Double action roulette
June 25th, 2012 at 2:33:25 PM
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Hi everyone,
Long time lurker and fellow math-guy. (well physics mostly)
Recently the M resort has started up a new roulette game with 2 wheels together!
Curious as to what everyone thinks of this game and if anyone has played it yet or not.
Long time lurker and fellow math-guy. (well physics mostly)
Recently the M resort has started up a new roulette game with 2 wheels together!
Curious as to what everyone thinks of this game and if anyone has played it yet or not.
June 25th, 2012 at 2:36:27 PM
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They use math in Physics ? Thanks for the warning. Was thinking about taking a Physics class next semester. NO MORE !
June 25th, 2012 at 2:56:02 PM
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It's a TCS John Huxley product. They're the primary manufacturer of wheels.
Here's their web page about it:
http://www.tcsjohnhuxley.com/en/live-gaming/roulette-wheels/double-action-roulette.html
When I was in Vegas for G2E, I was invited to their private show at the Palms, and saw the Double Action wheel. I have even given it a few spins.
The heavy central wheel is spin in one direction. The lighter outer ring is spun the opposite way. There is a loud clicking sound as it spins. Obviously these are some type of catch that allows the ring to come to quick and a perfectly aligned rest. While it's clicking, the ball is spin in the same direction as the ring, but opposite the wheel. When it "rests", it spins in unison to the central wheel and pockets.
Note that there is a video on the TCS page above that briefly shows this action. However, when you watch repeatedly, you notice that it's exactly opposite what I described. In particular, just about the time that the ball drops into a pocket is when the wheels align in the video. But you'll note that in the video, it's the wheel, including the pockets, that stop and about-face, while the ring maintains it's speed. That's what happens when you let an animator do the video, rather than incorporate actual footage. I.E. Nobody double-checked the animation!
With a correct spin, the ring comes to a rest (and the clicking stops) long before the ball starts to come out of the upper lip of the wheel.
I'm undecided about how annoying that clicking sound will be. I'm equally undecided about the wear and tear this produces. Will a bias form faster than they anticipate? Don't know.
Then there's the game itself.
As you can see, the layout is completely different, allowing for two full layouts (one for the wheel, and the other for the ring), as well as a third layout just for doubles.
The net result is that streets and two-lines have changed. And there's two of everything.
Also, the odds and payouts of what are normally even money bets have changed.
Bottom line: I'm not really a roulette player, so I can't say how the players will react. Personally, I don't like it.
Here's their web page about it:
http://www.tcsjohnhuxley.com/en/live-gaming/roulette-wheels/double-action-roulette.html
When I was in Vegas for G2E, I was invited to their private show at the Palms, and saw the Double Action wheel. I have even given it a few spins.
The heavy central wheel is spin in one direction. The lighter outer ring is spun the opposite way. There is a loud clicking sound as it spins. Obviously these are some type of catch that allows the ring to come to quick and a perfectly aligned rest. While it's clicking, the ball is spin in the same direction as the ring, but opposite the wheel. When it "rests", it spins in unison to the central wheel and pockets.
Note that there is a video on the TCS page above that briefly shows this action. However, when you watch repeatedly, you notice that it's exactly opposite what I described. In particular, just about the time that the ball drops into a pocket is when the wheels align in the video. But you'll note that in the video, it's the wheel, including the pockets, that stop and about-face, while the ring maintains it's speed. That's what happens when you let an animator do the video, rather than incorporate actual footage. I.E. Nobody double-checked the animation!
With a correct spin, the ring comes to a rest (and the clicking stops) long before the ball starts to come out of the upper lip of the wheel.
I'm undecided about how annoying that clicking sound will be. I'm equally undecided about the wear and tear this produces. Will a bias form faster than they anticipate? Don't know.
Then there's the game itself.
As you can see, the layout is completely different, allowing for two full layouts (one for the wheel, and the other for the ring), as well as a third layout just for doubles.
The net result is that streets and two-lines have changed. And there's two of everything.
Also, the odds and payouts of what are normally even money bets have changed.
Bottom line: I'm not really a roulette player, so I can't say how the players will react. Personally, I don't like it.
I invented a few casino games. Info:
http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ —————————————————————————————————————
Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁
June 25th, 2012 at 3:01:36 PM
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Quote: xxa second roulette ring rotates in the opposite direction of the main ring. When the winning number lines up on both rings, the player that has made the corresponding side bet is paid up to 1,200 to 1!
You can probably count on one hand the number of times
in a year that will happen. Another sucker bet.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
June 25th, 2012 at 3:03:41 PM
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Quote: DJTeddyBearBottom line: I'm not really a roulette player, so I can't say how the players will react. Personally, I don't like it.
Have you thought how it would impact your Poker for Roulette?
Donald Trump is a fucking criminal
June 25th, 2012 at 3:04:23 PM
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Man it is hard enough to hit a single number in roullete, now I gotta do it twice in one spin?
Vote for Nobody 2020!
June 25th, 2012 at 3:04:44 PM
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Actually, a double hits 1 in 38 times. Correctly picking the double happens 1 in 1,444 times.Quote: EvenBobYou can probably count on one hand the number of times
in a year that will happen. Another sucker bet.
(Assuming a double-zero wheel.)
I invented a few casino games. Info:
http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ —————————————————————————————————————
Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁
June 25th, 2012 at 3:07:18 PM
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Quote: DJTeddyBear
Bottom line: I'm not really a roulette player, so I can't say how the players will react. Personally, I don't like it.
Nobody will like it when they see how often
the two rings line up. Which is almost never.
The casino won't like it the first time they
have to pay off a $25 bet at 1200/1. Thats
$30,000. Oops.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
June 25th, 2012 at 3:08:35 PM
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Yes.Quote: NareedHave you thought how it would impact your Poker for Roulette?
In fact, one of the reasons I was at that show at the Palms was to talk to them about Poker For Roulette.
If you check my home page, you'll see, without being named, that my 4 spin version is designed with Double Action in mind:
Quote: Poker For Roulette home page, Four Spin version sectionThe four spin version is better thought of as a four result version. It is intended for custom Roulette systems where two results are produced in a single spin, enabling resolutions in only two spins.
The people at the ShuffleMaster focus group thought 5 spins was too ling to wait. 3 spins is better. But 4 results in 2 spins is fantastic.
Last edited by: DJTeddyBear on Mar 21, 2021
I invented a few casino games. Info:
http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ —————————————————————————————————————
Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁
June 25th, 2012 at 3:11:17 PM
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Quote: DJTeddyBearCorrectly picking the double happens 1 in 1,444 times.
If the average wheel is open for 2 shifts at 30 spins an hour,
thats 1 hit every 3 days. But it could easily go 3 weeks without a hit.
Thats forever in roulette. And somebody has to have bet on it.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
June 25th, 2012 at 3:11:53 PM
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Actually, because the numbers are laid out in opposite directions, on every spin there is always one number that finds it's match.Quote: EvenBobNobody will like it when they see how often
the two rings line up. Which is almost never.
I invented a few casino games. Info:
http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ —————————————————————————————————————
Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁
June 25th, 2012 at 3:13:19 PM
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But that one bet has a 17% house edge. BRING IT!Quote: EvenBobThe casino won't like it the first time they
have to pay off a $25 bet at 1200/1. Thats
$30,000. Oops.
I invented a few casino games. Info:
http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ —————————————————————————————————————
Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁
June 25th, 2012 at 3:13:20 PM
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This s**t is easy !!! I already have a method worked out for it. I am joking fellas.
Ken
Ken
June 25th, 2012 at 3:15:54 PM
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Quote: DJTeddyBearActually, because the numbers are laid out in opposite directions, on every spin there is always one number that finds it's match.
I'm talking about when the ball is sitting in the
matched numbers. Thats all that counts.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
June 25th, 2012 at 3:15:55 PM
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Assuming the game itself catches on, there will be bets on several numbers for that double hit.Quote: EvenBobIf the average wheel is open for 2 shifts at 30 spins an hour,
thats 1 hit every 3 days. But it could easily go 3 weeks without a hit.
Thats forever in roulette. And somebody has to have bet on it.
Therefore, it wouldn't surprise me to see it being hit several times per shift.
I invented a few casino games. Info:
http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ —————————————————————————————————————
Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁
June 25th, 2012 at 3:18:29 PM
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Quote: DJTeddyBearAssuming the game itself catches on, there will be bets on several numbers for that double hit.
Therefore, it wouldn't surprise me to see it being hit several times per shift.
If they're paying 1200/1, how can it hit that often?
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
June 25th, 2012 at 3:23:35 PM
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Quote: DJTeddyBearActually, because the numbers are laid out in opposite directions, on every spin there is always one number that finds it's match.
I wonder if a consitent spin by the dealer would get the weheel and ring to match the same way often. If so, and one number always matches for a double, that would be the number to bet on the side bet on every spin. It would have a better chance of hitting.
Donald Trump is a fucking criminal
June 25th, 2012 at 3:31:45 PM
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Quote: DJTeddyBearThere is always one pocket that's aligned. Therefore it's just 1 in 38 that it hits.
This is totally confusing. All I care about is how often the ball
lands in the matching pocket for both wheels. It can't be twice a shift.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
June 25th, 2012 at 3:39:57 PM
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hmmmQuote: EvenBobIf they're paying 1200/1, how can it hit that often?
I dont know
I invented a few casino games. Info:
http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ —————————————————————————————————————
Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁
June 25th, 2012 at 3:42:44 PM
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It's a promotional feature to attract new customers.
June 25th, 2012 at 3:44:31 PM
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I was right the first time. The ball will only match the two wheels
numbers once every 1444 spins, or every 3 days of two shift
play. Thats almost never in roulette terms. The odds are 1/1444
and they pay 1200/1. 17% HE is a sucker bet.
numbers once every 1444 spins, or every 3 days of two shift
play. Thats almost never in roulette terms. The odds are 1/1444
and they pay 1200/1. 17% HE is a sucker bet.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
June 25th, 2012 at 3:46:03 PM
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" 17% HE is a sucker bet." Next you will be saying 1 zero is better than 2 zero's. !
June 25th, 2012 at 3:47:54 PM
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Hurry Somebody come up with a side bet on the total of the two numbers. TEDDY ??
June 25th, 2012 at 3:52:27 PM
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Quote: buzzpaffHurry Somebody come up with a side bet on the total of the two numbers. TEDDY ??
Thats a good idea for a side bet. The highest 2 spins will add up to
is 72 and the lowest is 2. Figure where the break point is and make
it an even money high/low bet. All you need is an extra betting
space on the felt.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
June 25th, 2012 at 4:00:12 PM
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Bet on 2 reds 2 blacks, 2 greens Teddy where are you ?
June 25th, 2012 at 5:53:15 PM
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Quote: EvenBobThats a good idea for a side bet. The highest 2 spins will add up to
is 72 and the lowest is 2. Figure where the break point is and make
it an even money high/low bet. All you need is an extra betting
space on the felt.
lowest is 0000 ;)
Vote for Nobody 2020!
June 25th, 2012 at 6:20:44 PM
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Quote: bigfoot66lowest is 0000 ;)
Mid point is 37, if we ignore the zeros.
Allow a bet on the over 37, under 37 and skip 0 results. 37 is the total 1 in 36 times. House Edge : 2.78%. I am sure you could tweak that by doing something with the 0's.
"Then you can admire the real gambler, who has neither eaten, slept, thought nor lived, he has so smarted under the scourge of his martingale, so suffered on the rack of his desire for a coup at trente-et-quarante" - Honore de Balzac, 1829
June 25th, 2012 at 7:29:16 PM
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Quote: thecesspitMid point is 37, if we ignore the zeros.
Allow a bet on the over 37, under 37 and skip 0 results. .
You'd have to skip the zero's. It would have the same HE
as the other bets. Its just another place to make a bet. The
dragon bet is just another 2/1 dozen bet, but roulette
players think they accomplish something when they win
on it. Shrug.. DJ Teddy can steal this from me, this side
bet I wouldn't be against.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
June 25th, 2012 at 7:53:15 PM
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Hmmm... if you want it to be a 5.26% bet, you need to do something else to tweak it. Intriguing though.
Probably work better on a single zero wheel.
Probably work better on a single zero wheel.
"Then you can admire the real gambler, who has neither eaten, slept, thought nor lived, he has so smarted under the scourge of his martingale, so suffered on the rack of his desire for a coup at trente-et-quarante" - Honore de Balzac, 1829
June 25th, 2012 at 7:59:16 PM
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Quote: thecesspitHmmm... if you want it to be a 5.26% bet, you need to do something else to tweak it.
Why? If 37 is the true middle, its the same as betting red or
black and the HE would be 5.26..
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
June 25th, 2012 at 9:10:10 PM
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Sorry I was absent for a couple hours - particularly after taking that sudden about-face regarding the odds on that 1200 to 1 bet.
I've been scratching my head about it ever since.
I've been scratching my head about it ever since.
I invented a few casino games. Info:
http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ —————————————————————————————————————
Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁
June 25th, 2012 at 9:17:37 PM
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Nope.
37 is the most likely result. If you 37 as a win for the house, you only get a score of 37 1 time in 36 => 2.78% chance => 2.78% house edge. So NOT the same as betting black or red, in terms of hits. Black and Red lose 2 times in 38.
You can show easily it's 37 (ignoring all 0's), as it's just like a pair of 36 sided dice.
37 is the most likely result. If you 37 as a win for the house, you only get a score of 37 1 time in 36 => 2.78% chance => 2.78% house edge. So NOT the same as betting black or red, in terms of hits. Black and Red lose 2 times in 38.
You can show easily it's 37 (ignoring all 0's), as it's just like a pair of 36 sided dice.
"Then you can admire the real gambler, who has neither eaten, slept, thought nor lived, he has so smarted under the scourge of his martingale, so suffered on the rack of his desire for a coup at trente-et-quarante" - Honore de Balzac, 1829
June 25th, 2012 at 9:34:50 PM
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If you made Double-0 is a house win on either of the two spins, you could have over 36 and under 37, counting the single 0. This would give a house edge of 5.19% (more or less). The over under splits the results down the middle.
If you add both 0's in, the average result is 35.05, but it's biased towards the lower side if you used 35 as the middle number (and automatic loser for the house).
And I 'm going to do something else rather than work out the Maths on that.
If you add both 0's in, the average result is 35.05, but it's biased towards the lower side if you used 35 as the middle number (and automatic loser for the house).
And I 'm going to do something else rather than work out the Maths on that.
"Then you can admire the real gambler, who has neither eaten, slept, thought nor lived, he has so smarted under the scourge of his martingale, so suffered on the rack of his desire for a coup at trente-et-quarante" - Honore de Balzac, 1829
June 25th, 2012 at 9:55:17 PM
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I'm sure you're right, I haven't done any work on it at all.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
June 25th, 2012 at 11:02:33 PM
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Quote: EvenBobI'm sure you're right, I haven't done any work on it at all.
It's an interesting idea, for sure, though.
"Then you can admire the real gambler, who has neither eaten, slept, thought nor lived, he has so smarted under the scourge of his martingale, so suffered on the rack of his desire for a coup at trente-et-quarante" - Honore de Balzac, 1829
June 26th, 2012 at 1:29:59 AM
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The animation shows a single zero wheel. So the odds of the double hit would be 1:1369. House edge ~12.3%. Also since there isn't enough room for each possible outcome, it looks like you would need TWO chips to make the side bet. I could see allowing a split-straightup or double split. So split two numbers on one wheel, while straight up on the other, with a payout 600:1. Or split two numbers on both wheels, payout 300:1.
June 26th, 2012 at 2:23:54 AM
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Quote: ewjones080I could see allowing a split-straightup or double split. So split two numbers on one wheel, while straight up on the other, with a payout 600:1. Or split two numbers on both wheels, payout 300:1.
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June 26th, 2012 at 5:58:20 AM
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I was at the bar where I preparing to deal for my poker league when I was posting yesterday. It was during that time that I learned that the lead dealer wasn't going to show up, and I was going to be the lead dealer that night. It was something that I was not prepared for.
So I was a bit distracted when I started to think that Bob might be right and posted the following.
I didn't think about it at all until the ride home, and it was late, etc. I wanted to go right to bed, but posted the following:
I did my best head-scratching while I was in the shower this morning.
The 1,444 to 1 odds are correct. As such, the casino isn't losing a dime by paying 1,200 to 1.
On every spin, a single number on the ring lines up with the same number on the wheel. There's a 1 in 38 chance that the ball will find that pocket.
Therefore, 37 of 38 spins, all 38 of the 1,200 to 1 jackpot bets are losers. On that 38th spin, only one of them is a winner. If you were to cover every number every spin, you'd lose 1,443 bets and win 1,200 once.
FYI: For single zero wheels, it's a 1 in 1,369 chance to win 1,200 to 1.
NOTE: I don't know if the 1,200 payout is for single zero, double zero, or both. Regardless, the casino isn't losing money on it.
To give Bob a direct answer: You were calculating the duration for 1,444 spins at an average of 30 spins per hour. The reality is, the double appears about every 38 spins. I.E. It happens several times per shift as I indicated.
---
I was also thinking a lot about this comment:
Unlike the ball, which tends to spin for a longer time and hit several randomizing obstacles before settling down, the two wheels spinning in opposite direction settle down and sync rather quickly. And there's no visible randomizing element.
It's quite possible that on every spin, the new alignment is a fairly consistant offset from the prior alignment.
If that's true, you could very easily predict a small number of pockets that would be the double pocket, and bet on those. Then all you gotta do is keep calculating the new alignment, and betting that number (and a few neighbors) waiting for the the 1 in 38 times that the ball also finds the double pocket.
So I was a bit distracted when I started to think that Bob might be right and posted the following.
Quote: EvenBobIf they're paying 1200/1, how can it hit that often?
Quote: DJTeddyBearhmmm
I dont know
I didn't think about it at all until the ride home, and it was late, etc. I wanted to go right to bed, but posted the following:
Quote: DJTeddyBearSorry I was absent for a couple hours - particularly after taking that sudden about-face regarding the odds on that 1200 to 1 bet.
I've been scratching my head about it ever since.
I did my best head-scratching while I was in the shower this morning.
The 1,444 to 1 odds are correct. As such, the casino isn't losing a dime by paying 1,200 to 1.
On every spin, a single number on the ring lines up with the same number on the wheel. There's a 1 in 38 chance that the ball will find that pocket.
Therefore, 37 of 38 spins, all 38 of the 1,200 to 1 jackpot bets are losers. On that 38th spin, only one of them is a winner. If you were to cover every number every spin, you'd lose 1,443 bets and win 1,200 once.
FYI: For single zero wheels, it's a 1 in 1,369 chance to win 1,200 to 1.
NOTE: I don't know if the 1,200 payout is for single zero, double zero, or both. Regardless, the casino isn't losing money on it.
To give Bob a direct answer: You were calculating the duration for 1,444 spins at an average of 30 spins per hour. The reality is, the double appears about every 38 spins. I.E. It happens several times per shift as I indicated.
---
I was also thinking a lot about this comment:
Nareed might be onto something here.Quote: NareedI wonder if a consitent spin by the dealer would get the weheel and ring to match the same way often. If so, and one number always matches for a double, that would be the number to bet on the side bet on every spin. It would have a better chance of hitting.
Unlike the ball, which tends to spin for a longer time and hit several randomizing obstacles before settling down, the two wheels spinning in opposite direction settle down and sync rather quickly. And there's no visible randomizing element.
It's quite possible that on every spin, the new alignment is a fairly consistant offset from the prior alignment.
If that's true, you could very easily predict a small number of pockets that would be the double pocket, and bet on those. Then all you gotta do is keep calculating the new alignment, and betting that number (and a few neighbors) waiting for the the 1 in 38 times that the ball also finds the double pocket.
I invented a few casino games. Info:
http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ —————————————————————————————————————
Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁
June 26th, 2012 at 6:09:22 AM
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Quote: DJTeddyBear
To give Bob a direct answer: You were calculating the duration for 1,444 spins at an average of 30 spins per hour. The reality is, the double appears about every 38 spins. I.E. It happens several times per shift as I indicated.
All that matters is how often the ball falls into the
pocket that mathces both wheels, and thats every
1444 spins or every 3 days. On average. It will be
all over the map though. It could easily go a month
without hitting and hit twice in one day. Good old
variance.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
June 26th, 2012 at 6:22:18 AM
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Quote: EvenBobAll that matters is how often the ball falls into the
pocket that mathces both wheels, and thats every
1444 spins or every 3 days. On average.
1,444 spins is incorrect. It happens on average every 38 spins.
On EVERY spin, there is one pocket that is a double. Therefore, 1 in 38 times, the ball will find that pocket.
Your math is correct for a specific number. My math calculates how often the result is a double. ANY double.
While that's true, BOTH of your predictions are below average.Quote: EvenBobIt could easily go a month
without hitting and hit twice in one day. Good old
variance.
On average, there is a double several times per shift.
I invented a few casino games. Info:
http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ —————————————————————————————————————
Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁
June 26th, 2012 at 6:51:23 AM
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Quote: DJTeddyBear
On average, there is a double several times per shift.
Yes, but not a double with the BALL in it. Thats all
that counts, where the ball is. Thats why it pays
1200/1, because it only happens once every 3 days
on average. The odds of the ball falling into the
double is 1444/1. It will happen once every 1444
spins or so. I play roulette, thats a lot of spins.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
June 26th, 2012 at 7:01:02 AM
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Quote: DJTeddyBearI was also thinking a lot about this comment:Nareed might be onto something here.
How about that?
But, really, there's nothing to it. Assuming I have something, ti wuld be easily tested. Go down to the M, thats the hard part, and write down which numbers match on each spin. If a clear trend develops for one or a few numbers for a given dealer, stalk the table til the dealer comes along and bet the brains out of the sucker bet. better yet, bring along a team of five or six and have each pick a different number.
In fact, it's so simple I'm sure there's some safeguard for it. Perhaps the ring starts spining at a different time on each spin, for example, or at a different speed. But it's worth for a local to check out.
Donald Trump is a fucking criminal
June 26th, 2012 at 8:10:39 AM
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Bob, you're being stubborn. Or you're not reading my posts in full.Quote: EvenBobYes, but not a double with the BALL in it. Thats all
that counts, where the ball is. Thats why it pays
1200/1, because it only happens once every 3 days
on average. The odds of the ball falling into the
a double is 1444/1. It will happen once every 1444
spins or so. I play roulette, thats a lot of spins.
On EVERY spin, there is ONE pocket where the ring and wheel is aligned so that the pocket is a double.
There are only 38 pockets, so there's a 1 in 38 chance that the ball will find the double result pocket - each time.
The reason the odds are still 1,444 to 1 is because 1,444 to 1 refers to a specific number.
1 in 38 spins, the number you're looking for is the double pocket. 1 in 38 spins the ball finds the double pocket. But only 1 in 1,444 spins will the ball find the double pocket, when it is the number you're looking for.
Those other 37 in 1,443 times that the ball fell in a double pocket, somebody else won.
I invented a few casino games. Info:
http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ —————————————————————————————————————
Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁
June 26th, 2012 at 8:17:29 AM
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I was playing it at their show at the Palms, and spinning the wheel myself a few times. There's no mechanical device attached. The ring starts spinning when the dealer spins it.Quote: NareedIn fact, it's so simple I'm sure there's some safeguard for it. Perhaps the ring starts spining at a different time on each spin, for example, or at a different speed. But it's worth for a local to check out.
Here's the key: It depends upon how the dealers are trained, but I have a feeling that the training is going to be: Pick up the ball, push the wheel, spin the ring in the other direction, then put the ball in the track and throw it.
Except for the last step, the other steps will become a very predictable choreographed procedure, making your idea plausable.
I invented a few casino games. Info:
http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ —————————————————————————————————————
Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁
June 26th, 2012 at 8:28:36 AM
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Quote: DJTeddyBearOn EVERY spin, there is ONE pocket where the ring and wheel is aligned so that the pocket is a double.
There are only 38 pockets, so there's a 1 in 38 chance that the ball will find the double result pocket - each time.
I think I'm about to ask a stupid question:
If one pocket always is a double, is there somethign to rpevent me from placing a $5 bet on every number to be the double?
38 numbers times $5 = $190.
1,200 to 1 times $5 = $6,000.
$6,000 minues $190 = $5,810.
This is so freaking obvious I'm sure I made a mistake, or there is a limit on the numbers than can be bet. Say one per player.
But if it's four per player, you gather ten people and cover every double...
I must be making a big, basic mistake somewhere.
Donald Trump is a fucking criminal
June 26th, 2012 at 8:43:39 AM
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Not a stupid question....Quote: NareedI think I'm about to ask a stupid question:
...
I must be making a big, basic mistake somewhere.
Yeah, you can cover every number and be sure to get paid 1,200 to 1 when the ball falls into the double pocket.
The mistake is, only 1 pocket is a double. You'll hit once in 38 spins. But you've made 38 losing bets on the prior 37 spins, plus another 37 losing bets when you finally get your 1,200 payoff. Do the math. You're down 244 bets.
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If it makes you feel better, it's the same mistake I made when I did my temporary about-face last night.
I invented a few casino games. Info:
http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ —————————————————————————————————————
Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁
June 26th, 2012 at 8:50:27 AM
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Yep the double hits once every 38 spins. I just got myself confused on that as well. If you bet every number, there's still only a 1 in 38 chance the ball falls into the double pocket.
"Then you can admire the real gambler, who has neither eaten, slept, thought nor lived, he has so smarted under the scourge of his martingale, so suffered on the rack of his desire for a coup at trente-et-quarante" - Honore de Balzac, 1829
June 26th, 2012 at 9:26:19 AM
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Now I'm really confused. This used to happen in math class all the time. i thought I almost understood something, I'd ask the teacher, adn the explanation just left me more confused than before...
So, does a double hit on every spin, or on an average of once every 38 spins?
So, does a double hit on every spin, or on an average of once every 38 spins?
Donald Trump is a fucking criminal
June 26th, 2012 at 9:37:51 AM
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Delete
Stephen Au-Yeung (Legend of New Table Games®) NewTableGames.com
June 26th, 2012 at 9:50:22 AM
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One every spin, there IS one pocket that is a double pocket. But the ball only finds it once in 38 spins.Quote: NareedNow I'm really confused. ...
So, does a double hit on every spin, or on an average of once every 38 spins?
I invented a few casino games. Info:
http://www.DaveMillerGaming.com/ —————————————————————————————————————
Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁
