Blew out my bankroll

Well, as it turns out, I'm going to end up a loser this year. Starting with meeting with TeddyS, and after today meeting with Axiom, I have blown out and lost my entire bankroll. I'm pretty sure there's no hope to get that back plus the couple thousand I was behind so far this year. I turned to high risk higher dollar bets since meeting with Teddy, and then today with Axiom, my final hours blowing out my bankroll was losing my last $600 at a $100 Baccarat room with Axiom.

So far meeting up with others from this forum has not had good results at all for me. I've ended up betting bigger (which in and of itself isn't bad) but add to that the losing, and I just got wiped out.

I'll be taking a break from gambling for a while, and I may also have to stop meeting with people like Teddy and Axiom and others who have me betting more than I normally bet and changing my normal play locations and patterns that are more familiar to me.

I have been doing great in the stock market, and that is sometimes a trigger for me betting too big too. I tried to keep that in check, but I just went overboard on my bet sizes. My last losing bet was a $400 Baccarat bet on player. And I lost. Some Asian guy (with lots of "class") bet $405 just so he could touch the cards. I was totally out of my element, and it was a fitting end to what I was doing wrong: effectively things that I would normally never ever do if I were exercising more self control or if I were alone and gambling by myself -- the combination of being in an unfamiliar place and with people I don't know that well just isn't helping me at all.

So the good news is that without any money to gamble, I'm probably back to fiddling around with my toys at home. I have a couple of new cameras on the way, and I'll probably set up some computer stuff and do more physically productive things besides gambling. So I'm looking forward to that.

All my debts are paid and I have lots of toys to play with. So it's not a problem, but gambling at the casino is, for the first time in years, going to have to wait for a couple of weeks before I can continue doing that.

deleted

If I give up at craps, I will. When I used to compete in stunts, I first started off trying to do super slow first gear wheelies when everybody else was doing 2nd gear freeway wheelies. I was quickly "helped along" by the experienced guys at what was easier to do with better short term results. And it worked.

But if I had instead focused on what I already knew could be done, I could have been ahead of everyone who eventually started doing super slow circle wheelies. As a result, it took a couple extra years for that to catch on, and I ended up just being almost as good as the guys who taught me instead of being a real leader and showing how it should be done. I did become one of the top 2 or 3 guys to do very long (5 mile plus) freeway wheelies, but there were more than ten of those guys nationwide at the time and no big deal. I also did a 250 foot long distance endo before anybody else in my area had seen one, but a few months later and 900 feet was being done.

But I could have really pushed the slow stuff if I had stuck to my original plan and gone it alone more before following the "wisdom of the tribe."

And that's part of what I'm saying. Meeting with TeddyS and Axiom was interesting, but I think I am going to go back to my loner status for now. I want to stay away from outside influences a bit.

I hope my analogy makes sense. It's just that I'm on a track and I want to follow through and not just become a follower because it's easier.

"When you're not in the lead, the scenery never changes."

But yeah, I agree in the difficulty of the game I have chosen was not selected for ease of accomplishing my goal.

The other thing that might not be as obvious is that even if I accomplish my goal and win over a million dollars, I am still going to work for IGT and design and create stuff for them because I'm even more passionate about that stuff. I had a patent filed last week that I have been working on for a really long time, and it's by far the best idea I've had submitted to the patent office as sole inventor. It way beyond any amount of money could ever mean to me to have a chance to make that into something that turns into a product.

I am not motivated by the money at the end of the rainbow. I am motivated by my passionate desire to accomplish my personal goals.

I play about 2-3 hours per day, 5 days per week, 50 dollar antes. The first week was great. These past 2 weeks I have been getting absolutely killed. The whole time I'm screaming in my head "but I'M! supposed to have the advantage!!" This next week I am cutting my bets in half per the Kelly. Not a great feeling at all.

Yeah, taking a break sounds good. (For me, too). You don't want me to corrupt you any more ;)

Bankroll focus has been strong for me this year. The Wizard doesnt think much of it as a topic, pretty much just saying to quit when it isnt fun.

The thing is, you have to decide what it is, and nobody knows what it should be. It certainly is *not* what you can raise, that for most of us either means more than we should liquidate or, for when younger, not saving enough. And unless it is huge in comparison to what you might lose, you have to consider "slowing down" if you are on a losing streak.

Somehow I just recently came up with $10k as the right bankroll for me, based on arbitrary gut of comfort level. A bankroll for negative expectation has to have a replacement income; working on that now. I am using 2010 as my starting point and a losing streak has whittled away at the bankroll. Nonetheless I am much happier discarding my constantly worrying about losing X amount per year, a method that sucks.

Quote: Ahigh

Well, as it turns out, I'm going to end up a loser this year. Starting with meeting with TeddyS, and after today meeting with Axiom, I have blown out and lost my entire bankroll. I'm pretty sure there's no hope to get that back plus the couple thousand I was behind so far this year. I turned to high risk higher dollar bets since meeting with Teddy, and then today with Axiom, my final hours blowing out my bankroll was losing my last $600 at a $100 Baccarat room with Axiom.

So far meeting up with others from this forum has not had good results at all for me. I've ended up betting bigger (which in and of itself isn't bad) but add to that the losing, and I just got wiped out.

I'll be taking a break from gambling for a while, and I may also have to stop meeting with people like Teddy and Axiom and others who have me betting more than I normally bet and changing my normal play locations and patterns that are more familiar to me.

I have been doing great in the stock market, and that is sometimes a trigger for me betting too big too. I tried to keep that in check, but I just went overboard on my bet sizes. My last losing bet was a $400 Baccarat bet on player. And I lost. Some Asian guy (with lots of "class") bet $405 just so he could touch the cards. I was totally out of my element, and it was a fitting end to what I was doing wrong: effectively things that I would normally never ever do if I were exercising more self control or if I were alone and gambling by myself -- the combination of being in an unfamiliar place and with people I don't know that well just isn't helping me at all.

So the good news is that without any money to gamble, I'm probably back to fiddling around with my toys at home. I have a couple of new cameras on the way, and I'll probably set up some computer stuff and do more physically productive things besides gambling. So I'm looking forward to that.

All my debts are paid and I have lots of toys to play with. So it's not a problem, but gambling at the casino is, for the first time in years, going to have to wait for a couple of weeks before I can continue doing that.

Wow! The guy who says he knows more about the game than most people loses his bankroll and blames it on people that he just met. Teddys, get on the next flight to New Jersey. Revel needs you to save it.

" So far meeting up with others from this forum has not had good results at all for me."

I hope this does not mean you won't at least stop by from time to time to post info on your progress. And congrats on your patent !

Um, Ahigh, when you played with me (forum member), I am pretty sure you kept your bets at the low level you usually do. I think if you add up all of our 'sessions' you came out ahead, too. I was able to play with teddys and acesandeights and still keep my bets at the low level I always do. If you are saying you just won't be playing for a few weeks I think that is a very reasonable plan, then after the few weeks off you can assess how much (if at all!) you miss the actual playing of the game. Congrats on the patent...

Ahigh,
I admire that you had the sack to admit you lost your bankroll. Most people will not admit they fired their shot and missed; we only hear about the hits. I look forward to reading about your return to the tables.

Ahigh,

"My last losing bet was a $400 Baccarat bet on player."

i feel your pain. I've been there.
got tired of losing one particular session and lost discipline. said to hell w/it and Bet $100 Dont Pass/$600 odds instead of just walking away. LOST.
Luckily it was just the bankroll for that session.

Look on the bright side. You're sane enough to stop.
It Could be worse. You could be dipping into some bank acct that shouldnt be used for gambling and chasing losses the next week.

Quote: 1BB

Wow! The guy who says he knows more about the game than most people loses his bankroll and blames it on people that he just met. Teddys, get on the next flight to New Jersey. Revel needs you to save it.

I want to clarify that I don't blame TeddyS or Axiom for anything. And I'm 100% certain that they know that I don't hold them responsible for my losses. Your suggesting that I blame them isn't accurate.

I said very specifically "what I was doing wrong." Nobody coaxed me into betting and losing. I did it. I will admit that I wanted to win big, and I admit that I failed. Nobody's fault but own. I absolutely wanted to show off, and I failed. But I still had fun trying, and I wasn't angry or upset at all. Just moving on to other things now for a short time period.

You have to understand that I don't mind the break either. I've gambled nearly every single day I've been in Vegas for coming up on three years for an average of three hours a day. I gambled 8 hours yesterday, 16 hours the day before that, and 12 hours the day before that. I have absolutely no problem taking a break, and it has its own set of benefits.

My life is a very rich life that enjoy very much, too. I've got two wonderful kids that I take care of and a beautiful woman that I love very much who supports my passionate desire to pursue the game of craps. So does my employer and all of my friends and family. I'm not ashamed at all to admit what happened it's just part of the risk of what I do.

When I used to ride stunts, I had two really bad accidents. Only one of them was while doing a stunt, and I dislocated my shoulder (3 times after the accident) that was really painful. Those both cost more money than this mishap, and I was in the hospital and in great pain too. I fractured my sternum and broke three ribs in the more painful accident. Totalled my motorcycle (my fault no insurance). I admitted fault in that accident too. I was on the freeway and somebody almost hit me and I could have just been okay, but instead of just thinking "schweew!" I flipped them off and accelerated and went into an exit clover too fast and high sided. I flew up in the air about 5 feet and landed on the pavement travelling about 50mph. I told everyone what I did and that it was my fault then too. Everybody laughed at me and I deserved to made fun of for what I did, and it was funny. But like then, it wasn't the guy who almost hit me who was responsible for the accident. It was me. I was being a real prick just because they weren't paying attention, and I should have been more concerned about my own safety. I could have died if there were anything in my slide path I would have but I was lucky.

The moral of the story is that this is no big deal at all and that I am a very responsible person who makes mistakes and I own up to them when I make them.

Ahigh I’m sort of surprised by your bankroll demise.
Especially with all your saber-rattling and out-spoken verbal sparring with those who believe Dice Setting doesn’t work.

Unfortunately …. this type of story is very popular especially with Dice Setter’s getting together.
The philosophy of these hook-ups is to gain an advantage over the casino, but they often miss-fire.

Mistakes seem to be magnified, and ego’s get in the way of quitting when
we shoot like shit in a get-together. YES, it does happen to many of us Dice Setters.

Advantages are small, not huge, and anyone who portrays Dice Setting as a honey-pot, done on demand, needs to be realistic.

I suspect you will be back, the road to success is determination, dedication, and desire, which seems to suit your nature. Hopefully with a different attitude on peer recognition and more-on success based on your own standards.

Losing at times is part of any game …. which makes us work harder to minimize, while increasing the winning aspect.

Your conclusion … step back, examine the mistakes, take responsibility, and make changes …. should equal a speedy recovery.

Quote: Ahigh

I want to clarify that I don't blame TeddyS or Axiom for anything. And I'm 100% certain that they know that I don't hold them responsible for my losses. Your suggesting that I blame them isn't accurate.

As you've mentioned, when gambling with others vs. gambling alone, I too, find outcomes to be different when I change my usual way of doing things. It's generally for the worse, although when I really go on tilt, it's when playing alone.

Quote: Ahigh

You have to understand that I don't mind the break either. I've gambled nearly every single day I've been in Vegas for coming up on three years for an average of three hours a day. I gambled 8 hours yesterday, 16 hours the day before that, and 12 hours the day before that. I have absolutely no problem taking a break, and it has its own set of benefits.

Frankly this to me is incredible! As one who certainly enjoys to play, I couldn't imagine keeping this sort of schedule unless I was a professional with an edge, doing it as a job and not expecting any enjoyment out of it. Don't take me in the wrong way, I'm not being judgmental, just surprised- and surprised you lasted that long with that type of bankroll, unless the recent type of play was truly out of the ordinary.

I'll end up having to pay the tax man this year because of my winnings. I wonder if it has anything to do with not meeting up with any forum members, Hmmm... :)

I will be around after the 1st of the year to collect the forum TAX. And we do not take checks.

Quote: TheBigPaybak

As you've mentioned, when gambling with others vs. gambling alone, I too, find outcomes to be different when I change my usual way of doing things. It's generally for the worse, although when I really go on tilt, it's when playing alone.

Frankly this to me is incredible! As one who certainly enjoys to play, I couldn't imagine keeping this sort of schedule unless I was a professional with an edge, doing it as a job and not expecting any enjoyment out of it. Don't take me in the wrong way, I'm not being judgmental, just surprised- and surprised you lasted that long with that type of bankroll, unless the recent type of play was truly out of the ordinary.

Yeah, I was planning on not playing yesterday, but I played 16 hours again. I went from $50 to $380 near the end of my session, but I had an overall losing session. I may go back again today and try to use more discipline, but the losses continue...

You are correct, if you stopped betting on random shooters, you'd be betting less, so your actual expected loss would be lower. Of course, 99% of people will tell you that all shooters are random :)

Quote: Ahigh

I've gambled nearly every single day I've been in Vegas for coming up on three years for an average of three hours a day. I gambled 8 hours yesterday, 16 hours the day before that, and 12 hours the day before that...I've got two wonderful kids that I take care of and a beautiful woman that I love very much who supports my passionate desire to pursue the game of craps. So does my employer and all of my friends and family...The moral of the story is that this is no big deal at all...

Nice trick if you can pull it off.

Yeah. Thanks.

Hey Ahigh,

The thing to remember about meeting up with out-of-towners like me is that we don't gamble as much as you do :) I only play for a few days every month or so. I have winning weekends and losing weekends, but, of course, I lose in the long term. If I gambled every day I could never afford to play at the same limits as I do now. I'd probably have reduce my bet sizes by a factor of 5 or so.

As for craps shooting, I'm still pretty skeptical, although I now do believe that you can make "controlled" shots if you're in a place where you don't get heat for the dice going all the way down. Your ability to toss the dice into the corner and have one of them "stick" the way you set it while the other bounces to the wall is pretty good. I'm still not convinced that anything that hits the back wall is anything other than random, though.

Anyway, it was good meeting you, and I hope you are back in the game soon!

There is no such thing as having any advantage at Baccarat using any legal means unless you run into some weird aberration like those guys at Golden Nugget did. If you are "in it to win it", why are you messing with that game? Blowing out the tailend of a decimated bankroll at a Baccarat table just doesn't sound like logical thought to me.

I know a guy who is a talented blackjack player that also plays Baccarat and Craps. If not for his Baccarat and Craps action, he would be turning a slight profit or at least not losing but... He can't stay away from the Craps tables and loves to play Baccarat! He uses no dice control methods though and uses the official "drunken monkey" method of tossing the dice, so he is clearly a "thrill gambler" in which the psychological fulfillment of the act of gambling itself outweighs the financial considerations. I'm not saying that you fit this particular profile but there is just no such thing as (legal) AP Baccarat.

I'm on the fence on this dice control thing. I read "Wong on dice", got a set of dice and practiced a few thousand tosses or so... but I've never actually played Craps in a casino. That's because of my reluctance to do any frivolous gambling that I have no potential for a clear advantage. I play blackjack and poker exclusively because it's what I know, it's the tried and proven and all that. Maybe after 20,000 more practice throws using the dice control methods I have read about I will be ready to bet my first dollar at it but until then... no dice!hahahaa You will never see me at a Baccarat table under any circumstances either.

I've had another very good year. I think I can attribute that to exercising caution, not doing any "frivolous" gambling and having a bankroll that allows for a near zero ROR. Maybe you should listen to that guy talking about trying a little blackjack and poker? At the very least maybe stay focused on the Craps if you are any good at this dice control thing and stay away from Baccarat? I hope it swings around and you do better.

Quote: IvanYerkanoff

I know a guy who is a talented blackjack player that also plays Baccarat and Craps. If not for his Baccarat and Craps action, he would be turning a slight profit or at least not losing but... He can't stay away from the Craps tables and loves to play Baccarat! He uses no dice control methods though and uses the official "drunken monkey" method of tossing the dice, so he is clearly a "thrill gambler" in which the psychological fulfillment of the act of gambling itself outweighs the financial considerations.

Hey, I didn't know we knew each other!

Jokes, jokes, as I don't really like Baccarat all that much. But the above is a pretty good description for me with respect to blackjack/craps.

Quote: IvanYerkanoff

I know a guy who is a talented blackjack player that also plays Baccarat and Craps. If not for his Baccarat and Craps action, he would be turning a slight profit or at least not losing but... He can't stay away from the Craps tables and loves to play Baccarat!

If you had started out with poker, instead of blackjack player...I'd swear you were talking about TJ! lol

Quote: IvanYerkanoff

There is no such thing as having any advantage at Baccarat using any legal means unless you run into some weird aberration like those guys at Golden Nugget did. If you are "in it to win it", why are you messing with that game? Blowing out the tailend of a decimated bankroll at a Baccarat table just doesn't sound like logical thought to me.

I know a guy who is a talented blackjack player that also plays Baccarat and Craps. If not for his Baccarat and Craps action, he would be turning a slight profit or at least not losing but... He can't stay away from the Craps tables and loves to play Baccarat! He uses no dice control methods though and uses the official "drunken monkey" method of tossing the dice, so he is clearly a "thrill gambler" in which the psychological fulfillment of the act of gambling itself outweighs the financial considerations. I'm not saying that you fit this particular profile but there is just no such thing as (legal) AP Baccarat.

I'm on the fence on this dice control thing. I read "Wong on dice", got a set of dice and practiced a few thousand tosses or so... but I've never actually played Craps in a casino. That's because of my reluctance to do any frivolous gambling that I have no potential for a clear advantage. I play blackjack and poker exclusively because it's what I know, it's the tried and proven and all that. Maybe after 20,000 more practice throws using the dice control methods I have read about I will be ready to bet my first dollar at it but until then... no dice!hahahaa You will never see me at a Baccarat table under any circumstances either.

I've had another very good year. I think I can attribute that to exercising caution, not doing any "frivolous" gambling and having a bankroll that allows for a near zero ROR. Maybe you should listen to that guy talking about trying a little blackjack and poker? At the very least maybe stay focused on the Craps if you are any good at this dice control thing and stay away from Baccarat? I hope it swings around and you do better.

I made 7 Baccarat bets, and I won one of them.

<wait 30 minutes> $100 Banker lose, $100 Banker tie, $100 Player win, <wait 15 minutes> $100 Player tie, $100 Player lose, $100 Player lose, $400 Player lose.

This was the very first time I played Baccarat ever. I am absolutely not a Baccarat player. LOL.

A friend of mine recently won $37,000 in that very room, and I would have liked to have won more just so I could brag to him about it. But don't think that I don't like to do high stakes gambling besides my hobby of throwing dice. I'm doing fine overall, as well, even with these losses, I'm doing fantastic still.

Quote: AxiomOfChoice

Hey Ahigh,

The thing to remember about meeting up with out-of-towners like me is that we don't gamble as much as you do :) I only play for a few days every month or so. I have winning weekends and losing weekends, but, of course, I lose in the long term. If I gambled every day I could never afford to play at the same limits as I do now. I'd probably have reduce my bet sizes by a factor of 5 or so.

As for craps shooting, I'm still pretty skeptical, although I now do believe that you can make "controlled" shots if you're in a place where you don't get heat for the dice going all the way down. Your ability to toss the dice into the corner and have one of them "stick" the way you set it while the other bounces to the wall is pretty good. I'm still not convinced that anything that hits the back wall is anything other than random, though.

Anyway, it was good meeting you, and I hope you are back in the game soon!

No I had fun. I used to gamble more like that when I would visit vegas. When I interviewed at IGT, I lost $600 playing craps before the interview. While being interviewed, the guy who's my boss now asked if I had gambled, and I said "yeah I lost $600 so far" and he looked worried almost to where he might offer me advice, but he sort of stopped with his mouth half open. I had been out of work for more than a year. I told him, "it's no big deal." I ended up making $1400 .. and deposited the extra $800 at the Wells Fargo ATM before I got on the plane to go back home. Back then I knew nothing about throwing the dice, and I was just betting max 3x4x5x odds on a $10 table with three points and taking my chances like everyone else.

But I absolutely love playing bigger and I love gambling. Nothing really unusual except that I lost all my cash that I am willing to lose and I have to stop for a while.

" Back then I knew nothing about throwing the dice, and I was just betting max 3x4x5x odds on a $10 table with three points and taking my chances like everyone else."

The only thing that has changed since back then and now is that you now believe you are influencing the dice !

Quote: TIMSPEED

If you had started out with poker, instead of blackjack player...I'd swear you were talking about TJ! lol

Or Ivey for that matter.

Sorry about your luck Ahigh, but a break from gambling for awhile can sometimes be a good thing as well.

Quote: Buzzard

" Back then I knew nothing about throwing the dice, and I was just betting max 3x4x5x odds on a $10 table with three points and taking my chances like everyone else."

The only thing that has changed since back then and now is that you now believe you are influencing the dice !

I'd like to see your evidence of my making that claim. Where is that? I'm not saying that I haven't made that claim, but I'm just curious since I can't recall making that claim. I might have implied that I believe that, but since I'm not selling anything, I have no reason to state claims that I believe I can do it. I am just presenting evidence that it might be possible and not dismissing the possibility.

Even if I can prove that it's possible, I might not ever be able to do it myself. And that's just fine with me.

That being said, I don't know for sure that I can influence the dice. It just seems like it might be possible to me. That's how I look at it.

Gee, that took me all of 20 seconds to find.

" I absolutely believe that I hit back-to-back pairs more often than random"

" I absolutely believe that I hit back-to-back pairs more often than random"

Yeah, you know what, I think I do still believe that. I still don't consider myself a "DI" or an AP craps player, really. I haven't done any roll recordings in a very long time. Making money from pairs is pretty hard to do for me and I generally don't try much. And I don't yet have a strategy that matches my rolls yet.

Maybe I should go back to recording and software for a while in my time off from gambling.

Anybody want to see more videos?

Help me come up with some targets. I have a new camera that can do up to 2 hours of continuous slow motion recording that should arrive in a day or two.

http://camera.jvc.com

I can roll with that, the GoPro, the XR550V (1080p60), and the D5100 doing sound-triggered stills.

It's about time for another video session.

I knew you did. Of that I had never had any doubt. It's your money. As long as the kids live in a loving home, and

this belief does not negatively affect your life, have fun.

Also make sure the kids have fun. If you can't have fun as a kid, when the hell can you ?? LOL

Quote: Buzzard

Also make sure the kids have fun. If you can't have fun as a kid, when the hell can you ?? LOL

When you get old enough to gamble? lol

When you're dead?

Definitely not then !

A new perspective. A facebook friend (unrelated to anything I said) posted:

Quote: Troy Mangone

We may throw the dice, but the Lord determines how they fall. Prov 16:33

Marinade on that when it comes to the circumstances of your life.

Who knew that I could blame God? And I thought blaming the stick man was what you were supposed to do all this time.

That must be why people always say "Goddamnit!!!!" on the seven-out.

Quote: Ahigh

And I thought blaming the stick man was what you were supposed to do all this time.

I usually blame the casino owner.

Quote: Ahigh

A new perspective. A facebook friend (unrelated to anything I said) posted:



Who knew that I could blame God? And I thought blaming the stick man was what you were supposed to do all this time.

That must be why people always say "Goddamnit!!!!" on the seven-out.

I am a witness to Ahigh's inscrutible analysis of the stickman. He has pulled down all of his odds, hard way bets, and numbers when a new stickman who he had no experience with joined the table. The first time I witnessed such the shooter immediately 7'd out. I accepted Ahigh's glance after the roll....and I believe I congratulated him....

Quote: Ahigh

A new perspective.

http://bible.cc/proverbs/16-33.htm

Well! And Einstein said God does not throw the dice!

PS: see further comment, "The process here described would seem to have been employed ordinarily in trials where the judges could not decide on the facts before them" Gotta love Bible study!

You know I don't want to put my private finances too much on display, but while I'm cash poor right now, I just booked a $10,000+ win on the stock market in the last few days (pre-tax money) and I'm feeling great. Just sold that position and going into coast/relax mode. Absolutely feeling great. I'll probably still be doing some more videos and taking care of Christmas and what/not before I make another stab at the casino's money. But I have a couple of casinos who have presented themselves to me as targets, and I will be taking some shots at them probably in January.

Ahigh I am not surprised to hear that you lost money at craps and the problem is how the game works. Basically, for right way shooters you win one bet at a time and you lose all of them at one time.

So even a DI who can win one bet at a time, when he misses he will lose a lot at one time.

This is why I came up with a new "personal betting strategy" for craps: passline only with the fire bet. And here's why:

The fire bet is the only "jackpot bet" on the table (the other exotic bets such as tall, small, all, etc are not avaialble where I play) and when we play we ALL try to get the big win. Unfortunately you can lose a lot trying to get to the big win when you do a lot of place and come betting with odds.

So, I decided to just go for the big win and leave all of the static out of the picture: so it's come down to the pass line with the max fire bet.

If you're really a DI or a DC then those two bets are all you need. And if you just want to see if you are a DI or a DC those are the only two bets you need.

And to be honest, just making those two bets is a very inexpensive way for you to find out just how much of a DI or DC you are. And it's also a good way to bet on the other shooters. You can cheer them on -- hoping theyll make pass after pass for that thousand to one payoff.

Quote: AlanMendelson

Ahigh I am not surprised to hear that you lost money at craps and the problem is how the game works. Basically, for right way shooters you win one bet at a time and you lose all of them at one time.

So even a DI who can win one bet at a time, when he misses he will lose a lot at one time.

This is why I came up with a new "personal betting strategy" for craps: passline only with the fire bet. And here's why:

The fire bet is the only "jackpot bet" on the table (the other exotic bets such as tall, small, all, etc are not avaialble where I play) and when we play we ALL try to get the big win. Unfortunately you can lose a lot trying to get to the big win when you do a lot of place and come betting with odds.

So, I decided to just go for the big win and leave all of the static out of the picture: so it's come down to the pass line with the max fire bet.

If you're really a DI or a DC then those two bets are all you need. And if you just want to see if you are a DI or a DC those are the only two bets you need.

And to be honest, just making those two bets is a very inexpensive way for you to find out just how much of a DI or DC you are. And it's also a good way to bet on the other shooters. You can cheer them on -- hoping theyll make pass after pass for that thousand to one payoff.

No odds?

No he makes a good point, really. The edge on a fire bet would have to be compared to a compounded edge to be fair. And even with a large edge, if you bet it for a small amount, it's an inexpensive bet.

When SOOPOO and I were at Gold Coast, after there for about 5 minutes, they paid $17,000 in wins for 5 fire bets. Three for a nickel each, and the dealers and shooter each had a buck.

It does happen. But Alan, you make a good point that I don't really need much of a bankroll to play, just $1 on the fire and go for multiple points.

I still have a couple thousand bucks free cash, but it's Christmas time and I have kids, so it's just not earmarked for the table is all. I have to play Santa Claus too!

But I have been playing. I played last night for about 4 hours at Fiesta Henderson. I lost $6 and got $10 food comp. I had a $50 coupon that I bet on the line and did a random roll to hit aces and lose that right off. I should have liquidated it, but oh well. I still played enough for them to feed me more than I lost. Just not putting more than $150 on the table at a time is all.

I also met up with a friend the night before that and played for 8 hours. LOL. I lost $100, but I haven't seen this friend in a long time, and we had fun.

But believe it or not, even with 12 hours of play in the last two days, I'm still playing less than normal since meeting with Axiom.

Save some money for when I come Aaron...
I'll teach you a little song a friend and I made up...
The first verse is "$17 inside...BOOM! 7-out!"
You can imagine the following verses...lol

If you really are able to reduce the chance of a seven, odds favor you when you're shooting; you'd be a fool not to take them, especially since, depending on your skill, the pass line bet may still be on the house's side, and the fire bet almost certainly is.

I never ever bet the 5 or the 9. I try to keep all my edges under 0.50% per roll, except small amounts on the hardways.

That's my general rule, anyway. I will break it if I have a large stack that travels behind the 5 or 9 or if I want to reduce the amount of risk I have on the table to lock in a profit.

Quote: Ahigh

I played last night for about 4 hours at Fiesta Henderson. I lost $6 and got $10 food comp. I had a $50 coupon that I bet on the line and did a random roll to hit aces and lose that right off.

Love the Fiesta Henderson.

How does one get the $50 coupon?

That's a good question. The coupons I got yesterday were $10 instead of $50. I won three of the four $50 coupons, and they are not used to seeing them.

But as far as how I got them, this is one possible explanation (I complained that they didn't let me $20 coupon on the come to protect the other come bets [chips] that had already travelled). When I left after they said "no bet" to the $20 coupon on the come, the next roll was a seven out. And I said "consider that a complaint" and I left. After I got home, I had an e-mail asking me to take a survey and I told them what I thought of their "no travelling bets" corporate policy.

http://forum.goodshooter.com/topic157.html

They generally feed me every time I go, and I took the family for $100 steak dinner on one occasion as well.

Quote: Ahigh

They generally feed me every time I go, and I took the family for $100 steak dinner on one occasion as well.

Comps are great, but we all feed the casinos, not the other way around.

Sounds like pretty good customer service at Fiesta Henderson since they responded to your survey with a direct email. At least you know they're listening.