First Post, Looking for "Simple" WinCraps script
I created an Excel spreadsheet that does this and would like to compare my results to WinCraps.
I'm looking for what seems to me a very simple script:
Bankroll = $200
Don't Pass = $10
Odds 6/8 = $36 - returns 5/6 or $30
Odds 5/9 & 4/10 = $60 - returns 2/3 or $40 on 5/6 and 1/2 or $30 on 4/10.
That's it. No progression, no giving up after the shooter beats you some set number of times, just bet & roll.
If somebody wanted to get really fancy...
If bankroll gets to $1000, double all bets.
On a win, collect all and bet again.
On a loss, bet again.
It might be nice to note how many rolls it takes to bust or double your money.
I'd be curious about results after 1K rolls, 10K rolls, 1M rolls, etc.
Great forum here, I've seen some interesting & thought provoking stuff in the last few days.
Quote: TerribleTomI've been searching for a while and not found what I seek so I finally signed up so I could ask you all for help.
I created an Excel spreadsheet that does this and would like to compare my results to WinCraps.
I'm looking for what seems to me a very simple script:
Bankroll = $200
Don't Pass = $10
Odds 6/8 = $36 - returns 5/6 or $30
Odds 5/9 & 4/10 = $60 - returns 2/3 or $40 on 5/6 and 1/2 or $30 on 4/10.
That's it. No progression, no giving up after the shooter beats you some set number of times, just bet & roll.
If somebody wanted to get really fancy...
If bankroll gets to $1000, double all bets.
On a win, collect all and bet again.
On a loss, bet again.
It might be nice to note how many rolls it takes to bust or double your money.
I'd be curious about results after 1K rolls, 10K rolls, 1M rolls, etc.
Great forum here, I've seen some interesting & thought provoking stuff in the last few days.
Are you using Wincraps or Wincraps Pro?
Quote: CrapsGeniousAre you using Wincraps or Wincraps Pro?
Pro, though I would be happy with a script for either.
Quote: TerribleTomPro, though I would be happy with a script for either.
Welcome to the forum; interesting first post.
Are you using Wincraps or Wincraps Pro?
Game > Config > Bets
Odds 6/8 = $36 - returns 5/6 or $30 you are setting odds to lay x3
Odds 5/9 = $60 - returns 2/3 or $40 you are setting odds to lay x4
Odds 4/10 = $60 - returns 1/2 or $30 you are setting odds to lay x3
Under bankroll tab it may be better to start with 0 and then check "Allow Negative bankroll" to get the true results.
Action > Autoplay
Check Auto-Lay Full Odds
Auto-handle both winning and losing bets > Bet 10
Under Game > Config > Probabilities
unlock all cells and change the 7 to 4 or 5 and check mark "true probabilities"
There are way too many 7s in Wincraps. adjusting the probabilities gives for a more live table feel.
Quote: beachbumbabsWelcome to the forum; interesting first post.
Thanks. I just got started playing craps recently. A former co-worker of my wife is a former craps dealer and I read something about Don't Pass + Odds being the lowest house advantage out there so I tried it on a recent trip to Vegas.
I didn't spend a lot of money, and I had some sessions where I busted out fairly quickly - but I also had sessions where I more than tripled my money.
I'm a computer guy and a math guy at heart, and while I'm sure there is no betting system that will provide guaranteed results I'd like to think that by minimizing risk and maximizing reward that I can maximize my entertainment dollar at the craps table.
Quote: CrapsGenious
There are way too many 7s in Wincraps. adjusting the probabilities gives for a more live table feel.
wow.. tell the casinos to turn down the 7 magnet too?
Quote: CrapsGeniousin the mean time try this:
Are you using Wincraps or Wincraps Pro?
Game > Config > Bets
Odds 6/8 = $36 - returns 5/6 or $30 you are setting odds to lay x3
Odds 5/9 = $60 - returns 2/3 or $40 you are setting odds to lay x4
Odds 4/10 = $60 - returns 1/2 or $30 you are setting odds to lay x3
Under bankroll tab it may be better to start with 0 and then check "Allow Negative bankroll" to get the true results.
Action > Autoplay
Check Auto-Lay Full Odds
Auto-handle both winning and losing bets > Bet 10
Under Game > Config > Probabilities
unlock all cells and change the 7 to 4 or 5 and check mark "true probabilities"
There are way too many 7s in Wincraps. adjusting the probabilities gives for a more live table feel.
Thanks, those settings appear to work. Will a script allow me to just look at a report for a bunch of simulated rolls? Clicking the mouse for every roll is a PITA.
Too many 7s? Does WinCraps use its own random number generator or what?
Quote: TerribleTomThanks, those settings appear to work. Will a script allow me to just look at a report for a bunch of simulated rolls? Clicking the mouse for every roll is a PITA.
Too many 7s? Does WinCraps use its own random number generator or what?
yes creating and autobet script will give you what your looking for in sessions / game history.
It's just very weird to see 8 roll 3 times in a row many times over or point 7 5 numbers in a row. Sometimes adjusting the dice probabilities to adjust to the opposite of what you play will give you a "Does this system hold water approach" for example:
My wife and I play 6/8 for $12.00 (She plays the 8, i play the 6) for our craps entertainment.
After 1 win drop $4.00 to make the 6 or 8 look like $30.
After another win, get 1.00 change and tell dealer to place all the numbers for $64 across.
If I wanted to test this in wincraps I would adjust the 6 and 8 in the probabilities tab and set the 6/8 to 4 instead of 5 and then leave the other numbers including the 7 untouched.
This allows win craps to run many simulations with a negative result. I then compare it for real table feel Dice influencers know how to avoid the 7 by at least 25% of the time so I change the 7 in probabilities to 4 instead of 6 leaving the 6/8 set also at 4. (This gives me a much better outcome comparable to live table.
Playing the dark side is the same by adjusting the 7 to a lower number and 6/8 to a higher number (Example: in probabilities change the 7 to 4 and 6/8 to 6.
In my experience at the craps table, I do notice quite a few shooters will roll 2 points before a 7 even though some shooters roll 15-20 numbers many are repeated.
if you notice your wincraps settings allow for the average shooter to make 3 to 4 points then adjust the probabilities till you start to see an average of 2 points made before a 7-out is made. (keep in mind adjusting these probabilities does not mean that you will stop seeing Point-7outs, they still happen)
Those settings are important as they lower the number of lines needed in an auto-bet file and they can be changed very quickly.Quote: TerribleTomThanks, those settings appear to work. Will a script allow me to just look at a report for a bunch of simulated rolls? Clicking the mouse for every roll is a PITA.
Too many 7s? Does WinCraps use its own random number generator or what?
a script allows one to run in hyper-drive to run high speed simulations where the game data can be seen in the games log file window in WCClassic
I use it the most
also in auto-play the right side is where to have the program just auto-roll the dice
It is a very cool feature that is NOT in Pro
check it out
Here is the code I setup and ran 11,000 sessions
$200 bankroll, sessions ends when DPass is less than $10 or bankroll is $400 or more
you can set this up in Classic and open it in Pro and Pro will convert it, but there will be issues with running a new session
I might look at that tomorrow after dinner and dancing tonight
When . . .
Initializing Auto-Bet
then . . .
Set Auto-Lay Full Odds to True
Set Auto-Handle Winning Bets to "Take Bet and Winnings"
Bet $ 10 on Don't Pass
Go to "end"
While . . .
Next roll is NOT a come-out roll
then . . .
Go to "end"
While . . .
Next roll is a come-out roll
Bankroll is less than $ 1000
then . . .
Bet $ 10 on Don't Pass
Go to "check status"
While . . .
Next roll is a come-out roll
Bankroll is not less than $ 1000
then . . .
Bet $ 20 on Don't Pass
check status
While . . .
Don't Pass is less than $ 10
or while . . .
'set win goal to start new session
Bankroll is not less than $ 400
then . . .
Add $ 1 to Chip-Stack # 1
Reset table (preserve Chip-Stacks)
Bet $ 10 on Don't Pass
When . . .
Chip-Stack # 1 is equal to $ 10000
then . . .
Stop Auto-Rolling / Hyper-Drive
Bet $ 0 on all bets
end
it actually has a few of them
It is just fine for computer run simulations
I have seem way too many 7s at times too
or
just record actual dice rolls and enter them into WinCraps
easy money
got to run and dance
Sally
added:
I was just shown how to convert Classic auto-bet file to Pro
not that bad
I have not tested it but it looks ok
If
Initializing script
Then
AutoLay full odds = true :
AutoHandle Winning bets = "Take Bet and Winnings" :
Bet $10 on DontPass :
GoTo "end"
EndIf
If Next roll is NOT a comeout roll Then GoTo "end" EndIf
If
Next roll is a comeout roll And
Bankroll < $1000
Then
Bet $10 on DontPass :
GoTo "check status"
EndIf
If
Next roll is a comeout roll And
Bankroll >= $1000
Then
Bet $20 on DontPass
EndIf
: "check status" :
If Beginning new session Then Bet $10 on DontPass EndIf
If
DontPass is less than $10
Or
Bankroll is not less than $400 'set win goal to start new session
Then
Add $1 to CheckStack1 :
Start new session(preserve CheckStacks) :
EndIf
If
CheckStack1 is equal to $10000 'number of simulations to run in hyper-drive
Then
Stop AutoRolling / HyperDrive :
Bet $0 on all(bets)
EndIf
: "end" :
Quote: CrapsGeniousyes creating and autobet script will give you what your looking for in sessions / game history.
It's just very weird to see 8 roll 3 times in a row many times over or point 7 5 numbers in a row. Sometimes adjusting the dice probabilities to adjust to the opposite of what you play will give you a "Does this system hold water approach" for example:
My wife and I play 6/8 for $12.00 (She plays the 8, i play the 6) for our craps entertainment.
After 1 win drop $4.00 to make the 6 or 8 look like $30.
After another win, get 1.00 change and Tell dealer to place all the numbers for $64 across.
If I wanted to test this in wincraps I would adjust the 6 and 8 in the probabilities tab and set the 6/8 to 4 instead of 5 and then leave the other numbers including the 7 untouched.
This allows win craps to run many simulations with a negative result. I then compare it for real table feel Dice influencers know how to avoid the 7 by at least 25% of the time so I change the 7 in probabilities to 4 instead of 6 leaving the 6/8 set also at 4. (This gives me a much better outcome comparable to live table.
Playing the dark side is the same by adjusting the 7 to a lower number and 6/8 to a higher number (Example: in probabilities change the 7 to 4 and 6/8 to 6.
In my experience at the craps table, I do notice quite a few shooters will roll 2 points before a 7 even though some shooters roll 15-20 numbers many are repeated.
if you notice your wincraps settings allow for the average shooter to make 3 to 4 points then adjust the probabilities till you start to see an average of 2 points made before a 7-out is made. (keep in mind adjusting these probabilities does not mean that you will stop seeing Point-7outs, they still happen)
Gotcha. By adjusting the odds against your betting strategy you give yourself a "little bit of bad luck" kind of table.
I'll agree wholeheartedly that computerized random number generator and dice on a table are not the same.
For example:
Buy in with $200, bet $10 on DP, lay odds as mentioned in the OP (3X/4X/3X).
Double your money on Roll 52
Triple your money on Roll 105
Quadruple your money on Roll 158
Bust on Roll 1852
Maximum Bankroll $10872
10K rolls 10 more times...
----------------------------------
Bust on Roll 53
Double your money on Roll 17
Triple your money on Roll 41
Quadruple your money on Roll 212
Bust on Roll N/A
Maximum Bankroll $13552
Double your money on Roll 82
Triple your money on Roll 162
Quadruple your money on Roll 300
Bust on Roll NA
Maximum Bankroll $13586
Bust on Roll 123
Bust on Roll 22
Bust on Roll 13
Double your money on Roll 29
Triple your money on Roll 59
Quadruple your money on Roll 100
Bust on Roll N/A
Maximum Bankroll $14246
Double your money on Roll 39
Triple your money on Roll 207
Quadruple your money on Roll 435
Bust on Roll NA
Maximum Bankroll $12210
Double your money on Roll 48
Triple your money on Roll 63
Quadruple your money on Roll 86
Bust on Roll NA
Maximum Bankroll $11824
Bust on Roll 12
----------------------------------
Given results like that, I can't get to a craps table fast enough!
Set up the same variables in WinCraps and you bust out every time. Best I've seen on a $200 bankroll is $700-something, it certainly never gets anywhere near $10K.
To give you an idea of the apparently correct calculations from my spreadsheet:
Bet $10 - Roll 1 = 11 - Bankroll = $190
Bet $10 - Roll 2 = 6 - Lay Odds, Bankroll = $144
Roll 6 = 6 - Point Hit, Bankroll = $144
Bet $10 - Roll 7 = 10 - Lay Odds, Bankroll = $74
Roll 8 = 10 - Point Hit, Bankroll = $74
Bet $10 - Roll 9 = 5 - Lay Odds, Bankroll = $4
Roll 11 = 5, Point Hit, Bankroll = $4
Bust out on Roll 12 (Bankroll < $10)
This is a roll-by-roll detail of the final example of the 10 above.
Weird, eh?
ETA - I found my errors. I was paying out on a Come Out 12 instead of pushing, and collecting my DP bet twice when ever an Off roll hit 7. My results are much more realistic now.
you will bust out every time no matter the starting bankroll, sometimes it takes a long time but it will happen.Quote: TerribleTomSet up the same variables in WinCraps and you bust out every time. Best I've seen on a $200 bankroll is $700-something, it certainly never gets anywhere near $10K.
Nice you found your Excel errors
I have seen sims starting at $100 and $200 go well over $10k before eventual ruin
especially taking and laying 3X or higher odds.
It is the nature of the game to finally bust a bankroll when playing against a house edge.
I just ran 1000 sims of your method and here are the high bankrolls hit before ruin
11 sessions went over 10k and the highest was $59,819 just from a $200 starting bankroll.
I doubled your DPass from $10 to $20 once over $1k
over 469,000 rolls were required before the highest finally ruined.
25 sessions hit $5k or higher
71 hit $2k or higher
174 hit $1k or higher (this sounds right as I ran a 10k sim earlier on your method of play hit $1k over 18% of the simulated sessions)
The median highest bankroll before ruin was $370
that sounds about right
I also ran your system against the 35k Zumma dice rolls (real casino rolls)
the 28 sessions resulted in a highest bankroll of $4,284
7 sessions saw at least a $1k bankroll high before ruin
cool to get high from just $200
have fun!
Sally
Quote: mustangsallyyou will bust out every time no matter the starting bankroll, sometimes it takes a long time but it will happen.
Nice you found your Excel errors
I have seen sims starting at $100 and $200 go well over $10k before eventual ruin
especially taking and laying 3X or higher odds.
It is the nature of the game to finally bust a bankroll when playing against a house edge.
I just ran 1000 sims of your method and here are the high bankrolls hit before ruin
11 sessions went over 10k and the highest was $59,819 just from a $200 starting bankroll.
I doubled your DPass from $10 to $20 once over $1k
over 469,000 rolls were required before the highest finally ruined.
25 sessions hit $5k or higher
71 hit $2k or higher
174 hit $1k or higher (this sounds right as I ran a 10k sim earlier on your method of play hit $1k over 18% of the simulated sessions)
The median highest bankroll before ruin was $370
that sounds about right
I also ran your system against the 35k Zumma dice rolls (real casino rolls)
the 28 sessions resulted in a highest bankroll of $4,284
7 sessions saw at least a $1k bankroll high before ruin
cool to get high from just $200
have fun!
Sally
I just posted what i witnessed at casino tonight. Darkside shooter went down 20k after just 3 points were made from one shooter in just under 20 minutes. Darkside shooter eventually caught up after getting another 10k mark but man, what a grind. I would not recommend you trying this system of yours at a live casino, I've also ran many sims and my results are also not pleasant.
scrap your darkside idea and take your girlfriend to the movies instead.
After 1k rolls you will have $0.
After 10k rolls you will have $0.
After 100k or 1m rolls you will have $0.
Quote: RSDoesn't ANYONE going to mention the fact he's looking for 1000-1000000 rolls on a $200 BR but is betting about 1/4 of his br at a time? ???????
After 1k rolls you will have $0.
After 10k rolls you will have $0.
After 100k or 1m rolls you will have $0.
In practice, sometimes you'll have $0 after a dozen rolls.
And sometimes you'll have tripled your money in less than 100 rolls.
I realize that over the long run the house always wins.
betting 1/4 of the bankroll is betting BOLD. win big or go home. maybe more fun for him.Quote: RSDoesn't ANYONE going to mention the fact he's looking for 1000-1000000 rolls on a $200 BR but is betting about 1/4 of his br at a time? ???????
After 1k rolls you will have $0.
After 10k rolls you will have $0.
After 100k or 1m rolls you will have $0.
HE should be able to get that data or any other data (using Excel and WinCraps)
himself and wonder why you posted your last 3 statements.
The first 2 are 100% incorrect.
After 1k rolls you will have $0. <<<<<< "WRONG"
After 10k rolls you will have $0. <<<<<< "WRONG"
unless you have some data showing they are 100% correct.
The part statement about 100k rolls is also 100% incorrect.
After 100k ... rolls you will have $0. <<<<<< "WRONG"
the 1 million roll part may be 100% correct. waiting on the sim to finish
I only found 100k players to do this for a max 1 million rolls
Bankroll was busted . . = 100.000% of the time ( 100000)
Bankroll decreased . . = 100.000% of the time
Bankroll increased . . = 0.000% of the time
simulating dice rolls and actual casino dice rolls (I keep these to myself)
here are my results
for 1000 dice rolls and still going...
Bankroll was busted . . = 31.421% of the time ( 314206)
Bankroll decreased . . = 60.778% of the time
Bankroll increased . . = 37.111% of the time
for 10k dice rolls and still going...
Bankroll was busted . . = 87.630% of the time ( 87630)
Bankroll decreased . . = 89.184% of the time
Bankroll increased . . = 10.687% of the time <<<<< Yahoo!
for 100k dice rolls and a lucky 114 out of 100k players (skilled) few are STILL going...
and some are STILL winning!
winning IS fun!
Bankroll was busted . . = 99.886% of the time ( 99886)
Bankroll decreased . . = 99.893% of the time
Bankroll increased . . = 0.106% of the time <<<<< Yahoo! Jackpot!
nice try <<<<<< "WRONG"
Sally
Quote: CrapsGeniousI just posted what i witnessed at casino tonight. Darkside shooter went down 20k after just 3 points were made from one shooter in just under 20 minutes. Darkside shooter eventually caught up after getting another 10k mark but man, what a grind. I would not recommend you trying this system of yours at a live casino, I've also ran many sims and my results are also not pleasant.
scrap your darkside idea and take your girlfriend to the movies instead.
Show me a Sim that's not unpleasant in the end and we'll talk.
I'm just looking for a good time, not to replace my day job with the craps table.
It can happen fast or extend over thousands of rolls, a simple $200 buy-inQuote: TerribleTomIn practice, sometimes you'll have $0 after a dozen rolls.
And sometimes you'll have tripled your money in less than 100 rolls.
I realize that over the long run the house always wins.
all because of the odds bet
adds a lot of variance.
expecting wild bankroll swings ahead
have no fear
have fun
Sally
Quote: soxfanYears ago I tested a don't pass style against wincraps and it showed a decent profit after 500k rolls. I never played it live, and I never thought wincraps to be an accurate representation of a real dice game. Besides, why test against some ridiculous amount of rolls that a cat will never live long enough to see, hey hey?
Some truth here. Who's got the endurance to play 1000 rolls in a session?
Sims are fun math experiments and not much else.
everyone gets to play in only one session. It lasts a lifetime.Quote: TerribleTomSome truth here. Who's got the endurance to play 1000 rolls in a session?
Sims are fun math experiments and not much else.
most press the pause button and resume play at a later time.
Why?
at Craps each bet is an independent event just as each dice roll is.
Play 200 rolls today, and tomorrow and 600 rolls in two weeks, you have 1000 rolls
do that for the next 10 months and now you have 10,000 rolls.
large simulations make for more accurate results with a small error
smaller trial simulations make for larger errors
I just flipped a quarter 10 times and I got 6 heads
This coin produces 60% heads
no need to do any more flips. 60/40
wanna bet?
funny stuff
Sally
Quote: RSDoesn't ANYONE going to mention the fact he's looking for 1000-1000000 rolls on a $200 BR but is betting about 1/4 of his br at a time? ???????
After 1k rolls you will have $0.
After 10k rolls you will have $0.
After 100k or 1m rolls you will have $0.
Right now I have a WinCraps sim running where I started with $100, betting $5 + 3/4/3 Odds as described in the OP.
It's approaching 2500 rolls, over 265 completed turns, with a high bankroll of $930 and an average bankroll of 213.
And let's be honest, we're betting over 1/3 of the opening bankroll here.
She is red headed, afraid of nothing and a real con artist ( Must get that from Josie's side of the family, don't you think? ).
Anyway class was trying to define infinite or infinity.
Kids were talking about infinite hotel, infinite guests, infinite number of seats on a bus, etc. Not taking credit, just something I read somewhere a long time ago.
Mary Jo said " My popa says if you have an infinite number of monkeys and an infinite number of teletypewriters, one of the monkeys will type the complete works of William Shakespeare. "
Of course she told me this as she was borrowing $1500 from the Bank Of Popa, but I am giving her the benefit of the doubt, that it really happened !
Quote: TerribleTomRight now I have a WinCraps sim running where I started with $100, betting $5 + 3/4/3 Odds as described in the OP.
It's approaching 2500 rolls, over 265 completed turns, with a high bankroll of $930 and an average bankroll of 213.
And let's be honest, we're betting over 1/3 of the opening bankroll here.
Like I had mentioned earlier, open config > Probabilities and set the 7 to 4 or 5 as that wincraps program runs too many sevens.
