Why have casino gambling revenues declined?

Over the past 10 years or so, there has been a well-documented decline in Nevada gaming revenues, several casino resorts in AC and Vegas have shut down and more than one major gaming corporation has filed for bankruptcy.

What is going on? Is it just a temporary downturn -perhaps due to the nation-wide economic recession? Or has the spread of casinos to so many states just caused an inevitable shift away from Vegas and Atlantic City?

Have gamblers turned their attention to other shiny things? Like fantasy sports: Draft Kings and Fan Duel? Or tournament poker, with a low effective rake and most of the rake going to WSOP, WPT and their circuits?

Or is everyone now spending so much time on Facebook, Playstation and games like Pokemon GO -that people no longer have as much time to go to casinos or as much need for the adrenaline rush of gambling? And what happens when 3-D virtual reality goggles technology matures and becomes cheap - how will a deck of cards and counting to 21 compete? Will we still be rolling dice?

History tells us that we underestimate change - that people always underestimate how much and how rapidly things can change. So most people assume that casinos will be with us forever - but is it possible that in 15-20 years the casino gaming industry will be much smaller -or even nonexistent? Or will casinos, like death and taxes, always be with us?

None of the above. I think less people are gambling, especially among young people. I cannot get my friends to come gamble with me. Nearly everyone I know under 30 has a ton of college debt, and have zero interest blowing $100-$200 on casino games. Plus there is so much more cheap entertainment options, usually right at home, than there was 20-30 years ago.

Quote: gordonm888

Or has the spread of casinos to so many states just caused an inevitable shift away from Vegas and Atlantic City?

This is by far the biggest impact. Though Las Vegas has responded somewhat well. It used to be you could get a room, meals, drinks, and shows for cheap because it was all subsidized by the gambling. Those things have now become expensive, but people are now willing to pay for the luxury as they aren't losing nearly as much on the casino floor. My understanding is the non-gambling revenue on the strip is way up.

Quote: gamerfreak

None of the above. I think less people are gambling, especially among young people. I cannot get my friends to come gamble with me. Nearly everyone I know under 30 has a ton of college debt, and have zero interest blowing $100-$200 on casino games. Plus there is so much more cheap entertainment options, usually right at home, than there was 20-30 years ago.

yup, rise in online social gaming.

and it's going to get worse if Pokémon Go is any indication.
more interactive cell phone games are coming.

Quote: TomG

This is by far the biggest impact. Though Las Vegas has responded somewhat well. It used to be you could get a room, meals, drinks, and shows for cheap because it was all subsidized by the gambling. Those things have now become expensive, but people are now willing to pay for the luxury as they aren't losing nearly as much on the casino floor. My understanding is the non-gambling revenue on the strip is way up.

yeah, more states allowing casinos also cuts down on people wanting to travel far to vegas/ac.


and here's another pic of Angie because poll:

Quote: 100xOdds

yup, rise in online social gaming.

and it's going to get worse if Pokémon Go is any indication.
more interactive cell phone games are coming.

Screw the little Pokemon images!
Now if you could bet on the outcome(s), legally, they might have something;-)

<edit> and another nice pic of Angie 100X. I noted you went deep into the file for the last one, and I don't even remember this one ;-)

It's classic supply and demand.

Supply now outstrips demand.

People don't feel much need to travel to Las Vegas to gamble; I certainly don't.

Yes, Las Vegas is keeping afloat in part due to nightclubs / party scene, but as more and more casinos get built elsewhere, it could share a fate similar to Atlantic City.

Las Vegas could be in serious trouble once the boomers die off.

Quote: 100xOdds

and here's another pic of Angie because poll:

Chatterbox?? I just met 'er!!

With regards to the poll, in my opinion, the two main factors are a rise in online gaming (casino, sports, video games) and a "bad economy."

I don't know if the total ball of wax is smaller or if the portion that is "Las Vegas" or even "Nevada" is simply a smalller portion of a total that is the same (or growing). Perhaps UNLV's Gambling Research Center has actual figures.

In any case, Nevada, which is mainly Las Vegas, is in decline, and I attribute it to the growing availability of other casino and resort/casino options all over the country, and... all over the world.

Macau's gaming revenue was ginormous, and is still enormous enough that Wynn continues to build there. New casinos in Singapore, Vietnam and possibly Japan mean there is no reason to come to the USA. Tribal gaming joints are intercepting folks on the roads to Nevada. Why go another 200 miles when you can get your gamble on at 6 places within 150 miles of your house?

Nevada has to re-trench. Ask and answer the question, "Why do I need to go to Nevada?"

The "Jump the Shark"moment will be when prostitution is legalized in Clark County.

Quote: Ayecarumba

The "Jump the Shark"moment will be when prostitution is legalized in Clark County.

ahh.. then other states will legalize it.
and as quickly as marijuana.

Quote: Ayecarumba

Tribal gaming joints are intercepting folks on the roads to Nevada. Why go another 200 miles when you can get your gamble on at 6 places within 150 miles of your house?

Personally speaking, Indian casinos have zero effect on my desire to gamble in Vegas. The rules, odds, and games are just better there. Not that I haven't dropped a few dollars in the local casinos, but they are definitely not keeping me from wanting to go to Vegas.

Honestly, now that I think about it, gambling in the local Indian casinos has probably stoked the flames for me to want to go to Vegas even more.

Wait until next year when pot tourism takes off.

Quote: 100xOdds

ahh.. then other states will legalize it.
and as quickly as marijuana.

No need to legalize dope in Nevada. The west coast will fall to "Reefer Madness" soon. Besides "Spice" is all over the place already.

While it used to be casinos, prostitution is now the only unique thing left in Nevada vs. other states in the union.

shitty games and shitty comps have driven gamblers from Las Vegas strip casinos. If you play blackjack for less than $50 as your lowest bet, no reason to go to Vegas for most people. You're local game or off strip is better. They've driven out a large segment of the loyal middle tier gambling population that asks for a reasonable value for their money.

The AP's from WOV are killing it.

Apparently, gaming revenue in the U.S. is actually up vs. last year:

Month	Total USA	%Δ
January	3,179,715,732	0.43%
February	3,381,986,209	7.97%
March	3,388,808,628	-0.66%
April	3,362,457,300	3.09%
YTD	13,326,386,860	2.74%

In the same period, revenue vs. the prior year in Nevada was down 0.12%

Nevada's annual revenue:
2015 was up vs. 2014 by .95%
2014 was down vs. 2013 by 1.22%
2013 was up vs. 2012 by 2.62%

Source: David G. Schwartz. National Commercial Casino Gaming Monthly Revenues
Las Vegas: Center for Gaming Research, University Libraries, University of Nevada Las Vegas, 2016.

So the figures are bouncing around, but essentially flat in Nevada for the last five years. In the meantime, pay tables are getting worse, 6:5 is spreading like Zika virus, shrinking player's bankrolls like Brazilian baby heads.

Players can only be squeezed so far. It appears they are going elsewhere, rather than spending more on gaming in Nevada.

People are inherently dumb and have worse memories. Had a conversation with a guy while playing low stakes VP at a South Point bar and he was telling me how he used to Diamond at Harrah' but quit playing BJ when they switched from 2-1 to 3-2 on Blackjacks. He thought it was around 1998 or so. It wasn't worth pressing the point.

Quote: Ayecarumba

6:5 is spreading like Zika virus, shrinking player's bankrolls like Brazilian baby heads.

LOL, great quote. Very funny.

When I first heard that Nevada had outlawed Draft Kings and Fan Duel it got me to thinking about how much fantasy sports is competing with casinos for gamblers. Analytical gamblers no longer analyze what the True Count should be in order to increase your bet, or how to play a pocket pair of 8-8s in Hold-em. Instead they study game film and internet sites looking to get an edge when forming fantasy teams.

In terms of actual expenditures, the Fantasy Sports Trade Association – yes, there is a trade association – estimates that 32 million Americans spend $467 per person or about $15 billion/yr in total playing. Roughly, 11 billion flows toward football.

And isn't betting on fantasy teams more complex and more engaging than simply betting on the outcome of a game? Much less betting against the 10% vigorish of a sports book? I wonder if Vegas is simply unable to innovate enough to create new games of chance that are complex and engaging?

Quote: gordonm888

When I first heard that Nevada had outlawed Draft Kings and Fan Duel

They did not outlaw them. Nevada is one of the few states that explicitly does allow them. They simply have to go through the same regulations that all the other casinos and sportsbooks have to. So far those sites have declined. My guess is that the traditional sportsbooks will come up with a way to offer a lot more fantasy style bets

Quote: gordonm888

Much less betting against the 10% vigorish of a sports book?

According to quick google search draftkings and fanduel charge much higher commissions. They start at 10% for low limits, progressively getting lower as the bets get higher with nothing below 5.6%. Sports books with -110 lines charge 4.5%.

Quote: MrV

It's classic supply and demand.

Supply now outstrips demand.

People don't feel much need to travel to Las Vegas to gamble; I certainly don't.

Yes, Las Vegas is keeping afloat in part due to nightclubs / party scene, but as more and more casinos get built elsewhere, it could share a fate similar to Atlantic City.

Las Vegas could be in serious trouble once the boomers die off.

What's wrong with Vegas becoming mainly a party destination as opposed to gambling destination. Seems to be working out nicely, don't think Vegas will fall to ruin any time soon

Quote: Avincow

What's wrong with Vegas becoming mainly a party destination as opposed to gambling destination. Seems to be working out nicely, don't think Vegas will fall to ruin any time soon

http://vegasinc.com/business/gaming/2016/jun/07/wynn-is-champion-of-nongambling-revenue-but-no-fan

Wynn said. “It’s probably the only part of the business where I have cognitive dissonance. I walk into the clubs and I say to myself, either we have attracted every moron in the world...

After reading through this entire thread I realized the only thing I cared about was "Who is Angie and where can I meet her?".

My personal opinion is that, believe it or not, John Q Public is getting more educated on money. The sentiment is that the house always wins and that the games are all in favor of the house. So, fewer people are visiting casinos overall.

More people are saving money in response to the economic downturn of '06-'09. (You could argue it's '06-'14, I suppose)

Just my two cents.