Baccarat display screens

One thing I've wondered about for years is what is meant on those display screens you see on baccarat tables. Some of it is obvious, but there are four separate grids of red and blue circles. The first one, the "big road," is pretty obvious, but I have been trying to get a straight answer to the other three since they started making these signs.

To answer that question I created a new page on baccarat display signs. This page took a lot of time, so I hope you'll have a look. As always, I welcome comments, questions, and especially corrections, before I announce this to a wider audience.

It's an excellent page, Wizard, I liked the, "This is where the air starts to get thin," remark. I think the air got thin when players started worrying about these superstitions to begin with, but they can't really hurt you, and result in some excellent dramatics making Baccarat a fun game to watch (if not play), so who am I to complain? I really think there should be an Academy Awards representative at every Baccarat Table because I've seen players that would take, "Best Dramatic Performance," hands-down!!! Players acting like they got shot in the chest when the, "Unexpected," result occurs and everything else.

I maintain, however, that one may have his/her superstitions provided that they can't mathematically hurt you, though. I always light a cigarette anytime I hit for, "Free Games," on a slot machine...won't effect the result of the Free Games, although, I suppose I am hurting my lungs given that I only smoke five or less per day otherwise...

Anyway, great breakdown, and the next time I watch a Baccarat Table, I'll be able to understand the screen and why the superstitious players are betting the way they are, and perhaps, why they act so shocked when the, "Unexpected," happens.

Very interesting Wizard. This sentence, from the "Big Eye Boy" section, popped out at me, "The Big Eye Boy table is useful in gauging how repetitive the shoe is." Despite the clear explanation earlier regarding past results and future outcomes, it still sounds like an endorsement.

Regarding "Cockroach Pig", is there an explanation how it got named?

Do the displays in Asian countries track outcomes from right to left, since the writing is from right to left?

Quote: Mission146

It's an excellent page, Wizard,...

Thanks for the kind words. I'm amused that the casinos offer such statistics on lots of games. I've seen some argue it is unethical for casinos to take advantage of player superstitions in this way, but I completely disagree. Nobody is forcing the player to read these screens, and they only present truthful information. How the player processes this information is his own business.

Yes, baccarat can be amusing to watch. In Macau you see huge crowds gathering around "hot" tables, to enjoy the spectacle. Often you can hear the groans of agony far away when the unexpected outcome happens.

I might add that for the advantage player there is a practical use for this information. In baccarat tournaments it is very helpful to know how your opponents are likely to bet. Since most of them are recreational players, and don't understand that in a tournament you're not trying to beat the dealer, but beat the other players, it can be useful to understand how they think.

I agree with you completely on the first point. It is no more or less unethical than a sports book displaying a team's standings as well as how that team has performed against the team they are playing to date historically and to date in that season. As you have said, it is nothing more or less than the presentment of historical and indisputable fact, that one thinks it has an effect on the future is an entirely different subject. Furthermore, I should imagine that there are maany players who would stop playing Baccarat were this screen not available, why should a casino shoot itself in the foot?

As with any business, if the casino did not think the presence of this screen resulted in more entertainment/participation (i.e. profit), they wouldn't have them.

I wonder how they would respond to someone strictly playing what I might term, "Don't Pass," Baccarat. Wait for most of the bets to come out, then bet the opposite!!!

Would you mind going into a bit more detail as to how this would help in a tournament? It wouldn't change the odds, so the only function I see it serving is that you could bet against them, or bet with them...but less...if the cards are in the AP's favor, though, should he not (above 50% to win) just shove it all-in, or max, on the most likely result until he leads in chips?

Quote: Mission146

Would you mind going into a bit more detail as to how this would help in a tournament?

Let's say it is the last hand in a winner take all tournament with a secret bet. Your opponent has $1000 and you have $800. You're 90% sure your opponent is going to bet big on the Player. Obviously, you would want to "swing him" and bet the Banker.

Likewise, if you were ahead, you would want to be the same way as your opponent.

Once I made it to the final table of a half million dollar tournament at the Mandalay Bay. The first six outcomes were all Banker. I was early to act the next hand and bet everything on Player, in an attempt to swing the table. As expected everybody else went big on the Banker. Unfortunately, the Banker hit again, and I was eliminated.

Quote:

This is not a very realistic example, as I hand entered only Player and Banker wins

(emph mine)

this in the last para, do you mean to say "have entered" ?

Re the content, Wow! I can't believe how complicated this becomes!

Thanks for the answer, Wiz, I failed to consider that. I'm sorry about you getting knocked out of that tournament, and it just so happened that I read through the line and read your signature (again) after that paragraph, it's never been more appropriate!

Quote: Wizard

The first six outcomes were all Banker. I was early to act the next hand and bet everything on Player, in an attempt to swing the table. .

You mean swing the table to betting player?
Wouldn't everybody have lost if it was banker then?

Quote: EvenBob

You mean swing the table to betting player?
Wouldn't everybody have lost if it was banker then?

He means bet opposite everyone else. He bets Player, everyone else bets Banker. If he wins, they also lose... a total swing in his favor.

Quote: odiousgambit

Quote:

This is not a very realistic example, as I hand entered only Player and Banker wins

(emph mine)

this in the last para, do you mean to say "have entered" ?

Re the content, Wow! I can't believe how complicated this becomes!

Interesting.

I took that line to mean that he manually entered the info, rather than allow the (I assume) iDeal scanner to do the work.


On that note, I think having more realistic displays, ones that include ties, are better for the purpose of the article. Not necessarily better for the math, but they certainly affect the patterns and "story" the cards are telling.

FWIW, here's the best explanation of the roadmap that I've seen in English. I tend to think of the roadmap kind of like I do Pai Gow tiles; it takes some getting used to, but can be a lot of fun once you've got it down. Plus you can get in on the "monkey, monkey" and "oooh, there's a Pearl, I'm betting Player this time" talk with the Asian players.

First, I did mean "hand entered." There is a keypad where the dealer presses a button, like "player win" and it adds it to the screen. So I meant I just sat there pressing the buttons, not dealing actual cards. However, since I never explained the keypad I can see how the "hand entered" remark is confusing. I'll reword somehow.

Here again was the situation in that tournament. There was $500,000 in prize money and ten players. I'm sure it was very top heavy, with the winner getting about $350,000. I could talk about tournament strategy all day, but the main goal is not to beat the dealer but the other players. When you win and an opponent loses in the same hand, that is twice as sweet. At some point in most tournaments you're going to need to take some big risks, and win. This was my moment. I knew that most of the other players would bet Banker. I was already low on chips and needed to throw some Hail Marys to catch up. This was one of them. So I bet it all on Player. I was right that the other player went with Banker -- all of them. Unfortunately, the next hand was Banker, so I was out.

What I also found interesting is that those players that bet small on Banker were happy. While it was good to see me knocked out, I don't think they were happy for that reason. If everyone at the table wins, but you win the least -- that is BAD in a tournament.

Quote: Wizard

One thing I've wondered about for years is what is meant on those display screens you see on baccarat tables. Some of it is obvious, but there are four separate grids of red and blue circles. The first one, the "big road," is pretty obvious, but I have been trying to get a straight answer to the other three since they started making these signs.

To answer that question I created a new page on baccarat display signs. This page took a lot of time, so I hope you'll have a look. As always, I welcome comments, questions, and especially corrections, before I announce this to a wider audience.

now i'm coming closer and closer in betting $5000 on Banker instead of Dont Come at Riveria's 1000x odds Craps table.

wait till a new shoe and plop down my 5 yellow chips

Quote: Wizard

First, I did mean "hand entered." There is a keypad where the dealer presses a button, like "player win" and it adds it to the screen. So I meant I just sat there pressing the buttons, not dealing actual cards. However, since I never explained the keypad I can see how the "hand entered" remark is confusing. I'll reword somehow.

Here again was the situation in that tournament. There was $500,000 in prize money and ten players. I'm sure it was very top heavy, with the winner getting about $350,000. I could talk about tournament strategy all day, but the main goal is not to beat the dealer but the other players. When you win and an opponent loses in the same hand, that is twice as sweet. At some point in most tournaments you're going to need to take some big risks, and win. This was my moment. I knew that most of the other players would bet Banker. I was already low on chips and needed to throw some Hail Marys to catch up. This was one of them. So I bet it all on Player. I was right that the other player went with Banker -- all of them. Unfortunately, the next hand was Banker, so I was out.

What I also found interesting is that those players that bet small on Banker were happy. While it was good to see me knocked out, I don't think they were happy for that reason. If everyone at the table wins, but you win the least -- that is BAD in a tournament.

WIZARD I have never played a baccarat tournament before,but can`t you just see what the other players are betting on ie..player banker,or is it a secret bet?

Quote: Hunterhill

WIZARD I have never played a baccarat tournament before,but can`t you just see what the other players are betting on ie..player banker,or is it a secret bet?

In a tournament, you can do either. Secret bets are made by writing your bet down and handing it to the dealers.

Quote: Hunterhill

WIZARD I have never played a baccarat tournament before,but can`t you just see what the other players are betting on ie..player banker,or is it a secret bet?

There were usually be about 20 rounds. The first 19 the players bet in order, with the starting position each hand rotating around the table. The hand I wrote about I was early to act, so I didn't know what everyone else was going to do. Also, every player is allowed a secret bet to be used at any time, but almost always each player chooses to use it the last hand.

best explanation of the derived roads:
fate-in-the-cards-understanding-baccarat-trends
fate-in-the-cards-understanding-baccarat-trends-part-2
source:world gaming magazine

it is easy once you understand it, but you may not understand it very easily....

one should also know how to say baccarat in cantonese:
百家樂 = Bǎi jiā lè




edit: did not realize wizard had linked to this already!

Just by playing and sniffing around I stumbled on a proponent of the big road tracking system and was tossing around the math. I've already gotten past the fact that every every hand is independent of one another. My curiosity really lies in the weight and distribution of streaks within a shoe rather than simply how long you can ride one out. If you cast aside which banker/player you're wagering on mathematically can the volatility or lack thereof be a statistical indicator?

If you have a shoe that has 8 ties in the first half is that actually indicative of like or complementary cards early in the shoe and thus, albeit tiny, an indicator of volatility in later the shoe. Is that flawed logic to suggest that only like or complementary cards produce like results?

The same thing with streaks within a given shoe? Not which player will win but is there mathematically a lessened likelihood of a mid-shoe run of 8 in a shoe that already has 5 4-run wins vs a shoe that's been turning over after 1 and 2-wins the entire time?

Near the beginning.... "define trends" ... did you mean "divine trends"?

Player (capitalized) refers to the hand, whereas player (lower case) refers to participant in the game is fine, just make sure to take care about the start of a sentence.

I found the images a bit small and washed out but I'll revisit the page after my morning coffee and see if they improve.