PGT: Question on JB Simple Strategy

Hi everyone,

Just have a quick question about one of the rules in the "JB Simple" strategy for Pai Gow Tiles.

The rule, in the "Wong, Gong, and High-9" section, says "Play the best low hand if it is worth 6 or 7 points and the tiles include a low-2 and/or high-8."

My question is, does this mean to play the best low hand if the low hand itself would contain a low-2 and/or high-8, or play the best low hand if any of your four tiles is a low-2 and/or high-8?

Thanks all!

I have been trying to learn PGT for sometime and although it's possible to generate a complete strategy (in my case using a simplified House Way) it is difficult to remember all the possibilities. So I tried to categorise them - a previous version is on the wizard's site.

One thing I saw when starting to play was people not making their Hi 9's but making low hands of 6 and 7 instead. Some of the chart is 100% accurate but towards the bottom one has to make compromises. Hopefully the list of priorities "where a Hi9+ is possible" should help.

btw typically the Lo hand will be (say) 1-1 2-2 or Hi8 Lo8.

fwiw I use the following (not quite so simple) strategy and take a copy of it to the casino!

Thanks for this! At my current level I'm not really able to memorize all of your exceptions and I have a little trouble understanding how to interpret the middle parts of sheets....

But it looks like your pair splitting rules are almost identical to JB Simple except for splitting l6's with 2 and h10. And also, can I ask why you specified to split 2s to play 9+h8 when that's already covered by the "split 2s to make 6/8 or better" rule?

Also, the rules for playing three- to fourteen-point hands or so on your sheet that's on the wizard's site seem to approximate JB Simple pretty closely, but with some more-efficient exceptions. (I guess in creating a simple strategy you have to trade off efficiency for simplicity.)

I'm kinda at the point in my learning curve where I'm starting to explore advanced strategies and I've used JB Simple as a springboard because it's easy to put into practice even from memory and then learn more sophisticated nuances as I go.

For instance, if I have it right, I think l2 h8 l10 and any-6 plays as 8/8 and any other combination of 2 8 10 and 6 plays as 6/gong. And I saw someone recently pick up l4 11 h2 h8 and (correctly) play 6/9, which is actually why I asked the original question (that play doesn't have a l2 or h8 in the low hand but one of the four tiles is a h8, so I wondered whether JB Simple would play 6/9 there....).

Has the wizard offered to post your updated sheet to his site? Seems like a lot of players, especially advanced players, would benefit from it.

Thanks again!

Quote: docbrock

My question is, does this mean to play the best low hand if the low hand itself would contain a low-2 and/or high-8, or play the best low hand if any of your four tiles is a low-2 and/or high-8?

The original intent was "...if any of your four tiles are a L2 and/or H8".

I asked that same question in a thread a couple of years ago. JB gave some examples in that thread that might help you..




https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/off-topic/general/18285-pai-gow-tiles-strategy-question/

Quote: docbrock

... to split 2s to play 9+h8...

In this instance you do not split the Teens or Days and play the 7 as your Lo hand (which is why it say "Play" 9+H8.

Some decisions are fairly close and depend on whether you have Teen or Day (6-6 or 1-1) Hi 8 or Lo 8 etc. There's a calculator https://wizardofodds.com/games/pai-gow-tiles/calculator/ where you can try out the various combinations (also it uses a more accurate House Way than I did). You'll also see references to Lo8 Gong - the logic being that using a Hi8 in the Low hand makes it (say) a higher six than using a Lo8.

I think the wizard plays some close hands by gut feel - I don't have that level of expertise. So using your two highest tiles Lo2 and Hi8 in the same hand is a bit of waste if you had Lo4 and 11 and could make a good Low 6 hand and 9. I'm guessing the difference between a bad 5 and good 6 is bigger than playing a Gong and 9 in the high hand. (Also it's better to go for a push than a 50/50 win/lose as the former is break even but the latter is -EV due to the commission.)

It's a tough game to master but I suspect very rewarding. fwiw I've not had any difficulties having an A5 sheet of plays to consult at the table.

Much appreciated everyone for all the help. And thanks for the clarification on the 9+H8 play, CP. So just to be clear, the pair splitting rules for 2s according to your sheet are: split to make 6/8 or better or with 9+11, and play high-7/pair with 9+H8?

I thought when I started playing PGT that it was a fascinating game because it was so difficult to learn - even the basics - especially compared to a lot of other games. Let alone did I have any idea about how difficult it is to master.

And correct me if I'm wrong, but learning an optimal strategy would require that you learn one for the specific house way you'd be playing against, assuming you could obtain it, correct? There's a different optimal strategy for each different house way, theoretically, however subtle the differences?

I was talking to one man yesterday who said he'd picked the game up 30-odd years ago at Harrah's in Tahoe. When he asked how to play, he was told, 'ahh, it's a Chinese game, you'll never be able to learn it'. But he stuck with it and taught himself more or less through trial and error. I suppose we are fortunate to have better technology, to be able to optimize plays or strategies by computer, analyze plays with calculators, etc.

Regardless though, I think it's a great game.

Thanks again!

Thanks - yes for spltting 2's it's the same as https://wizardofodds.com/games/pai-gow-tiles/strategy/jb/advanced/ Also remember to check your low hand before splitting - for instance you wouldn't split with 2 2 4 GJ (1-1 1-1 2-2 2-1) since you already have a low hand of 7 without splitting. As you say it's a great game.

Quote: https://wizardofodds.com/games/pai-gow-tiles/strategy/jb/advanced/

2s and 12s Only split to make 6/8 or better if it improves the low hand.
Also split with 9 and 11. Do not split with 9 and High 8.