First pai gow (tiles) experience
November 28th, 2011 at 6:43:13 PM
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I played pai gow for the first time at the Silver Legacy in Reno last Wednesday afternoon. (Only one table open. Grand Sierra Resort's only table was closed and would not open until Thanksgiving evening, according to the pit boss.)
I sat down at the empty $10 table with my $100, but another guy came in with $600 as the dealer was preparing for the first hand.
Apparently he was ready to bank against my measly sawbuck bet. I won my first hand, however, with 9-something! "That was easy," I remarked!
The highlight was getting 3-gee joon, but I pushed as expected.
What I also expected was bystanders telling me what to do. I'm pretty slow even on the Wizard's free play game, so with real tiles in my hand I felt even slower.
Attempting to appear like I knew what I was doing, I made an obvious hand like a nine and looked for other possibilities. Usually before I could calculate other combos I got remarks like "only way to play" or from the dealer "yes, house way."
On my gee joon hand, the bystander remarked "yes, can't lose."
In the interest of not slowing the game, I went with the first choice nearly every time. So much for studying J.B.'s simple strategy!
Ultimately I won the first two hands, then lost five hands (not counting pushes), finishing down $31 in about a half hour.
(Another lady sat down with $550, all in 50s curiously, and got wiped out pretty fast on her $100 bets)
Two questions:
1. The dealer didn't seem to understand my question about pre-paying commission. Does pre-payIng work for small bets? (I'm assuming yes, but the dealer didn't care to show me or understand me.)
2. Are there any significant plays that really should go against the "wisdom" of the crowd? Kind of like hitting 16 against a dealer 10?
In closing, my feeling of playing pai gow was similar to learning to play mah jongg -- being a Chinese-American, it felt like opinionated aunts and uncles telling the newbie what to do!
I sat down at the empty $10 table with my $100, but another guy came in with $600 as the dealer was preparing for the first hand.
Apparently he was ready to bank against my measly sawbuck bet. I won my first hand, however, with 9-something! "That was easy," I remarked!
The highlight was getting 3-gee joon, but I pushed as expected.
What I also expected was bystanders telling me what to do. I'm pretty slow even on the Wizard's free play game, so with real tiles in my hand I felt even slower.
Attempting to appear like I knew what I was doing, I made an obvious hand like a nine and looked for other possibilities. Usually before I could calculate other combos I got remarks like "only way to play" or from the dealer "yes, house way."
On my gee joon hand, the bystander remarked "yes, can't lose."
In the interest of not slowing the game, I went with the first choice nearly every time. So much for studying J.B.'s simple strategy!
Ultimately I won the first two hands, then lost five hands (not counting pushes), finishing down $31 in about a half hour.
(Another lady sat down with $550, all in 50s curiously, and got wiped out pretty fast on her $100 bets)
Two questions:
1. The dealer didn't seem to understand my question about pre-paying commission. Does pre-payIng work for small bets? (I'm assuming yes, but the dealer didn't care to show me or understand me.)
2. Are there any significant plays that really should go against the "wisdom" of the crowd? Kind of like hitting 16 against a dealer 10?
In closing, my feeling of playing pai gow was similar to learning to play mah jongg -- being a Chinese-American, it felt like opinionated aunts and uncles telling the newbie what to do!
November 28th, 2011 at 7:35:18 PM
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Regarding question #2:
There are many middling hands where the house way is to maximize the low hand, but it is in your best interest to maximize the high hand. These hands are not good enough to expect a win, so you're really trying to increase your chances of a tie. If the dealer gets a hand similar to yours and maximizes the low at the expense of the high, maximizing your high hand most likely results in a tie. I expect I'm gonna get this wrong, but I'm talking about a hand like one that can be played either as 4/7 or 2/9. The house would play 4/7, but you should play 2/9.
I prefer to play alone, and I frequently expose my tiles to the dealer as I'm setting my hand. This let's the dealer (and frequently the pit boss) play along with me (I frequently have a toke bet out for him/her). But I always let them know that I don't want their advice unless I ask for it. I let them know that I don't always play house way, and I sometimes need a few moments to make my decision. Usually they are pretty good about it as long as I let them know. If I get too much unwanted advice from a dealer or another player, I just keep my tiles hidden from them while I'm setting my hand.
There are many middling hands where the house way is to maximize the low hand, but it is in your best interest to maximize the high hand. These hands are not good enough to expect a win, so you're really trying to increase your chances of a tie. If the dealer gets a hand similar to yours and maximizes the low at the expense of the high, maximizing your high hand most likely results in a tie. I expect I'm gonna get this wrong, but I'm talking about a hand like one that can be played either as 4/7 or 2/9. The house would play 4/7, but you should play 2/9.
I prefer to play alone, and I frequently expose my tiles to the dealer as I'm setting my hand. This let's the dealer (and frequently the pit boss) play along with me (I frequently have a toke bet out for him/her). But I always let them know that I don't want their advice unless I ask for it. I let them know that I don't always play house way, and I sometimes need a few moments to make my decision. Usually they are pretty good about it as long as I let them know. If I get too much unwanted advice from a dealer or another player, I just keep my tiles hidden from them while I'm setting my hand.
November 29th, 2011 at 5:09:02 AM
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Quote: smoothgrh
1. The dealer didn't seem to understand my question about pre-paying commission. Does pre-payIng work for small bets? (I'm assuming yes, but the dealer didn't care to show me or understand me.)
It's simply based on the math of the situation. To make numbers simple, let's use $20. If you play $20, to win $19, you are paying a 5% commission (19/20 = .05). If you are playing $21, to $20, you are "paying" 4.7% commission (20/21=.04662). As you can see, the difference is actually less than a half a penny per win, but $1 if you lose.
In the long run, you save money by prepaying the commission, but on smaller bets where you have finite dollars, you really aren't going to experience a huge difference.
I always manage to forget to prepay the commission anyways. The only place I have played where they allow it is Horseshoe/Harrah's Council Bluffs on Pai Gow Poker.
It's interesting to hear a newbie perspective from a Chinese-American. When I was in Atlantic City, I got funny looks when I sat down at a Pai Gow table (I'm very Anglo). At Caesars, I was at a table with another Asian betting a lot. I think I actually knew how to play the game better than he did, as he would wait for me to set my hand before showing the dealer, and a couple times set his hand wrong.
"One out of every four people are [morons]"- Kyle, South Park
November 29th, 2011 at 5:44:01 AM
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That's proper procedure.Quote: Tiltpoul...I think I actually knew how to play the game better than he did, as he would wait for me to set my hand before showing the dealer.
Even at PG Poker, if you need help, you're supposed to wait until everyone else sets their hand before showing yours.
I invented a few casino games. Info:
http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ —————————————————————————————————————
Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁
November 29th, 2011 at 5:56:42 AM
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Quote: DJTeddyBearThat's proper procedure.
Even at PG Poker, if you need help, you're supposed to wait until everyone else sets their hand before showing yours.
I know that.... I'm saying it was kind of ironic, as the dealer and I were both White, and the one player needing help was Asian. That's very unusual on that game.
"One out of every four people are [morons]"- Kyle, South Park
November 29th, 2011 at 6:35:23 AM
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Oh. Yeah, that IS kinda humorous.
I invented a few casino games. Info:
http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ —————————————————————————————————————
Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁
November 29th, 2011 at 1:19:35 PM
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Thanks for the insights on my questions!
Yes, I figured not pre-paying the commision on $10 bets would not make much difference at this point.
Not sure if my ethnicity had anything to do with it, but the observers seemed to rush me, but in an encouraging sort of way. As elderly Asians are wont to do. I just don't always trust their advice!
Yes, I figured not pre-paying the commision on $10 bets would not make much difference at this point.
Not sure if my ethnicity had anything to do with it, but the observers seemed to rush me, but in an encouraging sort of way. As elderly Asians are wont to do. I just don't always trust their advice!
