Double Dice HA?
Thanks,
Matt
From:
Quote:
By Frank Scoblete
Ed G. reports on a new dice variant:
Dear Frank:
New game called Double Dice. Here is what I have experienced:
Double Dice is a game where players compete against each other using a pair of dice to achieve the highest possible score up to 12. There are four bets in Double Dice. They are the Primary Bet, Double Dice Bet, Perfect Dice Bet and Double Out Bet, all available to each player. The Primary Bet is only mandatory to the players who are rolling the dice, otherwise it is optional. All other wagers are optional as well.
The Primary Bet consists of two players, or one player and the dealer if no other player is available, who each roll a pair of dice trying to get the best possible score. A score of 12 from rolling two sixes is considered a perfect score. If both players roll a perfect score on their initial roll it is considered a tie and all Primary Bets push.
After both players' initial turns, if only one player rolled a perfect score, that player is declared the winner. If both players' scores are under twelve and not equal, the player with the lowest score will roll one additional die for a chance to improve their score. In the instance where both players' scores are less than twelve but equal after the initial turn, each player will have another roll to try and improve their initial score. The player with the highest score without going over 12 is the winner of the game.
Any score above 12 is considered an automatic Primary Bet loss. An equal final score between players is considered a tie. The exception to this is an equal final score of eleven which will result in a loss for both players.
The payout schedule is as follows:
* Double Out Bet (both players ultimately exceed 12) 80-1.
* Perfect Dice Bet (both players roll perfect 12s) 50-1.
* Perfect Dice Bet (one player rolls perfect 12) 15-1.
* Double Dice Bet (both players roll identical pair, 1-5) 10-1.
* Double Dice Bet (one player rolls pair, 1-5) 2-1.
The Majestic Star in Indiana started this game Friday, 1-29-10. I couldn't get close to the table. When I arrived about 9pm the six player seats were taken and there were about 35 or 40 players jammed around the table waiting to play. A lady told me it was a simple game and gave me a rule card. She was waiting to play again. From the very little I saw the players don't actually touch the dice.
There was a marker for player #1 and player #2. I guess these get passed around the table so everyone gets a turn. There were two sets two dice on two plates or platters. And there is something like a cup that is used to cover them. After bets are placed the dealer covers one set and shakes it. Then he hands it to player one for the player to shake it. The cups and covers looked like a gold color and you can't see through them.
Then the dealer covers the next set of dice and shakes them. Then he hands them to player #2. Then player #2 shakes them. Then player #1 and #2 give them back to the dealer. The dealer takes the upside down cups off of sets #1 and #2. And you can see the dice on the plates. That was all I got to see.
I stopped back at 11:30 before I left the boat. The table was still full and there were about 25 players jammed around it waiting for seats.
There was a lot of cheering from the tables and the watchers.
Ed. G.
Players tied at 11 is a Primary Bet loss for both sides... but only after one/both players have had a chance to improve their score. So, if Player A and Player B both "come out" with an 11, each has a chance to roll one die to make their score a 12.
A double-six is considered a "Perfect 12", while any score 6-11 that is improved to a 12 is just a 12... similar to getting a Blackjack, versus hitting to a 21. Therefore, an improved-to 12 does not pay on the Perfect Dice bet.
If anyone is interested, I can post the full calculations. In the meantime, here is the house edge for each bet.
| Primary Bet |
|---|
| Event | Pays | Probability | Return |
|---|---|---|---|
| Win | 1 | 42.048% | 0.42048 |
| Lose | -1 | 42.048% | -0.42048 |
| Push | 0 | 13.119% | 0 |
| Lose(11-11) | -1 | 1.661% | -0.01661 |
| Double Bust | -1 | 1.123% | -0.01123 |
| Total | -0.02784 | ||
| House Edge | 2.784% |
| Perfect Dice |
|---|
| Event | Pays | Probability | Return |
|---|---|---|---|
| One Perfect 12 | 15 | 5.401% | 0.81018 |
| Two Perfect 12s | 50 | 0.077% | 0.03858 |
| Lose | -1 | 94.522% | -0.94522 |
| Total | -0.09645 | ||
| House Edge | 9.645% |
| Double Dice |
|---|
| Event | Pays | Probability | Return |
|---|---|---|---|
| Pair 1-5 | 2 | 2.392% | 0.47839 |
| Match Pair 1-5 | 10 | 1.929% | 0.19290 |
| Lose | -1 | 74.151% | -0.74151 |
| Total | -0.07022 | ||
| House Edge | 7.022% |
| Double Out |
|---|
| Event | Pays | Probability | Return |
|---|---|---|---|
| Double Bust | 80 | 1.123% | 0.89849 |
| Lose | -1 | 98.877% | -0.98877 |
| Total | -0.09028 | ||
| House Edge | 9.028% |
Quote: DweenI have the analysis finished, and all the probabilities add up to 100%, so I think I have everything correct.
If anyone is interested, I can post the full calculations. In the meantime, here is the house edge for each bet.
I agree with most of it. The only one I disagree is with the primary bet. I get a tie probabity of 6085/46656 or about 13.0423% and the win and lose are off by the differance.
edit to add: I found my error. I agree exacly now. I was forgeting the tie on both rolling a perfect 12. 6121/46656
Not to change the topic here, but since rdw said he was traveling to chicago-area casions, I have a bit of input:
Majestic Star and Ameristar are about equal - darker, dingy, smokey riverboats. LOW limits for the area ($10 bj, $5 to $10 craps, $10 roulette). Sign up for a majestic card if you can before, cause they are mailing out $110 cash vouchers right now.
Horseshoe is smokey but freaking beautiful, just like vegas. But definitely for the higher-roller. Expect $25-$50 mins on bj, $15 craps, and $25-$50 roulette after 9pm on a weekend. VERY VERY good service and attentive dealers. If you plan to spend money def need to go here, they treat you right if you have $10,000+ buy in.
Harras Joliet is non-smoking, as are the next 2. Their dealers suck - they dont say much and are frankly rude. average minimums, $25 bj, $10 craps, $10-$25 roulette.
Empress and Grand Victoria are about equal. Hit or miss service, minimums about the same as harras joliet.
PM me if you have any game specific questions like if they have whatever game and I'll happily respond.
Quote: kazsloTHANKS a lot for the breakdown. I can tell you that contrary to the article, there are usually 2 people max on the table on a busy Saturday night. Pretty crappy game for about 9% HA on most bets.
Not to change the topic here, but since rdw said he was traveling to chicago-area casions, I have a bit of input:
Majestic Star and Ameristar are about equal - darker, dingy, smokey riverboats. LOW limits for the area ($10 bj, $5 to $10 craps, $10 roulette). Sign up for a majestic card if you can before, cause they are mailing out $110 cash vouchers right now.
Horseshoe is smokey but freaking beautiful, just like vegas. But definitely for the higher-roller. Expect $25-$50 mins on bj, $15 craps, and $25-$50 roulette after 9pm on a weekend. VERY VERY good service and attentive dealers. If you plan to spend money def need to go here, they treat you right if you have $10,000+ buy in.
Harras Joliet is non-smoking, as are the next 2. Their dealers suck - they dont say much and are frankly rude. average minimums, $25 bj, $10 craps, $10-$25 roulette.
Empress and Grand Victoria are about equal. Hit or miss service, minimums about the same as harras joliet.
PM me if you have any game specific questions like if they have whatever game and I'll happily respond.
Holy crap...since when is $25 BJ "average" minimums? All the casinos in Southern Ind. have $10 tables - and $5 during the slower times.
