Much like Santa Ana Star Casino in NM, Sandia Casino has apparently introduced "No Vig Craps"
Note that the Albuquerque air port is down south near the Hard Rock casino. The Hard Rock is 12 miles south of the intersection of I-25 and I-40. It is approximately 30 miles from the Hard Rock up to the Santa Ana Star in Bernalillo. The Star is at exit 240. I've only been inside the Hard Rock once - and that was when it was the Isletta. I'm not sure what the conditions are there now. However, the Santa Ana Star is the home of the world's greatest craps game and is certainly worth a visit.
If you want to go to the Hollywood Casino on the San Filipe reservation then you'll have to go another 12 miles up I-25 to exit 252. When I'm visiting Albuquerque I rarely venture this far north, but I have played there on occasion. I do recommend calling ahead to see if they're going to have the craps tables open when you get there. Schedule is sporadic at best.
Sandia Casino is the largest in the market and the most Vegas-like casino in Albuquerque. It is at exit 234 off I-15. That's also known as Tramway Road. Good tables and crews. Odds are you will like it here.
It is approximately 20 miles from the intersection of I-25 and I-40 out to the Route 66 Casino west of Albuquerque. Route 66 has, perhaps, the best tables in the Albuquerque market for DI's. I have had issues here in the past with rules changing from dealer to dealer and box person to box person. You'll want to clarify if and when you can get the free buy bets on the four and ten, for example. When in doubt - ask.
If you are going to Albuquerque to hit the casinos but don't want to pay casino hotel rates - which can be high in this market - my recommendation would be that you select a hotel somewhere between exit 228 and 240. Somewhere in the middle there would probably be conveniently located to the main places you'll want to hang out.
Let's start up north at Bernalillo. There are four properties there. I'm familiar with two of them. When traveling without the spouse and staying on the cheap the Super 8 there is not a bad choice. Odds are you can score a room there via PriceLine for around $42 a night. A nicer option is the Holiday Inn Express. Their posted rate is $107, but I've scored rooms here via PriceLine bid for $45. By the way, if you're looking for something very upscale check out the Hyatt Regency Tamaya Resort. You'll pay a premium but it is world class.
Running south on I-25, Sandia Casino has a great hotel. If you don't have any play history there you'll probably be looking at a nightly rate on the weekend of around $205. Moving south from there, at exit 233 you'll find Staybridge Suites on Alameda, east of the Freeway. There are several other properties back to the west toward Balloon park.
At exit 232 (Paseo del Norte) you'll find the Mariott Pyramid, the Clarion, and a Howard Johnson Express. There may be a couple of other hotels at this exit but these are the major ones. The Marriott is starting to show its age and is used for a lot of corporate events. Often it's sold out on weekends. It's the home of the USKA National Karate Championships, so the kiddo and I have spent some time there. It's okay, but low on the scale compared to other Marriotts.
Down at exit 231 you'll find a lot of options. On the west side of the highway you'll find a La Quinta Inns and Suites and a Hampton Inn. On the east side of I-25 you'll find another La Quinta and a Hilton Garden Inn.
The next exit south of there will find a Holiday Inn Suites Hotel on Jefferson. Looks like a nice property but you're starting to get into some industrial areas around there. I'd probably pass on venturing over there. You might take a look at the Drury Inns and Suites at that exit - a little better situation, I think. But personally, I'd stay a little further up north.
No doubt some of you will also note that I have one of the local casino dealer schools marked on the map. That's there for the benefit of students who attend my Albuquerque seminars.
Albuquerque is something of a foodie heaven. The trick is to find those great little locals joints, which tend to be obscured by the preponderance of chain food restaurants. Personally, I just keep an eye out for the place with all the locals cars in the parking lot and the sign out front that advertises green chile.
Quote: heavy...Albuquerque is something of a foodie heaven. The trick is to find those great little locals joints, which tend to be obscured by the preponderance of chain food restaurants. Personally, I just keep an eye out for the place with all the locals cars in the parking lot and the sign out front that advertises green chile.
Heavy, you rock! That is an excellent synopsis of what my wonderful Land of Enchantment (some say Entrapment) has to offer in the gaming field. As I have said, I don't play much here in town (think I have put money on the tables maybe 8 times) but I can certainly offer my suggestions for food. One just needs to PM me. Hole-In-The-Wall Joints are usually the best. IMHO.
Quote: wikipedianame comes from the Arabic Abu al-Qurq', which means "father of the cork"
Rio Rancho on the map above was part of one of the greatest real estate sales scams of the 20th century. Hundreds of worthless lots were sold to unsuspecting Midwest and Eastern investors. It is what the salesmen in "Glengarry Glen Ross" were pitching. Their specialty was the soft sell. My grandfather bought a lot there, which I will probably inherit. It is worth less than what he paid for it in today's dollars. The town never grew like they said it would.
A trip here is definitely on my bucket list now.
Yeah, travel to New Mexico, Land of Enchantment.. buy some torquoise jewelry thats made in Japan, risk Altitude Sickness, travel on weird roads, wind up in an Indian Casino at a wide place in the road and drink Firewater ... all while learning that New Mexico is more properly The Land of Disenchantment.Quote: RaleighCrapsThis would be a pretty cool idea. Get a dozen or so of the craps players on this site to meet at one of these Free Buy/Field casinos, for a weekend. Would be a good time.
How much money would one have to pump through the Free Buy the Four and Ten OR Free Field Bet before it would be economically sensible?
Quote: FleaStiffYeah, travel to New Mexico, Land of Enchantment.. buy some torquoise jewelry thats made in Japan, risk Altitude Sickness, travel on weird roads, wind up in an Indian Casino at a wide place in the road and drink Firewater ... all while learning that New Mexico is more properly The Land of Disenchantment.
How much money would one have to pump through the Free Buy the Four and Ten OR Free Field Bet before it would be economically sensible?
you forgot to mention the hanta virus...but really, flea, altitude sickness? weird roads?
most of NM is a hell of alot nicer than most of NV... :)
Quote: FleaStiffYeah, travel to New Mexico, Land of Enchantment.. buy some torquoise jewelry thats made in Japan, risk Altitude Sickness, travel on weird roads, wind up in an Indian Casino at a wide place in the road and drink Firewater ... all while learning that New Mexico is more properly The Land of Disenchantment.
How much money would one have to pump through the Free Buy the Four and Ten OR Free Field Bet before it would be economically sensible?
Yeah, for those who have local casinos, travel to NM would not be done as a profit statement. However, since I have to travel whenever I want to play, where I travel to does not really matter. I may spend a bit more to get to NM, but seeing a new place is worth some cost.
Quote:Yeah, travel to New Mexico, Land of Enchantment.. buy some torquoise jewelry thats made in Japan, risk Altitude Sickness, travel on weird roads, wind up in an Indian Casino at a wide place in the road and drink Firewater ... all while learning that New Mexico is more properly The Land of Disenchantment.
If you're buying turquoise jewelry that's made in Japan then you're probably shopping in a souvenir shop run by East Indians, not Zunis or Tewas. If you're suffering altitude sickness get back on the Sandia tram and go back down the mountain. If you're traveling on weird roads slow down and check out the Spanish Mission churches, buy a Chimaya blanket, take the High Road to Taos and spend a couple of hours chilling in Kit Carson National Forest. If you're drinking Firewater in the casino it's probably not a Native American operation - unless you are in one of the restaurants of a bar off the casino floor. Go ahead. Get a cup of that fruit punch. It'll do you good.
I'll tell you a funny story. When my kids were younger we used to go to New Mexico every Thanksgiving. No, we didn't have relatives out there or anything like that. We made it a tradition to have Thanksgiving dinner with the Indians - just like the Pilgrims did. Okay, maybe the Pilgrims didn't eat at the Sandia buffet, but you get the idea. And New Mexico is still one of the kids' favorite places to go.
By the way, last time I was out at the Star they did book $10 buy bets on the four and ten - free. They'd also book a $10 Lay (to win $5) bet on the four and ten - free. Maybe they've tightened up a bit. Who cares.
Here's how to get your four and ten rocking.
$25 four and $25 ten
first hit pays $50 - press both to $50
second hit pays $100 - same bet
note that you just locked up $100 and have $100 in "free" action at this point. From here on we only press the number that rolls. Let's just ride the four.
third hit pays $200 - lock up $50 and go to $250
fourth hit pays $500 - lock up $250 and go to $500
fifth hit pays $1000 - lock up $500 and go to $1000
sixth hit pays $2000 - lock up $500 and press to $2500
seventh hit pays $5000 (and down if you're smart)
I will tell you that I've made this play up to the press to $2500 level many times - but never gotten the seventh hit. With that said, you're $1300 ahead at that point so that took some of the sting out of the seven.
Ugh, I just lost $1000 playing this method on the Wizard's game. Think I'll hold off on that trip to NM.Quote: heavy$25 four and $25 ten
first hit pays $50 - press both to $50
second hit pays $100 - same bet
note that you just locked up $100 and have $100 in "free" action at this point. From here on we only press the number that rolls. Let's just ride the four.
third hit pays $200 - lock up $50 and go to $250
fourth hit pays $500 - lock up $250 and go to $500
fifth hit pays $1000 - lock up $500 and go to $1000
sixth hit pays $2000 - lock up $500 and press to $2500
seventh hit pays $5000 (and down if you're smart)
I will tell you that I've made this play up to the press to $2500 level many times - but never gotten the seventh hit. With that said, you're $1300 ahead at that point so that took some of the sting out of the seven.
It doesn't matter if you have free bets or not - you're still going to have to have sufficient bankroll to survive the variance inherent to the game. You will get ahead. You will get behind. Over the long run it's a zero sum game - mathematically.
Okay. Just played again and got the seventh hit. Not only that, the four hit NINE times. I took it down before that as per your method. The Wizard's game won't let you bet more than $1,000. Got the ten up to $500 too. Finished with about $12,000. What a high variance system.Quote: teddysUgh, I just lost $1000 playing this method on the Wizard's game. Think I'll hold off on that trip to NM.
silly
Sally
Quote: mustangsallyI see after your second hit you stay at the same bet, $50.Quote: heavyHere's how to get your four and ten rocking.
$25 four and $25 ten
first hit pays $50 - press both to $50
second hit pays $100 - same bet
note that you just locked up $100 and have $100 in "free" action at this point. From here on we only press the number that rolls. Let's just ride the four.
third hit pays $200 - lock up $50 and go to $250
fourth hit pays $500 - lock up $250 and go to $500
fifth hit pays $1000 - lock up $500 and go to $1000
sixth hit pays $2000 - lock up $500 and press to $2500
seventh hit pays $5000 (and down if you're smart)
I will tell you that I've made this play up to the press to $2500 level many times - but never gotten the seventh hit. With that said, you're $1300 ahead at that point so that took some of the sting out of the seven.
Now you say the 3rd hit pays $200.
Looks like you are looking way too far into the future.
I have seen my BF make that bet many times and he only gets paid $100 for a $50 wager.
That makes your system cumulative profits much lower than you posted.
added: I was programming some Craps for my BF and he pointed this out to me. A bit hard to program your method as written.
Sally
yeah, pressing 100% of your profit is very aggressive.
i view it as swinging for the fences and hoping for that home run (5+ hits). in the meantime you get very little $.
i guess it's a way to play it.
mathematically it shouldnt make a difference since it's 0% house edge?
but you probably got to be playing a long time and multiple trips to ride out the variance to get that long roll.
I prefer 1/3 to 50% of the profit to press since i dont goto a casino that often per year.
i prefer to leave the casino with more $ per trip vs less $ per trip but 5yrs from now hit $5000 in one session. i rather have a happier experience per trip.
A math guy on this board uses 62% (Golden Ratio) of the profit to press.
edit:
and i guess in the end, if you add up all the $ you won no matter which strategy you use, the cummulative total should be roughly the same?
it's a preference of which you enjoy more:
- A big score
- series of smaller wins
I was at the table with one of my regular playing partners and he had the dice. I know from playing craps with this guy for over ten years that he tosses a lot of fours, eights, and tens. He set the five as the point and I bought the four and ten for $25 each and bet $18 each on the six and eight. My friend bet $5 each on the four and ten. He is even a lower roller than yours truly. Anyway, his next toss he rolled a four. I pressed to $50 and collected $25 (less the vig, of course, but I'll just assume you know that from here on). He collected $9 and said "same bet." Well, as his hand progressed I went from $50 to $100 and collected $50. Then from $100 to $200 and collected $100. Then from $200 to $400 and collected $200. Then from $400 to $1000 and collected another $200. At which point my friend said "make my four look like $10." And, of course, he sevened out the next toss.
Amusing anecdote number 2. Had something similar happen over at M Resort one Sunday. I'd just finished tossing a hand from straight out - was up around $2K for the session and decided to pull the plug and grab some lunch. Stood in line at the cage for probably fifteen minutes to cash out, then walked back over to the table to chat with some friends. I asked the player next to me if the dice had been all the way around the table already. He said "no, he's had the dice ever since you left the table." I asked what he was rolling, although it was pretty evident by looking at the layout. Most of the action was on the nine and ten. I dropped a twenty on the table and told the dealer I'd like $10 each on the nine and ten. Next toss the ten showed and I bought it for a quarter. Then it was off to the races. About fifteen minutes later we had one of those "dice down outside" moments and I decided to play the superstition game and turn my bets off. Seven out - line away. When the dealer returned my action to me my twenty bucks had turned into over $1500. Not my biggest win off $20 but not a bad one.
On pressing your bets - I sometimes talk to players about the old "golden ratio" and playing a Kelly based bet. Usually their eyes glaze over about thirty seconds into it. Craps players are not at all like card counting blackjack players, who get very excited about the joys of playing a full Kelly versus a partial and the like.
Agreed, in a no vig game it should not matter over the long run. Most of the guys I hang out with, though, are very concerned about short-run bankroll volatility, so you'll rarely see them betting to their advantage - assuming they even have one. You'll rarely see anyone attempting to capitalize on the free four and ten buys at the Star - but you will see a lot of guys walk in on weekends, buy in for twenty bucks and play for the next two hours doing nothing but prop bets. It is a strange thing to behold. In my neck of the woods I'd say they're just there for the drinks. But fruit punch? Hmmm. Maybe they just have sugar cravings.
My preference is to play a 50% press by pressing every other hit, regardless of what rolls. In my younger days I was a tad more conservative and pressed every third hit. There's something to be said for both methods of play. However, I suspect the correct play is to bet your advantage if you have one - and if you don't then either learn how to play SOME casino game with an advantage - or just admit that you're a recreational gambler and that your bankroll is "entertainment" money.
DUHHHH
Quote: teddysSorry to ressurect this thread (Whatever happened to Heavy?), but I'm driving to Nevada, and depending on the weather, may stop in Albuquerque. I'd like to know which casinos of Santa Ana Star, Sandia, and Route 66 have the free buy on 4&10 and/or triple the aces in the field. Anyone have any up-to-date info? God forbid I have to call them...
You should call, I would say. A lot of those promotional things get axed if they get bit.
I live here in area and these are my best recollections:
Sandia: Free buy on the 4 & 10 only @ $20 or more. 2x on Aces & 3x on Boxcars.
Santa Ana Star: Free buy on the 4 & 10 @ any amount(even $5). 3x on Aces & 3x on Boxcars.
Route 66: Free buy on the 4 & 10 @ any amount(even $5). 2x on Aces & 3x on Boxcars.
All of the above offer buy the 5 & 9 @ $20 or more with Vig on the Win only.
I've been playing mostly at Sandia lately when I play, pretty much VP, as I've been in a Craps losing rut. It's the nicest and least seedy. It also has the Best Hotel, Spa, Food and Golf. Also, My wife loves their Bingo room!
Quote: ten2winI'm sorry for the lateness on this post, teddys
I live here in area and these are my best recollections:
Sandia: Free buy on the 4 & 10 only @ $20 or more. 2x on Aces & 3x on Boxcars.
Santa Ana Star: Free buy on the 4 & 10 @ any amount(even $5). 3x on Aces & 3x on Boxcars.
Route 66: Free buy on the 4 & 10 @ any amount(even $5). 2x on Aces & 3x on Boxcars.
All of the above offer buy the 5 & 9 @ $20 or more with Vig on the Win only.
Thanks. Am I correct in saying Route 66 is the most convenient to I-40, but also the seediest? Or is it decent?
Yeah, me too. Only one way to get out of that rut, though...Quote:I've been playing mostly at Sandia lately when I play, pretty much VP, as I've been in a Craps losing rut.
Quote: teddysThanks. Am I correct in saying Route 66 is the most convenient to I-40, but also the seediest? Or is it decent?
You are correct. Route 66 is the Rio Puerco exit on I-40, I'm not sure of the number, maybe around number 190.
I'm going out on a limb here, but I'd say that Route 66 is a step up from The Santa Ana Star. They have a connected Hotel, a night club, the Best Buffet(by popular local vote), a nice bar and poker room. It's very isolated in a desolate area about 20 miles West of Albuquerque.
They do have $5 PGP, some 6:5 Blackjack Tables and those shorter Craps Tables, which I kind of enjoy for some reason.
Quote: teddysSorry to ressurect this thread (Whatever happened to Heavy?), but I'm driving to Nevada, and depending on the weather, may stop in Albuquerque.
Did you happen to stop on your way through???
I first went to Santa Ana Star. This was the hardest to get to and the furthest from the freeway. They did have the free bet on the field, four, and ten. I also noted that they had the 9/7 paytable on Ultimate Texas Hold 'Em trips, and a very good double deck blackjack game, neither of which I played. I played craps for about 10 minutes and was the only one at the table . I bet the passline, max odds (10x), and the four and ten for $25 each. I also bet the field starting at $15 and pressing on every win in a Fibonacci sequence. I eventually got sick of having to make a pass line bet, and colored up down $230. I got a tasty breakfast burrito with green chili for $1.75.
Next I went to Sandia. This is nice, but not super nice. It reminds me of some of the Indian casinos in AZ, like Lone Butte. They had the free buy on the four and ten. I bought them both for $25 each (no other bets), and doubled the bet after every win. One guy got both my four and ten up to $250 each, and then threw a die in the bowl when the faces clearly showed four...next roll, seven out :(
After that it got really bad and I left with a $400 loss.
Route 66 is outside of town on 1-40. It was also not very crowded. They gave me a free ace in blackjack where the max bet was $100. I bet a black chip and got a 6 on my ace. Dealer showed 10, so I hit and got a 2 for nineteen. Dealer had 20 :( The craps table had the same free buy on the four and ten. There was one other shooter at the table who was a real asshole. I bought in and played the same way I had at Sandia, parlaying the four and ten. I was winning a little (4 & 10s were hitting), when the guy said some shit to me and I finally had it and said "take all my bets down." Of course, as soon as I did this I KID YOU NOT the dealer called about six 4s and 10s in a row. I came back later and dropped $500 on a cold table.
I stopped a two more casinos on I-40, neither of which had craps, but I did pick up some free souvenirs like a New Mexico coffee mug. Fire Rock in Gallup had a $5 craps table with 3x4x5x odds. I decided to give it a throw, and again I was the only player. I played my usual method of $5 coming and max odds on every throw. It LITERALLY took me less than 15 minutes to lose $660. If someone had told me, "Shoot as worse as you possibly can," I'm not sure I could have fulfilled that directive more thoroughly. I think I collected on about three odds bets out of 50 or so made. I left and tipped the dealers $5, who were very nice.
I really hate craps right now.
Quote: teddysI did visit the casinos in Albuquerque. For my bankroll's sake, I wish I hadn't.
I really hate craps right now.
Now can you feel my pain!
I feel your pain Teddy:
playing dont... table is hot.. lose a few dont bets.
switch to passline.. table turns cold.. seven pso's in a row! uggg
Quote: 100xOddsswitch to passline.. table turns cold.. seven pso's in a row! uggg
One of these days you guys will believe me... the dice HATE, no, *really* HATE, no, *really* *really* HATE side switchers! [g]
If I can find that girl, you won't find me anywhere near a craps table, I can damn near guarantee you that.Quote: AhighNext time you play craps, make sure you have the hottest damn girl you can find that wants to do you, let her flirt with the crew while you're shooting and make comments about your hard ten or whatever. Low cut less them short stick (encourage it). You'll win.
With regard to "seediness" discussed in this thread, it should be noted that Santa Ana appears to have recently undergone a renovation and appears newer and cleaner than it did just a few years ago. Rt. 66, in comparison, has always seemed clean and safe to me, has an attached hotel, with clean and comfortable rooms, as well as an indoor pool, sauna, and exercise room. Customer service has always been above par at the "Route", it is easy to get to, and most dealers are very personable and professional. They still have 2 - 3 blackjack tables that pay 3/2. In my experience, during the week, you can find at least one 3/2 S17 shoe game and one 3/2 DD S17. At select time on weekends, they have more than one pit open (at least one babydoll type pit :-)) with a 3/2 S17 shoe game, one single deck 3/2 S17, d10/11 only, with a minimum around $15. True, 6/5 games are there too and one table has a lower minimum and is more frequently full than some of the better games.
Thanks in advance for any responses.
Those are great gambling options. No wonder Walter White made so much money card counting there. ;)Quote: newshooterSorry to revive this old thread again. My username is reflective of my experience at craps; have only been playing it for less than a year, but have really enjoyed those (relatively) few sessions, despite recent back-to-back losing ones. The ABQ area is the closest gambling destination to where I live, and is most frequently where I go. I can tell you that, as recently as this month, Santa Ana Star still had the free buy bets on the 4 and 10, and still pays triple on the field 2 and 12. Rt. 66 has the free buy bets, but pays double on the 2 and triple on the 12. All are at a $5 minimum. My question is this - with a relatively small BR ($200 - $300), should I be buying the 4 and the 10 each time, in addition to placing the 6 and the 8? Is my BR too small to withstand the variance? Generally, I bet $5 PL with 2X odds, and place the 6 and the 8 for $6.
With regard to "seediness" discussed in this thread, it should be noted that Santa Ana appears to have recently undergone a renovation and appears newer and cleaner than it did just a few years ago. Rt. 66, in comparison, has always seemed clean and safe to me, has an attached hotel, with clean and comfortable rooms, as well as an indoor pool, sauna, and exercise room. Customer service has always been above par at the "Route", it is easy to get to, and most dealers are very personable and professional. They still have 2 - 3 blackjack tables that pay 3/2. In my experience, during the week, you can find at least one 3/2 S17 shoe game and one 3/2 DD S17. At select time on weekends, they have more than one pit open (at least one babydoll type pit :-)) with a 3/2 S17 shoe game, one single deck 3/2 S17, d10/11 only, with a minimum around $15. True, 6/5 games are there too and one table has a lower minimum and is more frequently full than some of the better games.
Thanks in advance for any responses.
Have to been to Sandia? Seemed like the nicest casino of the bunch. Free buy on 4 & 10 when I played there.
Really, you should be playing the free bets exclusively. I would dump the 6 & 8 and switch the four and ten. Yes, it's more variance, but you'll lose less/win more! Play the field at the Star, too. A pass line bet is sometimes necessary to keep you in action, so you may keep doing that.
You win on 2,3,4,9,10,11,12
lose on 5,6,7,8
As teddys said, concentrating on the free bets should lead to the lowest loss, but that's not guaranteed. If 6s and 8s are being thrown a lot at the table, then that is the way to bet. But you pay a small price for those bets. Good luck, and may your next session be a winning one.
Quote: RaleighCrapsAs teddys said, concentrating on the free bets should lead to the lowest loss, but that's not guaranteed. If 6s and 8s are being thrown a lot at the table, then that is the way to bet. But you pay a small price for those bets. Good luck, and may your next session be a winning one.
I agree. Stay with 4/10 and Field. It's like Hard Rock Tampa, which still has only 1c Vig on every 20 bucks on ALL buy bets. Yet I still see people playing other bets.
Your vig will be tips. Your possible gain could be comps, it's possible according to some such action still will earn them.
Quote: newshooterSorry to revive this old thread again. My username is reflective of my experience at craps; have only been playing it for less than a year, but have really enjoyed those (relatively) few sessions, despite recent back-to-back losing ones. The ABQ area is the closest gambling destination to where I live, and is most frequently where I go. I can tell you that, as recently as this month, Santa Ana Star still had the free buy bets on the 4 and 10, and still pays triple on the field 2 and 12. Rt. 66 has the free buy bets, but pays double on the 2 and triple on the 12. All are at a $5 minimum. My question is this - with a relatively small BR ($200 - $300), should I be buying the 4 and the 10 each time, in addition to placing the 6 and the 8? Is my BR too small to withstand the variance? Generally, I bet $5 PL with 2X odds, and place the 6 and the 8 for $6.
With regard to "seediness" discussed in this thread, it should be noted that Santa Ana appears to have recently undergone a renovation and appears newer and cleaner than it did just a few years ago. Rt. 66, in comparison, has always seemed clean and safe to me, has an attached hotel, with clean and comfortable rooms, as well as an indoor pool, sauna, and exercise room. Customer service has always been above par at the "Route", it is easy to get to, and most dealers are very personable and professional. They still have 2 - 3 blackjack tables that pay 3/2. In my experience, during the week, you can find at least one 3/2 S17 shoe game and one 3/2 DD S17. At select time on weekends, they have more than one pit open (at least one babydoll type pit :-)) with a 3/2 S17 shoe game, one single deck 3/2 S17, d10/11 only, with a minimum around $15. True, 6/5 games are there too and one table has a lower minimum and is more frequently full than some of the better games.
Thanks in advance for any responses.
dont bother with the 6 and 8. heck, dont even bother with Pass line!
Play the lowest house edge:
Either buy the 4 and 10 only, or play the triple 2 field.
and make it working on every roll.
Quote: RaleighCrapsThe field paying 3x on the 2 and 12 is a wonderful bet. No house edge, and you have action on every roll.
You win on 2,3,4,9,10,11,12
lose on 5,6,7,8
Crazy that they offer this. I'd be playing this every roll and making my own pass lines, and that's about it I think.
Quote: 100xOddsdont bother with the 6 and 8. heck, dont even bother with Pass line!
Play the lowest house edge:
Either buy the 4 and 10 only, or play the triple 2 field.
and make it working on every roll.
OK. Thanks to all for the advice.
I was at both of these places around a month ago. You'd be surprised how little the field was being bet and, to a somewhat lesser extent, the 4 and 10. The couple of times I was there, there seemed to be a lot of inside action - moreso at the Route, than at Santa Ana.
Quote: newshooterOK. Thanks to all for the advice.
I was at both of these places around a month ago. You'd be surprised how little the field was being bet and, to a somewhat lesser extent, the 4 and 10. The couple of times I was there, there seemed to be a lot of inside action - moreso at the Route, than at Santa Ana.
Well, it shows to go you that more casinos should do this. The players don't know what to do with what they are handed anyway, maybe they just hear that the craps is set "loose".
Meanwhile APs also have no interest.
Quote: sodawaterif they are offering craps bets with zero house edge, you'd have to be insane to make bets that do have a house edge. Disregard any talk of "if the table is rolling 6s and 8s," because that's nonsense. The dice don't remember what they rolled the last throw, and even if they could, they don't have little hands and feet to reposition themselves the same way for the next throw.
I'm not disagreeing with you and odious by any means, but I am pointing out that in the overall scheme of things, just because you are making a 0% house edge bet, does not mean you are guaranteed to have the better outcome for that craps session.
Buying the 4 and 10 with no vig, and playing the field on triple 2 and 12 are both great bets. But if the 4s and 10s aren't being rolled, and 6s and 8s are, you will lose money, even though you were making the 'smarter' bet.
I know Superrick tracks all of the rolls in his sessions. I would love to see how the number distribution looks for him in each session. I bet there is rarely a perfect distribution of numbers. I can't explain it, but I have played hundreds of hours of craps at a wide variety of places, and I have seen places where certain numbers seem to come up more than they should. And the difference between a 0% edge bet, and 1.52% on a $5 bet is just not that big enough of an amount in a 4 hour craps session.
Quote: RaleighCrapsI can't explain it, but I have played hundreds of hours of craps at a wide variety of places, and I have seen places where certain numbers seem to come up more than they should. And the difference between a 0% edge bet, and 1.52% on a $5 bet is just not that big enough of an amount in a 4 hour craps session.
You feel this way because humans have evolved for 1000s and 1000s of years as hunter-gatherers, and hence, evolution placed a great premium on the development of the human brain to constantly search for patterns. What is useful for spotting a deer in a forest is totally counterproductive when trying to interpret the output data of random events.
Every single roll of two-dice is independent. Another way of saying it is there is absolutely no predictive value of past rolls for upcoming rolls. So, even if the table has been rolling 6s and 8s like they are going out of style, there is simply no way to exploit that information in a bet for the next roll.
It's one thing to look back at your time at the table and say "certain numbers came up more than they should." That's going to happen every session! The real value is saying which numbers will come up more often BEFORE they come up. And this can't be done.
The only reason someone should place the 6 and 8 when a table allows different zero-edge bets is if the entertainment value of the negative bet exceeds the cost of the bet. And that may well be the case. Sometimes it's nice to hit your favorite number. I like to play an occasional hard eight, because that's my favorite number, but I do it for the entertainment value when it hits.
Quote: sodawater...The only reason someone should place the 6 and 8 when a table allows different zero-edge bets is if the entertainment value of the negative bet exceeds the cost of the bet. And that may well be the case. Sometimes it's nice to hit your favorite number. I like to play an occasional hard eight, because that's my favorite number, but I do it for the entertainment value when it hits.
But isn't the whole game of craps entertainment value? Even with a 0% HE bet, there still is no money to be made from the game. Therefore, you had better be playing for the entertainment, because if you are playing for mortgage money, you're going to be homeless.
You had me at $100 Ace how do you get that? I find it hard to believe they will keep allowing that.Quote: teddysI did visit the casinos in Albuquerque. For my bankroll's sake, I wish I hadn't.
I first went to Santa Ana Star. This was the hardest to get to and the furthest from the freeway. They did have the free bet on the field, four, and ten. I also noted that they had the 9/7 paytable on Ultimate Texas Hold 'Em trips, and a very good double deck blackjack game, neither of which I played. I played craps for about 10 minutes and was the only one at the table . I bet the passline, max odds (10x), and the four and ten for $25 each. I also bet the field starting at $15 and pressing on every win in a Fibonacci sequence. I eventually got sick of having to make a pass line bet, and colored up down $230. I got a tasty breakfast burrito with green chili for $1.75.
Next I went to Sandia. This is nice, but not super nice. It reminds me of some of the Indian casinos in AZ, like Lone Butte. They had the free buy on the four and ten. I bought them both for $25 each (no other bets), and doubled the bet after every win. One guy got both my four and ten up to $250 each, and then threw a die in the bowl when the faces clearly showed four...next roll, seven out :(
After that it got really bad and I left with a $400 loss.
Route 66 is outside of town on 1-40. It was also not very crowded. They gave me a free ace in blackjack where the max bet was $100. I bet a black chip and got a 6 on my ace. Dealer showed 10, so I hit and got a 2 for nineteen. Dealer had 20 :( The craps table had the same free buy on the four and ten. There was one other shooter at the table who was a real asshole. I bought in and played the same way I had at Sandia, parlaying the four and ten. I was winning a little (4 & 10s were hitting), when the guy said some shit to me and I finally had it and said "take all my bets down." Of course, as soon as I did this I KID YOU NOT the dealer called about six 4s and 10s in a row. I came back later and dropped $500 on a cold table.
I stopped a two more casinos on I-40, neither of which had craps, but I did pick up some free souvenirs like a New Mexico coffee mug. Fire Rock in Gallup had a $5 craps table with 3x4x5x odds. I decided to give it a throw, and again I was the only player. I played my usual method of $5 coming and max odds on every throw. It LITERALLY took me less than 15 minutes to lose $660. If someone had told me, "Shoot as worse as you possibly can," I'm not sure I could have fulfilled that directive more thoroughly. I think I collected on about three odds bets out of 50 or so made. I left and tipped the dealers $5, who were very nice.I really hate craps right now.
Btw, I was one of the players who played max odds at the riviera when they had 1000x odds. I lost my entire years bankroll of $100,000 in about two days, hence the reason for my hiatus. But now it's a new year and I will gamble for a little bit, post reports here, and then disappear until next year. My net loss for the year was approx 30,000, as I had won approx 45,000 from the Star (all luck, no advantage play), which I didn't touch, and 25,000 from triple attack BJ before I was backed off the game (mmmmm, I love that game). The triple attack BJ win was mostly luck, as my win rate was way higher than the player advantage shown on discountgambling.net. I wired my 100,000 bankroll to the riviera and left with zero. Ouch.
I will be posting a report on Council Bluffs Horseshoe soon.
Ahigh, if you want, I will be at Sandia at the end of May, if you want to meet up. btw, you can not wire money to the star, so you have to have it on you. Dangerous walking around with a $50,000 brick.
Feel free to ask me any questions regarding the Star.
