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RaleighCraps
RaleighCraps
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July 13th, 2013 at 11:30:38 PM permalink
Quote: NokTang

I missed your AC story. Can you kindly put it here in short version? Thanks... as for Caesars Palace, I've always enjoyed playing craps there, especially in the main casino because the lighting is nice, the pit crew are well dressed, the dealers know how to deal, and while they hustle tips it's just part of making a living. I recall once winning apx $1000.usd in short order and the dealer asked me "how about the boys?" and so I bet $5.usd for them, on I think it was the hard ten. He said "no thanks" and actually moved the $5.usd chip to one of my own place bets. I colored up and whispered to him "fuck off dickhead" and went to the cage.



I apologize to our NJ forum readers in advance....

I grew up in northeastern PA, and we would get a quite a few people from Jersey who would come and summer vacation in the area. As a general rule, you could spot them from a mile away, as they were generally loud, obnoxious, and mostly seemed rude. (I have since decided that this is just the way everyone is there, so they don't realize what they are doing.) And now that I live in Raleigh, I can still spot people from Jersey and Long Island almost every time.

So the first part of the story is a dislike for the attitudes that are considered 'normal' in AC.

1997, took a junket trip to AC, playing craps at a $5 table around 6:30 AM. Two $10 tables with no action, one $5 with a crowd. Shooter gets on a roll, and they decide to add chips to the bank. But instead of doing it on the side, they plunk all the chips down in the middle, and stop the game. After a long break, shooter starts up again, and is still throwing numbers. Pit comes back and says table will raise to $10 when this point is resolved. (Again, two $10 tables are already empty). Shooter makes his point, and refuses to make a $10 PL bet. In fact, everyone refuses to play, and the game breaks up.
After 5 minutes Pit walks over to the table behind us, and lowers it to a $5 table.Something else happened as well that I don't remember, but I do know I got into a 'discussion' with the pit who just had an enormous amount of arrogance and rudeness. I finally told him he was the biggest pompous ass I had ever seen and I would never spend another dime in that casino.
We then went down to the Tropicana, and I didn't know Vegas and AC were not linked, so I gave the dealer my Tropicana card from Vegas. Instead of simply telling me the card wasn't valid in AC, the dealer went out of his way to berate me, and made it clear that AC was not Vegas. It was definitely a strong case of belittling a customer. I shrugged it off, as it was exactly what I had come to expect in AC.
A bit later in the game, the point was a 6, so I added $5 to my $10 PL bet, so that I could bump my odds to $100 ($15 bets got treated like $25). The dealer jumped into my shit something fierce. Accused me of cheating, past posting, you name it. I could not figure out what he was ranting about. Turns out, I was not allowed to add to the PL bet. I had never heard of such a rule before. As I tried to apologize for an honest mistake, I mentioned that I do this all the time in Vegas and it was not an issue. That bought me another 5 minute rant about how I was not in Vegas. That ended with me agreeing I was not in Vegas, and then asking him if his brother was a pit at the other casino. He looks at me and I said, "such a coincidence that earlier I had met the biggest asshole in AC, and now I had just met the second biggest asshole in AC. I just figured you two must have been related." I colored up, and vowed I would never return to AC.

Borgata almost got me to renege on that vow. I was very close to going, but then I found Beau Rivage in Biloxi and that has been a very nice place to stay and play. The staff is nice and the one or two bad eggs aren't really all that bad.

I told the junket owner that I wanted my name removed from any AC communications. I do not want to be called for any trips there. I thought I would get some questions, but instead she said, "I understand. We have 3 or 4 others who say the same thing. One guy gets absolutely furious if we forget and call him about AC."

As I said, not really fair to cast a dark shadow on any of our NJ readers, as I am sure there are some fine people in NJ. Just very few that I have ever met.
Always borrow money from a pessimist; They don't expect to get paid back ! Be yourself and speak your thoughts. Those who matter won't mind, and those that mind, don't matter!
NokTang
NokTang
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July 14th, 2013 at 12:53:26 AM permalink
Quote: RaleighCraps


As I said, not really fair to cast a dark shadow on any of our NJ readers, as I am sure there are some fine people in NJ. Just very few that I have ever met.



It was a rough place during my junket days as well. I did befriend one bus driver when I asked him about the area surrounding the casino's as we were on the way to Caesars from the airport. He said to me "you look like you can take care of yourself, what's the problem?"? Implication being and point he was making is everyone is in a getto mode/mood as are the casino's. It looks like shit, it is shit, you are in shit, get used to dealing with shit.
FleaStiff
FleaStiff
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July 14th, 2013 at 1:08:00 AM permalink
That is what is known as sweating the money. I can understand that if a fill is scheduled the do it when the cart comes out they sure ain't gonna leave the cart there and wait. Now scheduling a fill intentionally to break up a game... wow! And "this table is ten to get rid of all of you winners" is actually hilarious even though I'm sure you didn't think so at the time.

Remember, dealers can make erroneous assumptions about knowledge level and experience of the players, but dealers should at all times be courteous. My companion just took naturally to capping her pass line bets. She didn't know what she was doing. It was her very first time at a craps table ever. (Does that make me a good or a bad teacher)?

Biloxi is generally laid back and shall I say "stately" at times. Even when I made a mistake of walking in that heat and humidity, one casino was very nice to me.

I think it is still true that AC gets a certain style of player, loud. Detroit gets a certain style of player too: Loud and LONG. Man they bet those prop bets ALL the time. And call out each one individually before they do the Chicken Dinner stuff.
AlanMendelson
AlanMendelson
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July 14th, 2013 at 1:33:50 AM permalink
Quote: Beardgoat

I never liked Caesars Palace for craps since they used to use the coins on the table instead of $1 chips. I hated hearing the clanking coins. I played there once and never went back. Do they still use coins?



Coins were eliminated a couple of years ago.
AlanMendelson
AlanMendelson
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July 14th, 2013 at 1:38:23 AM permalink
Quote: Boz

I am not sure why Alan thinks it could not have happened.



Look I am sorry you guys have had a bad experience there. I never have. Granted they have some new dealers but I've never had a bad experience there nor have I ever witnessed anyone having a bad experience there.

The only thing I once did witness is when an abusive player argued with a dealer over a late bet and the player took a swing at the dealer -- and within seconds plain clothes security (two of them) jumped up from seats at blackjack tables and tackled that player. (Yes, undercover security playing blackjack at Caesars.)
FleaStiff
FleaStiff
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July 14th, 2013 at 2:05:22 AM permalink
Quote: AlanMendelson

(Yes, undercover security playing blackjack at Caesars.)

No accidental coincidence I'm sure. Many Pit Bosses are aware of a player's escalating situation (booze, temper, losses, loud voice, argumentative nature) and plain clothes security types congregate nearby but the "Big Burleys" in uniform are only on stand by. Its in the interest of the casino to get any situation over with soon and get belligerent types away from the games.

Everyone knows that in almost any casino there will be times when the Box gives a green light to a soft hustle so that the tip income goes up a bit. Its not anything major and its not anything shameful, even in casinos with a hoity toity reputation, it happens. A good box man knows to turn the green light off too.

On Edit: Please Note that on edit I said "the Box gives a green light to a soft hustle...". A soft hustle has to be subtle and fairly brief, humorous without any hint of greedy oppression.
jkluv7
jkluv7
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July 27th, 2013 at 9:33:18 PM permalink
I would have picked up my $50 and left them with $15...

When making a PL bet for the dealers, I like putting eh $1 chip on top of the letter "P" and announcing "We got $1 on the ASS line for the dealers". They always crack up and the other players have a good chuckle.
Asswhoopermcdaddy
Asswhoopermcdaddy
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July 28th, 2013 at 7:27:09 AM permalink
I wouldn't give them a choice. You either drop the tip for the boys or you make a bet for them based on what you feel like. Either way, they should be happy to get either toke or action. The guy could have easily given the dealers 44 on the inside and a Horn High yo / acey-deucey.
KeyserSoze
KeyserSoze
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July 28th, 2013 at 10:25:46 AM permalink
Reading threads like this serve as a good reminder why I NEVER TIP DEALERS!

p.s. The posts by Ibeatyouraces are pretty good.
Talent hits a target no one else can hit; genius hits a target no one else can see.
ahiromu
ahiromu
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July 28th, 2013 at 12:55:13 PM permalink
I was in Caesar's AC as a low roller for the table and nobody was really tipping... I was throwing a couple of bucks around here and there. I could have sworn that the dealers were throwing their hands up while I was shooting, blocking my "target" by hovering their hands a few feet above the table for no apparent reason. Has anyone experienced something like this before?

It's only really happened once, rubbing me the wrong way, but I could have just been imagining the whole thing.
Its - Possessive; It's - "It is" / "It has"; There - Location; Their - Possessive; They're - "They are"
Ibeatyouraces
Ibeatyouraces
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July 28th, 2013 at 1:50:25 PM permalink
deleted
DUHHIIIIIIIII HEARD THAT!
Beethoven9th
Beethoven9th
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July 28th, 2013 at 3:20:39 PM permalink
Quote: ahiromu

It's only really happened once, rubbing me the wrong way, but I could have just been imagining the whole thing.


Nothing would surprise me with Caesars dealers.
Fighting BS one post at a time!
Mosca
Mosca
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July 28th, 2013 at 4:19:38 PM permalink
I reported on this forum, about 3.5 years ago, regarding Caesar's AC:

Quote:

The mood: not good, IMO. The reason I walked away from the craps table was that the dealer and stickman were talking about how the dealer had to give up her Saturday off, and this was the 3rd one in a row and she was going to miss her grand daughter's christening, and blah blah blah blah blah. You know what? I'm not unsympathetic, but so what. Life often sucks in little ways. Part of your job is to keep that crap in the break room and not talk about it in front of the customers. And the pit boss was standing watching the table the whole time. For me, it put a downer on the experience, I'm trying to win and this jerk is complaining the whole time. And then at the 4 card table; right after I sat down, the guy to my left got paid and said along the lines of, "You could gimme some reds y'know, I'm all greens here." And the dealer SNAPPED at him, "Hey, all you have to do is ask. I got this big rack of chips here, what are you complaining about? You're getting paid." And like I said, it was true; the guy was up a lot, and hitting hand after hand. And I know that they try to do that, to bump the guy's play up. But still, I was taken aback and wanted to walk right there; it was just plain rude and unfriendly.



We haven't been back to Caesar's since.
A falling knife has no handle.
allinriverking
allinriverking
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July 28th, 2013 at 6:39:07 PM permalink
Quote: AlanMendelson


The dealers saw that when a player got $1 chips, the player would add the $1 chips to the passline bet he had for the dealers. So let's say a bet paid $14 -- they'd give the play ONE red and 9 WHITES (the one dollar chips) knowing that the player would stack all 9 on their passline bet. Yes, the player was drunk and they took advantage of him. At one point the stack of chips on the dealer bet looked like the Empire State Building -- and the point hit and the dealers got paid.



We as dealers are trained if a players bets red for the crew, make sure they have plenty of red. If they bet white for the crew, make sure they have plenty of white. If there is a $1 side-bet on a game, make sure the player never runs out of white. If a player bets a lot of $1 side-bets, hardways or yo's every roll, make sure they have plenty of white.

The guy was drunk, so you feel they took advantage of him. If he was that drunk on my game, the red chips would of been bet for me; not the whites...
allinriverking
allinriverking
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July 28th, 2013 at 6:46:01 PM permalink
Quote: hwccdealer

Quote: Beethoven9th

I happened to be playing craps at Caesars the other night and saw some blatant dealer greed on display. Here's what happened.

There was a guy playing next to me, and he was doing pretty well especially on the prop bets. So much so that over the course of about an hour, he was betting for the dealers quite frequently. He must have bet at least $30 to $40 dollars for them, perhaps more. Anyway, at the end of his session he was about $800 ahead. He colored up, and what happened next is what I found so irritating. Right before he left the table, he generously put $50 on the felt and said to the dealer, "This is for you guys. Where do you want to bet it?"

The dealer thought for a second, looked at the guy's winnings in his hand, and said, "Drop 3 of those red chips right here," and pointed to the Come box right next to the $50 that the guy had already tipped them. The player looked a bit confused but did as he was told and gave the dealer $15 more [for a total of $65 instead of the original $50 tip]. The dealer then stated, "We're going to go $64 across for us with $1 on the Yo." (I thought to myself, "What a greedy old bastard!)

But justice was served because the dealers got one hit on the very next roll, but right after that the shooter threw a seven. (I laughed to myself)

This incident, of course, had absolutely no effect on me, but does anybody else hate seeing dealer behavior like this? I mean, basically helping himself to 3 more of the player's red chips seems a little outrageous to me, especially when the player had already tipped almost $100 for them on an $800 win.

What do you guys think?



If a player asks us want we want with a tip, we have to drop it... We all pull tips all dealers and split daily, we don't have the right to bet another dealers share..

I don't know what the laws about tips are in Vegas, but here in Ohio, the state actually bans us from hustling tips (it's OK; we get plenty of them anyway from winning players.) So if one of us tried that, we'd get fired and potentially in trouble with the Gaming Commission, and there's a chance we'd jeopardize the jobs of the rest of the crew, too.

We're also trained to be grateful and thank players immediately for dealer bets, tokes, etc. and I make sure to do that, even if a dealer bet loses (i.e. if a blackjack player bets for me but loses, I thank him/her as I collect the losing bet, or if players bet for us but the 7 rolls and it loses, we generally announce, "Thanks for the bets, folks," or something along those lines.) So to see something like what you described shocks my conscience as a dealer.

That said, if someone offered to bet $50 for us any way we wanted, I'd probably take a vote among the other dealers on the table. We all share tokes, so it's their money, too. Plus it's the closest thing to gambling that the state allows us to do anyway.

odiousgambit
odiousgambit
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July 30th, 2013 at 3:26:23 AM permalink
Quote: ahiromu

I could have sworn that the dealers were throwing their hands up while I was shooting, blocking my "target" by hovering their hands a few feet above the table for no apparent reason



Did they do this before you threw the dice? Maybe they were having a little joke amongst themselves. I would have just waited for that to cease and desist. Just who was holding up the game would have to be pretty clear.

If they tried to actually hit the dice while in the air ... well, surely not!
the next time Dame Fortune toys with your heart, your soul and your wallet, raise your glass and praise her thus: “Thanks for nothing, you cold-hearted, evil, damnable, nefarious, low-life, malicious monster from Hell!”   She is, after all, stone deaf. ... Arnold Snyder
AlanMendelson
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July 30th, 2013 at 9:40:33 PM permalink
I've seen stick men tilt the stick in towards the table while a shooter who was trying to control the shot was ready to shoot, as if to create an obstacle for a clear path. It wouldnt bother me. the chance of hitting the stick is pretty slim. And if you do hit the stick you only have a 1/6 chance of throwing a 7 anyway.
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