"Play Crapps"

Has anyone seen these tables? .. What do you think?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2IVm6KiENGs

Quote: Malaru

What do you think?

Hopefully, an instant flop.

Yuck! I don't know what about craps needs to be "revitalized".

I watched the video for 30 seconds, verbally said no way, then started laughing. Absolute bullshit. No player control of the dice (part of the game I like), faster game (makes a high variance game ridiculous), only two dealers (if one of them sucks, you're screwed). Lol @ the guy yelling "yo" at a 5. Is this usable in California? That might be the only place I see if making some headway. It's not that complicated of a design, I'm sure hundreds of people have thought of something similar... I guess one person out of a hundred is stupid enough to think it will be taken seriously.

I think they already do have this game, or something like it, in the CA casinos, since the law prohibits them from using dice...anyone in CA wanna confirm?

Anyway, yeah, this pretty much sucks, and I can't imagine how much they had to pay attractive people to look excited to play it. I mean, this video praises the fact that "[it] places total control of the game in the hands of the dealers"...ummm...isn't most of the fun of craps in getting to throw the dice yourself and control your own fate, as it were?

As an aside, at the Trump Marina in AC last month, I did see a craps layout on a blackjack-sized table, similar to the video, except that it did use real dice that were in some sort of clear plastic contraption that shakes them up. It was closed when I was there though.

I think you're talking about rock n roll dice.

If you believe that the dice really are random, then it shouldn't matter that there is no shooter in this game.


On the flip side, this game uses loaded dice. Listen to the voice-over. Each deck contains 9 sets of six dice cards. 8 decks are put into the shoe.

If you can count cards, and keep 6 totals running in your head at the same time, then the deeper into the shoe you get, the more biased the shoe can become, and you can use that to your advantage.

Except, looking at the layout, a lot of the prop bets where that info can be helpful, aren't there....

Quote: ahiromu

I think you're talking about rock n roll dice.

I think that comment is in response to what OneAngryDwarf saw at Trump Marina.

Quote: ahiromu

Absolute bullshit. No player control of the dice (part of the game I like), faster game (makes a high variance game ridiculous), only two dealers (if one of them sucks, you're screwed).

The video is directed at the casinos, not the gamblers. It also speaks a lot about the table taking less space, thereby making more floor space available for other games. All these things would appeal to the casino.

DJTeddyBear makes a very good point regarding the show. There are bound to be some people who could keep six running counts. Aside from that, though, the use of a shoe with so many cards changes the odds for the players.What this game does is give the "dice" a bit of memory, as each "throw" is no longer an independent event, just as it happens with cards in BJ.

On the plus side for the ignorant gambler, in some cases numbers do become "due." The bad news is you can't tell which numbers are due.

As I said, I hope it's an instant flop.

On the other hand, I'm sure to some of the craps purists here, this game makes rapid craps looks not so bad after all ;)

Quote: DJTeddyBear

Except, looking at the layout, a lot of the prop bets where that info can be helpful, aren't there....

Nor is don't come visible.

Quote: SanchoPanza

Nor is don't come visible.

I have played full sized tables that have Don't Pass but no Don't Come. All don't bets are placed on Don't Pass and moved to the points by the dealers - presumably it would be the same on this abomination.

Quote: ahiromu

I think you're talking about rock n roll dice.

Nope, it was an honest-to-goodness craps layout, with all the traditional bets (including the don'ts), just compressed down to fit on a BJ-sized table.

Their arguments seem counter-intuitive. You can fit 4 of these in the space used for 2 Craps Tables...okay. You only need 2 dealers...okay. But you are staffing 4 tables that fit a little more than half of the players. So it's like you are just taking a Craps table and cutting it in half. You still basically need the same number of dealers and will service around the same number of players.

I might try it, because I like mixing things up. I wouldn't like not shooting, but hey, sometimes at a busy table you only shoot once an hour anyway. Plus I will admit that at times, other players slowing down the shots do get on my nerves. Not realizing the dice are out, fiddling around with them for a minute (not setting, just practice rolls in front of them or messing around). And it would be easier to not have to feel that some bozo from the other end of the tables just cost you $200 with one roll. It's easier to be mad at the house....anyway, that's just my devil's advocate side throwing some of my perceived pluses.

It does feel that the Don't is the bet though, even without counting. Every time you put together any number other than Seven, you remove one of the combinations that would cause it to repeat, but that doesn't ever happen with a Seven. Example, you "roll" a 6 and a 4. Point is 10. The effective removal of one of the 6s and 4s will have an impact on the ability to "roll" another. But with the Seven, that never happens. In fact, every Seven makes another Seven come MORE often, by increasing the composition of the "pairs" of numbers that create more Sevens. So even Seven winners on the Come out will hurt you when you finally establish a point.

Shokawah in Hopland, CA ( up 101 about an hour past Sonoma County) said they had it, I got a flyer a few months ago but when I went there it was nowhere to be found. Cache Creek has something like this but their deck is only 36 cards and is constantly reshuffled after each hand so it is exactly like a roll of the dice. Red Hawk might have the PlayCraps because their roll consisted of two cards. I would like more peoples thoughts on how counting could be advantageous. Maybe if a bunch of 6's or 1's are left it would be good to bet on the 30:1 payout?

Fuggetaboutit.

Someone at Play Craps Inc thought about counting.

According to the Gaming statement on their website, the game uses a continuous shuffle machine.

Even so, because of the CSM's buffer, the odds of the next card coming out are reduced slightly. This can lead to a player advantage, especially for the don't pass player. Stephen How describes how counting (with pencil and paper) works.

That's awesome... I wonder if they wouldn't let you do this. I mean I haven't seen it, but I highly doubt they would let you count BJ with a paper/pencil.

Quote: ahiromu

That's awesome... I wonder if they wouldn't let you do this. I mean I haven't seen it, but I highly doubt they would let you count BJ with a paper/pencil.

In the video, the dealer is NOT mucking after every roll, so you can actually count a little more than you'd think. The article linked above suggests only needing to count into the last 5 or so hands, but with the delayed mucking, you could go further (as he mentioned).

Quote: ahiromu

That's awesome... I wonder if they wouldn't let you do this. I mean I haven't seen it, but I highly doubt they would let you count BJ with a paper/pencil.

They don't let you count BJ with a paper & pencil.

But they DO let you count playcraps, since it uses a CSM. Don't knock playcraps, just learn the counting method from discountgambling.net and go make some money.