teddys
teddys
Joined: Nov 14, 2009
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November 26th, 2011 at 6:41:40 AM permalink
Yes, there is no mention of separation of church and state in the Constitution, but there might as well be. Both Jefferson and Madison used the phrase in contemporaneous writings, and they wrote the dadgummed thing. The Supreme Court noted the phrase with approval in 1879 and have basically incorporated it as text of the First Amendment ever since.

The Court said in County of Allegheny v. ACLU that nativity scenes on public property are not okay while Menorahs (Jewish ritual candelabras) and Christmas Trees are okay because those parts of the holiday season have become secularized to some extent (I would tend to disagree). The whole establishment clause case law is kind of muddled and silly, but you have to draw the line somewhere.
"Dice, verily, are armed with goads and driving-hooks, deceiving and tormenting, causing grievous woe." -Rig Veda 10.34.4
rxwine
rxwine
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November 26th, 2011 at 5:31:35 PM permalink
Quote: Nareed

Actually it isn't a Christian nation. I don't think there's any such thing anywhere on Earth, except perhaps the Vatican (if you can regard it as a real country). I've yet to see the words "Christian Nation" anywhere on the Declaration of Independence or the Constitution...



For that matter, the constitutional text could have been easily as written by an atheist of the time period as a Christian. It probably would have a different emphasis on freedom of religion, to general freedom which included religious belief.

Being a "Christian nation" is about as important as it was "Men only vote" nation as well. Well, people of light color anyway.
Quasimodo? Does that name ring a bell?
Face
Administrator
Face
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November 26th, 2011 at 7:09:29 PM permalink
I absolutely despise it with nearly all of my being, but not for religious reasons.

I hate it because regardless of religion or lack thereof, Xmas used to be special to me. Now I get it rammed down my throat so much starting from mid freaking October that by the time it's here, I'm just glad it's over. Xmas songs used to be fun to sing in late winter, now I'm burnt out on them well before Thanksgiving. Driving around and seeing the elaborate decor used to have a wow factor, now it's just some gaudy nonsense I ignore for 3 months out of the year. It's killed everything Xmas used to be to me.

Does anyone else feel this way? Specifically those who are very religious, don't you feel "your day" has been taken away from you and severley watered down? I know my mood at this time of year can only be explained by using nearly every expletive in the book.

At least for me, it's not an athiest thing. Wish me a Merry Xmas and you'll probably get one in return, unless I'm feeling obnoxious, then you might get a dry wish for a Joyous Wednesday instead. Either way, feel free to bring on the Jesus, just not until His time is come.
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1BB
1BB
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November 27th, 2011 at 4:13:03 AM permalink
Quote: NicksGamingStuff

Well I can see your point but what I mean is : Unlike others I will not take legal action I just dont care, I will just be bitter inside. Yes I do understand this is a christian nation which is fine, I just dislike it when people say Merry Christmas, or God Bless You etc... I say "Happy end of the year holiday season" (seriously). It is hard though to knock someone who says something with good intentions so I just say thank you and squirm inside.



Nick, I've read enough of your posts to think of you as a considerate and thoughtful person. When someone wishes you well no matter how they express it, they're doing just that- wishing you well. They're not trying to convert you or ram anything down your throat, so there's no need to feel bitter. On the other hand your response could be seen as insincere to some.

Remember, bitterness destroys the vessel in which it is kept.
Many people, especially ignorant people, want to punish you for speaking the truth. - Mahatma Ghandi
NicksGamingStuff
NicksGamingStuff
Joined: Feb 2, 2010
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November 27th, 2011 at 4:23:00 AM permalink
I do accept the well wishing, but still feel slightly annoyed inside. Tonight I was at a sushi restaurant and they were playing christmas music. If I had noticed before I sat down I would have left.... I am not sure why I dislike the holidays so much, it seemed to start after my freshman year of college. I have an idea of why I might dislike it but do not wish to share it on the forum. Some could say talking to a counselor could help, but getting a b.a. in psychology I do not buy the therapy, it is the same as talking to a stuffed animal. Anyway to those who celebrate the holidays, enjoy them and I wish you well for things that bring joy to your life, and to those like me who sit at home and sulk about how their life is nothing what they thought it would be 7 years ago misery loves company so if you are in LV around the holidays we can meet up and be miserable together.
FrGamble
FrGamble
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November 27th, 2011 at 5:15:17 AM permalink
You know what I kinda of agree with Face in that Christmas gets so overplayed that we lose the exciting anticipation for it and then immediately aftrwards it is gone in a flash, what a let down! I think we should hold off on the carols, music, and decorations till at least Dec. 17th and then also extend the music and fun after Christmas day for at least a week or two.
AZDuffman
AZDuffman
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November 27th, 2011 at 10:11:36 AM permalink
Quote: NicksGamingStuff

Some could say talking to a counselor could help, but getting a b.a. in psychology I do not buy the therapy, it is the same as talking to a stuffed animal. Anyway to those who celebrate the holidays, enjoy them and I wish you well for things that bring joy to your life, and to those like me who sit at home and sulk about how their life is nothing what they thought it would be 7 years ago misery loves company so if you are in LV around the holidays we can meet up and be miserable together.



Stuffed animals don't charge you $70 for a 50 min hour. Too bad I didn't see your offer in 2007, was in Vegas. Have to say if you dislike Christmas it is the place to be. I saw a total of one tree in one casino and it was not "Vegas-Sized" at all. If I had not known it was Christmas I'd never know. Weird.
All animals are equal, but some are more equal than others
Mosca
Mosca
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November 27th, 2011 at 10:24:23 AM permalink
Quote: AZDuffman

You need to face the fact that the USA was founded as a Christian Nation and that is what the majority prefers. I will give you $500.00 if you find for me the phrase "seperation of church and state" in the US Constitution. Look at any number of old (even newer) doccuments and you will see them dated "November 25 in the year of our Lord 2011."

I don't like Haloween Decorations but I realize that so many people do that it is what it is.

BTW: it appears "Atheism" is your religion (as being opposed to agnostic) so by demanding it not be in parks you are thus wanting to impose your religion on others.

Just a return rant. We now return you to your regularly scheduled blogging......................




And I'll give YOU $500 if you find the word "god" in The Constitution.

"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof..." The first article of The Bill of Rights. My point is that if you spend MY tax dollars to support YOUR religion, then you have used my tax dollars and the power of government to establish your religion.
NO KILL I
Mosca
Mosca
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November 27th, 2011 at 10:31:59 AM permalink
And note, I enjoy Christmas, and the holiday season, and Christmas songs both Christian and secular. I'll take "Merry Christmas", "Happy Holidays", and "God bless you" all in the spirit intended. Keep the religious decorations on the churches and your own property, and I'm fine with that.
NO KILL I
teddys
teddys
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November 27th, 2011 at 11:19:34 AM permalink
Christmas is a day to gamble, win big, and tip the (miserable because they have to be there on a holiday) dealers generously!
"Dice, verily, are armed with goads and driving-hooks, deceiving and tormenting, causing grievous woe." -Rig Veda 10.34.4

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