Are some people just incapable of learning VP?
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 | 5 votes (62.5%) | ||
| | 2 votes (25%) | ||
| | 1 vote (12.5%) |
8 members have voted
August 21st, 2018 at 7:58:09 PM
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I tried teaching someone the basics, they seem to be a little slow. Basically all they wanted to do was hold high cards, couldn't notice there being low pairs, four to a flush, etc. They actually couldn't even remember what the suits were, couldn't even see that a diamond was a diamond and a heart a heart. It was actually so funny to hear her answers, but they were so unintelligent, I have trouble believing this could be learned even close to quickly. Will they be able to learn slowly over the course of years rather than months, I don't know, probably. I know they are quite terrible at basic math, their answers to simple math questions is really a guessing game, they failed algebra many times.
Even if they learn, I expect many mistakes and for them to forget to hold premium dealt hands eventually.
Even if they learn, I expect many mistakes and for them to forget to hold premium dealt hands eventually.
I am a robot.
August 21st, 2018 at 11:27:43 PM
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Did they want to learn? Big question.
If so, what were they hoping to accomplish by learning? Did they want to lower the house edge, learn how to play computer perfect for their pride, or heard it's a way to make +EV?
If so, what were they hoping to accomplish by learning? Did they want to lower the house edge, learn how to play computer perfect for their pride, or heard it's a way to make +EV?
"Man Babes" #AxelFabulous
August 21st, 2018 at 11:45:31 PM
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Few people are completely unable to learn something when taught correctly. People learn differently and sometimes the problem isn't the student, or the teacher but the chemistry between them.
The only class I ever failed in HS was geometry. Had the same teacher for summer school and failed again. I originally had the same teacher a third time but I was able to talk my way into another teacher's class. This guy's techniques worked for me. I finished the year with an 87 and got a 94 on the Regents. I don't think the first guy was a bad teacher, just not a person I could learn from.
The only class I ever failed in HS was geometry. Had the same teacher for summer school and failed again. I originally had the same teacher a third time but I was able to talk my way into another teacher's class. This guy's techniques worked for me. I finished the year with an 87 and got a 94 on the Regents. I don't think the first guy was a bad teacher, just not a person I could learn from.
The older I get, the better I recall things that never happened
August 22nd, 2018 at 9:34:20 AM
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It's not that I'm not t capable; it's just that I don't care.
The best things in life are not free.
August 22nd, 2018 at 10:54:48 AM
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Sounds like someone who had never played a card game in their life, and you were trying to teach them to run before they could crawl.
August 22nd, 2018 at 2:33:26 PM
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In some ways, yes, kind of immersion. They have some learning disability, short term memory problems, etc. Everything I tell them about everything, they act like understand, then completely blow it routinely.Quote: TigerWuSounds like someone who had never played a card game in their life, and you were trying to teach them to run before they could crawl.
To answer DJ, I want them to learn and everyone else, so they're not stuck to only slot machines. I'm beginning to think the actual losses could go up if she played VP over the usual slot bets she makes, which can be pretty low. There won't be much if any EV VP around this area, but you never know what might change, or when there will be travel.
I am a robot.
August 22nd, 2018 at 2:39:13 PM
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Well, if this person has some mental disabilities, perhaps video poker is too complex a game for them to learn.
Maybe show them some baccarat? Or just some super basic craps, like pass line with odds, and nothing else.
Oh, there's also those electronic craps and roulette games, now, if you want to stick to non-slot machines.
Maybe show them some baccarat? Or just some super basic craps, like pass line with odds, and nothing else.
Oh, there's also those electronic craps and roulette games, now, if you want to stick to non-slot machines.
August 22nd, 2018 at 4:36:03 PM
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My ex-wife had ZERO card sense. There was no way to teach her anything. She struggled with Casino War.
Beware, I work for the dark side.... We have cookies
September 3rd, 2018 at 2:37:38 PM
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Quote: TigerWuWell, if this person has some mental disabilities, perhaps video poker is too complex a game for them to learn.
Maybe show them some baccarat? Or just some super basic craps, like pass line with odds, and nothing else.
Oh, there's also those electronic craps and roulette games, now, if you want to stick to non-slot machines.
Exactly. Play baccarat... it's easy, bet banker.
Even I can't learn craps. It's too complicated.
Roulette is easy and requires no strategy whatsoever. You get to choose how much variance you want, from the lowest (red/black) to the highest (single spot) and a bunch in between.
Or just play slot machines. So what if it's eighty-something percent return, at 30 cents a spin, who cares?!
September 3rd, 2018 at 3:11:03 PM
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You got a Pass line bet, you got an odds bet, you got a come bet, you got odds, if your line bet neither wins nor loses you go into the 'bonus round'. You ignore everything in the center of the table or anything that someone is calling out. What's complicated about it?Quote: KevinAAEven I can't learn craps. It's too complicated
?!
September 4th, 2018 at 1:10:46 PM
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Quote: FleaStiffYou got a Pass line bet, you got an odds bet, you got a come bet, you got odds, if your line bet neither wins nor loses you go into the 'bonus round'. You ignore everything in the center of the table or anything that someone is calling out. What's complicated about it?
I have this quirk that I don't play any games unless I can play them as PERFECTLY as I can. I just don't have the time to learn every single bet available at craps.
This means I only play two VP games (Bonus Poker and DDB), because I memorized the PERFECT strategy rules. At one time I had also memorized perfect strategy for JoB and Super Aces, but due to lack of play, I've forgotten. I know I could play JoB with perfect BP strategy and not lose much, but I would rather not get four aces on JoB! :-)
When I play video BJ, I use basic strategy with zero errors (I'm still working on whether a 3 card 16 v 10 should be stand or hit).
When I play table BJ, I count cards and use index plays a little. This is why I say "as perfectly as I can", because to play table BJ perfectly, you would have to be able to calculate the highest EV move given the exact composition of the rest of the deck, which requires a computer (illegal) or hours and hours of time (clearly, not feasible).
When I play slot machines, I play them perfectly (anyone does) because the computer does all the work for me! :-)
I would play roulette if it were single zero but I have yet to see one in my entire life. Double zero is not going to happen. I'll play slot machines before I play double zero roulette.
September 4th, 2018 at 1:16:05 PM
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Quote: KevinAAI have this quirk that I don't play any games unless I can play them as PERFECTLY as I can. I just don't have the time to learn every single bet available at craps.
If you played every single bet available in craps, you wouldn't be playing perfectly, because most of them have terrible odds.
Pass line with full odds, and nothing else, is about as perfect a game of craps as you can get.
At least, I think. I'm not really a craps guy, but that's definitely the lowest house edge.
Quote: KevinAA
I would play roulette if it were single zero but I have yet to see one in my entire life.
Vegas has some single zeros.
September 4th, 2018 at 1:32:20 PM
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Agree. If your goal is just to minimize HE play the DP and DC with full odds. PL and CL more “fun” if you want the crowd to be with you and sacrifice very little HE. Ignore every other bet at the table.
I assume you’ll play BJ that has a dumb side bet at the table? And just you don’t bet on the side bet. Just pretend that all the other craps bets are side bets at the BJ table and ignore them.
I’m also confused how you count and play “some” index plays but aren’t sure if you should hit a three card 16 into a 10. What to do with 16 vs 10 is the most basic of index plays for a counter.
I assume you’ll play BJ that has a dumb side bet at the table? And just you don’t bet on the side bet. Just pretend that all the other craps bets are side bets at the BJ table and ignore them.
I’m also confused how you count and play “some” index plays but aren’t sure if you should hit a three card 16 into a 10. What to do with 16 vs 10 is the most basic of index plays for a counter.
Last edited by: unJon on Sep 4, 2018
The race is not always to the swift, nor the battle to the strong; but that is the way to bet.
September 4th, 2018 at 7:28:01 PM
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Quote: unJonAgree. If your goal is just to minimize HE play the DP and DC with full odds. PL and CL more “fun” if you want the crowd to be with you and sacrifice very little HE. Ignore every other bet at the table.
I assume you’ll play BJ that has a dumb side bet at the table? And just you don’t bet on the side bet. Just pretend that all the other craps bets are side bets at the BJ table and ignore them.
I’m also confused how you count and play “some” index plays but aren’t sure if you should hit a three card 16 into a 10. What to do with 16 vs 10 is the most basic of index plays for a counter.
I know about that at a table game. I was referring to video BJ. Here is my problem: (6 decks, dealer hits soft 17)
September 4th, 2018 at 8:28:45 PM
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Quote: KevinAAI know about that at a table game. I was referring to video BJ. Here is my problem: (6 decks, dealer hits soft 17)
Rule is 45. Don’t hit a 16 against a 10 if your hand has a 4 or 5 in it.
The race is not always to the swift, nor the battle to the strong; but that is the way to bet.
September 4th, 2018 at 8:56:28 PM
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Quote: unJon
Rule is 45. Don’t hit a 16 against a 10 if your hand has a 4 or 5 in it.
That's cool! Thanks!
September 4th, 2018 at 9:01:19 PM
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dup dup
September 5th, 2018 at 2:53:02 PM
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You should run the various permutations of being dealt a 12 starting hand vs a 4 upcard. You’ll find another cool BS deviation.Quote: KevinAAThat's cool! Thanks!
Last edited by: unJon on Sep 5, 2018
The race is not always to the swift, nor the battle to the strong; but that is the way to bet.
September 5th, 2018 at 6:45:51 PM
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Quote: unJonQuote: KevinAAI know about that at a table game. I was referring to video BJ. Here is my problem: (6 decks, dealer hits soft 17)
Rule is 45. Don’t hit a 16 against a 10 if your hand has a 4 or 5 in it.
I'll go a step further and say to look at all cards exposed, not just your own hand.
The older I get, the better I recall things that never happened
September 5th, 2018 at 6:47:30 PM
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Quote: billryanQuote: unJonQuote: KevinAAI know about that at a table game. I was referring to video BJ. Here is my problem: (6 decks, dealer hits soft 17)
Rule is 45. Don’t hit a 16 against a 10 if your hand has a 4 or 5 in it.
I'll go a step further and say to look at all cards exposed, not just your own hand.
Def agree but I didn’t think you saw anyone else hand in video BJ? (I’ve never played it so I don’t know)
The race is not always to the swift, nor the battle to the strong; but that is the way to bet.
September 5th, 2018 at 6:50:09 PM
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Quote: unJonQuote: KevinAAI know about that at a table game. I was referring to video BJ. Here is my problem: (6 decks, dealer hits soft 17)
Rule is 45. Don’t hit a 16 against a 10 if your hand has a 4 or 5 in it.
I'll go a step further and say to look at all cards exposed, not just your own hand.
The older I get, the better I recall things that never happened
September 5th, 2018 at 6:53:11 PM
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Quote: billryanQuote: unJonQuote: KevinAAI know about that at a table game. I was referring to video BJ. Here is my problem: (6 decks, dealer hits soft 17)
Rule is 45. Don’t hit a 16 against a 10 if your hand has a 4 or 5 in it.
I'll go a step further and say to look at all cards exposed, not just your own hand.
Def agree but I didn’t think you saw anyone else hand in video BJ? (I’ve never played it so I don’t know)
The race is not always to the swift, nor the battle to the strong; but that is the way to bet.
September 5th, 2018 at 6:53:27 PM
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Quote: unJonQuote: billryanQuote: unJonQuote: KevinAAI know about that at a table game. I was referring to video BJ. Here is my problem: (6 decks, dealer hits soft 17)
Rule is 45. Don’t hit a 16 against a 10 if your hand has a 4 or 5 in it.
I'll go a step further and say to look at all cards exposed, not just your own hand.
Def agree but I didn’t think you saw anyone else hand in video BJ? (I’ve never played it so I don’t know)
Depends on the machine. Some casinos have machines where a number of players play against a dealer.
Some machines let a single player play seven hands vs dealer.
Normal VBJ is only you vs dealer.
The older I get, the better I recall things that never happened
September 5th, 2018 at 8:08:32 PM
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Quote: unJon
Def agree but I didn’t think you saw anyone else hand in video BJ? (I’ve never played it so I don’t know)
Yes, you can.
September 6th, 2018 at 6:55:06 AM
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Quote: billryanQuote: unJonQuote: billryanQuote: unJonQuote: KevinAAI know about that at a table game. I was referring to video BJ. Here is my problem: (6 decks, dealer hits soft 17)
Rule is 45. Don’t hit a 16 against a 10 if your hand has a 4 or 5 in it.
I'll go a step further and say to look at all cards exposed, not just your own hand.
Def agree but I didn’t think you saw anyone else hand in video BJ? (I’ve never played it so I don’t know)
Depends on the machine. Some casinos have machines where a number of players play against a dealer.
Some machines let a single player play seven hands vs dealer.
Normal VBJ is only you vs dealer.
If you look at those multi-player vbj machines, you will find that some, if not all, have each person's cards dealt from their own shoe, which is different from the dealer's shoe. There are about 6 pages of help files on them, and that information will be buried somewhere in them, if that's how the program works. So the effect of card removal on those games, or any use of checking other dealt cards, is negated.
If the House lost every hand, they wouldn't deal the game.
