justing2021
• Posts: 2
Joined: Sep 26, 2021
September 26th, 2021 at 2:47:39 AM permalink
The following strategy is "simple strategy" for jacks or better video poker

----2 unsuited high cards (if more than 2 then pick the lowest 2)
Question 1: Then which two cards you should keep? if you get any 4 or 3 cards of J, Q, K, A?

---- Suited 10/J, 10/Q, or 10/K
BleedingChipsSlowly
• Posts: 1033
Joined: Jul 9, 2010
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September 26th, 2021 at 3:47:52 AM permalink
“You don’t bring a bone saw to a negotiation.” - Robert Jordan, former U.S. ambassador to Saudi Arabia
TinMan
• Posts: 459
Joined: Nov 17, 2009
September 26th, 2021 at 6:23:45 AM permalink
I might be imagining things but I could have sworn the simple 96 JOB had a footnote at one point saying “hands not listed should never be played, most notably A/10 suited”.

Unrelated but I do hesitate when faced with something like 2/5/6/Q/J. If the low cards are suited the simple strat says to go for the SF. I know that’s wrong but there is a trade off between strength and simplicity. The advanced strat has to have several categories of SF draws. I wind up taking a middle road and will take the two high cards over the weakest SF draw with 2 gaps.
If anyone gives you 10,000 to 1 on anything, you take it. If John Mellencamp ever wins an Oscar, I am going to be a very rich dude.
ThatDonGuy
• Posts: 6542
Joined: Jun 22, 2011
September 26th, 2021 at 9:57:05 AM permalink
Quote: justing2021

The following strategy is "simple strategy" for jacks or better video poker

----2 unsuited high cards (if more than 2 then pick the lowest 2)
Question 1: Then which two cards you should keep? if you get any 4 or 3 cards of J, Q, K, A?

---- Suited 10/J, 10/Q, or 10/K

1. Keep the lowest two. If you get A, K, Q, then keep K, Q and discard the Ace.

2. With Ace/10 suited, keep the Ace, but discard the 10.

Personally, in (1), if I am dealt AKQJ, I would keep all four (with just AKQ, discard the Ace), and if dealt KQJ, I would keep all three. (With AQJ, I would discard the Ace.)
Also, in (2), if I am dealt King/10 suited, I would discard the 10 and keep the King. (Queen/10 and Jack/10, I would keep both.)
HopHoofer
• Posts: 18
Joined: Oct 13, 2021
October 13th, 2021 at 3:45:35 PM permalink
Quote: ThatDonGuy

Quote: justing2021

The following strategy is "simple strategy" for jacks or better video poker

----2 unsuited high cards (if more than 2 then pick the lowest 2)
Question 1: Then which two cards you should keep? if you get any 4 or 3 cards of J, Q, K, A?

---- Suited 10/J, 10/Q, or 10/K

1. Keep the lowest two. If you get A, K, Q, then keep K, Q and discard the Ace.

2. With Ace/10 suited, keep the Ace, but discard the 10.

Personally, in (1), if I am dealt AKQJ, I would keep all four (with just AKQ, discard the Ace), and if dealt KQJ, I would keep all three. (With AQJ, I would discard the Ace.)
Also, in (2), if I am dealt King/10 suited, I would discard the 10 and keep the King. (Queen/10 and Jack/10, I would keep both.)

1. You never hold three unsuited high cards containing an Ace. Basically it's true in most JoB varieties.
2. in JoB, for the hand AKQJ with suited QJ, hold QJ unless the 5th card is a 9 or same suit as QJ. I know this rule is beyond simple strategy, but it will trigger a major mistake if you don't hold this way.
3. Holding suited Ace Ten is a major mistake because Ten is a low card and there is no straight flush you can get. But it is a correct strategy in Joker or Bonus deuces for only certain pay schedules.
AxelWolf
• Posts: 22310
Joined: Oct 10, 2012
October 13th, 2021 at 5:16:45 PM permalink
Quote: ThatDonGuy

Also, in (2), if I am dealt King/10 suited, I would discard the 10 and keep the King.

Why?
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
ThatDonGuy
• Posts: 6542
Joined: Jun 22, 2011
October 13th, 2021 at 5:33:36 PM permalink
Quote: AxelWolf

Quote: ThatDonGuy

Also, in (2), if I am dealt King/10 suited, I would discard the 10 and keep the King.

Why?

"Why" do any of these plays? According to my calculation, holding just the King has a better expected value.
gordonm888

• Posts: 5263
Joined: Feb 18, 2015
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October 13th, 2021 at 5:58:47 PM permalink
Quote: ThatDonGuy

Quote: justing2021

The following strategy is "simple strategy" for jacks or better video poker

----2 unsuited high cards (if more than 2 then pick the lowest 2)
Question 1: Then which two cards you should keep? if you get any 4 or 3 cards of J, Q, K, A?

---- Suited 10/J, 10/Q, or 10/K

[**snip**]
Also, in (2), if I am dealt King/10 suited, I would discard the 10 and keep the King. (Queen/10 and Jack/10, I would keep both.)

Our WOO site WOO page on JOB strategy says

Suited TK (0.4682) (See note F)
K only (0.4649)

Note F. Suited 10, king vs. king only: Normally the suited ten and king is better than the king alone, however, if you must discard a 9 and a flush penalty card, then hold the king only.
*********
So, that seems to disagree with your calculation
So many better men, a few of them friends, are dead. And a thousand thousand slimy things live on, and so do I.
ThatDonGuy
• Posts: 6542
Joined: Jun 22, 2011
October 13th, 2021 at 6:06:36 PM permalink
Quote: gordonm888

Quote: ThatDonGuy

Quote: justing2021

The following strategy is "simple strategy" for jacks or better video poker

----2 unsuited high cards (if more than 2 then pick the lowest 2)
Question 1: Then which two cards you should keep? if you get any 4 or 3 cards of J, Q, K, A?

---- Suited 10/J, 10/Q, or 10/K

[**snip**]
Also, in (2), if I am dealt King/10 suited, I would discard the 10 and keep the King. (Queen/10 and Jack/10, I would keep both.)

Our WOO site WOO page on JOB strategy says

Suited TK (0.4682) (See note F)
K only (0.4649)

Note F. Suited 10, king vs. king only: Normally the suited ten and king is better than the king alone, however, if you must discard a 9 and a flush penalty card, then hold the king only.
*********
So, that seems to disagree with your calculation

I'll have to check my analyzer again. I get 0.4332 for King and 0.4292 for King/10 suited, but I think the value for King includes the possibility of drawing the suited 10.
LoquaciousMoFW
• Posts: 194
Joined: Aug 24, 2014
October 13th, 2021 at 6:22:42 PM permalink
I use a modified version of TDG's always discard 10 in K/10 suited: When playing 9/5 or worse Job or BP always discard 10 unless no flush penalty cards. Seems to get a bit closer to ideal without much extra effort.
ThatDonGuy
• Posts: 6542
Joined: Jun 22, 2011
October 23rd, 2021 at 8:02:35 AM permalink
I am working on something that can calculate the best plays for all hands containing a particular set of cards, and I noticed this:

With King/10 Suited in 9/6 Jacks or Better, you hold just the King (and discard the 10) if you also have both an offsuit 9 and a suited 2-8.

For example, with Ks 10s 9h 6c 2s, you keep just Ks, but change 2s to 2d and you keep both Ks and 10s.

This appears to be confirmed by the Wizard's VP hand analyzer.
Mission146