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DoubleOrNothing
DoubleOrNothing
Joined: Jan 2, 2012
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July 23rd, 2015 at 12:19:12 PM permalink
Quote: beachbumbabs

I do remember trying one of those back in the mid-90's and finding it intriguing and a bit scary, how good it was at creating a "dialogue". And they've had 20 more years to refine and improve it.


All I know is that the truth grows taller the further on down the line. Until people forget that they couldn't prove the thing in the first place.

Who knew the Wizard would end up like this.
I can't believe what I believe.
superrick
superrick
Joined: Jul 14, 2010
  • Threads: 28
  • Posts: 775
July 24th, 2015 at 3:03:52 PM permalink
How DI schools use propaganda to sell their classes

How many have every really thought anybody what they were reading on some of these DI craps boards?

There is a lot of information on these craps boards, but how much of it is just propaganda to sell classes. Do you guys believe everything on these DI boards?

Someone sent me a quote that the owner of the DI board wrote!

Quote:

The owner of the DI board wrote:
Hell, they claim the dice are weighted heavy on one side based on spinning the dice in a set of cheap calipers. Never mind that they donít know how to load the dice in the calipers properly. They donít even know that the purpose of the calipers is not to check the dice for weight imbalance. Itís to check the dice to make sure they are perfectly square. And if the dice are NOT perfectly square then itís highly likely that it is a result of how the dice were handled AFTER they left the manufacturer Ė not as a result of any flaw in the manufacturing process.



Then you have this quote.
Quote:

The owner of the DI board wrote this:
Look, Iím not picking on you here. Just trying to make a point. Last week I visited Midwest Game Supply in Kearny, Mo., the ONLY company manufacturing dice in the United States and one of the major suppliers of dice (including mine) in the business. I toured EVERY step of the manufacturing process Ė from the extrusion of the blank rods that are eventually cut into dice and milled to a tolerance of less than .003 of an inch to the weighing of the pip filler ďpaintĒ to the fact that there are digital micrometers on EVERY workstation along the way where the dice are measured for both size and shape.


Okay, he said that he took a trip to Midwest Game Supply in Kearny, Mo. Then in the above quote he said that the guys that said there were bad dice were checking the dice using cheap calipers to see if they were out of balance. Yet the truth of the matter is they were using a dice caliper from Midwest Game Supply!

So I want everybody to check out this link to Midwest Game Supply and it will show you how propaganda is used to sell their classes! First off the owner of the DI board that also sells his classes is writing that a dice the caliper is not to check the dice for weight imbalance.

In the links below it will show you that a dice caliper is used to check the dice for weight imbalance. That is the only purpose of a dice caliper and what the owner of the DI board is doing he is just spreading propaganda to sell taking a class, because if there were unbalanced dice out there why would you want to take a class on dice control?

http://midwestgamesupply.com/SKUs/Dice_Tools.htm

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x10b5qr_unbalanced-dice-part-1-bad-dice-in-las-vegas-casinos-must-see_news

The way that these guy that want to use propaganda to sell their classes get away with what they are doing is very simple, then just ban anybody that doesn't agree with what they are saying. Their DI board become a cult because the members can't ask a smart question about what they are selling without getting nothing but
propaganda!

So here is my question for you guys that go to these DI boards, do you think that you're getting the real story when you read anything on these boards?
Note, all my post start with this is just my opinion...! You do good brada ..! superrick Winning comes from knowledge and skill when your betting and not reading fiction http://procraps4u2.myfanforum.org/index.php ...
Ahigh
Ahigh
Joined: May 19, 2010
  • Threads: 89
  • Posts: 5195
July 25th, 2015 at 8:13:08 AM permalink
Quote: superrick

How DI schools use propaganda to sell their classes

How many have every really thought anybody what they were reading on some of these DI craps boards?

There is a lot of information on these craps boards, but how much of it is just propaganda to sell classes. Do you guys believe everything on these DI boards?

Someone sent me a quote that the owner of the DI board wrote!

Quote:

The owner of the DI board wrote:
Hell, they claim the dice are weighted heavy on one side based on spinning the dice in a set of cheap calipers. Never mind that they donít know how to load the dice in the calipers properly. They donít even know that the purpose of the calipers is not to check the dice for weight imbalance. Itís to check the dice to make sure they are perfectly square. And if the dice are NOT perfectly square then itís highly likely that it is a result of how the dice were handled AFTER they left the manufacturer Ė not as a result of any flaw in the manufacturing process.



Then you have this quote.
Quote:

The owner of the DI board wrote this:
Look, Iím not picking on you here. Just trying to make a point. Last week I visited Midwest Game Supply in Kearny, Mo., the ONLY company manufacturing dice in the United States and one of the major suppliers of dice (including mine) in the business. I toured EVERY step of the manufacturing process Ė from the extrusion of the blank rods that are eventually cut into dice and milled to a tolerance of less than .003 of an inch to the weighing of the pip filler ďpaintĒ to the fact that there are digital micrometers on EVERY workstation along the way where the dice are measured for both size and shape.


Okay, he said that he took a trip to Midwest Game Supply in Kearny, Mo. Then in the above quote he said that the guys that said there were bad dice were checking the dice using cheap calipers to see if they were out of balance. Yet the truth of the matter is they were using a dice caliper from Midwest Game Supply!

So I want everybody to check out this link to Midwest Game Supply and it will show you how propaganda is used to sell their classes! First off the owner of the DI board that also sells his classes is writing that a dice the caliper is not to check the dice for weight imbalance.

In the links below it will show you that a dice caliper is used to check the dice for weight imbalance. That is the only purpose of a dice caliper and what the owner of the DI board is doing he is just spreading propaganda to sell taking a class, because if there were unbalanced dice out there why would you want to take a class on dice control?

http://midwestgamesupply.com/SKUs/Dice_Tools.htm

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x10b5qr_unbalanced-dice-part-1-bad-dice-in-las-vegas-casinos-must-see_news

The way that these guy that want to use propaganda to sell their classes get away with what they are doing is very simple, then just ban anybody that doesn't agree with what they are saying. Their DI board become a cult because the members can't ask a smart question about what they are selling without getting nothing but
propaganda!

So here is my question for you guys that go to these DI boards, do you think that you're getting the real story when you read anything on these boards?



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hanlon%27s_razor
aahigh.com
dicesitter
dicesitter
Joined: Jan 17, 2013
  • Threads: 32
  • Posts: 1157
August 7th, 2015 at 7:37:42 AM permalink
Doubleornothing



the real question on here is why after all the years that the game of craps has been
played, we are still talking about the math of the game, when every person with
any knowledge of the game attests that the game can not be beaten from a
math standpoint.

That being the case there is little reason for a person like Math to waste any of his time
doing or talking about something that is not possible.

Your throw and sets may not work for everyone one, they may not even work for
you many times, but they are, have been and will always be the only chance you
have to affect the house advantage.

One would wonder why people like math feel some one like me poses such a threat to the
ego of those that cant believe in anything other than the math which is proven a bad partner.

All the crap I and others take for our efforts is veiled in the constant cry of you have not shown enough
data, you have not shown the right data, you get tired after 40 rolls ( now that was a good one
by the way, I am heading to Colorado in 3 weeks to go elk hunting with a bow and I cant stand
for 40 rolls) , and what must be the best of all I am doing this to sell something....

The truth is we play each week and Math and others have no idea how we do, they just suggest
we are not winning for some reason.... I guess it makes them feel better.

Regardless of how anyone looks at the data, if you cant influence the dice, the math only wont make
you a winner, and I admit the effort it takes is not for people like Math and others that want instant
gratification... but for many it is fun and worth the effort.

Does anyone actually believe if some one did prove openly they could beat the game that it would be
the end of the nonsense.... of course not... then people like Math would start harping about the fact
that well that was just on one table... what about al the rest......laughing

No you don't work on your throw or sets to satisfy people like Math and others, it is to see what you
can do....to me nothing else matters.

dicesetter
Zcore13
Zcore13
Joined: Nov 30, 2009
  • Threads: 39
  • Posts: 3714
August 7th, 2015 at 10:13:51 AM permalink
Quote: dicesitter



Does anyone actually believe if some one did prove openly they could beat the game that it would be
the end of the nonsense....

dicesetter



Of course it would. The topic would no longer be IF anyone can influence the roll of dice enough to overcome the house edge. The topic would be how many can do it.

But you can't answer the second question when not one person in the history of Craps has shown that the first question is possible.


ZCore13
I am an employee of a Casino. Former Table Games Director,, current Pit Supervisor. All the personal opinions I post are my own and do not represent the opinions of the Casino or Tribe that I work for.
Ibeatyouraces
Ibeatyouraces
Joined: Jan 12, 2010
  • Threads: 68
  • Posts: 11933
August 7th, 2015 at 10:27:08 AM permalink
Quote: Zcore13

Of course it would. The topic would no longer be IF anyone can influence the roll of dice enough to overcome the house edge. The topic would be how many can do it.

But you can't answer the second question when not one person in the history of Craps has shown that the first question is possible.


ZCore13


Of course, Frank S. says there's proof...

http://www.bjinsider.com/newsletter_187_dice.shtml
DUHHIIIIIIIII HEARD THAT!
DoubleOrNothing
DoubleOrNothing
Joined: Jan 2, 2012
  • Threads: 0
  • Posts: 186
August 7th, 2015 at 4:49:21 PM permalink
Quote: dicesitter

Doubleornothing



the real question on here is why after all the years that the game of craps has been
played, we are still talking about the math of the game, when every person with
any knowledge of the game attests that the game can not be beaten from a
math standpoint.

That being the case there is little reason for a person like Math to waste any of his time
doing or talking about something that is not possible.

Your throw and sets may not work for everyone one, they may not even work for
you many times, but they are, have been and will always be the only chance you
have to affect the house advantage.

One would wonder why people like math feel some one like me poses such a threat to the
ego of those that cant believe in anything other than the math which is proven a bad partner.

All the crap I and others take for our efforts is veiled in the constant cry of you have not shown enough
data, you have not shown the right data, you get tired after 40 rolls ( now that was a good one
by the way, I am heading to Colorado in 3 weeks to go elk hunting with a bow and I cant stand
for 40 rolls) , and what must be the best of all I am doing this to sell something....

The truth is we play each week and Math and others have no idea how we do, they just suggest
we are not winning for some reason.... I guess it makes them feel better.

Regardless of how anyone looks at the data, if you cant influence the dice, the math only wont make
you a winner, and I admit the effort it takes is not for people like Math and others that want instant
gratification... but for many it is fun and worth the effort.

Does anyone actually believe if some one did prove openly they could beat the game that it would be
the end of the nonsense.... of course not... then people like Math would start harping about the fact
that well that was just on one table... what about al the rest......laughing

No you don't work on your throw or sets to satisfy people like Math and others, it is to see what you
can do....to me nothing else matters.

dicesetter


Ya, well, it's the game of life/death. You can't write it in an equation, or assign probabilities to it for risk/insurance purposes reclined in some ivory tower. Such a "forum" doesn't wax and wane while its various aspects are foolishly certified and decertified to suit specific strengths and weaknesses respectfully.

Expect the unexpected. It's not enough, nay, wrong to say that because this math leads to this conclusion, whichever, there can be no others. New ideas lead to different conclusions, and even to different fields of math.

Those who can, do; those who can't, teach. But, those who can do neither, write long-winded treatises. And, those who can do both, invent. The latter requires both understanding and knowledge in equal amounts. When a problem's solution won't let you off with just sledgehammer math, or just tedious fiddling. Especially, when it's its knowledge, itself, which must be understood.

In other words, when we limit ourselves to math we limit ourselves to the limitations of math. In particular, our own mathematical limitations. Similarly, a physics which doesn't already speak of the end of physics all along can have no end. The persons who need to rethink such intractable problems aren't the physicists.
I can't believe what I believe.
MathExtremist
MathExtremist
Joined: Aug 31, 2010
  • Threads: 88
  • Posts: 6526
August 7th, 2015 at 5:44:41 PM permalink
Seriously, what chatbot software are you using? Was it a Loebner Prize winner?
"In my own case, when it seemed to me after a long illness that death was close at hand, I found no little solace in playing constantly at dice." -- Girolamo Cardano, 1563
petroglyph
petroglyph
Joined: Jan 3, 2013
  • Threads: 19
  • Posts: 3360
August 7th, 2015 at 7:48:06 PM permalink
Quote: MathExtremist

Seriously, what chatbot software are you using? Was it a Loebner Prize winner?



If it's not human, is it still a violation if we insult it?

I run a test sometimes on automated calls to my home phone. One time I was calling what I thought was a robot all kinds of names until the guy on the other end said, "I'm not a robot", hilarious. I still did not want to buy anything from it.

For all I know, AI may have rights now and probably some support group? But maybe only if it's incorporated.
DoubleOrNothing
DoubleOrNothing
Joined: Jan 2, 2012
  • Threads: 0
  • Posts: 186
August 8th, 2015 at 11:32:51 AM permalink
Quote: MathExtremist

Seriously, what chatbot software are you using? Was it a Loebner Prize winner?


It's far better to not understand something, and be left to ponder it, then to "understand" cool gibberish, and waste your life or the forum's life (whichever comes first) on it.

Nothing about AP gambling math in practice has been proved out. It doesn't have even real theoretical value. It's pointless anymore to ask for proof of earnings, etc, because no one will attempt serious answers. "So many times I win, so many times I lose," big deal. Like hitting yourself over the head randomly for the drunken parents who still house you.

I don't know of any theories named ME's theory of so and so. Do you? Sometimes I wonder that pasting and copying old probability math to answer things not ask doesn't get really boring.
I can't believe what I believe.

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