Poll

3 votes (21.42%)
2 votes (14.28%)
9 votes (64.28%)

14 members have voted

LarryS
LarryS
Joined: Feb 26, 2011
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March 13th, 2014 at 9:20:04 AM permalink
Quote: GWAE

I think you are forgetting about 2 things. (I didn't read your spoilers though)

1. There are other players at the table. If I am at the table and you are giving such bad advice then I will stop tipping.

2. complaints to your boss could make you lose your job which is obviously -ev



I agree...even if there arent other people at the table..anyone witnessing this exchange wont enter the tablr or may leave after a couple of hands from feeling uncomfortable. Empty seats means less tips. A general warning would be appropriate...."hey guys lets keep the game civil".....(even if the barking is comeing from one guy). And then if it continue....address the individual directly.

By letting a table deterorate, it means the number of people diminish...and less tips
AxiomOfChoice
AxiomOfChoice
Joined: Sep 12, 2012
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March 13th, 2014 at 10:42:01 AM permalink
Quote: GWAE

2. complaints to your boss could make you lose your job which is obviously -ev



If they fired every dealer who gave bad advice there would be no games.
pew
pew
Joined: Oct 6, 2012
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March 13th, 2014 at 11:11:56 AM permalink
Most rational (good) players should leave the table before the issue comes up. Barring that, the dealer should always be nice and diplomatic with both idiots. Keep it light. One time I split deuces, some guy grunted something, got up and walked away. See ya.
GWAE
GWAE
Joined: Sep 20, 2013
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March 13th, 2014 at 11:19:36 AM permalink
Quote: AxiomOfChoice

If they fired every dealer who gave bad advice there would be no games.



That is true but I was meaning they would complain that the dealer is an ass and was rude to them.

Firing every rude dealer would only eliminate about 60% of the games.
Expect the worst and you will never be disappointed. I AM NOT PART OF GWAE RADIO SHOW
Canyonero
Canyonero
Joined: Nov 19, 2012
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March 13th, 2014 at 12:00:07 PM permalink
Like the OP, I would also side with (i.e. "make him like me") the bad player on the grounds that he is more likely to do irrational things, plus he might also be more insecure psychologically and in need of an ally for validation / reinforcement. He might tend to show appreciation and try to secure that ally be placing big tips.

The returning customer part doesn't seem to factor as much in my opinion, there are too many variables. My primary goal is to maximize my tips this session.

Very nice thought experiment!
Neutrino
Neutrino
Joined: Feb 20, 2014
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March 13th, 2014 at 12:34:05 PM permalink
Many people mentioned the lack of information that would factor in the decision. There's no way in a hypothetical scenario like this that I can give you all the information. But I'll just address the most common one, let's pretend there are no other people at the table, just these 2.
Neutrino
Neutrino
Joined: Feb 20, 2014
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March 13th, 2014 at 12:35:41 PM permalink
Quote: LarryS

Empty seats means less tips.



This is probably the best argument I've seen for staying neutral so far.
LarryS
LarryS
Joined: Feb 26, 2011
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March 13th, 2014 at 1:45:37 PM permalink
Quote: Neutrino

This is probably the best argument I've seen for staying neutral so far.



when going on break i would tell the pit boss to intervene, and let him be the "bad guy". But conflict at the table causes loss of tips from the others who either leave or feel uncomfortable.
soulhunt79
soulhunt79
Joined: Oct 8, 2010
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March 13th, 2014 at 2:09:14 PM permalink
How is siding with the bad player in anyway +EV?

Is the assumption that bad players tip more?

You have no knowledge of what the rest of the table feels so any decision there could be -EV or +EV, you have no knowledge.

I feel you have a better chance at convincing the bad player that 3rd base could have saved the table vs convincing 3rd base they were wrong.



Unless the bad player was tipping a lot more, I see no benefit in siding with the side that indicates you are a moron and a bad BJ player yourself.



BTW, I wouldn't get into it unless asked though. If asked what I would have done, is say the book says to do what 3rd base did(or something of that nature).
LarryS
LarryS
Joined: Feb 26, 2011
  • Threads: 67
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March 13th, 2014 at 8:56:05 PM permalink
Quote: soulhunt79

How is siding with the bad player in anyway +EV?

Is the assumption that bad players tip more?

You have no knowledge of what the rest of the table feels so any decision there could be -EV or +EV, you have no knowledge.

I feel you have a better chance at convincing the bad player that 3rd base could have saved the table vs convincing 3rd base they were wrong.



Unless the bad player was tipping a lot more, I see no benefit in siding with the side that indicates you are a moron and a bad BJ player yourself.



BTW, I wouldn't get into it unless asked though. If asked what I would have done, is say the book says to do what 3rd base did(or something of that nature).




I have seen dealers get verbally abused, and seeing their anguish and self restraint...I would tip them .If the loudmouth turned on the dealer for exerting control....I would chime in and back the dealer if he was handling it correctly...and also tip

If I saw the dealer doing his job(or her job) and taking control of the table...and asking the loud mouth to refrain.....the loudmouth may stop tipping....but I would guess thatother people at the tble would be so relieved..that they would tip.

the smaller picture is that the loud mouth might stp tipping or leave the table....the big picture is that table becomes a more suitable place for other players to play. The table now has a chance of filling up. More people...more chance of tips.

When I am tense at a table I dont think of tipping. If someone is verbally abusive and the dealer doesnt take charge or at least get a floor person to take charge.....i dont think of tipping. I am thinking of leaving.

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