Any New Games being trialled in Las Vegas

Has anybody see any new games being trialled in Las Vegas after the G2E show?
Is there any new games going to be trialled in Las Vegas this year?

Do casinos in Las Vegas likes to try new games now a days?

Quote: MrCasinoGames

Has anybody see any new games being trialled in Las Vegas after the G2E show?
Is there any new games going to be trialled in Las Vegas this year?

Do casinos in Las Vegas likes to try new games now a days?

Honestly, no. Some say that they do and trial them, but cannot and do not always give them full support. A new game must be like a child that can feed itself without a parent's help. This is because table games crews are too busy and too concerned running their bread-n-butter games in order to train and support new games that require hand-holding to cross the street. Sad but true. A new game is thrown into the mix, and must perform immediately and beautifully, and about as well as established and proven games - right off the bat.
95% of games sink and drown straight away, No funeral or wake, about 4% linger in a coma on life support before the plug is pulled, and 1% do quite well.
Three card Poker, EZ Baccarat, EZ Pai Gow, and Ultimate Texas Hold 'em are the new games that made it without casinos pulling them back - out of hundreds of new games patented and developed.
Deuces Wild, Let it Ride, Carribean Stud faded and passed away for the most part.
Other games get "pocket niches" or footholds where they hang in there, while getting pulled from other casinos, in a "two-steps forward, two-steps back" fashion. Few games can maintain a steady fire over the years.

Bet the Deck has been revived at the Flamingo. There is also Mini Tex as the Red Rock, that may have launched before the show. There is also High Card Flush at Harrah's Laughlin, but that has been there since about June 2011. Basically, there has been a lull in new games.

Is the Alphabet Roulette still on at the Fitz?

1. I think a new crap bet has a good shot, because the Fire bet, Sharpshooter bet, and Replay bet all suffer from the same illness; low hit frequency, low "reloading" rates, low income, and the potential to aggrevate and correlate to table dumping. We got a couple of crap player who bet a $5 Fire bet and a $3 pass line bet and then wait "for the Freezer to defrost" - if it does.
2. The "Branching Out" factor: A new game needs about a dozen installs or contract agreements about a year out from its first install, then about 40 installs the second year out, to show some promise. I think High Card Flush, like a lot of new games, will get a singular popular install then fail to branch out.
3. There are tens of thousands of physical table games in the U.S. casino market. You get 50 or 100 installs, you're doing okay. You get 500 installs, you've got a huge hit; you get 1,500 you are Three Card Poker, - you are Elvis Presley, Paul McCartney, or Eric Clapton.

Edit: Roger Snow once told me an account he had with a game designer whose game he thought was very fine. He offered something like a $250,000 cash signing bonus, 30% of GROSS revenues, and the clear ability to get literally hundreds of installs, - like the next Three-Card Poker. The guy answered, "No, Mr. Snow - I want a $5 Million dollar bonus to sign, 55% of Gross revenues - and both your wife and sister to come to my hotel suite for some three-way action, comped on your tab," or something outrageous like that, and filled with grandiose hubris. Roger said, "No...we'll get back to you," and they went ahead with other games that did well. The guy called back 6 months later, and agreed to the original deal, but it was off the table by then. He then called back a YEAR later, basically offering the game for $1.25 and a can of Pepsi, just to get his game out. The offer was withdrawn. The great new game became an invisible piece of historical vaporware from the annals of the blown-and-unkown deals that could have been.
Lesson: you get ONE chance to make it if lucky; if you miss the boat, you ain't on the ride...

7-14-21 is still at the Hard Rock and the Palms. I actually enjoyed the game. I wish it success.

Triple Attack Blackjack has a few installs but I think it will crash and burn. Strategy is too hard and variance is too high.

UTH is huge; they are growing in every market it seems now. I also enjoy the game.

Quote: Nareed

Is the Alphabet Roulette still on at the Fitz?

I don't believe so. And pulled from the Golden Nugget were Zero (which basically performed like its name - what WERE they thinking??!! to quote a wise Eliot Jaconson on naming your game wisely), Rupert's Island Draw, (which wasn't a draw), and the like.
ALL of these new games had no major distributor behind them, essentially "self-published" games with no marketing force or network behind them, and none were proven better than the existing games on the floor.

Do we really think we can re-invent Blackjack or Poker or Roulette better than the established originals? Generally not, the best we can do is a useful and incremental improvement that just might be significant - once proven to be so:.
Totally brand new games (essentially) that ARE decent (like Three-card Poker or Two-cards High, IMGDO - or "In My Game Designing Opinion" for what it's worth) generally only have the opportunity to do well with a big and established distributor backing you up: Shufflemaster, DEQ, or Galaxy, basically. And they will ask for and get 70% or 80% of the gross to play ball, else no dice.

Quote: teddys

7-14-21 is still at the Hard Rock and one other place I can't remember. I actually enjoyed the game. I wish it success.

Triple Attack Blackjack has a few installs but I think it will crash and burn. Strategy is too hard and variance is too high.

7-14-21 was at the palms casino. Is it still there?
Yes, I think the Triple Attack Blackjack Strategy is too hard and variance is too high, as will.

Alphabetic roulette is out of the Fitz.

7-14-21 is still at the Palms.

Most new game inventors try to talk me into taking a percentage of revenue in lieu of a math fee. They usually make it out like a 1% share is worth $10,000. In reality, a 100% share of most game concepts is worth $0.

Quote: Paigowdan

Three card Poker, EZ Baccarat, EZ Pai Gow, and Ultimate Texas Hold 'em are the new games that made it without casinos pulling them back -

EZ Bac is doing OK in Vegas? The 3 casinos around
here that had it took it out because none
of the Asian players would go near it. It would sit
a whole shift without a single player.

Quote: Wizard

Alphabetic roulette is out of the Fitz.

7-14-21 is still at the Palms.

Most new game inventors try to talk me into taking a percentage of revenue in lieu of a math fee. They usually make it out like a 1% share is worth $10,000. In reality, a 100% share of most game concepts is worth $0.

would you like a 1% share in Cameltoe Poker?

Quote: EvenBob

EZ Bac is doing OK in Vegas? The 3 casinos around
here that had it took it out because none
of the Asian players would go near it. It would sit
a whole shift without a single player.

EZ Bac has around 300+ installs, and is getting more; it is at a major Las Vegas Baccarat-specific property, which is the real Asian Games pit of Las Vegas, and as such is a real barometer of its fine worth. They went from 3 tables to 7 tables as a strong vote of confidence.

Let me also say that I am NOT the inventor of EZ Baccarat, nor do I have a financial interest in that game, although it is a similar product signed by the same distributor. Bob, I simply assume you "took a shot" at the game of EZ Baccarat simply because you wanted to take a shot at me, in a "so THERE, Dan, a-HA!" type of fashion - yet it is simply not my game. I do respect it immensely, know and like the inventors of the game, and have to admit that it is doing great, and is a great success.

For that matter, 300 EZ Baccarat installs is triple - three times - the installs of Blackjack Switch, and NO ONE here should wish Geoff any bad will for getting a game pulled out here or there, either.
Agree, Bob?

Quote: Wizard

Alphabetic roulette is out of the Fitz.

Too bad. I wanted to try to bet my name. If I recall correctly, it had better odds than regular roulette.

Quote:

Most new game inventors try to talk me into taking a percentage of revenue in lieu of a math fee. They usually make it out like a 1% share is worth $10,000. In reality, a 100% share of most game concepts is worth $0.

You should offer a discount in exchange for a 1% share. What if the next game you analyze turns out to be the new 3CP?

Quote: s2dbaker

would you like a 1% share in Cameltoe Poker?

I would like a share in "Jessica Simpson Cameltoe...."

Quote: Paigowdan

EZ Bac has around 300+ installs,

I wanted to play it, but I won't sit at a table
with no players because I don't bet every hand.
The pit told me the Asian players boycotted it
because they didn't trust it.

Quote: EvenBob

I wanted to play it, but I won't sit at a table
with no players because I don't bet every hand.
The pit told me the Asian players boycotted it
because they didn't trust it.

With as many installs as it has, a lot of players do trust it.
A lot of players pulled back at EZ Pai Gow at first, not trusting it simply because it was new, and it "seemed" newfangled - when its play is clear.

I've seen countless casino players look at ANY new game at ALL with squinty eyes, muttering..."A-HA! there's got to be a catch, they've got Something up their sleeve, those fancy-pants gangsters, those whipper-snappers, those fancy-pants City-Slickers, yada yada yada..." - and polishing a magnifying glass like they were Inspector Clouseau....I have seen many people look at EZ pai Gow a year ago, saying, "I don't trust it, I'll never play it," and a year later, it is ALL they play, wouldn't play any other Pai Gow Poker...I greet them by name when I'm dealing it, or see them buy in time and time again from my dealing position at the crap table at work...

Quote: Paigowdan

With as many installs as it has, a lot of players do trust it.
..

Asian bac players are very clannish. They thought
EZ~Bac was too fast, also. They like to sit and
stare at their cards, which is ridiculous. I can predict
90% of the time where the majority of the bets
will go. Its mostly a trend game, I laugh when there are
6 bankers in a row and they all sit there studying their
cards, like every one of them isn't going to bet banker
this time.

Quote: EvenBob

Asian bac players are very clannish.

Oh, they can be indeed, Bob. ALL gamblers are vulnerable to clannish, superstitious, or "change-of-Routine" suspicions. they wouldn't be human otherwise.

Quote: EvenBob

They thought
EZ~Bac was too fast, also. They like to sit and
stare at their cards, which is ridiculous.

The whole commission-and-lammer tracking of old-style Baccarat - and its slow-down - was something they are simply acclimated to. Gamblers ARE often creatures of habit. But getting full pay on a Banker's win, instead of getting nailed with a 5% commission, is something brand new that very many people adjust to very well, also.

Quote: Paigowdan

tracking of old-style Baccarat - and its slow-down - was something they are simply acclimated to.

Most bac tables have a leader that all the
Asian players follow. If he bets player, so
do they, usually. If they're all betting player
and you bet banker, they will slam you with
dirty looks. And if you win, they want to
kill you.

Per DEQ (distributor of EZ Bacc)

Installs worldwide @ 11/30/10 = 237
Installs worldwide @ 2/2/12 = 403

The game is a big hit based on those numbers despite what any one pit or property may tell you.

Per DEQ (a non-exclusive distributor of EZ Pai Gow Poker)

Installs of EZ PGP @ 11/10/10 = 20
Installs of EZ PGP @ 2/2/12 = 44

These numbers do not include EZ Pai Gow tables distributed/installed by Gaming Network.

EZ PGP has had 120% growth in installations for DEQ in the last 14 months....something appears to be working well with this game.

This game appears to be gaining traction and working.

Is Texas Hold'em Deluxe (Gaming Network) still at Golden Nugget? I believe they had it at a couple of Station Properties (Palace & Sunset) and supposedly also at NY NY. It was getting some players at the GN when I was there in November. Not crazy action, but not sitting dead.

Lesson: you get ONE chance to make it if lucky; if you miss the boat, you ain't on the ride...

As for Snow offering what he did, Snow is no dummy. He saw a potential otherwise he would not have offered what he did. Snow has the muscle of SM behind him, that a lone game designer does not. The final offer should have been taken by SM unless there was spite.

If you believe that you get one chance that is exactly what you get. Edison failed over a 100 times before he finally succeded in the light bulb.

Dan I read you article about game concept from napkin to casino over a dozen times. I plan on reading it several more time. Great reading, but I do not agree with going the route of a distrututor is for me. They will want the lion's share and leave crumbs for you. If you have a dud, which over 99% of new games are, let the distubutor take the chance and do all the work. If you feel confident in your game, then doing it on your own may be the better option.

Best wishes for all new game developers and I will see you on the other side of this journey.

Quote: Paradigm

It was getting some players at the GN when I was there in November. Not crazy action, but not sitting dead.

Went I was there GN at the end of the year 2011, It (Texas Hold'em Deluxe) was not there.

Quote: AceCrAAckers

Lesson: you get ONE chance to make it if lucky; if you miss the boat, you ain't on the ride...

As for Snow offering what he did, Snow is no dummy. He saw a potential otherwise he would not have offered what he did. Snow has the muscle of SM behind him, that a lone game designer does not. The final offer should have been taken by SM unless there was spite.

Roger cannot and will not be jerked around. Intelligent men who are there on business cannot waste their time or be held hostage to unreasonable demands from a game designer. If you get a fair offer, especially one that can "make" you, it could be one's only shot; not necessarily so, but very risky to look such a gift horse in the mouth. Distributors move onto other games, games that fill their resource limits and priorities, where a previously passed-on game might not be able to jump get into the queue again.

Quote: AceCrAAckers

If you believe that you get one chance that is exactly what you get. Edison failed over a 100 times before he finally succeded in the light bulb.

Edison was his own sponsor with his own manufacturing and laboratory facilities, and had the resources to repeatedly get another go at it. He could persevere. For many of us, we're just in a hole, managing or coping with a side project that may or may not make us; if a door opens for us, it might be the only one. One game designer I know was already a millionaire, and chose a distributor, as he can't set up another operation for the game's distribution.

Quote: AceCrAAckers

Dan I read you article about game concept from napkin to casino over a dozen times.

Great thanks!

Quote: AceCrAAckers

I plan on reading it several more time. Great reading, but I do not agree with going the route of a distrututor is for me. They will want the lion's share and leave crumbs for you. If you have a dud, which over 99% of new games are, let the distubutor take the chance and do all the work. If you feel confident in your game, then doing it on your own may be the better option.

It may indeed, but for me the expenses were prohibitive: licensing, math, marketing, sales, support, review, etc. For me, it would have been like trying to purchase a paper mill to get a novel out. Going with DEQ as distributor gave me another livelihood, not wealth yet, but put me on the map and put us in position to really take off with follow-ups or with just EZ Pai Gow. I know for a fact that I would have been just another broke dealer, just getting by and managing, with no successful game out, had I tried to do it solo. I gave up the lion's share of something that would not have come to be, - for a fifth share before many expenses, but in something that indeed did get on the map. I honestly believe that if I hadn't done it this way, EZ Pai Gow would have been a great game design sitting in my filing cabinet, a stillbirth.

Quote: AceCrAAckers

Best wishes for all new game developers and I will see you on the other side of this journey.

It is a journey to get there! Best of luck!

Quote: AceCrAAckers

Edison failed over a 100 times before he finally succeded in the light bulb.

It was more like 2000 times. He didn't invent it, he bought
the patent and made a better filament. Edison was first
and foremost a ruthless businessman, something most
inventors aren't. His claim to fame was spotting a good
invention, buying the patent rights, improving it and
calling it his own, and marketing the hell out of it. He
put his name and face on everything, he invented what
they now call 'branding'. Edison was a genius, a marketing
genius.

Quote: Paradigm

Per DEQ (distributor of EZ Bacc)

Installs worldwide @ 11/30/10 = 237
Installs worldwide @ 2/2/12 = 403

The game is a big hit based on those numbers despite what any one pit or property may tell you.

If Dan did his own marketing and sales, instead of taking 20% (?) of loyalty, he only had to install:

Installs worldwide @ 11/30/10 = 47
Installs worldwide @ 2/2/12 = 81

but then a lot of DEQ folks would be out of job

"Top Play Poker" by Joe Awada, is at The Orleans since Jan, 2012, on field trial

Quote: RoyalBJ

If Dan did his own marketing and sales, instead of taking 20% (?) of loyalty, he only had to install:

Installs worldwide @ 11/30/10 = 47
Installs worldwide @ 2/2/12 = 81

but then a lot of DEQ folks would be out of job

Dan's game is EZ Pai Gow Poker. The above was for EZ Bacc.

I think Dan's point has been that he wouldn't have been able to do his own marketing & sales based on time and dollars required. So 20% of a growing installed base (50+ or whatever) without having to do the sales and installation legwork seemed better to him than what he would have been able to accomplish on his own.

I think that decision is very individual for game developers. Some feel that they can do it based on time/resources and others feel it is best to go with a distributor. There isn't a right answer for everyone.

I should get me some test installations for Cameltoe Poker!

'Neverbust Blackjack' (Planet Hollywood)
'Power Blackjack' (Paris Casino)
'Burn 20 Blackjack' (Binions)

were all field trialed in 2011 and are still installed in the casinos.

Quote: Switch

'Neverbust Blackjack' (Planet Hollywood)
'Power Blackjack' (Paris Casino)
'Burn 20 Blackjack' (Binions)

were all field trialed in 2011 and are still installed in the casinos.

Is Power BJ still at Paris? (or anywhere else?)

Is Neverbust still at PH (or anywhere else?)

I am mathematically challenged but I believe the following is true.

20% of something is greater than 120% of nothing ??

Quote: buzzpaff

I am mathematically challenged but I believe the following is true.

20% of something is greater than 120% of nothing ??

Each game developer must ask these questions for themselves.

1. Do you believe in your ability?
2. Do you want to invest time and money in what you believe in? Budget 50K and couple of years.
3. Are obstacles going to stop you? The first door you knock on will not be slammed on your face; they won't bother to open it.
4. Are you going make excuses why you failed or are you going to accept it if this happens? Over 99% are duds and as much as you believe in your game it probably is too.
5. Are you afraid? Do you want to use a distributor and let them take a lion's share > 70%+ for their support. This can only be answered by each individually.
6. Have you done everything you can?

Here is the dilemma that all games must overcome. It has an expected loss for the player and yet the player wants to keep playing. How do you create such a game? It is easy to create a game with a HE but having the player wanting to repeatedly play is an entirely another matter.

Most games are duds > 99%. It is not good enough to be hall of famer, only a Babe Ruth caliber game developers will succeed. Mickey Mantle, A Rod, Tom Seaver will not make the cut. Given the long odds, letting the distributor take the chance and risk is not a bad choice. They have the connections and they can get it installed where you might not even get a meeting with the DTGs.

Here is where a lone developer has a chance. Distributors do not have an edge on game development. In fact the next great game will more likely come from an unknown game developer than from them.

New game is an almost an impossible sell. My plan of attack was to give them a product they are familiar with. This mean side bets. This has to be so spectacular that they will give you a chance. This will be your ticket to get a meeting with them. Have several side bets installed and maybe one of them will be open to trying your table game.

Best wishes for all game developers.

Quote: buzzpaff

20% of something is greater than 120% of nothing ??

This is true but would you take this deal if you could get it installed in third as many places as the distributors and keep 100% of this?

Quote: AceCrAAckers

If you believe that you get one chance that is exactly what you get. Edison failed over a 100 times before he finally succeded in the light bulb.

Edison ripped off of Tesla! So is marketing a novel game easier than inventing one from scratch?