage and adding that to the payoff. Its more memory than true math skill but it does take basic math skills.
Dealer schools: You will hear alot of comments. Ownership often changes. Job placement history is meaningless. It used to be that a school might send a student out on an audition while still in school and the student might be hired on the spot. Now graduates are walking around and filling out online applications and feeling the downturn in the economy.
The local college is said to have good classes. Some of the proprietary schools have good reputations but one opened up fairly recently and its clear from the web site that there might be a language problem.
Dealer schools: You will hear alot of comments. Ownership often changes. Job placement history is meaningless. It used to be that a school might send a student out on an audition while still in school and the student might be hired on the spot. Now graduates are walking around and filling out online applications and feeling the downturn in the economy.
The local college is said to have good classes. Some of the proprietary schools have good reputations but one opened up fairly recently and its clear from the web site that there might be a language problem.
December 6th, 2009 at 11:27:32 PM
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Quote: FleaStiffSlot machines don't get wages, don't ask for benefits, don't get sick and don't unionize.
Actually, they do, but if a slot machine calls in sick, it's a lot less of a big deal than trying to find a substitute dealer. :^)
December 6th, 2009 at 11:48:01 PM
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Slot technician programs exist at some schools.
Perhaps with increasing acceptance of networked slots its a growing field?
I still would say that its a well, "dicey" career move involving corporate programs to avoid or shed any burden for health care or pension obligations.
Its a vice and is likely to continue but the threat of online gambling would be ever present and virtual dealers an ever present threat. Working conditions can be stressful. Some dealers learn curse words in several languages but must keep that professional smile on their face no matter what is hurled at them.
Perhaps with increasing acceptance of networked slots its a growing field?
I still would say that its a well, "dicey" career move involving corporate programs to avoid or shed any burden for health care or pension obligations.
Its a vice and is likely to continue but the threat of online gambling would be ever present and virtual dealers an ever present threat. Working conditions can be stressful. Some dealers learn curse words in several languages but must keep that professional smile on their face no matter what is hurled at them.
December 7th, 2009 at 1:04:59 AM
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Quote: FleaStiffWorking conditions can be stressful. Some dealers learn curse words in several languages but must keep that professional smile on their face no matter what is hurled at them.
How bad is it in Vegas? I've been dealing with a lot of VIP players here (in BC) insulting dealers and yet as management we are told to let it go because, well, they are VIP players. Where does the line get crossed? We kick them out, we get fired.
December 7th, 2009 at 6:02:51 AM
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I'm not quite certain where the lines are.
I do know that there is a difference between uttering an expletive in a moment of stress and directing that expletive towards a dealer.
Violence is not likely to be tolerated.
Blowing smoke intentionally at the dealer seems to happen from time to time.
Warnings tend to be given but sometimes a player can be too stupid or too drunk to heed them.
I do know that there is a difference between uttering an expletive in a moment of stress and directing that expletive towards a dealer.
Violence is not likely to be tolerated.
Blowing smoke intentionally at the dealer seems to happen from time to time.
Warnings tend to be given but sometimes a player can be too stupid or too drunk to heed them.
December 7th, 2009 at 2:27:43 PM
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Another line to cross is requesting new dealers. Now I understand for the sake of luck you can request a dealer change (at least we're allowed to here) but one player asked for 5 changes on my shift alone. One day he likes FEMALE dealers. Another he asks for female dealers that speak Mandarin only. Once he wanted a female Mandarin-speaking dealer who wore glasses (don't ask). I just think sometimes these requests are so stupid but we're told to do whatever they want.
Anybody ask for a hot Swedish girl to deal?
Anybody ask for a hot Swedish girl to deal?
December 7th, 2009 at 11:14:50 PM
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I've never asked for "same dice" or anything like that. I've never asked for any specific dealer or type of dealer, though I usually do prefer female blackjack dealers. However, for someone working in the casino industry, I guess he doesn't remember all the normal players, he remembers the weird ones that he had to put up with. And in many casinos, weird and broke may get you tossed out but weird and a stack of chips means you stay.
December 8th, 2009 at 9:16:14 AM
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I think your ability to ask for a new dealer would be predicated by the amount you are betting. Certainly you would probably need to be betting blacks ($100) at minimum to get your request granted, and probably in a high roller room.
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You want the truth! You can't handle the truth!
December 9th, 2009 at 10:02:20 AM
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Over here, the pit boss decides where the dealers go, and unless there are exceptional circumstances (such as an altercation between the players and dealers, or an exceptionally large player arriving) then dealers will not be changed at the request of players.
The pit boss will decide who deals where based on ability.
The pit boss will decide who deals where based on ability.
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December 9th, 2009 at 2:09:54 PM
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That's the way it should be. Moving dealers is silly and allowing the whales to swear and abuse the staff is even sillier. But money talks as they say.
December 23rd, 2009 at 12:37:10 AM
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Quote: RiverRockThat's the way it should be. Moving dealers is silly and allowing the whales to swear and abuse the staff is even sillier. But money talks as they say.
Nobody knows it better than this guy: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RPqsyFFZb_0 :-)
I just started working as a dealer a couple of weeks ago...having to grin and bear it as people swear and blame you for giving them bad cards is tough. It's even worse on craps, some people will find ANY reason whatsoever to blame you for a seven out, moving the dice too slowly, moving them too quickly, putting your hands in the wrong place on the rail, etc. I had my first-ever truly nasty player last week too, on Three Card Poker (surprising since usually carny game players are pretty mellow, at least compared to BJ and craps players), called me just about every name in the book--but I quickly decided I wouldn't take it personally, and just dealt the cards like I'm paid to.
All in all, it's really not such a bad job--sure there's abuse involved, but it's not back-breaking physical labor, and pays quite well for the level of education required (about 2 months of community college classes.
"I believe I've passed the age/of consciousness and righteous rage/I've found that just surviving was a noble fight...
I once believed in causes too/I had my pointless point of view/And life went on no matter who was wrong or right..." --Billy Joel
December 23rd, 2009 at 8:12:01 AM
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Quote: OneAngryDwarf
I just started working as a dealer a couple of weeks ago...having to grin and bear it as people swear and blame you for giving them bad cards is tough. It's even worse on craps, some people will find ANY reason whatsoever to blame you for a seven out, moving the dice too slowly, moving them too quickly, putting your hands in the wrong place on the rail, etc. I had my first-ever truly nasty player last week too, on Three Card Poker (surprising since usually carny game players are pretty mellow, at least compared to BJ and craps players), called me just about every name in the book--but I quickly decided I wouldn't take it personally, and just dealt the cards like I'm paid to.
All in all, it's really not such a bad job--sure there's abuse involved, but it's not back-breaking physical labor, and pays quite well for the level of education required (about 2 months of community college classes.[/q
Sounds like you have a good disposition for the job and industry. Myself I think I would just figure I've been yelled at and blamed for stuff all my life so just let it go.
Mind if I ask what training classes were like? I keep considering taking the clases as sort of "Plan B" if my current job goes south. (not "Plan A" due to long commute.) Do you just basically take turns dealing to each other and such? Did the instructors tell someone in class to try and pass-post to trip you up?
I've been dealing monte-carlo nights for some time now and dealing is a better alternative to some stuff out there (call center, etc.)All animals are equal, but some are more equal than others
