How to find the patent number on a game?

Trying to find the patent number of a game out there called So What, or Dealer's Hot So What, owned currently by Score Gaming.

Would it be weird to call and ask them?

Is there a better way to find out?

Gaming patents are stupid complicated, a very quick search came up with nothing (I work in IP), but there's always a chance they put the game under a person not listed on their website... associated with someone other than Score Gaming... or listed it without the term "blackjack" in the disclosure. I'd like to note that their math analysis http://www.scoregamingnv.com/wp-content/uploads/SO-WHAT-BJ.pdf is dated 2011, which is far back, but backlogs vary significantly between the arts.

Your solutions are to hire a legitimate patent searcher or contact Score.

I've spoken with Bobby Jones at the Grosvenor Showcase and he seems very friendly. I notice they have a "contact" button on their website ( http://www.scoregamingnv.com/who-we-are/ ).

How do you know it's patented in the first place?

Quote: MathExtremist

How do you know it's patented in the first place?

It's offered for commercial use in the United States. Correct me if I am wrong, but every game out there has patent protection? Otherwise, the casino could simply offer the same game under a different name.

No, there are many casino games that aren't patented. There are also many others that are copied, to some degree, from other games. Think about how many blackjack side bets relate to a player score of 20, for example.

Some of them are not patented because they are not patentable.

Odd. I know that Nevada requires for a patent application in order for a new game to be considered.

Also, why would a casino pay a fee for a game that isn't patented? Why wouldn't the casino just have the graphics art department make a new layout, with enough changes to dodge a copyright claim, and then put the game on the floor for free?

Quote: 21Flip

Trying to find the patent number of a game out there called So What, or Dealer's Hot So What, owned currently by Score Gaming.

Would it be weird to call and ask them?

Is there a better way to find out?

You can search the USPTO's assignment database to see all the patents and published applications assigned to Score Gaming. Here's where you search: http://assignment.uspto.gov/

If you run a search on all patents and published applications assigned to Score Gaming, it comes back with 12. (see http://assignment.uspto.gov/#/search?q=%22score%20gaming%22&sort=patAssignorEarliestExDate%20desc%2C%20id%20desc&synonyms=false)

You can take a look at each of the listed patents/applications and see if one of them is what you're looking for.

If it's not there, then one of the following things is the case:
1) The inventor(s) have not applied for a patent on this game
2) The inventor(s) have applied for a patent, but it has not published or issued yet (patent applications publish 18 months after filing unless the inventor(s) elect for it not to publish until it issues (if it issues at all))
3) The inventors applied for a patent, but have not yet executed an assignment to Score Gaming.
4) The inventors applied for a patent, executed an assignment, but for some reason Score Gaming hasn't gotten around to recording the assignment at the USPTO.

I hope this is helpful. Feel free to give me a shout on here or via PM if you have follow-up questions.

Quote: 21Flip

Odd. I know that Nevada requires for a patent application in order for a new game to be considered.

Also, why would a casino pay a fee for a game that isn't patented? Why wouldn't the casino just have the graphics art department make a new layout, with enough changes to dodge a copyright claim, and then put the game on the floor for free?

Nevada requires a patent application (basically, a proof of filing for a patent), which indicates proof of taking good faith steps in trying to obtain a patent. This means that Nevada does not require a published Utility patent, which is different. If they did, game designers and companies would lose years and years in gaming industry opportunity cost while the patent goes through the long process of getting its final approval. This can take eons.

Game owners can also use trademarks, copyrights, and just their "game source momentum" to establish themselves as a reliable fee-requiring source for the game.

Some casino operators do use public domain side bets with no fees, or develop their own versions without external fees in some cases. They do have artwork done, file copyrights ("MGM Stud" or the like), and get some games installed - for the games they can do this for. Remember, they also have to file for gaming approval, which is time and money, and if an already-approved game is leased very inexpensively, why bother, as it makes more sense to install the game cheaply, then to re-do all the development work (artwork, mathematics, gaming approval, etc.) all over again.

Thanks, PGD.

That's actually really interesting and informative.

Today I Learned! (TIL)