Most negative craps dealer?

I tend to play at Mont Bleu in Lake Tahoe fairly frequently. In general, it's a fairly friendly staff, but they have one dealer that has to be one of the most negative people I've ever encountered. I remember a few months back he noticed that I would come in at least once a month (and in this instance it was my second trip in 3 weeks). He started pestering me on how much I was winning (guess he was surprised to see me so frequently and assumed I must be doing well because I made frequent trips). I just said "I do OK", but he wanted to know how much (and I just blew him off at that point). Anyway, I got down about $800 and then started to make a nice comeback. I noticed when I was just about all the way back to my original amount, he sighed when he had to pay off one of my come bets. It was like he was pissed that I had made the comeback and wanted to see me lose. That seemed pretty strange to me since he had nothing to gain by that and also would undoubtedly get a smaller tip (if even a tip at all), if I did lose. Then, over this past weekend, this was a sampling of his calls....

"6. 1, no fun, seven out" and "3,4, out the door, seven out"

And of course he always raised his voice when he was making the call to make sure everyone betting the pass line knew that they had lost. If was like he enjoyed seeing people lose. A very strange character.

When you make a point of eight you can say, "Six, two piss on you." Or how about "Five, five glad I don't work in a dive." " Six, three your mama lives in a tree." You get the idea. Just don't look at the dealer as you sing these jingles so he doesn't think you're talking about him.

Or you can take the more dignified approach and ask him, "Why don't you want me to win?"

Seriously, the moment someone gets on you you have to find out why they want the ride.

Some dealers truly have an US versus THEM attitude and think if you take the casino's money you are taking Their money. Many casinos encourage such attitudes but some employees develop them on their own.

Gambling is supposed to fun, there is supposed to be a decent chance of winning... some dealers do not really believe this.

Quote: Greasyjohn

When you make a point of eight you can say, "Six, two piss on you." Or how about "Five, five glad I don't work in a dive." " Six, three your mama lives in a tree." You get the idea. Just don't look at the dealer as you sing these jingles so he doesn't think you're talking about him.

Nice, LOL.

Quote: FleaStiff

Gambling is supposed to fun, there is supposed to be a decent chance of winning... some dealers do not really believe this.

Yeah, but fortunately in my experience that's sorta rare. I think dealers know that people often tip more when they win, and I would hope they would realize that actively rooting against them lowers those tips. I know there is tip-sharing and such, but every tip a dealer gets makes their own wage go up a bit.

I feel like most people that do this either are having a terrible day, hate their job, or hate their life period.

Thought of the most rational reason. Intentionally acting that way because he knows he shares tips and less players equals less work...

Had you been tipping?

Quote: tringlomane

Yeah, but fortunately in my experience that's sorta rare. I think dealers know that people often tip more when they win, and I would hope they would realize that actively rooting against them lowers those tips. I know there is tip-sharing and such, but every tip a dealer gets makes their own wage go up a bit.

I feel like most people that do this either are having a terrible day, hate their job, or hate their life period.

Thought of the most rational reason. Intentionally acting that way because he knows he shares tips and less players equals less work...

I was about to post the same thing. These people are not unique to gambling or casinos. Ignore them and don't let them ruin your time. Is there any peer pressure within a pit crew? I would think at least one of the dealers would tell him to knock it off.

Quote: 1BB

Is there any peer pressure within a pit crew? I would think at least one of the dealers would tell him to knock it off.

Yes, there is peer pressure both in the break room and at the table. Every Stick man has to avoid the temptation to run over a slow base dealer, every base dealer has to learn to watch his end of the table, every box man has to learn to keep the dealers in check so they don't run rampant with begging for tips but are allowed to encourage it taking place to some degree.

I do think that once a casino gets so empty that its on the "watch list" the employees get discouraged and realize even if everyone in the place was a massive tipper the casino is so empty that its hopeless, then there is an Us versus Them mentality that prevails.

There are two main skills required to be a dealer. The easier, more quantifiable skill is, of course, following the game procedures competently and efficiently. The other skill is developing a thick skin and an ability to not let other things and people get to you. This is a much more nebulous area.

I'm not excusing this dealer's behavior in any way-in fact, it sounds like he belongs in a different profession. But it also sounds like he's absorbed quite a bit of negativity from people over the years, both players and bosses. Imagine dealing all night to (with) a bunch of angry people, blaming you for their own choice to play a negative-expectation game, screaming at you for something you have absolutely no control over. Then during your break, the pit boss writes you up for failing to follow some little procedure or mispaying a hand that surveillance just happened to pick up. Is it easy to see how such a work environment might eventually get to some people?

The recent glut of casino openings in many states has meant many more available dealing jobs than there were before, meaning that there will be some people who just aren't cut out for it-just about anyone can learn the nuts-and-bolts, but the psyche is another matter.

More Negative Dealers: If I may mention blackjack dealers in this thread.

In blackjack dealers can intentionally throw the cards at your knuckles. During the deal I've had to keep my hands on the armrests to avoid injury. And some dealers will pitch the cards so you have to reach for them. I had a dealer at the IP in Vegas that was a real wise guy type. Hustling for tips. On a round my first up-card was an ace. When he came around to deal my second card it was a 10, and as he placed the card on my ace he says loudly and sarcastically, "Thank you." Like you owe me a tip. I felt uncomfortable with this guy and a round or two later I slid my chips toward him to color up and he says to me in a sarcastic tone, "What's the matter, win to much money?" I just politely said that no I was hungry and wanted to go eat. You could have held my hands over a fire and I wouldn't have tipped this guy.

Here's something you might try when you're playing blackjack and you have a dealer you don't like: After a win, slide a $5 chip over to the dealer. If he places it in the tip box say, "I wanted change." AND GET YOUR CHANGE. (Of course if he asks what you want say you want change.)

I once slid a $5 check to a dealer because I really did want change, and she put it in the tip box. So I told her that I wanted change and she just kinda sheepishly smiled and continued dealing. I could tell she wasn't trying to scam me, she was just embarrassed and hoped I'd just go away. So I told her a second time that I wanted change. Then a pit boss who had overheard the conversation told her to give me $5 from the tray.

Most negative player my ex wife !

Quote: Greasyjohn

When you make a point of eight you can say, "Six, two piss on you." Or how about "Five, five glad I don't work in a dive." " Six, three your mama lives in a tree." You get the idea. Just don't look at the dealer as you sing these jingles so he doesn't think you're talking about him.

Or you can take the more dignified approach and ask him, "Why don't you want me to win?"

Seriously, the moment someone gets on you you have to find out why they want the ride.

Hahahahha! I'm using these. Ok here's mine. Six,Four Your wife's a whore.

Quote: Greasyjohn

Here's something you might try when you're playing blackjack and you have a dealer you don't like: After a win, slide a $5 chip over to the dealer. If he places it in the tip box say, "I wanted change." AND GET YOUR CHANGE. (Of course if he asks what you want say you want change.)

I once slid a $5 check to a dealer because I really did want change, and she put it in the tip box. So I told her that I wanted change and she just kinda sheepishly smiled and continued dealing. I could tell she wasn't trying to scam me, she was just embarrassed and hoped I'd just go away. So I told her a second time that I wanted change. Then a pit boss who had overheard the conversation told her to give me $5 from the tray.

This is why I always ask if they want change when they send me a nickel or more even if I'm 90% sure it's a tip. To me, it's change until proven a tip. Besides, even if they want change, there's a chance they will be betting the smaller amounts for me.

In craps, players are a lot more explicit with what's for the dealers, since it's a more verbal game. In that case, there's usually no question. That said, I used to work with a female dealer who was a complete sourpuss. She signed the early out constantly and probably worked 15-10 hours a week, never smiled, and even flashed dirty looks as I cracked a joke or tried to assist with moving a blocked die.

Of course, the casino got so desperate for supervisors that she applied - and got it. And changed her tune. (Temporarily, from what I hear - she didn't last.)

Quote: FleaStiff

Some dealers truly have an US versus THEM attitude and think if you take the casino's money you are taking Their money. Many casinos encourage such attitudes but some employees develop them on their own.

Gambling is supposed to fun, there is supposed to be a decent chance of winning... some dealers do not really believe this.

EXACTLY FleaStiff!

I have just encountered a negative Craps dealer over at Cosmo on the day shift that leaves at 9 PM. I would list his name, but Las Vegas Cosmopolitan dealers and Pit Bosses do not wear name tags. He has a small gotee, short haircut. He wishes for a 7-out on every roll and prefers an empty table so that he does not have to work. When asked why not cheer for customers so that he could get tipped if they win also, he said he does not want any stinking $1 tips.

Also, Craps dealer John at Bellagio is a very discriminating superficial dealer. John is a smaller, shaved head dealer that works the day shift noon to 8. John pretends to be nice on the surface, however is rude to $10 players and nice to black chip bettors only. He will do things at the table like wave his hands in front of the dice as you toss them or push the dice back to you with the 7s showing on the side continuously if you are a $10 player, but not to black chip players.

This Link provides a list of Dealers that are not so friendly:

Link to Good and Bad Craps Dealers

I'm glad my casino is in such a small little podunk town that nobody cares to put us on a list of bad dealers...chances are a few of us would end up on it, whether due to attitude or ineptitude (not saying I'm any better in that regard).

Best craps experience I had on my last Vegas trip was the Golden Gate. I was wearing a piano-related shirt (since I play piano) and as soon as I approached the table the boxman's eyes lit up. "I'm a musician too!" he exclaimed. There were only 1 or 2 other players on the table the whole time so we struck up a great conversation about our favorite bands and genres. I hit a few numbers and ended up winning about $100 or so. As I was about to leave he actually came over to the cashier's cage and gave me his band's Youtube page name, which I admit is pretty blatant self-promotion, but the fact that he was so positive and enthusiastic about both his day job and his sideline was a great vibe. I didn't get his name, unfortunately, but he's on day shift and looks kind of like John Lithgow.

Worst dealers I had were at the Riviera, where the stickwoman actually yelled at the poor base dealer when the base got confused as to which hardways to pay.

Quote: Bohemian

This Link provides a list of Dealers that are not so friendly:

Link to Good and Bad Craps Dealers

Interesting someone takes the time to make that site.

One thing to remember about craps, and I tell this to people I teach when I am dealing a party, is that craps is both a "manly" game and has a certain amount of "street" to it. By this I mean the players accept and even expect a certain amount of ball-breaking from the crew. The problem is I estimate that maybe 1 in 10 people have the people skills to know where the line is and play to the crowd. 4 in 10 are simply sheep who can follow procedure but have no judgment skills and should not be allowed to deal craps but will be great on most other games. The other 50% just won't cut craps for various other reasons.

Ditto to the thick skin comment, and it must be thickest for craps. It is probably the only bastion in the casino where dealers can use any kind of personal judgment at all, even though they have multiple procedures to follow.

My advice is to either find another table, life is too short.

Burnt out and incompetent craps dealers are an embarrassment to the industry and to the other members of their particular crew. I deal dice and have dealt dice for 3 decades and I'm here to tell you that that if a craps dealer has the notion that his personal agenda is in sync with the House philosophy that dealer is a deluded fool or he's a victim of corporate brain washing. Yes, management does give us a spot to work our trade, and they pay us an absolutely insulting wage while on the job. For this we make damn sure the game is "on the square" and the game is protected and secure. We do this, that's sort of the deal. But its been my experience that the dice crews are MUCH better off being positive and helpful towards the players. There is nothing more miserable than working a full shift fighting with a bunch of players whom you have an adversarial relationship with. It makes no sense to me why management would keep a dealer on a crew where he's costing the house revenue through lost play due to pissed off players. Good, solid dealers who can connect with players cause repeat business and this is good for the economic health of the house, it causes a lot less stress for the employees and the players seem to enjoy themselves more. Win-win, right? Anyway, I'm sorry you guys have run into these miserable pricks while playing Craps and ask that you not judge us all as you would them.