Optimum Bet Size vs Bankroll

I'll be in town at the end of March greeting our new grandson. Mrs.M and I are staying at the Aliante Station whilst visiting the new parents. I plan on shooting craps at least twice, At the Aliante and somewhere downtown, Main Street or El Cortez. My available bankroll is 1K total. I like playing passline W/odds and placing the 6 and 8 for twelve each. I'd be interested to hear others' opinions on optimum bet size vs bankroll in order to stave off ruin, which, to be honest, I haven't had much luck in doing lately.

There have been many discussions about this, and the truth of the matter is that you can stave off ruin pretty easily with that kind of setup.

My opinion: Throw down 5 on the PL, $10 on odds, $12 on 6/8. Most you will ever lose from a 7-out is $39, and I guarantee you won't lose everything 12 straight time (which would bring you to half your bankroll).

If you start to win, I would recommend pressing your odds to the full 3,4,5 while increasing your place bets accordingly. My rule of thumb is that if I'm going to be making a place bet, I want it to be on the same order of magnitude as I would get if I win the point. If you're throwing down $50 on the odds for PL, but only winning $14 per place bet, it doesn't seem to constructive to me.

I am a risk big, lose big, win big kind of guy but this is how I started out when I was learning the game and wanted to play conservatively. My big recommendation is to follow 3/4/5, although 10x is better by the numbers it can ruin bankrolls pretty easily.

This is how I play with a similar bankroll: PL+odds, places a couple, come bet + full odds every roll. It's really fun when you're winning, but I've lost a few hundred within a half an hour this way.

I think you and I might play well together. I like a 5 dollar PL bet but I tend to press the odds a bit harder which is why I play the Station properties or El C/Main Street downtown.

I hate going beyond 3,4,5 - I'd rather get more action (albeit with a higher house advantage) by going for another personal point with a come bet.

I like pushing the odds as high as I can stand it, but it is SO deflating when sequential Come bets go away when Mr. Big Red comes to visit.

I would agree with ahiromu. Start out with a basic PL plus 3x4x5x odds, and two place bets for $12. That's a reasonable level of risk for a $1K trip bankroll. If you win, you can press the odds to approach the 10x limit and the place bets accordingly. You could also try a PL and two comes to get even more of your action out on the odds where less will be exposed to the house edge. I'm sure a lot of forum members would advise that (well, except one :O). Same deal as before: start out at 3x4x5x and press as much as you are comfortable on the odds. To be honest, there is no reason you should be betting up to the full 10x odds unless you are on a mega-roll; your $1K just won't last that long if you start out at that level (but you probably knew that).
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Are you saying you often experience ruin of the whole $1K with just a PL+odds and two $12 place bets over the course of a trip?

If you do, tell me what table you're going to be at and I'll fly down to Vegas to play the don'ts against you.

Well, My last three sessions the bankroll was 500-800 not 1K. I was backing 10X odds on the inside points and 5/6X on 4 and 10. All three times the dice were cold enough to induce frostbite at the beginning of the session, by the time the initial bleeding had stopped, I had to pull in my horns quite a bit just to stay in the game. I believe this time I'll hold up at 5x until the dice start treating me more kindly.

A $1K bankroll at a $5 table should be quite sufficient to avoid ruin. I also play a progressive strategy with a basic bet: Pass with 3x odds, place 6 and 8. If 6 or 8 is not available, I place another come bet to put up a third number but limit my bets to $45. Once I win back the orginal bets I start to press by adding come bets and pressing odds.

Playing the 10x odds is what's killing you, honestly. It doesn't even allow for a lot of variation, a few misses and you're ruined.

To Ahiromu and the others who weighed in, many thanks! I have gotten way to aggressive these last few sessions with regard to bankroll management(and that guy in the corner rolling his eyes and saying "well,Duh!" can go to hell).Good lessons don't come cheap. If any of you are around Aliante or El Cortez on the 28th or 29th and see a big guy with a grey beard wearing a tasteful black and green Hawaii shirt and playing very conservatively, that'll be me. Thanks again.

It does seem to me that the easiest mistake to make once you get into smarter gambling, is to underestimate bankroll needs. I certainly did that my last time out.

This is complicated for me personally, as I have a superstition about luck and playing with a hurting bankroll [my last go at it just reconfirmed this for me, a completely unscientific evaluation of course]. So it means for me playing with a much larger bankroll, and session bankroll, than is theoretically needed.

In your case, seems as though you are betting about $50 at a time. A rule of thumb that has worked for me is to figure 10 times that amount, plus add a cushion, this for session bankroll. So not less than $600 at a session. And you probably ought to bring twice that on your trip in order to have a losing session and still have later sessions without having the dice find out your bankroll is at risk. This is the mistake I made last time out btw [sorry, my superstition kicking in again!]

Quote: odiousgambit

...the dice find out your bankroll is at risk.

Isn't your bankroll at risk as soon as you make a bet?