Wizard
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Wizard
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September 24th, 2011 at 6:57:00 AM permalink
Dan would take me to the woodshed if he could for posting this, but there is a good article on shuffle tracking in baccarat by Bill Zender. The article withholds the expected values for knowing a specific card and position in the next hand, siting only a book by Steve Forte.

Have no fear, I just ran the numbers myself. They can be found in my new and improved page on Baccarat Flashing Dealers and Shuffle Tracking. APs enjoy. As always, I welcome all comments.
It's not whether you win or lose; it's whether or not you had a good bet.
buzzpaff
buzzpaff
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September 24th, 2011 at 7:18:09 AM permalink
Why not use the cloaking feature you recently installed, so that Dan can not see this thread ??
FleaStiff
FleaStiff
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September 24th, 2011 at 7:58:15 AM permalink
citing.

>This is information is not easy to come by, but is very valuable when you do have it.
>The cells in red denote a positive expected value, as high as 21.5% when the 1st or 3rd card is known to be a 9 (bet the Player).

Well, "very valuable" and 21.5 percent mean alot but I don't see how those tables indicate that or how one could possibly follow a card thru the shuffling process.

That Tran conspiracy of bribes to dealers focused on baccarat/Mini-Bacc and I figured it had to be for a reason.
mustangsally
mustangsally
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September 24th, 2011 at 8:35:47 AM permalink
removed
silly
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Wizard
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Wizard
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September 24th, 2011 at 8:50:55 AM permalink
Quote: buzzpaff

Why not use the cloaking feature you recently installed, so that Dan can not see this thread ??



I don't know what you're referring to. Perhaps you have me confused with someone else?
It's not whether you win or lose; it's whether or not you had a good bet.
heather
heather
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September 24th, 2011 at 9:08:41 AM permalink
The Catwalk 2.0 article is talking about a MiniBacc shuffling method that involves a machine. I would guess that big table Baccarat would be a more obvious target for would-be shuffle-trackers due to the slow and unusual shuffle (not to mention higher limits and greater player carte blanche).

Quote: Catwalk 2.0

The Baccarat Procedure That Advantage Players Love



Call it a System and I'll be interested. Procedures and Methods never seem to work for me. Gotta be a System.
FleaStiff
FleaStiff
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September 24th, 2011 at 9:50:05 AM permalink
>You need to read the article the Wizard linked to and view the articles' excellent pdf on how it is done.
Okay. I got it. There are several procedures one of which involves inserting a "cut card" (usually solid red plastic) between the 14th and 15th card from the 20 to 25 spread cards. In performing this segment it is possible that a bystander may glimpse a card whose position can then be calculated during the course of playing out the shoe.

I know the start of play usually involves exposing one card and using that card's value as the determinant of how many additional cards will be exposed and then put into the discard tray. Often the red plastic cut card is inserted by the player, so its not going to be any 14th card. Or is this something else?

>It is a well known team play.
Not well enough known amongst dealers and surveillance types apparently.
>It is also well known that the dealer will purposely show cards in the ribbon.
I once had to tell the dealer how the game went so I don't think they are generally well trained.
Face
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Face
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September 24th, 2011 at 12:20:54 PM permalink
Wow. It's very creepy that I spent much time yesterday thinking of a Bac count and whether it was possible. Even more strange is that I'm not interested in Bac at all really, and had no reason to think about it. Even stranger than that I wondered if the Wiz had ever tackled that subject, and now I find this. And as if things weren't weirding me out enough....

Quote: Wizard

Dan would take me to the woodshed



I'm having flashbacks, and the conspiracy seed has been planted. If you start capitalizing all letters in "god" and reporting from Laughlin, my mind will surely split in two.

Edit:
Quote: FleaStiff

Often the red plastic cut card is inserted by the player, so its not going to be any 14th card. Or is this something else?



In Bac, the cut card is placed by the dealer exactly at the 14th card.

Quote: FleaStiff

>It is a well known team play.
Not well enough known amongst dealers and surveillance types apparently.



I knew about it and my location doesn't even offer Bac. Willy Allison (the guy who runs Catwalk) is part of the group I mentioned in DorothyGale's thread about Griffin, the guys that are trying to open up casinos and get them to talk to each other, instead of being ashamed and hiding protection failures. Good stuff.
The opinions of this moderator are for entertainment purposes only.
buzzpaff
buzzpaff
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September 24th, 2011 at 12:54:13 PM permalink
" don't know what you're referring to. Perhaps you have me confused with someone else? "

That's the problem with satire SIGH> P S Black plate on the way.
FleaStiff
FleaStiff
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September 24th, 2011 at 2:48:39 PM permalink
Quote: Face

In Bac, the cut card is placed by the dealer exactly at the 14th card.

This must be limited to what is sometimes referred to as Big Table Baccarat. All I do is Mini-Bacc where limits are low and tongues are foreign.

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