Gary Johnson for President

Quote: ams288

Check out fivethirtyeight.
Clinton 47.1
Trump 43.7
Johnson 7.9

I need to learn who this Johnson guy is. Why does the media seem to pay no attention to him? Could be the biggest spoiler since Ralph Nader.

Quote: Wizard

I need to learn who this Johnson guy is. Why does the media seem to pay no attention to him? Could be the biggest spoiler since Ralph Nader.

As a libertarian I give you permission to learn nothing about Gary Johnson. The old joke is that libertarians are just republicans who smoke pot, in the case of Johnson it happens to be not at all a joke---he was the governor of NM as a republican and he uses marijuana.

Quote: Wizard

I need to learn who this Johnson guy is. Why does the media seem to pay no attention to him? Could be the biggest spoiler since Ralph Nader.

Gary Johnson is the Libertarian candidate. He is a former owner of a medical marijuana company. He has a wide array of "different" views -no government controls on private gun ownership, wide open borders with no controls on immigration, marijuana for everyone, shrink the federal government to a fraction of its size - that would normally be sufficient to make him unattractive to both Democrats and Republicans.

But Johnson is emerging as the "protest" candidate for people who are repulsed by both candidates. Everyone knows he won't win, so you don't really need to be concerned about his views, and by voting for him you need not do a write-in vote (which takes a lot more time) and your disapproval of Hillary and Trump will show up visibly in the election results.

Many Bernie supporters and Never Trump Republicans are planning to vote for Johnson, without supporting him with donations, etc.. I may vote for him as well, just to protest Trump and Hillary. I think 10% of the popular vote is a possibility.

This thread is a split-off from presidential betting. To answer my own question, here is my own summary of Gary Johnson's positions:

• Taxes: 43% immediate cut in federal spending. Elimination of most forms of taxes, including the income tax. Main source of tax revenue would be a sales tax on non-essential items.
• Energy: Supports coal and nuclear energy. Believes government should mostly stay out of it.
• Free trade: Supports it and opposes tariffs.
• Military: Supports a 43% cut in the military budget. Believes we should stay out of most foreign conflicts. Opposed both the Afghanistan and Iraq wars.
• Gun rights: Strongly in favor.
• Abortion: Believes it should be up to each state. Opposes late-term abortions.
• Drug policy: Legalize marijuana. Other drugs should be seem as a health problem rather than a crime problem.
• Education: Supports private school vouchers.

Source: Political positions of Gary Johnson. Click that link for many more positions. Here is a link about Gary Johnson himself.

My question to the Republicans on the board is why isn't there a mass movement to switch over to supporting Johnson? I know that few people want to waste their vote on a protest candidate but Johnson seems more than that. Maybe his positions are a little strong but he seems to stand for what Republicans used to stand for. I can see how the religious Republicans would have their issues with him, but I imagine they are not in love with Trump either.

I personally agree with most of his positions.

The problem is, we pretend it is something it isn't when we vote for somebody who has no chance. Then that candidate just takes votes away from one side - in this case, the Republican.

So he needs to convince me he can throw it into the House of Reps. I *think* that would mean a dark horse could win?

Quote: Wizard

My question to the Republicans on the board is why isn't there a mass movement to switch over to supporting Johnson? I know that few people want to waste their vote on a protest candidate but Johnson seems more than that. Maybe his positions are a little strong but he seems to stand for what Republicans used to stand for. I can see how the religious Republicans would have their issues with him, but I imagine they are not in love with Trump either.

I personally agree with most of his positions.

So do I. If I may add two cents about free trade, some of the so-called free trade deals are anything but free trade. Nafta was like 1200 pages of regulated trade, or something like that. I mean, I may be simple-minded, but it seems like free trade should only require ONE sheet of paper. Lift restrictions, sign, sign, and that's it. Presto, free trade.

The rest of what he says above, I could live with. Most things should be up to the states, "respectively, or to the people".

I may vote for this guy. Thanks for posting.

Quote: odiousgambit

The problem is, we pretend it is something it isn't when we vote for somebody who has no chance.

There's no pretending. Most people know when they vote for someone with no chance, it's just a matter of principle. I'm a republican, but I would never, and have never, voted for a member of the Bush Crime Family. In fact, I skipped voting for Reagan way back when, BECAUSE of his VP pick, Bush Senior. The Bushes are not nice people. Prescott Bush was NOT a nice man.

Besides, usually some of the same people are behind both presidential candidates. Some of the same people that gave us Bill Clinton, also gave us Bush, both Daddy Bush and Baby Bush. And those same people also gave us Obama. There's usually a group behind all of them, and their agenda is served no matter who wins.

Now congressional races are a horse of a different color. The electorate can still control who their congressmen are and how they vote on legislation. Local races are very important.

I've always wondered if conspiracy advocates are attracted to the Austrian school of economics or if the school makes its followers into them?

Quote: odiousgambit

The problem is, we pretend it is something it isn't when we vote for somebody who has no chance.

Maybe for you, that is what it is. Some people care more about their country than voting for a winner.

It seems what is most important to you is if your team wins or not, not whether or not America continues.

Quote: billryan

I've always wondered if conspiracy advocates are attracted to the Austrian school of economics or if the school makes its followers into them?

It's worse than that. Don't you know I see an Austrian under every bed?

Quote: billryan

I've always wondered if conspiracy advocates are attracted to the Austrian school of economics or if the school makes its followers into them?

That question keeps me up at night too.

Quote: Wizard

That question keeps me up at night too.

Great minds and all of that..

Quote: petroglyph

Maybe for you, that is what it is. Some people care more about their country than voting for a winner.

It seems what is most important to you is if your team wins or not, not whether or not America continues.

Everyone gets to decide how to cast their vote.

I would bet that most people feel they are doing what is best for their country with their vote, even if they vote straight party tickets every time, because they think their party will do the best job for the country.

Judging how someone feels about their country based on their vote is a bit harsh unless that vote is for someone who hates our country.

Not one of the candidates running for President "hates" our country.

Quote: petroglyph

Maybe for you, that is what it is. Some people care more about their country than voting for a winner.

It seems what is most important to you is if your team wins or not, not whether or not America continues.

If you want your vote to be symbolic, fine. But as long as a candidate without a majority of the vote can win, we are still just going to be stuck with the two party system. That will continue to mean there are only two real candidates, plus some folks you can use for your protest vote.

I was a fan in '12 and drove a couple of hours to see him at one point.

As governor, he vetoed approximately as many bills as the other 49 governors put together.

He's an athlete who's climbed Everest and ran the Ironman and who started using pot for pain after a bad hangliding accident, but says he has stopped for the campaign.

As far as I know, he's not pushing the 43% cut this time around.

Quote: Wizard

Taxes: 43% immediate cut in federal spending. Elimination of most forms of taxes, including the income tax. Main source of tax revenue would be a sales tax on non-essential items.

I personally agree with most of his positions.

I'm curious as to whether you agree with this particular position. A sales tax-only (or primarily) revenue system would have a major flaw that most people can't stomach: it would be strongly regressive. That term means that a disproportionate share of such taxes would be paid by those with the lowest incomes. Yes, you can set it up so that "essential" items aren't taxed (that's already the case in most states re groceries), but who decides what is essential and what isn't? In any event, the poor would still be spending most if not all of their incomes, and be subject to disproportionately higher taxes than the rich, who spend only a small fraction of their incomes.

It is also safe to say that such a sales tax would be FAR higher than existing sales taxes. Canada has the VAT, which is 14% (if memory serves) and that ONLY supports the provincial, not the federal governments. I've read that a national sales tax would have to be in the 20-30% range (depending on that "essentials" calculation). Wouldn't that be a major disruption to the economy if the prices of virtually all ("non-essential") products shot up?

In any event, voting for Johnson would be like voting for Homer Simpson. I'm not going to do that, even though I DO agree with Homer on all the important issues. Mmm, donuts.