AC overnight II

i am new here and do not know either Face or Ace. But I stand by my original diagnosis. Lack of a good woman often leads to self destruction among some men. Face reminds me of many hotheads I have known. I wish I could say he will not repeat that behavior in the near future, but I would be lying if I did. And a man who has a successful law practice could learn a better system or at least stick to it rather than mixing it and hunches, for lack of a better word.

Quote: aceofspades

I am slowly realizing I am so used to having financial stress that, without it, I do not know how to function-- as such, unless there is some sort of financial chaos in my life -- I think I subconsciously seek it out

Scary realization.

Akin to the theory that compulsive gamblers continue to gamble due to a subconscious desire to destroy themselves.

You might do well to reread what you wrote and ponder its significance.

Life is too short to fight demons of our own creation.

http://www.retorno.org/addiction/am-i-a-compulsive-gambler If you answered yes to 3 or more questions, you probably have a gambling problem.

Quote: aceofspades

I am slowly realizing I am so used to having financial stress that, without it, I do not know how to function-- as such, unless there is some sort of financial chaos in my life -- I think I subconsciously seek it out

Not only do I completely understand, I'd say that realizing it is a huge step that has you more than halfway towards fixing it.

Again, I'm not gonna sit here and shrink you. But seek help. I don't mean prostrate yourself before a psychiatrist and beg for salvation. But at least seek an answer out, even if it's just a bit of research done on your own.

Reflection and introspection. Talk to yourself. Get to know yourself. Hell, you might find that this little bit of self destruction is how you cope, and you might desire to continue it. If so, then that's you. But if you're going to do it, know it. At least that way, you have some sort of control over it and understanding of it. And should you come to the point where you want / need to stop it, you've already done the work to identify the "why" and can jump right on working on the "how".

Quote: dummy

Face reminds me of many hotheads I have known. I wish I could say he will not repeat that behavior in the near future, but I would be lying if I did.

It almost sounds like you're saying I'm crazy. I bet if I asked for a second opinion, you'd tell me I'm ugly, too ;)

Quote: MrV

Scary realization.

Akin to the theory that compulsive gamblers continue to gamble due to a subconscious desire to destroy themselves.

You might do well to reread what you wrote and ponder its significance.

Life is too short to fight demons of our own creation.

Indeed I have read and re-read and taking steps to alleviate this.

Quote: MrV

Life is too short to fight demons of our own creation.

Not that short.

Quote: Face

You might find that this little bit of self destruction is how you cope, and you might desire to continue it.

Interesting.

" It almost sounds like you're saying I'm crazy. I bet if I asked for a second opinion, you'd tell me I'm ugly, too "

Based upon your own words, you REALLY think you will not repeat this behavior in the near future ? ? ?

" Part of me thinks I may have wanted to forget those lessons, that I wanted to self destruct. And that's what I did. "

I pray I am wrong.

Quote: Kerkebet

Not that short.

"Life is short but it's the longest thing you'll ever do"-Bono

Perhaps an epiphany, coupled to a dash of penance, would be efficacious and yank you out of your malaise.

My buddy walked the Way of St. James, aka Camino de Santiago , and found himself much improved by the experience, which exercised both body and spirit.

He wants to walk it again this Fall, and I might join him, at least for a week or two.

Quote: MrV

Perhaps an epiphany, coupled to a dash of penance, would be efficacious and yank you out of your malaise.

My buddy walked the Way of St. James, aka Camino de Santiago , and found himself much improved by the experience, which exercised both body and spirit.

He wants to walk it again this Fall, and I might join him, at least for a week or two.

Looks interesting (and I am not going to comment on religion here - that is for DT)

A superstition I have after losing big is to throw out the bottle of the cologne I was wearing during the loss - that has just been done!

Quote: dummy

Based upon your own words, you REALLY think you will not repeat this behavior in the near future ? ? ?

I didn't say that at all. I am of the type that obtains relief from self destruction. But I am aware of it, and that gives me some control. As a result, I haven't broken one of my toys in 5 or so years, haven't struck a person in anger (hockey aside) in 17 years. Because of reflection and introspection, I am the (mostly) reasonable adult you know today, instead of the barely restrained animal that I was.

I think that's what caused me to reach out to Ace. What I felt that I saw "wrong" with him is what I've found wrong with me, or at least along a similar vein. It appears though that he's aware and searching, which is all I hoped for in the first place.

Will it happen in the future? Sure. It's hard for a leopard to change its spots. But it won't be the "near" future, as I took the time to learn from this instead of pushing it away and refusing to deal with it.

Of course, to an elder, 5 years might seem to be "near". For a man older than time itself, it's but a blink of an eye ;)

Miss you, budd =)

Quote: Face

I think that's what caused me to reach out to Ace. What I felt that I saw "wrong" with him is what I've found wrong with me, or at least along a similar vein. It appears though that he's aware and searching, which is all I hoped for in the first place.

Will it happen in the future? Sure. It's hard for a leopard to change its spots. But it won't be the "near" future, as I took the time to learn from this instead of pushing it away and refusing to deal with it.

In the past, I would have ran to the bank before they closed or taken a cash advance and began playing $1k/hand in an effort to get it all back right away - this time, I pushed my seat back from the table, as hard as it was, and went home.

Quote: Face

Short answer - hockey. Correct answer - me.

I've struggled with anger issues my whole adult life. Eventually one tires of putting fists through walls, doors, windows, etc and dealing with the broken fingers and broken toys that result, so I learned (am still learning) to control it. Mostly, I have been doing quite well.

It took a lot of reflection and introspection. Hockey, like BJ, is only sort of in your control. Sure, you can strive to do your best and play the "perfect" game, but the bounces (variance) and the play of your team (table) mates instill randomness into your game. You cannot control it, so you need to prepare for the inevitability that it will bury you.

Once I realized that, things got much better. I began to set goals for myself. No longer did I care about winning or losing, instead putting all my value into just myself, making sure that I played to my full ability and always gave 100%. Sometimes we won championships, sometimes we lost games 45-2, but I always had a blast. And when I did something dumb or made a mistake or got lazy and didn't give 100%, I examined it instead of reacting to it. Why did I do that? What happened that put me in that position. And the biggie, what can I do to make sure that never happens again?

It's made me a much better player. It's made me a much better person. But last week I lost all that. I could blame all the pressure that life has on me now, I could blame all the things wrong with my life, I could blame the play of my teammates that gave up the lead and lost within the final 3 minutes of a playoff game. But really, I just forgot my lessons. Part of me thinks I may have wanted to forget those lessons, that I wanted to self destruct. And that's what I did.

So I flipped the $%^& out. I damaged my reputation with my 12 teammates, the two refs, the guys on the other team, the friends and family in the stands, set a bad example for the kids watching, and am out an $80 stick that I can't afford to replace. And that game is still lost and my season is still over. In my world, there could not have been a worse outcome short of me taking off my skate and stabbing people with it. But while what is done cannot be undone, I still have a choice. Cry and beat myself up about it, or figure out why it happened so I can make sure it never happens again.

I choose the latter. I hope you can do the same.

I have noticed a few posts in the past where you've spoken from the heart. I admire you for wanting to be a better person--for choosing the high road.

Quote: Face

Short answer - hockey. Correct answer - me.

I've struggled with anger issues my whole adult life. Eventually one tires of putting fists through walls, doors, windows, etc and dealing with the broken fingers and broken toys that result, so I learned (am still learning) to control it. Mostly, I have been doing quite well.

It took a lot of reflection and introspection. Hockey, like BJ, is only sort of in your control. Sure, you can strive to do your best and play the "perfect" game, but the bounces (variance) and the play of your team (table) mates instill randomness into your game. You cannot control it, so you need to prepare for the inevitability that it will bury you.

Once I realized that, things got much better. I began to set goals for myself. No longer did I care about winning or losing, instead putting all my value into just myself, making sure that I played to my full ability and always gave 100%. Sometimes we won championships, sometimes we lost games 45-2, but I always had a blast. And when I did something dumb or made a mistake or got lazy and didn't give 100%, I examined it instead of reacting to it. Why did I do that? What happened that put me in that position. And the biggie, what can I do to make sure that never happens again?

It's made me a much better player. It's made me a much better person. But last week I lost all that. I could blame all the pressure that life has on me now, I could blame all the things wrong with my life, I could blame the play of my teammates that gave up the lead and lost within the final 3 minutes of a playoff game. But really, I just forgot my lessons. Part of me thinks I may have wanted to forget those lessons, that I wanted to self destruct. And that's what I did.

So I flipped the $%^& out. I damaged my reputation with my 12 teammates, the two refs, the guys on the other team, the friends and family in the stands, set a bad example for the kids watching, and am out an $80 stick that I can't afford to replace. And that game is still lost and my season is still over. In my world, there could not have been a worse outcome short of me taking off my skate and stabbing people with it. But while what is done cannot be undone, I still have a choice. Cry and beat myself up about it, or figure out why it happened so I can make sure it never happens again.

I choose the latter. I hope you can do the same.

Yet you're so together when it comes to your duties on this forum. It's like two different people.

Quote:

Looks interesting (and I am not going to comment on religion here - that is for DT)

My friend is "spiritual," not "religious;" he noted that many non-Christians walked the Camino, including atheists, Muslims, and Hindus.

To me, it seems like a great way to "step out of my life," do something different, and immerse myself in a different setting.

Good hiking boots are a must, as walkers can do twenty miles in a day.

Quote: Greasyjohn

I have noticed a few posts in the past where you've spoken from the heart. I admire you for wanting to be a better person--for choosing the high road.

Thanks, Greasyjohn. I hope by posting it lets brother Ace know he's not alone in his struggles.

Quote: 1BB

Yet you're so together when it comes to your duties on this forum. It's like two different people.

Duality of man.

All men contain ugliness. It's a necessary part of life. Love and hate have their usefulness, but when one seeps where it doesn't belong, problems arise.

Ace appears to be on his way. His postings here have shown that he's looking, and I see that's he has at least found something. It might not be The Answer, it might not even be on the right track. But the journey of a thousand miles is made of individual steps, and he's taking them. For that, I commend him.

Quote: MrV

Scary realization.

Akin to the theory that compulsive gamblers continue to gamble due to a subconscious desire to destroy themselves.

You might do well to reread what you wrote and ponder its significance.

Life is too short to fight demons of our own creation.

My wife has a subconscious desire to destroy me!

Quote: pew

My wife has a subconscious desire to destroy me!

If I am on the jury, I am voting justifiable homicide.

Okay who wants to go over to DT and hug it out? A little Kumbaya? You'll have to start without me. I'm not a member.

Quote: dummy

If I am on the jury, I am voting justifiable homicide.

Amen brother, but its not homicide. She wants/needs to keep me alive and suffering.

Quote: Face

Ace appears to be on his way. His postings here have shown that he's looking, and I see that's he has at least found something.

The only way to beat something
is cut it off at the source. You
can't change who you are. A drunk
has to quit buying booze and going
to bars. To quit smoking, quit buying
them and having them in the house.
To lose weight, quit eating out and
quit having any food that you can't
eat in your house. To stop losing
money gambling, stop gambling and
going to casinos. No lottery tickets,
no track, no nothing.

Trying to change your nature once
you're an adult is an almost impossible
task. 12 step programs and rehab
are notorious wastes of time. The
vast majority go right back to their
bad habits. Keep the problem substance
as far away from you as possible, and
live with who you are. Find some less
destructive way to act out your inner
demons.

Quote: EvenBob

The only way to beat something
is cut it off at the source. You
can't change who you are.[snip]

Trying to change your nature once
you're an adult is an almost impossible
task.[snip]

That's why I wanted to make sure Ace was looking. He needs (if I may be so bold to say "needs") to find the root of his problem.

From the outside, it's easy to say he has a "gambling issue". But it's also quite likely that the gambling issues he's experiencing aren't gambling related at all, and are rather a manifestation of something else entirely. If it is, and I'm leaning slightly towards that possibility, then quitting gambling isn't going to solve anything. Kill the gambling and the acting out will just manifest in some other aspect of his life, an aspect where the repercussions could be much more severe.

I'll again use myself as an example. I've written about my struggles with drug and alcohol abuse several times, both here and at DT. And many know that despite going totally dry for 5 or so years, I'm back to drinking. Many would suspect that this is bad news just waiting to blow up, based on what I have posted in the past. But drinking wasn't the root of my problem. My blind rage was the source of everything.

Despite that I'm a known addict and have had issues in the past with getting fall down drunk, getting into fights, and flipping cars at 90mph, my restart of drinking has caused me no issues whatsoever. Since I started again, I have not gotten fall down drunk, have not thrown up, started no fights, crashed no cars. I don't drink because I've had a bad day, or use it to escape. In fact, as you know, when I'm in that "bad place", I actively choose not to drink at all. Because I have identified the root of my problem, my anger, and now have the information I need to control it.

Had I just assumed that booze was the problem, I'd have quit drinking and still had the real problem of being a loose cannon. I'd still be breaking #$%^ and hating everyone and raging like an animal. But I engaged in reflection and introspection and found the real problem, enabling me to fix it.

That's what I hope Ace can do. You can't fix a problem without knowing exactly what it is, and if gambling is not his root problem, he will be no better off. He could even be worse off, which is why I made the comment about him finding that this is the way he needs to cope. My drug use was horrible by all accounts, but I can think of plenty possible or even likely alternatives that would've been much worse, had I not went down that path.

But he's gotta do the work. So keep it up, Ace. Post if you want to, PM if you need to. Talking often helps.

Quote: EvenBob

The only way to beat something
is cut it off at the source. You
can't change who you are. A drunk
has to quit buying booze and going
to bars. To quit smoking, quit buying
them and having them in the house.
To lose weight, quit eating out and
quit having any food that you can't
eat in your house. To stop losing
money gambling, stop gambling and
going to casinos. No lottery tickets,
no track, no nothing.

Trying to change your nature once
you're an adult is an almost impossible
task. 12 step programs and rehab
are notorious wastes of time. The
vast majority go right back to their
bad habits. Keep the problem substance
as far away from you as possible, and
live with who you are. Find some less
destructive way to act out your inner
demons.

I don't have any other demons in life - I enjoy the casino and gambling - the subconscious desire to implode when it comes to finances rears its ugly head but I have finally realized that is what is happening - I think by realizing this, I can work on it and try to prevent future implosions

As for other vices that could be an outlet…….I don't smoke, do drugs, rarely drink and am celibate

In an offbeat way, I think that pew's wife's subconsciousness holds the ultimate solution.

Quote: Face

Kill the gambling and the acting out will just manifest in some other aspect of his life, an aspect where the repercussions could be much more severe.

That's the point, find some other way to
act it out that has no repercussions.

Here's what shrinks do. They get you to
pay them $150 an hour to get to the
root of what your problem is. What they
don't tell you is, when you find out what
it is, that doesn't make it go away. So
your dad beat you when you were a kid
and it screwed you up. Realizing that won't
make your issues go away, it might not
even help to know it.

Some people turn to exercise to take the
place of destructive habits. Start running
in marathons, weight training and going
to the gym every day. If you're self
destructive, set goals you can't attain and
beat yourself up that way. Doing it with
money or in relationships is way to costly.

Quote: EvenBob

That's the point, find some other way to
act it out that has no repercussions.

Here's what shrinks do. They get you to
pay them $150 an hour to get to the
root of what your problem is. What they
don't tell you is, when you find out what
it is, that doesn't make it go away. So
your dad beat you when you were a kid
and it screwed you up. Realizing that won't
make your issues go away, it might not
even help to know it.

Some people turn to exercise to take the
place of destructive habits. Start running
in marathons, weight training and going
to the gym every day. If you're self
destructive, set goals you can't attain and
beat yourself up that way. Doing it with
money or in relationships is way to costly.

I already workout 5 days a week ( I know that's not the point and you were merely using that as an example of a constructive outlet.

Quote:

- the subconscious desire to implode when it comes to finances rears its ugly head but I have finally realized that is what is happening - I think by realizing this, I can work on it and try to prevent future implosions

OK, now we're getting somewhere.

You seem to have identified your issue; now, how best to address it?

I assume by "implode" you mean you keep betting into a losing streak?

If so, the answer is pretty simple, at least in theory: discipline.

Bring a set amount to the casino, and if that is lost, stop and go home.

Set loss limits, and honor them.

Yeah, easy for me to say.

Not to pry, but do you "impode" financially in situations which are not gambling-related?

With all humility, I think I know exactly what's wrong and what would fix it (for AoS; not tuned in enough on Face to make that statement). I just don't know if he wants to hear it from me, either privately or on here, so I won't mention it further.

Quote: Baccaratfrom79

Excellent, excellent, excellent.

The best way the only way. Sure, don't relish to lose anything, but when I send that FM or bring that cash, it was earmarked for playing and effects nothing else in life. It is not money to make money or money to survive, it is not money to pay bills nor is it money borrowed. All in my case and the only way I could ever suggest to family and friends to play. However, do what you are comfortable with and what floats your boat.

Again, works fine....

Quote: MrV

OK, now we're getting somewhere.

You seem to have identified your issue; now, how best to address it?

I assume by "implode" you mean you keep betting into a losing streak?

If so, the answer is pretty simple, at least in theory: discipline.

Bring a set amount to the casino, and if that is lost, stop and go home.

Set loss limits, and honor them.

Yeah, easy for me to say.

Not to pry, but do you "impode" financially in situations which are not gambling-related?

Yeah before I started gambling it was shopping.

Quote: beachbumbabs

With all humility, I think I know exactly what's wrong and what would fix it (for AoS; not tuned in enough on Face to make that statement). I just don't know if he wants to hear it from me, either privately or on here, so I won't mention it further.

I honestly have no idea where BBB is going with this.

Quote: MrV

, how best to address it?


Bring a set amount to the casino, and if that is lost, stop and go home.

Set loss limits, and honor them.

Yeah, easy for me to say.

Been doing it for years, works. Just have to be honest with yourself as to the number you can afford.

Quote: aceofspades

I honestly have no idea where BBB is going with this.

I'm offering what might be helpful insight but only if you want to hear it. Unsolicited advice is the worst, but if you want to have the conversation, I'd be willing to take the chance. We have a nice friendship that I'm not willing to throw out otherwise.

Quote: beachbumbabs

I'm offering what might be helpful insight but only if you want to hear it. Unsolicited advice is the worst, but if you want to have the conversation, I'd be willing to take the chance. We have a nice friendship that I'm not willing to throw out otherwise.

BBB - you should always feel free to put your two cents in :)

Ace, I'd recommend you read Barry Greenstein's book -- http://www.amazon.com/Ace-River-Advanced-Poker-Guide/dp/0972044221

It's nominally about poker but contains a lot of great insight on the psychology of gambling, social dependency, and the destructive behaviors that can afflict gamblers.

If you an internalize his wisdom I think you would have much better times in the casino.

Also, I know it might be cathartic for you to post these updates, and you might enjoy the attention, but the very nature of these threads sort of turns you into a "gambling hero" and it might be adding to your pain when you take a loss.

Your gambling results are your business, not anyone else's. Losses are much easier to take if they are not discussed in mega-threads for the world to see.

Here is how an emotionally mature gambler handles a negative downswing: Taking a break if the game is bad, taking a break if he is tired or sad, or playing on if the game is good AND he is playing well.

Here is what an emotionally mature gambler does not do: excessively complain about bad beats, exaggerate bad luck to obtain sympathy, interpret gambling results as somehow a judgment on his character -- or any number of other irrational reactions to the inevitable losing streaks that come with any gambling game.

Quote: aceofspades

BBB - you should always feel free to put your two cents in :)

I always give you a nickels worth, because
your hourly rates are so high.

Quote: sodawater

Here is what an emotionally mature gambler does not do: excessively complain about bad beats, exaggerate bad luck to obtain sympathy, interpret gambling results as somehow a judgment on his character -- or any number of other irrational reactions to the inevitable losing streaks that come with any gambling game.

I am not seeking sympathy.

Quote: aceofspades

I am not seeking sympathy.

Just as well as you will get little here.

Double post. Big fingers small tablet Grrrrrr

Quote: dummy

Just as well as you will get little here.

HAHA - I need that laugh :)

Quote: aceofspades

BBB - you should always feel free to put your two cents in :)

Ok, here goes. This will be long.

You are a kind, intelligent, well-mannered, handsome, fun man who might be the loneliest soul I know, possibly excepting myself. Your only true friend from your perspective is your dog, though there are those in your life who love you.

You routinely see the most beautiful women and richest men in NYC at their absolute worst; selfish, craven, vindictive, angry, betrayed, vicious. You have to defend their behavior without being allowed to judge or condemn them, and you serve as their tool when they are unworthy of the gifts they have been given in this life. Deep down, you resent them throwing away their happiness and bonds to each other over minutia, when those things are what are most missed in your own life. They treat money as power and points on the scoreboard of life, and throw it away on things they don't need and don't value except as levers against each other. They don't stop there, either; they use their children as pawns in the negotiations, no matter what might be in the children's best interests, and that hurts you to see it, since if you had children, you would value them so highly you would not allow that to happen.

You are almost completely outwardly driven, because you think you have very little intrinsic value. You're wrong about that - you're actually extraordinary, complex, and genuine - but you don't believe it. That belief has been reinforced many times by failed relationships and attempts to make yourself available to them. The public humiliation that was MM was only part of a long series of what you see as missed opportunities for a relationship with desirable women. You date women (many times, anyway) not for what they bring to you as a person, but for what they bring to your status and validation; arm candy. Women who are demanding, capricious, flirty, materialistic, and selfish, because they've been raised as beauty queens and gold diggers, not as life partners. If a rare one honestly loves you more than herself, you screw it up because you feel undeserving of their love. And your criteria for meeting and going after them reflects other peoples' values (ie looks, sexiness, popularity), not your own, so you get into a pattern of failure that reinforces your opinion that you're unlovable.

Years of dealing with the rich and famous has jaded your appreciation of money. You used to amuse yourself by buying things you didn't need, and once you got them you didn't use them. Once they were yours, the interest was over; it was proving to yourself, and to those around you, that you could have whatever you thought you wanted that was important.

Gambling as you do now, attending high-roller events with stars, playing high-dollar amounts until you bust out, going on tilt and getting emotionally involved with the results, enjoying the camaraderie with dealers and staff, mixing with the hottest women in the room; all of that boils down to buying friendships you don't think you would have otherwise, and shows your contempt for the money you blow and ultimately, yourself. Again, you're wrong about your assets and attractiveness, but you don't believe it.

Now, what to do about it. You need to find a woman and friends who share your core values. Chances are they're not other rich people. Your woman needs to be your oasis of love, sensibility, friendship, and non-judgmental support. You will never survive the toxic hi-dollar divorce atmosphere long-term without being able to decompress with her on a near-daily basis. She does not need to be hot and beautiful or approved of by anyone other than you. She needs to be your partner, not your object of desire.

Your friends need to be as equally happy with beers in the backyard as they are cruising the East River on a yacht, and they need to be people to whom you can say any damned thing you want. They might argue with you or call you a fool, but they'll be honest with you, and like you for who you are, not what you have.

Before you can find those people, you have to start liking yourself more. Appreciate your own best qualities (and they are many), not having to demonstrate them to others, but admiring them in yourself. Nobody is perfect; some people are more skilled at hiding their flaws from others, is all. And you have to recognize and reject the outside influences of advertising and social culture that creates insecurity and inferiority, the judgment of others, and materialistic trappings of success. Once you know you're worth the quality of people you want to know, you will find and keep them in your life.

If I were making a list of what I like about you, the money would not be on it. But the assets I have seen in you, I listed in the first two paragraphs; you demonstrated them when we met, and in conversations we've had over the last couple of years. Even though it's a positive affirmation, it's still coming from outside (me). You might start by making 2 lists: the first one of what is likeable about yourself (read it again and add to it daily), and the second one of what is truly important to you in friends (and your woman should be your best friend; you're wired that way). Then find those people, and see them through your own eyes (and your own heart), not the eyes of those who will see you with them.

I will tell you that someone told me similar things about myself 30 years ago. And so it's easy to recognize it in someone else. The hard part is breaking the pattern, and I still have to work at it, so I know it's not an overnight process. But you have so much to offer, you need to start making it available to yourself first, and then to others as you begin to trust your own value.

That's about all I have to say.

Quote: beachbumbabs

Ok, here goes. This will be long.

You are a kind, intelligent, well-mannered, handsome, fun man who might be the loneliest soul I know, possibly excepting myself. Your only true friend from your perspective is your dog, though there are those in your life who love you.

You routinely see the most beautiful women and richest men in NYC at their absolute worst; selfish, craven, vindictive, angry, betrayed, vicious. You have to defend their behavior without being allowed to judge or condemn them, and you serve as their tool when they are unworthy of the gifts they have been given in this life. Deep down, you resent them throwing away their happiness and bonds to each other over minutia, when those things are what are most missed in your own life. They treat money as power and points on the scoreboard of life, and throw it away on things they don't need and don't value except as levers against each other. They don't stop there, either; they use their children as pawns in the negotiations, no matter what might be in the children's best interests, and that hurts you to see it, since if you had children, you would value them so highly you would not allow that to happen.

You are almost completely outwardly driven, because you think you have very little intrinsic value. You're wrong about that - you're actually extraordinary, complex, and genuine - but you don't believe it. That belief has been reinforced many times by failed relationships and attempts to make yourself available to them. The public humiliation that was MM was only part of a long series of what you see as missed opportunities for a relationship with desirable women. You date women (many times, anyway) not for what they bring to you as a person, but for what they bring to your status and validation; arm candy. Women who are demanding, capricious, flirty, materialistic, and selfish, because they've been raised as beauty queens and gold diggers, not as life partners. If a rare one honestly loves you more than herself, you screw it up because you feel undeserving of their love. And your criteria for meeting and going after them reflects other peoples' values (ie looks, sexiness, popularity), not your own, so you get into a pattern of failure that reinforces your opinion that you're unlovable.

Years of dealing with the rich and famous has jaded your appreciation of money. You used to amuse yourself by buying things you didn't need, and once you got them you didn't use them. Once they were yours, the interest was over; it was proving to yourself, and to those around you, that you could have whatever you thought you wanted that was important.

Gambling as you do now, attending high-roller events with stars, playing high-dollar amounts until you bust out, going on tilt and getting emotionally involved with the results, enjoying the camaraderie with dealers and staff, mixing with the hottest women in the room; all of that boils down to buying friendships you don't think you would have otherwise, and shows your contempt for the money you blow and ultimately, yourself. Again, you're wrong about your assets and attractiveness, but you don't believe it.

Now, what to do about it. You need to find a woman and friends who share your core values. Chances are they're not other rich people. Your woman needs to be your oasis of love, sensibility, friendship, and non-judgmental support. You will never survive the toxic hi-dollar divorce atmosphere long-term without being able to decompress with her on a near-daily basis. She does not need to be hot and beautiful or approved of by anyone other than you. She needs to be your partner, not your object of desire.

Your friends need to be as equally happy with beers in the backyard as they are cruising the East River on a yacht, and they need to be people to whom you can say any damned thing you want. They might argue with you or call you a fool, but they'll be honest with you, and like you for who you are, not what you have.

Before you can find those people, you have to start liking yourself more. Appreciate your own best qualities (and they are many), not having to demonstrate them to others, but admiring them in yourself. Nobody is perfect; some people are more skilled at hiding their flaws from others, is all. And you have to recognize and reject the outside influences of advertising and social culture that creates insecurity and inferiority, the judgment of others, and materialistic trappings of success. Once you know you're worth the quality of people you want to know, you will find and keep them in your life.

If I were making a list of what I like about you, the money would not be on it. But the assets I have seen in you, I listed in the first two paragraphs; you demonstrated them when we met, and in conversations we've had over the last couple of years. Even though it's a positive affirmation, it's still coming from outside (me). You might start by making 2 lists: the first one of what is likeable about yourself (read it again and add to it daily), and the second one of what is truly important to you in friends (and your woman should be your best friend; you're wired that way). Then find those people, and see them through your own eyes (and your own heart), not the eyes of those who will see you with them.

I will tell you that someone told me similar things about myself 30 years ago. And so it's easy to recognize it in someone else. The hard part is breaking the pattern, and I still have to work at it, so I know it's not an overnight process. But you have so much to offer, you need to start making it available to yourself first, and then to others as you begin to trust your own value.

That's about all I have to say.

Nice piece. Many things a lot of us can relate to. However, when we get all the experience and get it all right, it's time to go anyways??

Take 5 grand to the casino, have no other
access to more money. Lose the 5 and go
home. Or win on it and go home.

Ace, I'm sure the casino would be more than happy to extend you a line of credit :)

Quote: beachbumbabs

Ok, here goes. This will be long.

You are a kind, intelligent, well-mannered, handsome, fun man who might be the loneliest soul I know, possibly excepting myself. Your only true friend from your perspective is your dog, though there are those in your life who love you.

Thank you (I know there are friends I have that love me and care about me but, they have their own lives and issues as well and I cannot always impose upon them with my problems)

Quote: beachbumbabs

You routinely see the most beautiful women and richest men in NYC at their absolute worst; selfish, craven, vindictive, angry, betrayed, vicious. You have to defend their behavior without being allowed to judge or condemn them, and you serve as their tool when they are unworthy of the gifts they have been given in this life. Deep down, you resent them throwing away their happiness and bonds to each other over minutia, when those things are what are most missed in your own life. They treat money as power and points on the scoreboard of life, and throw it away on things they don't need and don't value except as levers against each other. They don't stop there, either; they use their children as pawns in the negotiations, no matter what might be in the children's best interests, and that hurts you to see it, since if you had children, you would value them so highly you would not allow that to happen.

Practicing divorce law is not an easy task - especially in New York where things are a lot more superficial.

Quote: beachbumbabs

You are almost completely outwardly driven, because you think you have very little intrinsic value. You're wrong about that - you're actually extraordinary, complex, and genuine - but you don't believe it. That belief has been reinforced many times by failed relationships and attempts to make yourself available to them. The public humiliation that was MM was only part of a long series of what you see as missed opportunities for a relationship with desirable women. You date women (many times, anyway) not for what they bring to you as a person, but for what they bring to your status and validation; arm candy. Women who are demanding, capricious, flirty, materialistic, and selfish, because they've been raised as beauty queens and gold diggers, not as life partners. If a rare one honestly loves you more than herself, you screw it up because you feel undeserving of their love. And your criteria for meeting and going after them reflects other peoples' values (ie looks, sexiness, popularity), not your own, so you get into a pattern of failure that reinforces your opinion that you're unlovable.

Years of dealing with the rich and famous has jaded your appreciation of money. You used to amuse yourself by buying things you didn't need, and once you got them you didn't use them. Once they were yours, the interest was over; it was proving to yourself, and to those around you, that you could have whatever you thought you wanted that was important.

Gambling as you do now, attending high-roller events with stars, playing high-dollar amounts until you bust out, going on tilt and getting emotionally involved with the results, enjoying the camaraderie with dealers and staff, mixing with the hottest women in the room; all of that boils down to buying friendships you don't think you would have otherwise, and shows your contempt for the money you blow and ultimately, yourself. Again, you're wrong about your assets and attractiveness, but you don't believe it.

Now, what to do about it. You need to find a woman and friends who share your core values. Chances are they're not other rich people. Your woman needs to be your oasis of love, sensibility, friendship, and non-judgmental support. You will never survive the toxic hi-dollar divorce atmosphere long-term without being able to decompress with her on a near-daily basis. She does not need to be hot and beautiful or approved of by anyone other than you. She needs to be your partner, not your object of desire.

Your friends need to be as equally happy with beers in the backyard as they are cruising the East River on a yacht, and they need to be people to whom you can say any damned thing you want. They might argue with you or call you a fool, but they'll be honest with you, and like you for who you are, not what you have.

Before you can find those people, you have to start liking yourself more. Appreciate your own best qualities (and they are many), not having to demonstrate them to others, but admiring them in yourself. Nobody is perfect; some people are more skilled at hiding their flaws from others, is all. And you have to recognize and reject the outside influences of advertising and social culture that creates insecurity and inferiority, the judgment of others, and materialistic trappings of success. Once you know you're worth the quality of people you want to know, you will find and keep them in your life.

If I were making a list of what I like about you, the money would not be on it. But the assets I have seen in you, I listed in the first two paragraphs; you demonstrated them when we met, and in conversations we've had over the last couple of years. Even though it's a positive affirmation, it's still coming from outside (me). You might start by making 2 lists: the first one of what is likeable about yourself (read it again and add to it daily), and the second one of what is truly important to you in friends (and your woman should be your best friend; you're wired that way). Then find those people, and see them through your own eyes (and your own heart), not the eyes of those who will see you with them.

I will tell you that someone told me similar things about myself 30 years ago. And so it's easy to recognize it in someone else. The hard part is breaking the pattern, and I still have to work at it, so I know it's not an overnight process. But you have so much to offer, you need to start making it available to yourself first, and then to others as you begin to trust your own value.

That's about all I have to say.

I cannot agree with you BBB about a woman being the solution to my issues. There is no way any particular person can be a solution to someone's internal problems.
I think relying on another person to "solve" a problem for you only makes you dependent upon that person.

While I think you wrote a very thoughtful and caring piece, I do not agree with your prescription. I think I have to work through this issue of being financially self-destructive from the inside out and basically retrain my brain so that I do not take bad beats personally and seek revenge upon the cards themselves by playing more and more when I am not in the right frame of mind (meaning that I have to allow myself to be financially happy and not seek to interject chaos where none need be)

Ace at least if you play some baccarat you can rip the cards up, crumble them in your fist or even stab them with a pen. It helps.