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May 31st, 2020 at 10:33:55 AM permalink
Ok so Iím confused. I find out yet again there is another type of machine.

In Pennsylvania we have these illegal slot machines manufactured by POM or something like that. Anyways itís actually an acronym for pace o matic. This guy is the original inventor of the pot-o-gold machines and claims that the IGRA allows for pull tabs and bingo. So thatís where pot o gold cane from.

He also claims many companyís use this system as their base and are able to maintain profits while allowing for incredible payouts.

How can we tell these pull tab machines from any other machine if this pull tab system is still in place?
Mission146
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May 31st, 2020 at 10:57:41 AM permalink
Iím not sure if weíre talking about the same machines. There are some recent new machines that I believe to be legal through the PA Lottery. That game is simple, play if youíre going to win or breakeven (because you get another look); donít play if youíre going to lose.

The only illegal machines Iíve encountered in PA are the Cherry Masters.

So, if youíre not referring to one of the two types of machines I referenced; Iím afraid I have no idea.
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May 31st, 2020 at 6:09:35 PM permalink
Well they are the skill machines you may have seen popping up in bars. I know they are class 2 from previous conversations, but the fact that the pot-o-gold has been around forever and not a single person knows what Iím talking about when it comes to the pull tab machines. Iím pretty sure Washington state uses a pull tab system, but that is off the top of my head and probably wrong.

I canít see a single thing on the pot o gold machines that indicate it may have been something other than the games within the system. Which were all types of games, but they werenít the games apparently they are pull tabs. Maybe it was a jurisdiction thing...
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May 31st, 2020 at 6:34:35 PM permalink
Ok Washington state has ďlotteryĒ ticket slot machines that apparently are not marked any different, but I knew about the lottery ticket system because of DRich.

http://slotfanatics.com/showthread.php?20340-Class-2-rigged-machines/page4
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May 31st, 2020 at 6:42:56 PM permalink
https://pace-o-matic.yellowdogcreative.net/pot-o-gold-celebrates-30-years-as-industrys-most-versatile-game-platform/

POT-O-GOLDCELEBRATES 30 YEARS
It was 30 years ago this month that Michael Pace debuted a powerful bitmap graphics controller board featuring hardware-optimized transparency and extensive use of programmable array logic devices. It accommodated the requirements of a gaming machine with serial communications, battery-backed data storage and discrete input/output. It was the heart and soul, that is, the hardware platform and operating system, of a product Pace named Pot-O-Gold. And it went on to become the worldís most broadly used platform for game creation.

Pot-of-gold machine

EARLY ON CASINOSí WERE NETTING $10,000 PER MACHINE WEEKLY
The initial market for Pot-O-Gold was Indian Gaming and its first game an electronic pull tab for the Seminole tribeís Florida casinos. The Pot-O-Gold pull tab put Paceís U.S. Games at the technological forefront of a new market, its unique capability a finite storage of plays. It kept count even at power off, mimicking the mechanical games that calculated payouts per play and guaranteeing a consistent payout and profit. The Indian Gaming Regulatory Act of 1988 allowed gaming w


here tribes had sovereignty and allowed gaming in three classes, the second of which allowed bingo games with no limits on prizes Ė and included pull tabs. It also allowed for technical enhancements, hence approval for Pot-O-Gold, which quickly became the casinosí best earning games. Players stood in line to play in anticipation of what were huge payouts; the casinos were netting $10,000 per machine weekly.

PACEíS POT-O-GOLD HAD A NUMBER OF FIRST IN THE GAMING INDUSTRY
Paceís nuances to Pot-O-Gold resulted in a number of additional firsts, including a touch screen to speed up play; the first integrated progressive, with all the accounting and statistical data integrated in the main system; the first embedded bill validator and validator accounting in a casino gaming machine; the first cabinet to integrate a printer and hopper; the first Draw Poker and Blackjack with customizable screens.

By 1994, Pot-O-Gold was in South Dakota, Minnesota, Wisconsin, New York, North Carolina, Mississippi and Montana. It was the first machine installed in Foxwoods Casino in Connecticut. When South Carolina opened its doors to the Pot-O-Gold in 1994, U.S. Games sold 25,000 machines into the state. But despite its earliest expressions, Pot-O-Gold is not a game, or even many games. It is a platform particularly accommodating to game software. It is at the root of a long series of innovations, for example, Paceís two-player bingo game, Lotto 6, which solves a legal stumbling block in some states by allowing players to compete with each other for prizes.

THE POT-O-GOLD PLATFORM IS BEING USED TO BUILD GAMES ALL OVER THE WORLD
Pace sold U.S. Games in 1986. A couple of years later the company was bankrupted. Because of the dissolution of U.S. Games, it is difficult to determine the total number of Pot-O-Gold game systems sold, though estimates are at 55,000 legitimately manufactured and purchased games. But more than 300,000 games using Paceís Pot-O-Gold platform format are on location today, most knock-offs of Paceís original creation. The platform is being used to build games all over the world, including large numbers of the boards being built in and sold from China.

Pace-O-Matic is a leading developer and marketer of best-in-class game systems for coin-game operators. Our history of industry leadership dates back to the early 1980s and includes the innovation of many of the industryís most broadly adopted technologies and enduring game concepts. Today we support coin-game distributors and their operators with the best earning games local laws allow, world-class games that are as legal and defendable as they are exciting and profitable.
Mission146
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May 31st, 2020 at 6:53:35 PM permalink
Quote: heatmap

Well they are the skill machines you may have seen popping up in bars. I know they are class 2 from previous conversations, but the fact that the pot-o-gold has been around forever and not a single person knows what Iím talking about when it comes to the pull tab machines. Iím pretty sure Washington state uses a pull tab system, but that is off the top of my head and probably wrong.

I canít see a single thing on the pot o gold machines that indicate it may have been something other than the games within the system. Which were all types of games, but they werenít the games apparently they are pull tabs. Maybe it was a jurisdiction thing...



I know what you're talking about, I think. Are you referring to the Class II Electronic Bingo machines that are initially seeded with a pool of possible results and that the spinning mechanism is basically for entertainment purposes only? When the pool of results is exhausted, or essentially anytime the central system decides (or someone does it) it gets reseeded with a similar pool of results.

From an AP standpoint, I guess what would matter is how precisely it works. You would want to know if it's a pool belonging only to one machine, an entire bank of machines or if it's even more widespread than that. As with pull tabs, there would reach a theoretical point that the EV would be more than 100% based on the cost to purchase all possible results and the combined value of all remaining results.

But, again, you would need to know a lot of specific information and even with that information it could be difficult to gather the information (spin data) you would need.

One exception being is if the pools all yield the same results in the same order every time, but I couldn't imagine them messing up that badly (again) in this day and age. I guess anything's possible.

The simplest way to play the bar ones, again assuming we're talking about the same ones, is play if you are going to win and don't play if you are going to lose. Like, literally.
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May 31st, 2020 at 7:01:51 PM permalink
Quote: Mission146

I know what you're talking about, I think. Are you referring to the Class II Electronic Bingo machines that are initially seeded with a pool of possible results and that the spinning mechanism is basically for entertainment purposes only? When the pool of results is exhausted, or essentially anytime the central system decides (or someone does it) it gets reseeded with a similar pool of results.

From an AP standpoint, I guess what would matter is how precisely it works. You would want to know if it's a pool belonging only to one machine, an entire bank of machines or if it's even more widespread than that. As with pull tabs, there would reach a theoretical point that the EV would be more than 100% based on the cost to purchase all possible results and the combined value of all remaining results.

But, again, you would need to know a lot of specific information and even with that information it could be difficult to gather the information (spin data) you would need.

One exception being is if the pools all yield the same results in the same order every time, but I couldn't imagine them messing up that badly (again) in this day and age. I guess anything's possible.

The simplest way to play the bar ones, again assuming we're talking about the same ones, is play if you are going to win and don't play if you are going to lose. Like, literally.



Ok i understand the bingo ones but from what i understand about the "pull tab" ones / "scratch off tickets" from some of the links that I posted, people claim no mark is needed for the scratch off ticket version of the "slot machines". The bingo ones play bingo in front of you but for the scratch off/ pull tabs apparently no indication is given to the player that they are playing anything other than a slot machine apparently.

But from what i think ive read the system works exactly like the bingo, except two people are not needed to play the system

No AP for me on this simply a history lesson as well as investigations of who invented what in the industry. I know how the lotteries make money so no thank you.
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May 31st, 2020 at 7:55:44 PM permalink
Pretty new (2006 haha) pot-o-gold manual

http://www.slotsdirect.com/potofgold/Pot_of_gold_CD/Good%20POG%20Manual.pdf
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May 31st, 2020 at 10:39:07 PM permalink
stephencmarvin
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September 24th, 2020 at 10:52:32 PM permalink
Nice information. Thanks
Stephan M.

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