Reincarnation?
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4 members have voted
March 10th, 2019 at 4:48:02 PM
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In one of ZenKing rant threads Bob has mentioned that reincarnation is a real thing. I was flabbergasted. He has provided a bunch of links supporting his hypothesis. I think I could believe in God before reincarnation.
March 10th, 2019 at 4:52:42 PM
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Quote: SOOPOOIn one of ZenKing rant threads Bob has mentioned that reincarnation is a real thing. I was flabbergasted. He has provided a bunch of links supporting his hypothesis. I think I could believe in God before reincarnation.
I suppose it would have to be something at the quantum level as I think it’s atoms or protons or something can be in two places at once and that somehow your atoms are trapped in this body but when you die you don’t reincarnate but regenerate and grow up again and again and again. Ok that’s as weird as I’m getting right now
March 10th, 2019 at 5:07:16 PM
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Reincarnated in the form of food and fertilizer for living organisms?
March 10th, 2019 at 5:09:10 PM
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Quote: SOOPOOIn one of ZenKing rant threads Bob has mentioned that reincarnation is a real thing.
I really have no interest in discussing
this here, already that on DT. If you
spend weeks reading all the research,
the conclusion you'll come to is, hmm,
something's going on here. Unless
you have prejudiced religious bent.
FrG's explanation was the devil was
influencing the research to turn our
attention away from god. I'm serious,
he really said that.
Quote:I think I could believe in God before reincarnation
I'm an atheist, thank god, so my mind
is open. If you accept the research or
reject it, what difference does it mean
to reality. I can ignore gravity, will that mean
it will disappear when I jump off the 10th
floor.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
March 10th, 2019 at 5:09:26 PM
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Quote: aceofspadesReincarnated in the form of food and fertilizer for living organisms?
Nope. Having memories of a previous other person's life.
March 10th, 2019 at 5:10:37 PM
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I think EB is more likely to remain earthbound as a ghost, and float over a swamp in the form of hot gas.
Sanitized for Your Protection
March 10th, 2019 at 5:19:19 PM
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If you are reincarnated it wouldn't really matter cuz you probably wouldn't know that you were reincarnated and that would be the same and death IMO.Quote: SOOPOOIn one of ZenKing rant threads Bob has mentioned that reincarnation is a real thing. I was flabbergasted. He has provided a bunch of links supporting his hypothesis. I think I could believe in God before reincarnation.
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
March 10th, 2019 at 5:24:58 PM
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Quote: AxelWolfIf you are reincarnated it wouldn't really matter cuz you probably wouldn't know that you were reincarnated and that would be the same and death IMO.
Bingo. Only little kids remember, sometimes,
and the memories disappear by age 5. The
'you' that you're attached to, the guy that
likes certain TV shows and foods and has
quirks, that's just something you constructed
to get thru everyday life. To think that construct
will live forever in some heaven or hell is
ridiculous. Even Carl Jung said we were all
part of a universal consciousness, that's the
part of you that goes on and on forever.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
March 11th, 2019 at 1:11:41 AM
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Quote: EvenBobBingo. Only little kids remember, sometimes,
and the memories disappear by age 5. The
'you' that you're attached to, the guy that
likes certain TV shows and foods and has
quirks, that's just something you constructed
to get thru everyday life. To think that construct
will live forever in some heaven or hell is
ridiculous. Even Carl Jung said we were all
part of a universal consciousness, that's the
part of you that goes on and on forever.
We took a trip to Philadelphia when I was 4 years old, according to my mom. Apparently, when we got to one part I started leading my mom and dad around and talking about all kinds of things that I used to do there. My mom still talks about it to this day and believes in reincarnation as a result.
I don't remember any of it. I think I remember some pretzel factory where you were able to make your own pretzel.
March 11th, 2019 at 1:36:45 AM
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Quote: MaxPenWe took a trip to Philadelphia when I was 4 years old,
Those are the kind of cases that they investigate. They
aren't reported here because reincarnation is not part
of our belief system. It's reported far more often in
countries like India.
What they've been doing for over
60 years is they investigate the kids story to see if
there's any possible way he's making it up. Somebody
told it to him, or there's some way he would know
the story other than a memory. If he checks out, then
they investigate the people in the story that he's telling.
They have thousands and thousands of these cases on
record, if you're skeptical just investigate it till you're
not skeptical anymore. Books have been written by
journalists who were skeptical, and no longer are. This
doesn't prove reincarnation exists, but it certainly points
in that direction. Something is going on that we can't
explain any other way.
This is as boring as watching grass grow, but it's
science and not sensationalism, what would you
expect. If you're looking to see who was a famous
person in a past life, you won't find it from these
stodgy academics.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
March 11th, 2019 at 8:51:05 AM
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Does deja vu come into play as a possibility memory from your formerlife?
March 11th, 2019 at 9:50:20 AM
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I remember seeing this story about ten years ago. Christian parents who now believe their son was reincarnated. It's a pretty convincing story.
March 11th, 2019 at 11:59:21 AM
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Reincarnation is real.
Global warming is fake.
Nuff said.
Global warming is fake.
Nuff said.
The older I get, the better I recall things that never happened
March 11th, 2019 at 12:26:54 PM
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Quote: aceofspadesDoes deja vu come into play as a possibility memory from your formerlife?
Deja vu is a neurological hiccup in the corpus callosum, the membrane separating the brain's hemispheres. Messages that pass back and forth hit that hiccup and get delayed as they find a new path thru. So instead of, say, seeing that guy cross the street, your brain "sees" it, but there's a delay before both halves confirm it. That delayed confirmation is deja vu. You really did "do that before", it was just a few milliseconds ago and not a millennia.
Sorry to those for whom just lost some magic. Sometimes education sucks.
The opinions of this moderator are for entertainment purposes only.
March 11th, 2019 at 12:49:46 PM
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Quote: billryanReincarnation is real.
Global warming is fake.
Nuff said.
lol
March 11th, 2019 at 1:11:33 PM
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Let me fix that for you....Quote: billryanReincarnation is real.
Global warming is fake.
Nuff said.
Reincarnation is real.
Roulette systems are real.
Global warming is fake.
I'm starting to see a pattern here.
p.s. I think global warming is real, but I think it has been blown way out of proportion. However, there is nothing wrong with trying to improve our environment and trying to go green.
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
March 11th, 2019 at 1:22:37 PM
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Quote: AxelWolfp.s. I think global warming is real,
It's been going on since the last
ice age started to melt 20K years
ago. I wouldn't worry about it.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
March 11th, 2019 at 4:38:34 PM
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I believe in pre-birth and after-death memories, reincarnations are possible.
I am a robot.
March 11th, 2019 at 4:41:09 PM
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If reincarnation were real and most common in unde 5 years of age, the toddler suicide rate and kids who had already given up at that point would be through the roof, no?
March 11th, 2019 at 4:53:54 PM
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Fallacy.Quote: mcallister3200If reincarnation were real and most common in unde 5 years of age, the toddler suicide rate and kids who had already given up at that point would be through the roof, no?
I am a robot.
March 11th, 2019 at 5:06:29 PM
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Trust me, I'm not in the least bit worried about it. If its real, I'm sure no one I care about will be around by the time it has any real consequences. In the mean time, if lose California to the ocean, I guess that's what they get for being a Sanctuary State. (-;Quote: EvenBobI wouldn't worry about it.
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
March 11th, 2019 at 5:48:54 PM
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Quote: mcallister3200If reincarnation were real and most common in unde 5 years of age, the toddler suicide rate and kids who had already given up at that point would be through the roof, no?
That's not what the memories are like.
Ever hear a story when you were young
and later in life you can't remember if
that really happened to you or was it
just a story you heard. It's like that.
And the memories usually peak about
age 4, when the brain goes thru changes
into a more adult like brain. That's why
kids all over world start school at 5. Even
in primitive societies the father would
often hang around until the kid was 5.
The whole point of the 60 years of research
has nothing to do with reincarnation. The
whole thrust of the work is to try and prove
the memories the kids have aren't real, they
come from coaching, from something they
were told or heard. When they exhaust
every way the kid could know what he knows,
then they start to take them seriously.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
March 11th, 2019 at 5:58:11 PM
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My question would be, what is being reincarnated? I agree, what we think of as the self is mostly a narrative construction. Maybe the one thing we could pin down is DNA, but that is out of the picture.
Taking all of this at face value, I can dream up other explanations. For example, the child has some sort of link to the person of the past, or their memories, without actually being that person. Whatever it means to be a person, in this context.
Taking all of this at face value, I can dream up other explanations. For example, the child has some sort of link to the person of the past, or their memories, without actually being that person. Whatever it means to be a person, in this context.
March 11th, 2019 at 7:32:15 PM
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Quote: RigondeauxFor example, the child has some sort of link to the person of the past.
They always look for links and
if there are any, they reject the
case. Here's one that stands
out in my memory.
India, a 3 year old boy remembers
a life as a street cigarette vendor
in a city 200 miles away. The kid
has never left home, the family
has no friends or relatives there.
The vendor was on his bike and
was killed by a car. The kid remembers
all of it, his name as the vendor,
his address, his family. They investigate
and it's all true, every detail that the
kid had no way of knowing.
The memories they validate are
usually in the same vicinity of
where the person dies, sometimes
within blocks. Seldom is the
kid thousands of miles away
from where the person died.
Almost always it's a traumatic
death that's remembered, like
the sudden shock of unexpectedly
dying transferred the memories
along with the soul into the
new person. Most people don't
die that way, so there's no reason
for memories to transfer.
It's really not an issue of belief,
these things are happening and
have always happened in all
cultures, but they're usually
ignored as babblings of a
3 year old and he soon forgets
them anyway.
It's only been in the last half
century that we have the ability
to investigate on a large scale
to verify what the kids are saying.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
March 11th, 2019 at 7:33:08 PM
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Maybe everyone is the same person but his multiple lives are being played out concurrently instead of consecutively.
March 11th, 2019 at 7:47:06 PM
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Quote: RSMaybe everyone is the same person but his multiple lives are being played out concurrently instead of consecutively.
Yes, one of many theories. Ralph Waldo
Emerson talked about the over-soul in
1841.
(1) the human soul is immortal,
(2) our conscious ego is slight and limited in comparison to the soul
(3) at some level, the souls of all people are connected
Even Jung, after analyzing thousands of patients,
came to the conclusion we are all connected to
a universal consciousness, an 'over-soul', The
oldest religion in the world, Hinduism, has always
taught reincarnation. Heavens and hell's were
invented by greedy religious types who used
the religion to control people.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
March 11th, 2019 at 8:41:03 PM
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Only thing I believe so far, is that if there is any before or after, we have no awareness of it.
Btw, if anyone has a "near death" experience, instead of wasting time asking about the after life, or talking to your dead Aunt Mary, get the cure to cancer, or maybe the solution to a proof or something else useful.
Btw, if anyone has a "near death" experience, instead of wasting time asking about the after life, or talking to your dead Aunt Mary, get the cure to cancer, or maybe the solution to a proof or something else useful.
Sanitized for Your Protection
March 11th, 2019 at 9:28:43 PM
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Quote: rxwineOnly thing I believe so far, is that if there is any before or after, we have no awareness of it.
That you know of. I have no awareness
of radio waves, or the noise coming
from a dog whistle. But they exist.
Houdini made a pact with his wife
that whoever died first, the other,
if possible, would make every effort
to make themselves known as a
ghost. He went first and she never
heard a peep from him.
It doesn't work that way. Many near
death experiences say they could
see themselves and loved ones in
the experience, but they had no
real feelings for them, not strong
ones anyway. It's the ego that gets
attached to things in this life, not
the part of us that moves on.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
March 11th, 2019 at 9:32:26 PM
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Quote: EvenBobThat you know of. I have no awareness
of radio waves, or the noise coming
from a dog whistle. But they exist.
Not only that I know of, but no way to test for, which is why It is different than those things you mention.
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March 11th, 2019 at 9:34:00 PM
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Another fallacy. Who said your dead Aunt Mary would even be there? Assuming facts not given to solve a problem. I think it is safer to assume where there are no bodies, there is no care about bodies or even any conscious thought there is a body or a body is missing. There would be no hunger, no thirst, no thoughts of temperature, no pain, because there is no body to send these signals. It could be just a bunch of crazy people talking about these things and there might not even be consistency, since people can have different unique experiences, and may remember things differently than accurate, if they choose to remember things that happened. Maybe I shouldn't have said I believe in them to be honest, I'm not sure I do believe them or at least believe do not believe them all.Quote: rxwineOnly thing I believe so far, is that if there is any before or after, we have no awareness of it.
Btw, if anyone has a "near death" experience, instead of wasting time asking about the after life, or talking to your dead Aunt Mary, get the cure to cancer, or maybe the solution to a proof or something else useful.
I am a robot.
March 11th, 2019 at 9:54:30 PM
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Quote: rxwineNot only that I know of, but no way to test for,
Yet. There was no way to test for
radio waves until very recently
in human history. The electromagnetic
spectrum has always existed
around us. What else exists around
us that we aren't aware of.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
March 11th, 2019 at 10:01:19 PM
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Quote: onenickelmiracleAnother fallacy. Who said your dead Aunt Mary would even be there?
I'm just reporting a smidgen of things reported by other people in their alleged near death experiences. Not my own. Since I've never had one. Or at least not one with anything to remember.
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March 11th, 2019 at 10:06:13 PM
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Quote: EvenBobYet. There was no way to test for
radio waves until very recently
in human history. The electromagnetic
spectrum has always existed
around us. What else exists around
us that we aren't aware of.
Doesn't matter. There still might be real leprechauns. But there needs to be more evidence than just a possibility which is the case for everything one can propose nearly.
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March 11th, 2019 at 10:48:26 PM
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Quote: rxwineDoesn't matter. There still might be real leprechauns. But there needs to be more evidence
There's zero evidence that god or the
devil or angels or demons exist, yet
half the world believes it. There is
more hard evidence pointing to
reincarnation than there is that
a god exists, and if you ask him,
he'll make the next light turn
green for you.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
March 11th, 2019 at 11:52:46 PM
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Quote: EvenBobThere's zero evidence that god or the
devil or angels or demons exist, yet
half the world believes it. There is
more hard evidence pointing to
reincarnation than there is that
a god exists, and if you ask him,
he'll make the next light turn
green for you.
Can you name a single case for which no possible flaws in evidence exist? A claim that some kid in one country couldn't possibly know about some person in another country a hundred years earlier is impossible to confirm for sure.
Heck there are still magic tricks which I know there is a trick for, but I still can't figure it out. Doesn't mean it's real magic. There have been hoaxes so good they fooled many people for decades.
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March 11th, 2019 at 11:57:23 PM
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String theory. lol.Quote: rxwineCan you name a single case for which no possible flaws in evidence exist? A claim that some kid in one country couldn't possibly know about some person in another country a hundred years earlier is impossible to confirm for sure.
Heck there are still magic tricks which I know there is a trick for, but I still can't figure it out. Doesn't mean it's real magic. There have been hoaxes so good they fooled many people for decades.
I am a robot.
March 12th, 2019 at 12:02:15 AM
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Plus the brain can do some really weird things. Synesthesia. Music prodigies. Brain damage causing people to speak in different accents. Calculating prodigies, (I think that one is still good unless they've discovered tricks for all of it), and people who can remember every face they ever see.
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March 12th, 2019 at 12:12:39 AM
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My personal favorite thing I would like to believe in is alien manned UFOs. But the best I can do is find some cases that are difficult to debunk. But that's not proof to me.
Sanitized for Your Protection
March 12th, 2019 at 12:34:58 AM
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I kind of think many of those are evidence for a hologram or simulated universe, in my opinion. Just seems like a brain shouldn't be able to do some of these things perfectly. In a simulated universe, all bets are off, because at that point, you kind of have to admit anything is possible and can't see past the veil.Quote: rxwinePlus the brain can do some really weird things. Synesthesia. Music prodigies. Brain damage causing people to speak in different accents. Calculating prodigies, (I think that one is still good unless they've discovered tricks for all of it), and people who can remember every face they ever see.
I am a robot.
March 12th, 2019 at 7:18:18 AM
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Quote: EvenBobThose are the kind of cases that they investigate. ... They have thousands and thousands of these cases on record.
The University of Virginia Medical School research center founded by Ian Stevenson (d-2007) continues to operate today. Its research papers are available from the Division of Perceptual Studies. Those interested can get more info here.
I encourage anyone interested -- even the least bit interested -- to check out Dr. Tucker's book, Return to Life. It describes cases where young children --- many from USA or Europe -- report prior-life experiences, including some where the identity of the prior-life individual can be identified positively. It's a great read, especially for folks with children.
As a special note for WoV "energy" naysayers, Tucker gives one of the most readable summaries of quantum energy and theoretical physics that I have found anywhere. This part of Tucker's book is as eye-opening as the main part of the book. As Niels Bohr said, "If quantum mechanics hasn't profoundly shocked you, you haven't understood it yet."
I'll close by giving a big thank-you to Bob for calling everyone's attention to Dr. Stevenson, a pioneer who suffered many slings and arrows from other medical (and other) professionals as he reported his research findings. Anyone who tries to discuss energy-related gaming experiences on WoV suffers the same "slings and arrows." So sad, don'cher know?
March 12th, 2019 at 8:00:00 AM
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Quote: RSMaybe everyone is the same person but his multiple lives are being played out concurrently instead of consecutively.
There was a short story or something about that.
Some guy dies and meets God. God tells him he is going to be reincarnated, over and over again. In fact, he is going to be reincarnated as every person who has ever lived and ever will live. Once he is done living out all those billions and billions of lives, he will be reincarnated as the God he is currently talking to.
His memory is erased, he's reincarnated, and has the same conversation with God every time he dies.
March 12th, 2019 at 9:26:13 AM
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Quote: RS
Maybe everyone is the same person but his multiple lives are being played out concurrently instead of consecutively.
Quote: EvenBobYes, one of many theories. Ralph Waldo
Emerson talked about the over-soul in
1841.
Hmmmm. So maybe Nathan is the concurrent reincarnation of Beachbumbabs?
Maybe Zenking is the concurrent reincarnation of Zcore13?
So many better men, a few of them friends, are dead. And a thousand thousand slimy things live on, and so do I.
March 12th, 2019 at 10:40:09 AM
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Quote: LuckyPhowI'll close by giving a big thank-you to Bob for calling everyone's attention to Dr. Stevenson, a pioneer who suffered many slings and arrows from other medical (and other) professionals as he reported his research findings.
These people are bonefied scientists, they
do everything from the scientific standpoint.
They fully admit that after 60 years of nose
to the grindstone investigation, they have
no answer as to why a 3 year old would have
totally verifiable memories of the life of
someone who died. They have theories, and
they all point to reincarnation.
What's interesting is how boring all of this is.
Just like life is mostly boring, so is the transition
after death boring.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
March 12th, 2019 at 10:53:33 AM
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EB is the reincarnation of Yogi Berra.Quote: EvenBobI'm an atheist, thank god..,
What's interesting is how boring all of this is.
"Truth is ever to be found in the simplicity, and not in the multiplicity and confusion of things."
-- Isaac Newton
