IGT Unsolicited Submission page

Can anyone tell me how much stock to put into IGT's online submission page? Has anyone else gone this route?

I (we - I have a partner) have a demo of an (atypical) slot machine online with the math completed, but I'm not entirely sure I'm ready to lay out the money for a patent. Would anyone approach this company (or any other) with a design but no patent?

I would be leery because unsolicited ideas might cause you to forfeit certain legal rights.

I think i would get at least a provisional patent before doing this just to be safe.

Lawyer up and set up a meeting.

Thanks for the replies. I did a little digging through old threads and remembered why this topic frustrated me before and why provisionals weren't on my radar: opinions are all over the place.

I'm leaning toward the approach MathExtremist described in one of those threads, to write the spec and take a stab at the claims. Can anyone comment on how this will likely effect cost if I can do it effectively and the number of claims is relatively limited (I think I can capture the invention with few claims) ??

I believe it was RealizeGaming who said in one thread that he had a number of patents and paid an average of $12k ea for them. I/we don't have that. We might have half that... maybe.

edit: I'm asking about cost in lawyer's time, if I get a lawyer to look over a provisional. Should I be able to get this done for <$5k?

Just two things you should do first:

1. Make a search (start with Google) to be sure no one else has your idea.
2. Make a poor man's copyright (patent) which is where you mail a registered letter to yourself with your idea/details inside. It is cheap to do and wouldn't hurt but will not necessarily help you.

And then talk to a lawyer.

Quote: AlanMendelson

Just two things you should do first:

1. Make a search (start with Google) to be sure no one else has your idea.
2. Make a poor man's copyright (patent) which is where you mail a registered letter to yourself with your idea/details inside. It is cheap to do and wouldn't hurt but will not necessarily help you.

And then talk to a lawyer.

Do people really do patent searches in the gaming world? I have read more from the software/startup perspective, where the advice often seems to be don't bother... you're going to be stepping on someone's patent(because the system is that broken); If you ever make money, you're going to be sued (In the video Patent Absurdity, The author of "Patent Failure" says everyone he knows who is making money is being sued); and if the suit is enforceable, it's better to not have known about the patent because statutory penalties are treble if you know. But then, I think the trendy fast iteration internet-startup business model is also not as conducive to patents.

Quote: socks

I'm asking about cost in lawyer's time, if I get a lawyer to look over a provisional. Should I be able to get this done for <$5k?

Assuming your game isn't too complex, you should be able to get a patent lawyer to WRITE your provisional for well under $1K. To merely look over what you've written would cost less.

Quote: AlanMendelson

Make a poor man's copyright (patent) which is where you mail a registered letter to yourself with your idea/details inside. It is cheap to do and wouldn't hurt but will not necessarily help you.

These tend to be worthless. About the only thing this can be used for is if you end up with an unethical lawyer who steals your idea.

Quote: DJTeddyBear

Assuming your game isn't too complex, you should be able to get a patent lawyer to WRITE your provisional for well under $1K. To merely look over what you've written would cost less.

Oh, so, in another thread discflickr quoted the Wizard as saying <$5k dont bother, $5k = go with provisional, $10k = get a utility.

Are these numbers out of date? Maybe it was a misquote? Or is $5k a threshold for some other reason?

It is really hard to put a number on the cost. Each lawyer can charge different amounts, some games take a long amount of time to put into a solid patent, and sometimes the drawings used in the patent and the background search vary from one game to the next.

I do like the idea of a provisional. I also do some of my own research and patent writing which does save on the cost, but it has taken a number of years to feel comfortable that i'm actually helping in the process.

IGT will want some assurance that it is your game before they even look at it. I know in my case i have to submit my games through their website and they check to see if it is a published patent before they allow their other employees to look at it. They state that the process takes a very long time for them to review a submission. I just wish they would reply back if they are not interested instead of not doing anything.

To give you an idea of the process i use now when i have a new video poker idea:

1. Write all the steps or rules to follow for the new game.
2. Include every possible embodiment from the base game.
3. Research the patent office, or google patents for the game concept i want to use. Keep track of patent numbers for games that could be similar to your game.
4. Create drawings to show the gaming process (i use smartboard notebook software)
5. Find a good patent in your field to use as a guide to writing your patent.
6. Make sure to reference the drawings as you write your patent and be very thorough in explaining your game.
7. For the claims, i write down the main concepts i use in my game... Again use other patents to help you.
8. Once i get to this point, i have a rough draft of a patent and i get ready to meet my patent attorney. The work mentioned above can save you thousands of dollars, but you definitely need a professional patent attorney going forward from this point.

I'm currently working on my next game and i'm always following the steps above.

Hope this helps you out some.

Quote: socks

Can anyone tell me how much stock to put into IGT's online submission page? Has anyone else gone this route?

I've always felt that submitting a game idea via an online submission form (with any manufacturer) is not the best way to go. There is something to be said about making an in-person presentation where you can show your enthusiasm, make the case for your game, and answer questions. When submitting a game idea online, you have no idea what kind of consideration it was given. If they decline, you've may have ruined your chances for then presenting the same game in person as they may say they've already reviewed the game. My recommendation would be to try to use what contacts you can muster up and get in the door to make a personal presentation. You can typically get a meeting with someone at any of the major slot manufacturers if you just try hard enough.

Quote: RealizeGaming

IGT will want some assurance that it is your game before they even look at it. I know in my case i have to submit my games through their website and they check to see if it is a published patent before they allow their other employees to look at it. They state that the process takes a very long time for them to review a submission. I just wish they would reply back if they are not interested instead of not doing anything.

Interesting, thanks.

Quote: jon

There is something to be said about making an in-person presentation where you can show your enthusiasm, make the case for your game, and answer questions. When submitting a game idea online, you have no idea what kind of consideration it was given. If they decline, you've may have ruined your chances for then presenting the same game in person as they may say they've already reviewed the game.

Good points, thanks. It's easy when you get worn down to start after doing the first couple of legs (design, code, math), to start looking for the easiest route... especially when this isn't the only project on the plate. But I think we're going to try and get a provisional. After that, there's no reason not to just show the game online right? I mean, it'd be nice to get a proper gut check on the idea before proceeding. (I'm obviously eager to get someone to tell me that my idea is as awesome as I think it is. Typical inventor, I know :) )

Q: So, places prefer to see a patent before seriously looking at an idea. How much difference is the provisional vs utility patent in this regard. Will some places only consider a game that has a utility patent?

You should be okay with only a provisional, but it seems like they prefer a utility before taking a serious look at it. IGT will check to see that it is either a provisional or an allowed patent before talking with you. I run into a problem at this point because my patent lawyer doesn't like to publish my provisionals, so it makes it hard to prove that my games are legit until they issue.