SHOOTING at Mandalay festival
Las Vegas Blvd closed from Tropicana to Russell when I went out at mid-day. Identical "Vegas Strong" sign at the Palms (perhaps all Stations?). Identical "Prayers for the victims, thanks to the brave first responders" signs at several (all?) MGM properties.Quote: KeeneoneI did not notice much of a change around town. Seemed like a normal Tuesday ...
Quote: KeeneoneWent out today (1st time since the tragic event) and enjoyed a beautiful day in the valley. I did not notice much of a change around town. Seemed like a normal Tuesday (not saying this is good or bad, just posting my experiences)...
Another Day Another Dollar. Honestly this will do nothing to stop Vegas and I honestly haven't watched or listened about it too much. Some guy went nuts and killed a bunch of people. I've seen it before and I know it will happen again. I have to agree with Aces that Country Music could make you Hot Sucker and Rage Quit like he did. Little children dying worse deaths all over the world. Plenty of injustice all over the world that this tragedy doesn't even compare. We are all going down soon enough. Nobody is guaranteed another minute. Tom Petty just fell down on his floor and it was basically over.
I am just glad I have plenty of Guns and Ammo... that is the important thing to buy for me... the Ammo! The nice thing about Guns is that they don't lose value and usually only go up so it is a safe place to hide money IMHO. I'm betting Gun Sales and Prices go up after this.
Quote: DocLas Vegas Blvd closed from Tropicana to Russell when I went out at mid-day. Identical "Vegas Strong" sign at the Palms (perhaps all Stations?). Identical "Prayers for the victims, thanks to the brave first responders" signs at several (all?) MGM properties.
I did not make it to the strip today. Other than the signage (with well wishes), have you noticed any change in the city? Maybe the mood or something else? Others have mentioned bag searches.
In the hours following a violent rampage in Las Vegas in which a lone attacker killed more than 50 individuals and seriously injured 400 others, citizens living in the only country where this kind of mass killing routinely occurs reportedly concluded Monday that there was no way to prevent the massacre from taking place. This was a terrible tragedy, but sometimes these things just happen and theres nothing anyone can do to stop them, said Iowa resident Kyle Rimmels, echoing sentiments expressed by tens of millions of individuals who reside in a nation where over half of the world deadliest mass shootings have occurred in the past 50 years and whose citizens are 20 times more likely to die of gun violence than those of other developed nations. Its a shame, but what can we do? There really wasn't anything that was going to keep these individuals from snapping and killing a lot of people if that's what they really wanted. At press time, residents of the only economically advanced nation in the world where roughly two mass shootings have occurred every month for the past eight years were referring to themselves and their situation as helpless.
I have not witnessed any bag searches. Monday evening, there were a couple of guards/monitors on the entrance drive at the Venetian, but they just waved us through. I used to encounter that all of the time at the self-parking entrance at the Bellagio, and it may be the norm for the Venetian. We noticed what seemed to be a higher number of police vehicles parked on the streets with lights flashing and officers mostly just standing around, as if they wanted to demonstrate a police presence.Quote: KeeneoneI did not make it to the strip today. Other than the signage (with well wishes), have you noticed any change in the city? Maybe the mood or something else? Others have mentioned bag searches.
I think I sense the mood being down just a bit, but that might just be my own mood.
Quote: Rigondeaux
On the other hand, I think we clearly have a right to own some types of guns.
Should the right to bear arms, also have to mean the right to bear an armory and thousands of rounds of ammunition?
Personally, I think multiple purchases in either case should put some authority on alert whether there is any other reason or not.
As one of the survivors said on the news, at least we did some things different after 911. Shootings, no one really wants to do anything different. Same shit, different day, no improvement.
Quote: rxwineShould the right to bear arms, also have to mean the right to bear an armory and thousands of rounds of ammunition?
Personally, I think multiple purchases in either case should put some authority on alert whether there is any other reason or not.
As one of the survivors said on the news, at least we did some things different after 911. Shootings, no one really wants to do anything different. Same shit, different day, no improvement.
I think we went waaaaayyyy to far after 9/11. Your Clinton/Bush types were probably going to eradicate the 4th anyway, but they really went wild after that. We also destroyed a country (or 2) that had nothing to do with 9/11 and created ISIS, so we didn't prevent more terrorism very effectively. So what did we really do after 9/11? A cannon ball into a pool of crap.
I'm not sure that the amount of ammo or number of weapons is as important as the type. And, how do you know if someone is firing off all his ammo at the range or stockpiling it?
If someone had a stockpile of hunting rifles and shotguns, I don't know how concerned I'd be.
If someone had a stockpile of weapons used only for killing as many people as possible as fast as possible, I might be a little concerned, even though they are probably harmless. Obviously, these weapons serve no practical purpose outside of slaughter.
The rebuttal to that is, people think there's going to be a civil war or something so they want to be armed for it. That point of contention can probably never be resolved. It's just a power struggle between people who think you need military weapons for the coming civil war, or whatever, and people who don't.
Quote: johnnyqMrs. Q and I were planning on being in Vegas this upcoming weekend. Now she says she would feel wrong going out to Vegas and having a good time so close to this horrible tragedy.
It had not occurred to me not to go. This event is about as bad as it gets, but going to Vegas or not this weekend, unfortunately, can't change what has already happened. But I don't think I can, or should, try to change the way she feels.
Would you still go to Vegas ?
Quote: beachbumbabsEverything else being equal, yes I would. In defiance of this person trying to terrorize crowds and venues, if for no other reason.
I wish I needed to attend G2E this year. It would mean I had a game on display there. I would stay and do it, though maybe some will leave.
I hope you will follow through with your plans.
We are leaning now on going to Vegas this weekend as originally planned. Thoughts and prayers to everyone affected, and thanks to the 1st Responders.
Quote: NeutrinoI heard rumors of the inventer of ez pai gow died during the shooting. can anyone confirm if this is true or not?
Dan died a few months ago.
What about a man who lives in rural Maryland and his barn contains a fully functioning military weapon capable of taking out Albuquerque, New Mexico? Would you worry then? In fact, he was an explosives expert and federal contractor who put his skills to use in the Middle East, not in the USA.Quote: RigondeauxI'm not sure that the amount of ammo or number of weapons is as important as the type. And, how do you know if someone is firing off all his ammo at the range or stockpiling it?
If someone had a stockpile of hunting rifles and shotguns, I don't know how concerned I'd be.
If someone had a stockpile of weapons used only for killing as many people as possible as fast as possible, I might be a little concerned, even though they are probably harmless. Obviously, these weapons serve no practical purpose outside of slaughter.
ons for the coming civil war, or whatever, and people who don't.
So back to the question, was the suite comped or not? It tells us a lot about the killer and MGM.
Quote: AxelWolfHow does that tell us a lot about the killer?
In an odd sort of irony, the famous FOX News legal expert Bob Massi, who is based in Las Vegas and has been for decades, asked this same question a few hours after my post. He also wants to know....said so right there on the air...
It tells us if the killer was in fact a comped in a nice expensive suite, based on his play and credit line, on an obviously peak time with the concert going on. Knowing if he plays at that level gives us some insight as to his general disposition.
When you combine his now obvious gambling addiction with the well known fact that Filipino's will drive you not only nuts, but mad, we may have discovered the motive for his act.
We are also interested in why the Filipino "girlfriend" came back to the USA. (due back as I type this)
I just thought it was fairly well established by now this guy was, in fact, a high-roller. Knowing if this suite was comped or not would tell us very little IMO. I'm guessing it was comped.Quote: NokTangContext:
So back to the question, was the suite comped or not? It tells us a lot about the killer and MGM.
In an odd sort of irony, the famous FOX News legal expert Bob Massi, who is based in Las Vegas and has been for decades, asked this same question a few hours after my post. He also wants to know....said so right there on the air...
It tells us if the killer was in fact a comped in a nice expensive suite, based on his play and credit line, on an obviously peak time with the concert going on. Knowing if he plays at that level gives us some insight as to his general disposition.
When you combine his now obvious gambling addiction with the well known fact that Filipino's will drive you not only nuts, but mad, we may have discovered the motive for his act.
We are also interested in why the Filipino "girlfriend" came back to the USA. (due back as I type this)
Knowing how much this guy has won or lost gambling and his financial situation would add some insight to this.
If this was motivated due to gambling losses I can just imagine what kind of crap the religious and anti-gambling people will come up with. Las Vegas is already thought of as the modern day Sodom and Gomorrah.
Please excuse me if I don't understand the relevance. Check out this article, if you haven't:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-nation/wp/2017/10/02/las-vegas-gunman-liked-to-gamble-listened-to-country-music-lived-quiet-retired-life-before-massacre/
According to his brother, losing a million wouldn't really hurt him and he made money gambling. His brother also says that the casino comped him the top floor of the Atlantis on one occasion. His brother says he played $100/hand Video Poker (which may be denomination or approximate total bet) and that, from the article, "He's the small end of the big fish."
He also wired a substantial sum of money out prior to the shooting, so he clearly has access to cash.
So, we know he gambles a lot.
Thus, his room was either comped during a peak time which means he gambles a substantial sum of money, (We already know that) or alternatively, that he paid for his suite because he has access to money (which we also already know).
Therefore, I fail to see what the room being comped or not tells us that we don't already know.
Can someone say watch list?Quote: monet0412Another Day Another Dollar. Honestly this will do nothing to stop Vegas and I honestly haven't watched or listened about it too much. Some guy went nuts and killed a bunch of people. I've seen it before and I know it will happen again. I have to agree with Aces that Country Music could make you Hot Sucker and Rage Quit like he did. Little children dying worse deaths all over the world. Plenty of injustice all over the world that this tragedy doesn't even compare. We are all going down soon enough. Nobody is guaranteed another minute. Tom Petty just fell down on his floor and it was basically over.
I am just glad I have plenty of Guns and Ammo... that is the important thing to buy for me... the Ammo! The nice thing about Guns is that they don't lose value and usually only go up so it is a safe place to hide money IMHO. I'm betting Gun Sales and Prices go up after this.
Can someone say hypocrites lol !!
I guess what happens in Vegas stays in Vegas is a bunch of malarkey!?
Quote: NokTang
When you combine his now obvious gambling addiction with the well known fact that Filipino's will drive you not only nuts, but mad, we may have discovered the motive for his act.
I have never heard this about Filipino's and I was born in Asia
Where does this come from?
"Well known fact" ???????????????
really?
Sounds like total BS to me
I get why the general population who knows very little about gambling and comps might think a comped suite has some big significants, but I'm bewildered as to why anyone who's been around here for any length of time thinks it's of any real importance.Quote: Mission146NokTang,
Please excuse me if I don't understand the relevance. Check out this article, if you haven't:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-nation/wp/2017/10/02/las-vegas-gunman-liked-to-gamble-listened-to-country-music-lived-quiet-retired-life-before-massacre/
According to his brother, losing a million wouldn't really hurt him and he made money gambling. His brother also says that the casino comped him the top floor of the Atlantis on one occasion. His brother says he played $100/hand Video Poker (which may be denomination or approximate total bet) and that, from the article, "He's the small end of the big fish."
He also wired a substantial sum of money out prior to the shooting, so he clearly has access to cash.
So, we know he gambles a lot.
Thus, his room was either comped during a peak time which means he gambles a substantial sum of money, (We already know that) or alternatively, that he paid for his suite because he has access to money (which we also already know).
Therefore, I fail to see what the room being comped or not tells us that we don't already know.
If the guy was worth millions at one time and that was his last 100k, I might start wondering if gambling losses were a major part of his motivation. Why go after innocent people at a music festival and not just target the casinos directly? It's mind-boggling to think this guy wanted to target the entire LV economy and he set out to be the # 1 mass shooter in US history.
Quote: terapinedI have never heard this about Filipino's and I was born in Asia
Where does this come from?
"Well known fact" ???????????????
really?
Sounds like total BS to me
Well known by anyone who has dealt with or dated Filipino's. You, as the saying goes, have to beat your own head against a urine soaked wall to get in the same frame of mind.
Quote: AxelWolf
If the guy was worth millions at one time and that was his last 100k, I might start wondering if gambling losses were a major part of his motivation. Why go after innocent people at a music festival and not just target the casinos directly? It's mind-boggling to think this guy wanted to target the entire LV economy and he set out to be the # 1 mass shooter in US history.
I would agree with that completely, but I think we both agree that whether or not the suite was comped has nothing to do with whether or not he was down to his last 100k. He was either down to his last 100k or he wasn't, but the suite being comped or not tells us nothing about that.
It's hard to understand the motivations of a mass shooter, and I cannot even pretend to speculate. Maybe he just didn't want to live anymore and decided to go out big. That's actually why I would favor the news media publishing information about shooters, but not their actual names, if it can be avoided. I'm not saying that's why all shooters do it, or even a secondary reason...I wouldn't know...but it is possible.
Quote: Mission146
Therefore, I fail to see what the room being comped or not tells us that we don't already know.
As mentioned, the fact it's being hidden from us means something. It isn't the secret clue to anything I suppose but is part of the puzzle most of us are trying to figure out...why? did he do it???
Quote: Mission146I would agree with that completely, but I think we both agree that whether or not the suite was comped has nothing to do with whether or not he was down to his last 100k. He was either down to his last 100k or he wasn't, but the suite being comped or not tells us nothing about that.
It's hard to understand the motivations of a mass shooter, and I cannot even pretend to speculate. Maybe he just didn't want to live anymore and decided to go out big. That's actually why I would favor the news media publishing information about shooters, but not their actual names, if it can be avoided. I'm not saying that's why all shooters do it, or even a secondary reason...I wouldn't know...but it is possible.
I am certain that MB / MGM officials are being grilled to figure out any unusual behaviors and try to detail all of his moves via security footage and interviews with security, housekeeping, food services, gaming hosts, etc.
I am sure the authorities will figure out his financial situation pretty quickly. It's as good of an excuse as any and with people grasping for straws any insight, whether speculative or not, is news. It would be pretty terrible for Vegas if it is found that his gambling losses sparked this attack and that MGM was complicit by granting him lines of credit on money he shouldn't have had. The MGM would be sued into oblivion if that were to be proven. The MGM is going to be sued into oblivion anyway, but I don't think there is cause right now to show MGM negligence unless a housekeeper / room service staff knew that the killer had an unusual amount of weaponry and said nothing, or worse, said something to a supervisor and nothing was done.
Interestingly enough, Steve Wynn a year ago revealed his hotel's security measures. Video here. Likely the killer does not get away with this at Wynn. I see all strip hotels doing this.
In people with mental illnesses (which includes psychopaths), it is difficult to bring any kind of logic to this senseless act. It could have been voices telling him to do it.
Yeah, but these false positives are not acceptable. Think of just how many AP's alone (not drug dealers, no drugs, innocent and traveling) have been pulled over and a K-9 unit "signaled" there were drugs in the car - allowing the cops to ILLEGALLY SEARCH someone's vehicle. Every single story I've heard of a K-9 unit sniffing a car they've "signaled" drugs. Every single one. REAL K-9 sniffing teams would be lovely, and sound like a phenomenal idea (just like this gun oil sniffing machine) but when you give the police something like that, suddenly it'll start reading a false positive on everyone (especially if you're black).Quote: FleaStiffAs for a sniffer yeah there is always the chance of someone's salami sandwich triggering it but if the device is small and cheap, then false positives can be dealt with. Heck, any checkpoint is often going to have gun oil from the guard's own weapon...
Unrealistic??? Okay, say someone didn't even want to kill you, just annoy and piss you off. Why the hell wouldn't they just call in and say those things just to have you have to then jump through the hoops of "proving" your sanity? The "hotline" idea is hideously flawed. It would never work.Quote: boymimboThat is a unrealistic scenario and I would rather have that happen in a blue moon than have 20,000 people commit suicide with a firearm every year. I admire your imagination though...
Yes, I'm familiar with a bit more psychology than I've discussed on these forums. ALL THE SAME the questions are designed with specific leading/answers to check consistency/etc/etc. It really is NOT hard to pass them... really it's not. And here's the most interesting case anyways... OKAY say you've got a ton of southerners who of course are proud 'MERICA gun owners. Say they FAIL the test. Are you going to take their guns away? lol... You'll only EVER get those guns by prying them from their cold, dead hands. The actual application of this fails as well. MILLIONS would NEVER give up their guns, ever. Is the government going to start a civil war against them?Quote: boymimboIf you've taken any real mental health tests administered by a professional like I have you know that lying on them doesn't work. They don't ask questions like "Do you have suicidal thoughts?" They ask far less obvious questions in a long series designed to detect when you are being inconsistent.
The flaw here is that in order to change, we'd need to take guns from people that already have them. Again I pose the question: which side (Dem or Republican) would do that? It's a laughable thought that EITHER side would EVER try to take guns from anyone, especially given the 2nd amendment is to protect ourselves from a tyrannical government trying to TAKE our guns...Quote: boymimboNations can change identities...
Quote: boymimboI am certain that MB / MGM officials are being grilled to figure out any unusual behaviors and try to detail all of his moves via security footage and interviews with security, housekeeping, food services, gaming hosts, etc.
Undoubtedly so, which should be to figure out how many times he managed to cargo a modified, automatic or semi-automatic weapon to his room undetected as much as anything else. Granted, not the fault of Mandalay Bay as there are no laws that say he should have been searched, at any point, but maybe some sort of metal detector law for buildings over a certain occupancy will be considered in the future. Probably not, but dare to dream.
Quote:I am sure the authorities will figure out his financial situation pretty quickly. It's as good of an excuse as any and with people grasping for straws any insight, whether speculative or not, is news. It would be pretty terrible for Vegas if it is found that his gambling losses sparked this attack and that MGM was complicit by granting him lines of credit on money he shouldn't have had. The MGM would be sued into oblivion if that were to be proven. The MGM is going to be sued into oblivion anyway, but I don't think there is cause right now to show MGM negligence unless a housekeeper / room service staff knew that the killer had an unusual amount of weaponry and said nothing, or worse, said something to a supervisor and nothing was done.
I imagine they probably will, although, we don't know what cash reserves (paper, bearer bonds) he might have had and where those might have been hiding. In other words, he might have actually had more than they are ultimately able to find, so anything else is conjecture or a minimal case.
Gambling losses would not, "Spark," the attack, the perpetrator sparked the attack by shooting a bunch of people. I also cannot imagine how gambling losses would make MGM, or any other casino, complicit provided they are lending money within State and Federal law as well as Gaming Regulations. They have a responsibility to transact financial dealings in accordance with the law, and that's it.
Should casinos be more proactive in attempting to identify problem gamblers and not extend credit to them? Maybe. It's arguable that they should. However, as long as all the financial dealings themselves are above board, I don't see what liability they could possibly have for one man's actions.
The housekeeper point is interesting, but if all of his weapons and modifications were obtained legally and he was in legal possession of them, then what duty does the housekeeper, or anyone else, have to report anything. Granted, they are almost all muzzle loaders, but my Step-Dad has over ten guns, should I report him for an inordinate number of guns?
Again, I'm not saying a housekeeper shouldn't report that, but does it really rise to the level of negligence on the part of the property if there is no legal duty to report such a thing?
Maybe there is a legal duty to report that. Do you know? I don't. I don't really pay much attention to reporting laws in the State of Nevada. In Ohio, I know there would only be a need to report it if you knew a Felony was taking place, but if the weapons are legally possessed, there is no Felony. In a case such as that, I would personally probably report that sort of arsenal in a hotel room, but I do not believe that I would be under any legal obligation to do so (in that state) because I have no way of knowing an actual Felony had been committed simply because someone is in possession of a crap ton of firearms.
Also, housekeepers at any hotel I ever worked at were specifically instructed to NEVER look inside of anyone's bags, so the only thing a housekeeper would have to report (if they were in bags) is that the guy had a ton of luggage...and that's not really something I could imagine anyone would report.
Quote:Interestingly enough, Steve Wynn a year ago revealed his hotel's security measures. Video here. Likely the killer does not get away with this at Wynn. I see all strip hotels doing this.
Great video, and again no laws saying so, but they should have all already been doing that. I think that there should be a law that states any buildings of a certain maximum occupancy (or greater) should take those kinds of actions...at least metal detectors.
Quote:In people with mental illnesses (which includes psychopaths), it is difficult to bring any kind of logic to this senseless act. It could have been voices telling him to do it.
May well never know.
Quote: Mission146Is it being hidden or has nobody asked directly? Is Mandalay Bay refusing to comment, in general terms? I don't really know that anybody is hiding anything, more like whether or not the room was comped is as trivial a detail as what the shooter had for breakfast that morning.
You can indicate my curiosity about it is "trivial" since I'm a nobody but it will be difficult for you to maintain the inquiry and interest of Bob Massi on National TV mention of the question is "trivial". He said "I want to know" if the suite was comped. He's an as you might know, attorney in Las Vegas with a show on FOX News. It's really fine with us that it tells you nothing, but it tells us something.
I also find it odd that you consider the room service aspect trivial as well. As you may not be aware, one of the remote camera's was on a room service food cart on that floor(may have been in front of his room?).
Thank you for being gracious and understanding. We are not arguing, we are discussing something without the all too often name calling and personal insults. Kind regards also as have enjoyed your writing's over the years.
I think they are grasping at straws finding out if the suite was comped or not.Quote: boymimboI am sure the authorities will figure out his financial situation pretty quickly. It's as good of an excuse as any and with people grasping for straws any insight, whether speculative or not, is news.
I take it you mean lines of credit he didn't have the ability to cover?Quote: boymimboIt would be pretty terrible for Vegas if it is found that his gambling losses sparked this attack and that MGM was complicit by granting him lines of credit on money he shouldn't have had.
"Shouldn't have had" If someone has a Million dollars should they be able to get a Million dollars in credit to gamble with?
If the casino knew the guy had a gambling problem and they were using incentives such and comped suites to encouraging him I can see how bad that might look.
Since it's being reported that his GF was a host (hostess is the word they used one time, they said her job was to encourage gamblers) it will be interesting to see if she has something to say regarding them encouraging him to gamble. She could really put a hurt on MGM if she goes down that road.
Quote: NokTangI had asked about the room(suite actually) being comped a few pages back. No one has replied and I've not seen it reported on.
I would lay good odds it was. Like I wrote earlier, I either stayed in that suite or one directly above or below it many times, and it was always comped. Casinos also save the best suites for their high rollers as comps.
However, what difference does it make if it was comped? The Mandalay bears no fault in all of this either way.
Quote: Rigondeaux
The rebuttal to that is, people think there's going to be a civil war or something so they want to be armed for it. That point of contention can probably never be resolved. It's just a power struggle between people who think you need military weapons for the coming civil war, or whatever, and people who don't.
I think you should be able to be armed to the same extent as the people that you will be protecting yourself from. Create a detente situation. Nukes for everybody.
Quote: Wizard
However, what difference does it make if it was comped? The Mandalay bears no fault in all of this either way.
Please call Bob Massi for your answer. It matters to him enough he mentioned the question needed an answer on National TV and it matters to me. It doesn't matter to you or several others. The Mandalay may in fact bear some responsibility in many opinions.
Quote: MrVIt seems a bit ironic that the worst "monster" in the history of Las Vegas turns out to be the exact type of person the casinos want as a patron: a high roller.
Every account of his casino action I've read indicate he was a slot player. Sure, they have some high limit slots these days but I don't get the "high roller" label.
Quote: AxelWolf
Since it's being reported that his GF was a host (hostess is the word they used one time, they said her job was to encourage gamblers) it will be interesting to see if she has something to say regarding them encouraging him to gamble. She could really put a hurt on MGM if she goes down that road.
I'm not sure you have the context correct. I think she was more of a hostess in a slot area of the Atlantis in Reno. She came back to the USA for no good reason. She's Filipino. She took his SH.. in public so the report goes. MGM's not worried about her we can be sure of. Focus on the comped suite, if in fact comped, and you have your path to motive IMHO.
Quote: NokTangEvery account of his casino action I've read indicate he was a slot player. Sure, they have some high limit slots these days but I don't get the "high roller" label.
Casinos love it when people regularly bet big amounts in -EV slots.
By report Paddock bet pretty big: big enough to win big jackpots, generate SCRs, and (apparently) get a suite comped due to his play level.
No, he's not a true whale: he was not betting hundreds of thousands on every turn of the cards: but he was the exact type of gambler casinos try to coddle as he plays slots, not table games (less variance for casinos to absorb).
Quote: NokTangThe Mandalay may in fact bear some responsibility in many opinions.
It is always convenient to have a living person or entity to blame for everything, isn't it?
Quote: NokTang. Focus on the comped suite, if in fact comped, and you have your path to motive IMHO.
I will keep an open mind as things progress, but as things stand right now, this makes no sense to me whatsoever.
Quote: WizardIt is always convenient to have a living person or entity to blame for everything, isn't it?
More important is a company with deep pockets.
Quote: MrVIt seems a bit ironic that the worst "monster" in the history of Las Vegas turns out to be the exact type of person the casinos want as a patron: a high roller.
I don't know what Casino in Vegas you go to but it has been clear for many years, decades even that they want volume. They want a million ploppies with low bankrolls playing 15% losers. They don't want 10 players with million dollar bankrolls playing beatable games or close to beatable games.
Quote: IbeatyouracesMaybe he just had a hatred for country music.
I heard reports that he previously tried to get rooms during a similar music festival that featured rap artists, but the "specific" suites he requested weren't available.
If true, and assuming the request was for the same corner suite for the same purpose, this would lend support to a "kill anyone", rather than a "kill cowboys" mindset.
Or... maybe he was so upset that he got passed over for a comp during the rap concert weekend that he went nuts?
Quote: WizardIt is always convenient to have a living person or entity to blame for everything, isn't it?
For the record, unless there’s some kind of egregious information we haven’t learned yet, I don’t think that MB should be held responsible for this.
But I think the argument that the lawyers will try to take, is that gambling addicts tend to be unstable people, and if the casino is purposely inviting this type of person with comps, they’re putting the overall safety of casino patrons at risk. Not that I agree with it, but I can see the logical connection. Bars have been held responsible many times for injuries resulting from patrons that have been overserved.
How would you identify a gambling addict unless they self-report? Unless credit is involved, the casino knows nothing about your personal financial situation. Throwing away $100k/yr in the casino could be completely reasonable for somone making 7 figures.
Quote: AyecarumbaI heard reports that he previously tried to get rooms during a similar music festival that featured rap artists, but the "specific" suites he requested weren't available.
If true, and assuming the request was for the same corner suite for the same purpose, this would lend support to a "kill anyone", rather than a "kill cowboys" mindset.
Or... maybe he was so upset that he got passed over for a comp during the rap concert weekend that he went nuts?
Maybe he read the "AC rap concert" thread warnings and wanted to prove a point.
Quote: NokTangPlease call Bob Massi for your answer. It matters to him enough he mentioned the question needed an answer on National TV and it matters to me. It doesn't matter to you or several others. The Mandalay may in fact bear some responsibility in many opinions.
ROTFL
You fell for the oldest trick in the book to get viewers
Bob Massi says his question is important and wants you to keep watching.
My advice, turn him off. But you cant, he got you. LOL
The question is not important and being on National TV is meaningless
Its still a meaningless question
Quote: NokTangYou can indicate my curiosity about it is "trivial" since I'm a nobody but it will be difficult for you to maintain the inquiry and interest of Bob Massi on National TV mention of the question is "trivial". He said "I want to know" if the suite was comped. He's an as you might know, attorney in Las Vegas with a show on FOX News. It's really fine with us that it tells you nothing, but it tells us something.
I wouldn't call your curiosity trivial when it comes to this. My point is that the following statements are absolutely true:
1.) He rented, by one means or another, a room at Mandalay Bay.
2.) He transferred, by one means or another, a number of semi-automatic, modified semi-automatic and/or automatic weapons to that room.
3.) He used a hammer to break multiple windows.
4.) From those broken windows, he fired down upon a crowd of concert attendees.
5.) Several hundred were injured.
6.) Last report I saw, fifty-nine were killed, so assumes nobody else succumbs to their injuries.
That said, I care more about your curiosities than I do about either those of Bob Massi or those of Fox News. People are dead. I really don't care what the legal implications are for Mandalay Bay, MGM Resorts or any of it.
So, in my personal opinion, whether or not the suite was comped is trivial. Comped or non-comped doesn't bring anyone back to life.
Further, we have corroboration from his brother that he was a big time gambler. We also know he wired substantial cash. Therefore, he either had access to the sort of cash that would pay for the suite, access to someone else with that sort of cash, or MGM extended him a comped room based on his play.
Quote:I also find it odd that you consider the room service aspect trivial as well. As you may not be aware, one of the remote camera's was on a room service food cart on that floor(may have been in front of his room?).
I only spoke to housekeepers and my knowledge of Ohio law as to what they are or are not required to report to police. I am aware of the camera installed on the room service cart, and that is a pertinent matter. On the other hand, it is not unusual for a person to order room service and request that someone knock and just leave the cart outside the door. It may or may not be trivial. If the room service guy or other staff helped with it, then that is not trivial.
Quote:Thank you for being gracious and understanding. We are not arguing, we are discussing something without the all too often name calling and personal insults. Kind regards also as have enjoyed your writing's over the years.
Thank you for the compliment, and I have always enjoyed all of our interactions over the years!
Quote: NokTangFocus on the comped suite, if in fact comped, and you have your path to motive IMHO.
I just want to know what your angle or Massi's angle is. That he may have had a gambling problem? He could have had a gambling problem with or without a comped suite, we know he had access to substantial casino credit at multiple places.
Quote: gamerfreak
But I think the argument that the lawyers will try to take, is that gambling addicts tend to be unstable people, and if the casino is purposely inviting this type of person with comps, they’re putting the overall safety of casino patrons at risk. Not that I agree with it, but I can see the logical connection. Bars have been held responsible many times for injuries resulting from patrons that have been overserved.
That's a garbage law too, with respect to the bars. The worst part is that it is often last bar to serve, which essentially means that a guy can get annihilated in one bar, but then go to a second bar and have one drink, and if he nails someone, the second bar can also be held liable.
At least that is logical in the sense that the bar(s) provided the substance that directly led to the impairment which directly led to the vehicular homicide and/or injury.
Did Mandalay Bay sell the dude the guns? Were the guns and modifications comped to him? Did I miss the MLIFE Firearms Emporium when I was there? I knew I should have looked around more before filling my stomach at the buffet.
Quote:How would you identify a gambling addict unless they self-report? Unless credit is involved, the casino knows nothing about your personal financial situation. Throwing away $100k/yr in the casino could be completely reasonable for somone making 7 figures.
I agree with that. I mean, there are other, "Tells," don't get me wrong. Kind of like that one documentary with that host who essentially directly said that his one client from Canada had a gambling problem. Time at table, on device. Funny thing is addicts and AP's share a ton of traits.
