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lilredrooster
lilredrooster
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Mission146
November 25th, 2022 at 8:59:55 AM permalink
__________________


one last post on this subject and then I'm going to shut up for a long time

the current market cap of BTC as I'm watching right now is:

three hundred and 16 billion, six hundred and eighty eight million, six hundred and eighty seven thousand, and seven hundred and three dollars

which is really not all that much when you consider that Elon Musk's net worth is about $191 billion

.
"believe half of what you see and none of what you hear" - Edgar Allan Poe
darkoz
darkoz
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November 25th, 2022 at 9:16:53 AM permalink
Quote: Mission146

Quote: darkoz



Magic the gathering is not what I would consider a collectible either although it's certainly has some sisterhood to it.

The value of magic the gathering is that they had tournaments and that the "collectibles" imbued powers for the owner such that during the tournament your collection, knowledge of its usage and combination of power could determine whether you win or lose.

The intrinsic value in magic the gathering therefore is akin to say tennis or basketball.

To claim basketball items are nothing but collectibles because they have no intrinsic value off the playing field is ridiculous.

Same with magic the gathering.

EDIT: BTW if you are interested in a good book about magic the gathering I suggest "Jonny Magic and the Card Shark Kids". After becoming top champion at Magic the card shark kids attacked card counting at blackjack.

The winning combinations and keeping track of the cards at Magic is so complex that they found card counting to be something for kindergarteners.
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(Quote clipped to remove quote in quote)

All I can say is that you can expect to be surprised! I hope you will enjoy the article!

The most stable form of "collecting", at least as a long-term investment, seems to actually be sealed box sets. While many people collect and have individual cards graded, early research would indicate that buying boxes of cards and then opening and storing them is generally not profitable. If you had done that right off the bat before Magic the Gathering actually popped as a game, and held those individual cards, then they can be worth a ton of money now, but most people (obviously) did not think to do that at the time.

Anyway, I have no idea what the rest of your post is saying. It seems that you are objecting to something I said, or some perception of what you think the article is going to be, but I'm not sure what your objection is.

Magic the Gathering is known as a CCG (Collectible Card Game) or TCG (Trading Card Game), but the most consistent way to invest in Magic appears to be in sealed product. Because it is sealed, you don't even know what cards are in those boxes...other than they are part of some set of cards, but you don't know the individual cards.

I don't know what the ratio of players to collectors is, and I strongly suspect many collectors are also players, but the article is mostly going to focus on Magic the Gathering sealed boxes as a viable long-term investment.
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Ah I see.

But I think the fact you are talking about sealed packs makes all the difference.

The entire reason sealed packs have so much long-term value is because most purchases are for players to open and use in tournaments. Hence the value of the cards is for gaming.

The value of unopened boxes is for collecting due to their scarcity.

That's not dissimilar to comics which unopened and sealed are worth more than ones that are read.

Or even cars which value goes down as soon as you drive off the lot. Are cars collectibles? Of course they can be but that isn't what people generally consider cars as because their value is elsewhere.

EDIT: And if I came across too strong I apologise. That wasn't my intent. You always post interesting articles.
For Whom the bus tolls; The bus tolls for thee
rxwine
rxwine
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November 25th, 2022 at 9:19:31 AM permalink
As a reminder, even getting a prediction right doesn’t necessarily mean anything as far as predicting power. You either have to show repeated consistency. Or be able to show a method to generally arrive at more correct answers.
Fair is fair, if unprovable claims are insisted to be true, one should be able to use unprovable methods of debunking.
Mission146
Mission146
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November 25th, 2022 at 9:20:00 AM permalink
Quote: lilredrooster

__________________


one last post on this subject and then I'm going to shut up for a long time

the current market cap of BTC as I'm watching right now is:

three hundred and 16 billion, six hundred and eighty eight million, six hundred and eighty seven thousand, and seven hundred and three dollars

which is really not all that much when you consider that Elon Musk's net worth is about $191 billion

.
link to original post



Why would you shut up for a long time?

I don't know if it is that much or not that much. I think it's, "That much," since BTC has a fundamental value of nothing and Musk owns things or has holdings in things with fundamental values of more than nothing.

Besides, one of the notions of BTC is that it is created to be finite, so mining new BTC becomes more and more difficult relative to the BTC that has already been mined. The fact that it's finite and more cannot be created once it has all been mined was supposed to be one of the draws to it as well as a long-term stabilizing force, even though it would still be fundamentally worthless. Besides, you have Doggycoin, EtherealCoin, ConfidenceGame.Coinv2.1 and whatever the heck the other ones are called, so since new coins can just come out anytime someone feels like trying to make a new coin, the finiteness of BTC...which shares the same fundamental value of nothing that these other coins (presumably) have...doesn't make Shytecoin, in general, a finite resource.
https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/off-topic/gripes/11182-pet-peeves/120/#post815219
GenoDRPh
GenoDRPh
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November 25th, 2022 at 1:51:45 PM permalink
Question for those of you who use BTC for the reasons Axel and The Wizard use it: Do you buy BTC and hold it and use it over time, accepting and increase or decrease in value as time marches on, or do you buy it each time you need it, and sell it when you stop needing it each time?

Gene
billryan
billryan
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November 25th, 2022 at 3:00:47 PM permalink
Grayscale is a huge financial firm with about 3 billion dollars in assets. Or does it? They claim to own hundreds of thousands of bitcoins, worth billions, yet they refuse to show any proof of ownership. Coinbase vouches for them, but who vouches for Coinbase? SBF does or did.
I suspect we are about to find out a whole lot of people there are over-leveraged and it isn't just the emperor who is wearing new clothes.
The difference between fiction and reality is that fiction is supposed to make sense.
ChumpChange
ChumpChange 
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November 25th, 2022 at 3:17:58 PM permalink
Many large bitcoin platforms are at severe risk of going bust very soon. They have already banned transactions just days before declaring bankruptcy. I don't watch CNBC to watch the parade of top bitcoin platform executives saying everything is fine on Wednesday only to be proved wrong by Saturday.

RT: Coinbase: “We’re fine”
Also, Coinbase: Our bonds are trading at 53 cents on the dollar. A level signaling distress.
AxelWolf
AxelWolf
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November 25th, 2022 at 3:45:43 PM permalink
Quote: GenoDRPh

Question for those of you who use BTC for the reasons Axel and The Wizard use it: Do you buy BTC and hold it and use it over time, accepting and increase or decrease in value as time marches on, or do you buy it each time you need it, and sell it when you stop needing it each time?

Gene
link to original post

As I already said, I have sold off a significant amount thus far, but nowadays, I just hold onto it if I play at an online casino and make money I just cash it out into my bitcoin wallet where it remains. I have more bitcoin than I need to use at online casinos my deposits are rarely more than 1k at a time. There are a few sportsbooks I trust that I occasionally will deposit up to 3k


"do you buy it each time you need it, and sell it when you stop needing it each time?"

When you're on an exchange you are not really buying and selling it(technically you are I guess) you can just trade it back and forth between your cash balance and BTC to avoid any fluctuation. Again, I don't do that, but I could.

Assuming one trusts Coinbase, I suggest everyone at least have one just in case. It's basically the same as having a PayPal account where you can earn free crypto for a few minutes of your time. You don't have to buy or be invested in crypto to have an account with money in it.

The Wizard can answer for himself, but I believe he sells his BTC as he hasn't any faith in it.
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
DRich
DRich
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November 25th, 2022 at 4:10:35 PM permalink
Quote: rxwine

Bitcoin itself seems more like a wager than an investment.



^^^This^^^
Order from chaos
AxelWolf
AxelWolf
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November 25th, 2022 at 5:43:07 PM permalink
Quote: DRich

Quote: rxwine

Bitcoin itself seems more like a wager than an investment.



^^^This^^^
link to original post

Aren't most investments a gamble/wager? Some are far less risky than others but less risk oftentimes equals less potential reward.

As far as I'm concerned, unless you can show me the +EV math, all investments are just gambling. Since no one can predict the future, even things that have past data showing decades of positive returns can suddenly crash.
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪

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