Limits to casino video game design

I mostly play poker, but recently I ventured out into the slot area for a brief survey of the machines after having an idea for a new casino game. I had never realized that all of the video slot machines were basically the same game with different graphics. You do have Video poker and Keno, but virtually everything else is simply slots. The Bellagio does have new heads up limit Texas Hold'em machines just outside of the poker room, but I believe that they are rakefree and that you are essentially playing against a strong AI, so the house may not technically have an edge (maybe simplifying regulation?) So, what, exactly, are the boundaries to video game design both from a regulatory standpoint and from an adoption standpoint?

In general, I'm working under the assumption that anything you can put numbers to should be allowable from a regulatory standpoint. Is this reasonable?

Obviously, from an adoption standpoint, you have to convince someone that you can make them money better than the flashing lights and well studied sounds they have in place. What I'm most interested in is whether the slot bias presents a significantly greater barrier to entry than that found in table games, or do you just not hear about people developing new video games because of more natural barriers (funding video game development is expensive but anyone can work with a deck of cards, ...)

John

It's basically the latter. The approval cycle for an electronic game can cost upwards of $25,000 in a single jurisdiction, and manufacturing licenses are very, very expensive. None of that is necessary for table games, and of course there are virtually no manufacturing costs for a table game either.

As far as the design aspects, look at the various state regulations for guidance (or GLI-11 etc.). In Nevada, see Regulation 14.

I haven't yet tested the limits of regulatory approvals, but I'm working on several concepts for entirely novel video gaming machine content -- stuff that goes way, way beyond spinning reels, line pays, and bonus rounds.

Interesting. I was thinking more about the costs of coding a game, although for some game types these costs might be controllable through outsourcing at this point. It is encouraging to hear that someone who knows more about this than me is pursuing it.

Are you going to try to get it through approval yourself, before approaching a third party(distributor?), or do you hope to interest someone else who would take care of that cost? Same question for manufacturing, is that something the game developer would look into/fund initially?

The idea I'm working on goes significantly beyond spinning wheels, though maybe not as much as yours from the sounds of it. In the past, I've considered trying to put bounds on the game tree for arcade style action games. I didn't get all that far, in part because I couldn't be convinced the risk was worth it.

Regulatory approval only comes after you have a working slot machine. GLI will likely be happy to talk with you concerning regulatory issues if you are a legit business and have about $20,000 deposit to retain their services and want to pay them $125 per hour.

To back up what MathExtremist said, you can look at GLI-11 (available at gaminglabs.com) and the Nevada regs. These are the backbone of most regulations in the United States. Other than that, the largest variation in rules comes from return percentage and top award odds.

So is my impression of this information that the "wheel" (aka, rng+stripping+coding) has already been invented (and approved), and that "new" games are mearly dressing bonus play in different themed "skins"? If that is the case, it would makes it very expensive and difficult for an independent developer with something completely different to gain a foothold.

From a designer standpoint, I would caution against games that are so different that they would take more than ten seconds for a player to understand what they need to do different from, "put in your money, hit "max bet", enjoy the cartoon and sound show, repeat". I think that's all slot players really expect (and want). If there were games that required the use of an actual strategy to maximize returns, you are now competing with video poker instead of slots.

CM,

Thanks for the link. $20k is steep but doable I think. I'm a programmer who is about 10 days into writing a demo which I think will take about a month. Some of the code will be usable elsewhere if this doesn't go anywhere. Hopefully, once I have the demo and a provisional patent, I can post a link to a demo here? I'd love additional feedback before approaching someone like GLI.

forum question: I'm having to refresh this page to see answers to my thread. My thread is not showing up in "Game Inventors Corner" on my computer. Is this on my end, or is there some sort of probation for new members posting to the main forums?

John

Quote: socks

CM,

Thanks for the link. $20k is steep but doable I think. I'm a programmer who is about 10 days into writing a demo which I think will take about a month. Some of the code will be usable elsewhere if this doesn't go anywhere. Hopefully, once I have the demo and a provisional patent, I can post a link to a demo here? I'd love additional feedback before approaching someone like GLI.

forum question: I'm having to refresh this page to see answers to my thread. My thread is not showing up in "Game Inventors Corner" on my computer. Is this on my end, or is there some sort of probation for new members posting to the main forums?

John

I'm sure lots of people here will be happy to look at a demo (based on first-hand experience), but GLI won't do anything with demo software. GLI's job is to test slot machine cabinet hardward and software, and write letters of compliance for given regulatory jurisdictions. See this:
http://www.gaminglabs.com/default.asp?contentID=45

Aye,

I used "Video Game" and not just "Slots" in the title because I'm not necessarily trying to make a slots competitor. It probably will be hard to break through one way or the other, but I think my game passes your 10 second test, at least, as far as basic play goes. Like I said to CM, hopefully I can post a demo in a few weeks for some better feedback.

Thanks,
John

Quote: Ayecarumba

So is my impression of this information that the "wheel" (aka, rng+stripping+coding) has already been invented (and approved), and that "new" games are mearly dressing bonus play in different themed "skins"? If that is the case, it would makes it very expensive and difficult for an independent developer with something completely different to gain a foothold.

From a designer standpoint, I would caution against games that are so different that they would take more than ten seconds for a player to understand what they need to do different from, "put in your money, hit "max bet", enjoy the cartoon and sound show, repeat". I think that's all slot players really expect (and want). If there were games that required the use of an actual strategy to maximize returns, you are now competing with video poker instead of slots.

I agree with the strategy comment, but I have a hard time believing that only spinning-reel slots will ever be popular. There are dozens of different genres popular in the non-casino video game world. Even in video slot games, a small number of games use non-traditional game mechanisms, whether it's cascading symbols, all scatter pays, or non-orthogonal playfields. I'm betting that within 10 years there will be a meaningful number of gaming machines on the floor that don't involve the imagery of spinning reels at all.

Quote: MathExtremist

Even in video slot games, a small number of games use non-traditional game mechanisms, whether it's cascading symbols, all scatter pays, or non-orthogonal playfields.

I've seen an online demo at Leading Edge's site for a slot-type game where gems "fall" on the screen,a nd you win depending on how many of the same type are contiguous, kind of like a match-3 game like Bejeweled. Also an "Othello" based game.

That's different enough from spinning reels, I suppose, but not to get me interested.

Quote: socks

Aye,

I used "Video Game" and not just "Slots" in the title because I'm not necessarily trying to make a slots competitor. It probably will be hard to break through one way or the other, but I think my game passes your 10 second test, at least, as far as basic play goes. Like I said to CM, hopefully I can post a demo in a few weeks for some better feedback.

Thanks,
John

Thanks for the feedback. Best of luck to you, and we all look forward to a demo.

As for the link dropping off, your most recent comments will drop to the bottom of the list, but they pop back up when someone new replies. I think it is designed to keep you up to date on the newest comments.

Quote: MathExtremist

I agree with the strategy comment, but I have a hard time believing that only spinning-reel slots will ever be popular. There are dozens of different genres popular in the non-casino video game world. Even in video slot games, a small number of games use non-traditional game mechanisms, whether it's cascading symbols, all scatter pays, or non-orthogonal playfields. I'm betting that within 10 years there will be a meaningful number of gaming machines on the floor that don't involve the imagery of spinning reels at all.

I'm not a hardcore slot player. I'm not even a casual slot player. However, what I have observed is that players, especially on the penny slots, will play with no idea what a winning combination is supposed to look like. I have seen machines with like, 30 different paylines. It's nuts.

I think players are only looking for the bonus round, where they can enjoy a little video, listen to some music, and maybe "pick" something to reveal a prize. This seems pretty straightforward, and not spinning reel-like at all (even though the RNG based processes behind the game are essentially the same as a traditional slot machine). However, if you add in any element of strategy or required player activity that might affect the size of the winnings, it becomes a very different game, which I don't think will appeal to many current slot players. "Too stressful", "Too much thinking" they will say. Has anyone put in a "double or nothing" feature, similar to the ones found on some VP machines, on a slot? If not, why not? If so, was it successful?

Quote: MathExtremist

I'm sure lots of people here will be happy to look at a demo (based on first-hand experience), but GLI won't do anything with demo software. GLI's job is to test slot machine cabinet hardward and software, and write letters of compliance for given regulatory jurisdictions. See this:
http://www.gaminglabs.com/default.asp?contentID=45

I guess I have some reading to do. I was imagining plugging up a modern computer/OS with usb devices to accept payment/input/ect... But GLI requests copies of "video, sound, printer, touchscreen, and bill validator software" which makes me think that's not going to happen. All of a sudden, I have pictures of people in backrooms with EPROM burners. Do all these companies really develop proprietary drivers for all these things or is there some sort of industry standard? Can I go to a manufacturer who will have these things on hand, and if so, what do I expect to pay?

Thanks again,
John