Vulturing ultimate x question
look at this picture, it shows you what I mean.
https://wizardofodds.com/games/video-poker/tables/ultimate-x/
Quote: cmlotitoThese are most likely the new style machines that have a loading screen when switching between games. As far as I can tell these newer machines cannot be vultured. The older style machines can be vultured, you just have to find them.
Why couldn't they? The loading screen has nothing to do with anything, you're talking about the All-Star multi-game machines, they are the ones with Three-Play, Five-Play, Ten-Play, Ultimate X, Super Times Pay and sometimes Spin Poker and others on them. Very popular machines.
In my experience, you only get the loading screen when you switch from one game TYPE (ex. Super Times Pay to Ultimate X) to another.
Quote: GWAEdo they say next hand 2x. I made the same mistake on the first few I played until I realized they have to say next hand.
look at this picture, it shows you what I mean.
https://wizardofodds.com/games/video-poker/tables/ultimate-x/
Yeah, I had the good fortune of making that mistake in a High Limit room and calling Axelwolf in on the play...still haven't heard the end of that one...lol!
What can I say, I'd never seen an Ultimate X machine before at that time!
Quote: Mission146Why couldn't they? The loading screen has nothing to do with anything, you're talking about the All-Star multi-game machines, they are the ones with Three-Play, Five-Play, Ten-Play, Ultimate X, Super Times Pay and sometimes Spin Poker and others on them. Very popular machines.
In my experience, you only get the loading screen when you switch from one game TYPE (ex. Super Times Pay to Ultimate X) to another.
The machines that are the new type of ultimate x I have seen are like this. If it has a multiplier for next hand and you put money in it the multiplier disappears. This even happened to me when I was playing on a machine to kill some time. I was not paying attention and ran out of credits on the machine. I did not leave the game. I simply put more money in it and as soon as the credits registered the multipliers that should have appeared on the next hand disappeared. The machines I am talking about are at Maryland Live casino in Hanover, Maryland. I have not seem the same type of machine in Vegas So I cannot speak to how the same kinds of machine work in Vegas.
I do know the "older" style of Ultimate X machines I have seen in Vegas and at other casinos retain the multipliers.
Tunica (where I know Mikey plays) is probably the toughest market for multipliers in my foray of trying. Even worse than Vegas. :-\
As soon as you told me how good it was, and how many there were, I knew this would be next to impossible in that location.Quote: Mission146Yeah, I had the good fortune of making that mistake in a High Limit room and calling Axelwolf in on the play...still haven't heard the end of that one...lol!
What can I say, I'd never seen an Ultimate X machine before at that time!
It was very funny and still is.
Dose it say next hand? *Face palm* Your eyes must have been filled with dollar signs and you had the money spent one minute, full of tears the next.
The first time I ever seen UX I tested them st8 up to see how they worked and I thought wow this is going to be confusing to people the first few min.
I was wondering why the the bonus card (logo) was on fire.
Quote: GWAEAre machines at maryland live VLTs?
All machines at Maryland Live are regular slot machines as far as I know. The ultimate X at the bar play like traditional games where the multipliers stay on the machine. The free standing newer machines are the ones I have witnessed lose their multipliers when putting money into the machine. I have gone 4 times now and looked at playing off the multipliers at the bar tops. It appears the bar tops do not get much action since I do find some games with multipliers but maybe only 2 or 3 plays per machine at best. I would think if others were vulturing there would be no multipliers left on any game instead of just 2 or 3 games left per machine. I think people just sit at the bar for the free drinks and play the cheaper games on those machines for a free buzz.
Quote: cmlotitoThe machines that are the new type of ultimate x I have seen are like this. If it has a multiplier for next hand and you put money in it the multiplier disappears. This even happened to me when I was playing on a machine to kill some time. I was not paying attention and ran out of credits on the machine. I did not leave the game. I simply put more money in it and as soon as the credits registered the multipliers that should have appeared on the next hand disappeared. The machines I am talking about are at Maryland Live casino in Hanover, Maryland. I have not seem the same type of machine in Vegas So I cannot speak to how the same kinds of machine work in Vegas.
I do know the "older" style of Ultimate X machines I have seen in Vegas and at other casinos retain the multipliers.
were these the .05/.10/.25 machines in the back of the casino near the food court?
and/or the $1/$2/$5 machines in the High limits area?
I can tell you that vulturing works were the .25/.50/$1 machines near the poker room.
had a 2x multiplier on a line and hit quads on deuces wild. hm.. I never verified the amount I won. I saw I had more $ than what I put in and just cashed out.
edit:
read your post above. Which bar?
Rams head or the R-bar near the e-Craps machine?
Quote: 100xOddsQuote: cmlotitoThe machines that are the new type of ultimate x I have seen are like this. If it has a multiplier for next hand and you put money in it the multiplier disappears. This even happened to me when I was playing on a machine to kill some time. I was not paying attention and ran out of credits on the machine. I did not leave the game. I simply put more money in it and as soon as the credits registered the multipliers that should have appeared on the next hand disappeared. The machines I am talking about are at Maryland Live casino in Hanover, Maryland. I have not seem the same type of machine in Vegas So I cannot speak to how the same kinds of machine work in Vegas.
I do know the "older" style of Ultimate X machines I have seen in Vegas and at other casinos retain the multipliers.
were these the .05/.10/.25 machines in the back of the casino near the food court?
and/or the $1/$2/$5 machines in the High limits area?
I can tell you that vulturing works were the .25/.50/$1 machines near the poker room.
had a 2x multiplier on a line and hit quads on deuces wild. hm.. I never verified the amount I won. I saw I had more $ than what I put in and just cashed out.
edit:
read your post above. Which bar?
Rams head or the R-bar near the e-Craps machine?
The bar in question is the one next to the e-craps machine. The game is on the machines on the opposite side of the bar from the e-craps.
The other machines I am talking about I can't recall where exactly they are located but there is an entire row of them, maybe 6-8 machines, I forget how many. After trying 2 of the machines and seeing the multipliers vanish I just avoid these types of machines now. These ones are much taller than the older style ones I have seen in Vegas and other casinos in PA.
Quote: AxelWolfAs soon as you told me how good it was, and how many there were, I knew this would be next to impossible in that location.
It was very funny and still is.
Dose it say next hand? *Face palm* Your eyes must have been filled with dollar signs and you had the money spent one minute, full of tears the next.
You seemed distinctively not amused at the time...lol
Quote: GWAEAre machines at maryland live VLTs?
Yes, because the lottery commission monitors the casino so they call them VLTs. But the laws state they behave like VP in Vegas, PA, and a bunch of other places though.
Quote: cmlotitoAll machines at Maryland Live are regular slot machines as far as I know. The ultimate X at the bar play like traditional games where the multipliers stay on the machine. The free standing newer machines are the ones I have witnessed lose their multipliers when putting money into the machine. I have gone 4 times now and looked at playing off the multipliers at the bar tops. It appears the bar tops do not get much action since I do find some games with multipliers but maybe only 2 or 3 plays per machine at best. I would think if others were vulturing there would be no multipliers left on any game instead of just 2 or 3 games left per machine. I think people just sit at the bar for the free drinks and play the cheaper games on those machines for a free buzz.
Maryland gives free alcoholic drinks? Are you sure about that? I'd be surprised.
Quote: tringlomaneYes, because the lottery commission monitors the casino so they call them VLTs. But the laws state they behave like VP in Vegas, PA, and a bunch of other places though.
Maryland gives free alcoholic drinks? Are you sure about that? I'd be surprised.
I don't drink so I am not sure. All I know is I see people sitting there drinking, guess I assumed it was free.
As soon as I stepped away from the machine some guy walks up and starts checking the games for multipliers. I just barely beat him to that one. I never found another one the rest of my stay. I will definitely keep a eye out for them in the future.
50% of the machines uou check you find multipliers? That's incredible.Quote: tringlomaneTunica is the worst market I've dealt with since more seriously looking for them in the last 9 months or so. I don't always check while I'm in Tunica now because I bricked terribly in the first couple times I tried. I tend to check everywhere else though. I feel like finding anything on about 50% of the machines is the average in my random travels. That's a mental estimate though.
Quote: AxelWolf50% of the machines you check you find multipliers? That's incredible.
Maybe that's an overestimate, dunno. I have run hot on this game all year. That may include swooping in at the right times. I know the last time I was at Blue Chip in Indiana, I clearly beat a guy out on Monday afternoon. I found a lot of multipliers while he probably struggled. Tunica overall, I seem like I was closer to 10-20% of all machines. I did better in Vegas this year than Tunica. But I was at CET properties a lot, and now they have tons of those games thanks to the addition of All Star Poker II units.
Quote: cmlotitoThe machines that are the new type of ultimate x I have seen are like this. If it has a multiplier for next hand and you put money in it the multiplier disappears. This even happened to me when I was playing on a machine to kill some time. I was not paying attention and ran out of credits on the machine. I did not leave the game. I simply put more money in it and as soon as the credits registered the multipliers that should have appeared on the next hand disappeared.
While I understand the reasoning for the game makers to do this, it seems like it should not be allowed by Gaming. Kind of like a progressive being reset without a jackpot being paid. If I was a non-vulture, this would turn me off the game right away - run out of credits ==> run out of multipliers! No way!
yesQuote: camaplWhile I understand the reasoning for the game makers to do this, it seems like it should not be allowed by Gaming. Kind of like a progressive being reset without a jackpot being paid. If I was a non-vulture, this would turn me off the game right away - run out of credits ==> run out of multipliers! No way!
I wonder what the return when this happens? Perhaps this could be challenged as it may fall under the 75% return policy.
Quote: AxelWolfyes
I wonder what the return when this happens? Perhaps this could be challenged as it may fall under the 75% return policy.
It's really difficult to quantify, but I would doubt the return would fall under 75% as a result. You would have to have very few hands played (with the feature) on a particular unit to cause the return to drop that low due to disappearing multipliers.
Over all yes but what if I play 10 coins and then cash out every time and not play the next hand what would the pay back be?Quote: Mission146It's really difficult to quantify, but I would doubt the return would fall under 75% as a result. You would have to have very few hands played (with the feature) on a particular unit to cause the return to drop that low due to disappearing multipliers.
Quote: AxelWolfOver all yes but what if I play 10 coins and then cash out every time and not play the next hand what would the pay back be?
Could be argued you are not using "proper" strategy, which is why your return is below 75%.
I disagree they are FORCING you to put in more money and play a completely different hand that could result in losing in order to get your %. Each hand should have a value of over 75%Quote: RSCould be argued you are not using "proper" strategy, which is why your return is below 75%.
Maybe they are not playing it correctly or not understanding the game. This has already happened to at least 4 people on here in the last 2 weeks.
Quote: AxelWolfOver all yes but what if I play 10 coins and then cash out every time and not play the next hand what would the pay back be?
Assuming the multipliers disappeared every time, the overall return (assuming the base hands played as expected) would be slightly lower than 50%.
Quote: GWAEHas anyone else seen this happen other than the person who said it happened to them?
Maybe they are not playing it correctly or not understanding the game. This has already happened to at least 4 people on here in the last 2 weeks.
I've had it happen on one occasion, I had a, 'Next hand,' multiplier and it disappeared (vulturing) on one of the UX only units. I've successfully vultured the same unit before, and in fact, successfully vultured it on a different game on that very occasion, so I assumed it was just some sort of one-time glitch. Apparently, it seems as though it may be more common than that, but having vultured that unit on multiple occasions, I do not assume it is a regular thing.
Quote: Mission146It's really difficult to quantify, but I would doubt the return would fall under 75% as a result. You would have to have very few hands played (with the feature) on a particular unit to cause the return to drop that low due to disappearing multipliers.
I think it could be challenged under the reg about altering the outcome of a game.
When I was at the casino on Sunday I was actually showing an acquaintance how to vulture. We're on machine 4 of 4 in a bank and the lady on machine 3 is playing $.25 on 10 lines. She hits a sizable win and has 2-4X next game on every line and hits cashout. I get ready to pounce and [hopefully] show my buddy what a good vulturing hit looks like. But all she does is put the $750 ticket in her purse and put another $100 into the machine. If those multipliers disappeared on her because she cashed out after a good win she'd be in an uproar and probably never play that game again.
Quote: Mission146Assuming the multipliers disappeared every time, the overall return (assuming the base hands played as expected) would be slightly lower than 50%.
The problem with this is that gaming looks at it such that a single game must be able to pay back at least 75% using a strategy. In this case if in any one game you just played the 5 coins instead of the 10 it would pay back over 75%. Otherwise, the player who holds every card dealt would be getting less than a 75% return. There just has to be a strategy that returns at least the minimum.
If regulations prohibit harming the perceived integrity of games using rigged dice on slots, they shouldn't steal and not think it harms the appearance of gaming. Jeez, the screen says next hand 2x, then you lose it after you bite. Hammer time for the machine.
I would try downloading free play to see if they still disappear.
