Norm- qfit

Very disappointed that norm came in here and said he doesn't post because he gets bashed.
However months have gone by with no one bashing him yet he has posted ABSOLUTELY zero and we lost a valuable member in kj- -anyone out there in ownershship think maybe it's time to reevaluate

Why would the owner(s) care about it?

Several popular, prolific posters have been cast out, yet the board is still active.

KJ is missed by some, but nobody here is indispensable.

Except the Wiz.

I don't think this needs to be rehashed. But the question is not about which member brought more value to the forums.

And Norm might not be getting bashed. But if he posted here some antipathy regarding the whole prior scene would be forthcoming... Again.

Norm who?

No one is really that disappointed he's not posting.

Rehashing this is not good. I honestly doubt any real resolution is possible(I can hope, but I'm not fooling myself). Lines were crossed(everyone lost, some more than others) decisions were made.

It is what it is.

There does not seem to be any desire for resolution of this issue any more. There may have been at one time, but entrenchment seems to complete at this point.

I don't miss QFit at all; he contributed very little for five years and he was part of a train wreck when he came back. He's friends with the boss, and that is peachy, but few here seem to care much for him. No idea what any of the folks involved are like in "real life"--just what is depicted here.

Agree with Axel. What's done is done. This went past the point of no return.

I don't want Qfit here. He falsely accused me of copyright violation, among other things. He is very good at detracting from the forum with minimal activity.

I don’t think the point by wizardofnothing was that Qfit should be back. I think his point was that kewlj should be back.

Since this is my first post here, a brief introduction. I am a 20 plus year advantage player and member of the Blackjack Hall of Fame. I have not been a regular member of a message board forum since Ken Smith’s blackjack forum shut down, 5 years ago, although I occasionally read several including this one. I have known Qfit for several decades and kewlj or whatever variant of that handle he now uses for 10 years or so.

Qfit exhibits the same behavior time and time again. He is always in some sort of confrontation or war of words with someone, that he is attempting to bring down. I believe it’s a status thing with Qfit. I have witnessed Qfit attack and threaten a dozens of people with legal action and one of his most common threats is just what you have described, copyright violations. He seems to think every word he has ever said or posted is copyright protected.

Kewlj on the other hand is a braggart. He loves to tell you what a successful AP he has become right down to the dollar amount that he has earned. He is pretty damn full of himself for someone that has achieved so little. He seems to think the million dollar mark that he is at or close to puts him in elite company, when the truth is that over the 15 or so year that it took him, that puts him at the very low range of professional advantage players. Most career AP’s average 4-5 times this amount per year and hit this mark in a fraction of the time.. I have a friend that owns a newsstand that makes more than this.

Back on Ken Smith’s forum, I always liked kewlj and tried to help him advance to more advanced techniques of advantage play, but he aspired to and has achieved nothing more than mediocrity, mid-level card counting, the lowest ring on the AP ladder. And he always seemed to think he was something special for achieving that lowest accomplishment. He is like a professional baseball player with a lifetime batting average of .215 that tells us how great he is because he is a professional baseball player.

After banishing kewlj from his site, I was surprised to see Qfit bring their war to another site like this one. He frequently attempts to shut down the opinion of those that he is fighting with but usually limits it to one specific forum, that he wants to be king of the castle at. Seeing him attempt to shut down kewlj everywhere was an escalation for him. I was also surprised to see Michael Shackleford take sides as he did against an established member, when he very obviously sided with Qfit a member that rarely participates on this forum. It was pretty apparent that Michael had little respect for kewlj. Perhaps he too tired of hearing about kewlj’s minimal accomplishments.

So they are both gone. Less drama. Keep it that way. Anyone yearning for Qfit can find him at his site and anyone missing kewlj can likely find him at whatever forum he is currently touting how great he is.

What upsets me about this situation is that the Wiz nuked Kewlj for something outside of this website
Why is the Wiz looking to other websites to determine if somebody should be nuked
The internet is huge and many people imitate and pretend to be other people
There is no way to determine 100% that a person posting on another website is posting here
Its ridiculous
Does the Wiz surf gamblingforums to determine who to punish here
Nuking a member here should only be dependent on posts made here
Not on some other website where it is impossible to say 100% sure its a person you know

Yes, KewlJ's nuking sucked when it happened.

But then KewlJ dug his grave really deep over at that other forum.... so what's done is done.

Could. Not agree anymore terapained. Well said

Quote: seinfeld

I don’t think the point by wizardofnothing was that Qfit should be back. I think his point was that kewlj should be back.

Since this is my first post here, a brief introduction. I am a 20 plus year advantage player and member of the Blackjack Hall of Fame. I have not been a regular member of a message board forum since Ken Smith’s blackjack forum shut down, 5 years ago, although I occasionally read several including this one. I have known Qfit for several decades and kewlj or whatever variant of that handle he now uses for 10 years or so.

Qfit exhibits the same behavior time and time again. He is always in some sort of confrontation or war of words with someone, that he is attempting to bring down. I believe it’s a status thing with Qfit. I have witnessed Qfit attack and threaten a dozens of people with legal action and one of his most common threats is just what you have described, copyright violations. He seems to think every word he has ever said or posted is copyright protected.

Kewlj on the other hand is a braggart. He loves to tell you what a successful AP he has become right down to the dollar amount that he has earned. He is pretty damn full of himself for someone that has achieved so little. He seems to think the million dollar mark that he is at or close to puts him in elite company, when the truth is that over the 15 or so year that it took him, that puts him at the very low range of professional advantage players. Most career AP’s average 4-5 times this amount per year and hit this mark in a fraction of the time.. I have a friend that owns a newsstand that makes more than this.

Back on Ken Smith’s forum, I always liked kewlj and tried to help him advance to more advanced techniques of advantage play, but he aspired to and has achieved nothing more than mediocrity, mid-level card counting, the lowest ring on the AP ladder. And he always seemed to think he was something special for achieving that lowest accomplishment. He is like a professional baseball player with a lifetime batting average of .215 that tells us how great he is because he is a professional baseball player.

After banishing kewlj from his site, I was surprised to see Qfit bring their war to another site like this one. He frequently attempts to shut down the opinion of those that he is fighting with but usually limits it to one specific forum, that he wants to be king of the castle at. Seeing him attempt to shut down kewlj everywhere was an escalation for him. I was also surprised to see Michael Shackleford take sides as he did against an established member, when he very obviously sided with Qfit a member that rarely participates on this forum. It was pretty apparent that Michael had little respect for kewlj. Perhaps he too tired of hearing about kewlj’s minimal accomplishments.

So they are both gone. Less drama. Keep it that way. Anyone yearning for Qfit can find him at his site and anyone missing kewlj can likely find him at whatever forum he is currently touting how great he is.

This is an extremely accurate assessment of the situation... That said I'm still a KJ fan. I've never seen the "bad" posts on "the" other forum, but I've seen his posting for many years back from Ken Smiths message board. I respect his blackjack game and in regards to posting his figures touting or not I think the forum enjoyed getting "real" live feedback from an actual practicing professional. Every site you see all these theoretical numbers, etc. KJ brought the numbers from the street to the forums, again regardless of why. It was always fun to see the real life roller coaster ride that is card counting play out year after year with him ending victoriously (which of course we're rooting for). It's like a movie where at some points you think it's all over, but by the end the hero is successful and all are happy.

In the end, I think it's a bit too far gone at this point to remedy sadly enough. Perhaps with some more time one or both will learn to live and let live and perhaps one day long down the road KJ will return. Who knows. Without any feuds currently running the forums do seem a bit less dramatic though.

Quote: Romes

Without any feuds currently running the forums do seem a bit less dramatic though.

You must have the political discussions blocked. Good for you =)

Quote: Romes

This is an extremely accurate assessment of the situation

99% of the time here, kj caused less drama than most people. And he was here for a pretty long time.

And what did Qfit bring in his less than %1 of time?

Quote: rxwine

99% of the time here, kj caused less drama than most people. And he was here for a pretty long time.

And what did Qfit bring in his less than %1 of time?

As stated in the post I quoted... Qfit brought the fight here. That's why I think that post is pretty accurate.

Quote: Face

You must have the political discussions blocked. Good for you =)

They aren't that bad!

Quote: RonC

They aren't that bad!

Certainly not compared to the comments section on the average national news website...

Quote: Romes

As stated in the post I quoted... Qfit brought the fight here. That's why I think that post is pretty accurate.

Since I only follow basically what goes on in the forum, it all seems extremely lopsided.

KJ, intial truce breaking comment that set everything off, was something like "please don't."

He may have become a pariah after he left here, but I don't even follow that.

Quote: Face

You must have the political discussions blocked. Good for you =)

Blocking them is an AP move. ;-)

Many men threaten, but few men sue.

Did Norm ever REALLY sue anybody over the nonsense on these boards?

I bet he didn't.

So who was playing seinfeld here? Enquiring minds want to know.

I can't go into specifics but norm has done worse then that to some - he definitely stomps his feet a lot -
As I mentioned elsewhere he has threatened multiple people with law suits

Quote: Wizardofnothing

I can't go into specifics but norm has done worse then that to some - he definitely stomps his feet a lot -
As I mentioned elsewhere he has threatened multiple people with law suits

Let me make this clear. I have never in my life threatened a single soul with a lawsuit. I hope to be able to say that on my death bed as I'm one of the least litigious people you will ever know about. I don't even have a lawyer. KJ has repeatedly stated that I threatened the Wiz with lawsuits. Ask him yourself if this is true. You would do well to avoid the image of naiveté by not repeating the wild claims of anonymous folks on the I'Net. And, you should give some thought as to why you would repeat such claims on a public forum on the word of angry persons with a history of wild claims.

The atmosphere in the U.S. has become toxic due partly to the political environment. This is the nasty season. Don't let it leak into unrelated arenas. Try getting back to discussions on advantage play, and away from those that spend their lives trying to disrupt.

Is QFIT related to Bloody Mary? Maybe Beetlejuice?

The only time he appears here is when you say his name three times....

Werent you complaining for some BS reason saying someone posted of your "copyrighted" website or some such thing and had Mike remove it?

I deny that Norm has ever threatened me with a lawsuit. If he had, I would have nuked him, as I would with any member.

I am not at liberty to discuss who told me or specifics but I know for a fact norm has threatened people before and done some outright crazy things.
If wiz chooses to deny it that is fine- I do not know what happened in this situation but honestly Wiz the fact that you booted someone for norm is not right- he contributes zero here and should just go to his own forum and spew whatever he wants-
I knew he would
Chime in on this thread which just goes to exactly what I was saying

There's an old maxim: "If you won't defend your rights, Don't complain when you lose them." There is a difference between asking that your rights be respected and threatening a lawsuit. I repeat, I have never threatened a single soul with a lawsuit. In my 67 years on this planet, the only time I have ever been in civil court was to testify in a no-fault divorce case for friends that both wanted the divorce.

I'm so tired of this. All I wanted to do was create a place where APs could discuss their craft. A handful of nasty people with extreme egos and an inability to accept other people's opinions make this task enormously time-consuming. If anyone hasn't noticed, I am fascinated by this game called blackjack. I share this info because I think it is fascinating. One person has threatened to spend the next 50 years attacking me. He has publicly stated that he will celebrate on the day I die. He threatened Mike in the same manner. If you are a friend to him, help him. Anyone that spends that much energy devoted to exacting revenge for perceived slights to his fragile ego is not in a good place. Supporting this nonsense by repeating his lies helps no one.

Again, this is a gaming forum. Discuss gaming.

Good luck all. Back to work.

You haven't discusssed gaming at all!!!!!!

I have said all I have to say on the matter many times. If you don't like how KJ was treated, there are plenty of other forums out there.

And there is. No room to resolve it and let him back?

Quote: QFIT

Let me make this clear. I have never in my life threatened a single soul with a lawsuit. I hope to be able to say that on my death bed as I'm one of the least litigious people you will ever know about.I don't even have a lawyer. KJ has repeatedly stated that I threatened the Wiz with lawsuits. Ask him yourself if this is true. You would do well to avoid the image of naiveté by not repeating the wild claims of anonymous folks on the I'Net. And, you should give some thought as to why you would repeat such claims on a public forum on the word of angry persons with a history of wild claims.

The atmosphere in the U.S. has become toxic due partly to the political environment. This is the nasty season. Don't let it leak into unrelated arenas. Try getting back to discussions on advantage play, and away from those that spend their lives trying to disrupt.

I seem to remember a situation here where you said you never did something, perhaps it was something like I never sent Mike a PM. Meanwhile you send him an email. You get what I'm saying? Let's say you never use the word sue or whatever. Have you ever, or had/asked somome put pressure on anyone regarding various situations? Perhaps you indicated you would do x, y or z and someone may have took it as you might sure them or contact someone? It's obvious you put pressure on someone regarding KJ. And others have claimed you did various types of things of that nature.

Quote: Wizardofnothing

And there is. No room to resolve it and let him back?

Nope. Will never happen as long as I have anything to do with it.

There are two forum members who are dead to me -- Kewlj and Statman.

Why does this keep having to get re-hashed. Stop it. Decisions have been made. Move on. Have read both of KJ's and QFit's posts it's clear both contributed to what has happened. Just stop. Enough.

Quote: ams288

Is QFIT related to Bloody Mary? Maybe Beetlejuice?

The only time he appears here is when you say his name three times....

AMS told a funny joke.
I am impressed.
Also surprised he didn't accuse him of being a Republican ;-)

Quote: Wizard

Nope. Will never happen as long as I have anything to do with it.

There are two forum members who are dead to me -- Kewlj and Statman.

I know most of the KewlJ story, from multiple Forums. I have no recollection of Statman, but I am gonna read up on it.
Want to ensure (insure?) that I don't become 'dead'.

AxelPup would descend into the depths of grieving ;-)

Somebody gotta keep the Greenies on their toes.
It's a public service thing....

<edit> Speaking of 'dead' and 'dying', I'm having a hard time keeping up with the current level of banter here, I actually feel sorry for the Mods....
Either the the level of banter is way up, or I am getting much slower. Maybe both ;-)

Quote: ams288

Is QFIT related to Bloody Mary? Maybe Beetlejuice?

The only time he appears here is when you say his name three times....

Now that is pretty darn funny, even coming from you...

He does seem to show up any time he is mentioned a few times. There may be something to that theory.

Most people that use language saying that they have to get people to "respect their rights" also seem to threaten lawsuits in order to make sure those rights are respected. I am not saying that QFit has done so, I have not idea, butmany threats made about respecting rights come with some threat of a lawsuit.

Card counting at blackjack has got to be the most boring thing to talk about, period. I can't understand why even fight about it.

Quote: Ibeatyouraces

Card counting at blackjack has got to be the most boring thing to talk about, period. I can't understand why even fight about it.

It's kind of like having a conversation about the best formatting method to use on a floppy disk. It was relevant 30 years ago, not so much today.

Quote: TwoFeathersATL

I have no recollection of Statman, but I am gonna read up on it.

I don't think you'll find anything dramatic other than a feud with Buzz. In both cases, the reason these individuals are dead to me is things said through private communication.

re: Statman - Dude thought no-0 roulette existed. And he thought that it would still have a house edge, even if the payouts were unchanged from normal. And he claimed to be a college level math professor. Even had a website for the "journal" that he and his "students" produced. That site attributed some strikingly idiotic math to the Wiz and others here. But, of course, it was just because Statman had utterly no idea what was happening in the world around him.

'it was just because Statman had utterly no idea what was happening in the world around him'.
That's it.
I'm under the fridge if anyone needs me.
I'll peek out after the snowfall....
Just 2F

Quote: rdw4potus

re: Statman - Dude thought no-0 roulette existed.

That's the only part of your post I disagree with. There was an Internet casino, I'm trying to remember the name, that had a "no juice lounge" or something like that with all 0% house edge games, or very close to it. The roulette game had zero zeroes. I think they did it to attract new players. There was also a low max bet in the No Juice Lounge.

Quote: Wizard

That's the only part of your post I disagree with. There was an Internet casino, I'm trying to remember the name, that had a "no juice lounge" or something like that with all 0% house edge games, or very close to it. The roulette game had zero zeroes. I think they did it to attract new players. There was also a low max bet in the No Juice Lounge.

One of my early online gaming clients had zero-edge roulette. Might have been the same one you're talking about, and that was exactly why they did it. The maximums were really low, like $1 or something. When you're not space-constrained, you can afford to do all sorts of wacky stuff with content.

Quote: MathExtremist

One of my early online gaming clients had zero-edge roulette. Might have been the same one you're talking about, and that was exactly why they did it. The maximums were really low, like $1 or something. When you're not space-constrained, you can afford to do all sorts of wacky stuff with content.

So a -3% for the player then (-;