Blackjack Counting Camouflage (Cover) Techniques

I liked where aceofspades 'Trip Report - VEGAS' was going, so I wanted to open up a new thread for card counters to discuss their techniques to cover their activities and avoid being backed off in one form or another (level bet, BJ banned, or 86'd). I was backed off of BJ from a major LV casino group in 2006, and don't want to have it happen again. My current goals are really pretty modest, I like to make enough on average that my trip expenses including flights, food, beverage, shows, concerts, fights, etc are paid for either through the money I make or through comps, therefore, I feel I can take some hit on my return in order to avoid detection.

I typically use a high/low count (both 6 deck and DD), incorporating most of the Illustrious 18 and Fab 4 play variations into my game and usually spread 1-16 units.

My favorite book on the subject is Ian Andersen's 'Burning the Tables in Las Vegas' and I've tried to incorporate some of those techniques into my own play, especially when it comes to bet progression. Some additional cover plays I also use to avoid detection are:

- I don't generally wong into a shoe, I play it from the start.
- I try to play most shoes to the end, but will leave early occasionally if the count is excessively bad. In these cases, I try to set up an excuse early in the session, something like I can play until my girlfriend calls, then take a fake phone call in order to set up the reason to leave.
- I always try to be friendly and talkative with dealers, pit critters, other players, and waitresses
- Play dumb, act confused on some basic strategy plays, even asking other players. This is particularly useful for me where the count may dictate a play that goes against basic strategy (standing on 12 v 3 with a count of +2) while I re-calculate the TC based on the cards I've just seen.
- I never split 10's, (even when the count dictates it) against a 5 or 6, I feel this is too much of a red flag
- I only insure when the count dictates it AND it's a reasonably good hand anyhow (18, 19, 20, 21). I know the correct play is to insure any hand when the TC is +3 or better. The reasoning behind this play is that it's consistent with how many players make insurance decisions, based on the size of the bet (which in my case will be larger because of the count) and based on the strength of the hand.
- Recently I've adapted to getting comfortable sitting in the middle of the table with players on both sides, previously I was a first base or third base player when counting.
- Play other house games that have minimal house edge. My preferences are craps (Pass or DP with full odds), baccarat (no mini baccarat), and good paytable VP.

I'd like feedback on any of these and would also like to hear about other cover techniques that BJ players use.

Good topic Midwest - for those who have read my Trip Report - you know I take a different route when it comes to camouflage. I call it "anti-flage" and basically it is being over the top - i.e. announcing when I arrive at the table that "I'm here to count cards and win money" or telling the dealer "The slower you deal, the easier it for me to count" - or something along those lines. I also will make appearances at the tables and not even play - just become friendly with the dealers and PB's - let them feel comfortable with me and then re-appear later and voila - no heat :)

I know this is not the traditional way of doing things but, it works for me

I am fully prepared for an avalanche of criticism so, fire when ready!

Act like a gambler. Cheer when you make a min bet BJ or get a good double card. Act real nervous when you have bigger bets out there.

Make mistakes (and piss off the other players) when you have min bets. I love doing that. They hate me so much. Then I can push to 2 hands because they keep leaving the table.

Increase and decrease bets in a random fashion. Be casual. I like to shuffle winnings into my bet and then grab some off the top to increase my bet into a positive count.

Hide bigger denomination chips under smaller ones when increasing your bet.

Squirrel away chips so it looks like you are losing or breaking even.

Quote: dwheatley

Make mistakes (and piss off the other players) when you have min bets. I love doing that. They hate me so much. Then I can push to 2 hands because they keep leaving the table.

This is funny to me also, so many players are convinced that other player 'poor' plays will affect their overall results. And while it may on a particular hand, they selectivley forget the times it works in their favor.

Cover play for blackjack card counters:

1. If you're playing purple as your minimum bet, then maybe follow some of Ian Andersen's advice. But of course, BJ Survey Voice and other skills check software can detect the "Ultimate Gambit" just fine anyway.

2. Play short sessions.

3. Play unrated.

4. Play aggressively and don't waste even a cent on worthless "cover plays." Spread as high as your bankroll can afford, wong in and out of shoes, and move along before anyone has a chance to analyze your play. How you play A8 v 6 isn't going to buy you more than 30 seconds of extra playing time when all is said and done, so make your time at the tables count and don't worry about "cover" that is actually just -EV play with no (or an extremely dubious) tangible benefit.

And no disrespect intended, but to MidwestAP: if you're following all of those plays that you listed above, then you really don't need to worry about cover at all, as you're losing so much EV that you're very likely playing a break even or possible slightly negative game. Insurance alone is the most valuable index play you have. Not taking it correctly every single time has a hugely negative impact on your play, not even considering the other areas where you are simply lighting money on fire. Again, don't take that the wrong way, I just hate to see people laboring over different ways to "fool" the pit when it's not necessary, doesn't really buy you the time that you think it does, and cuts into your already paper-thin edge.

i have been counting for thirty years, playing in casinos for 25,
so i can do it while drunk or high on benzos.
i like to drink heavily at the table, as most counters do not do this.
i have even been flagged for drinking too much and told i would have to slow down.
most casinos do not think that a "drunk" could be counting down at a full table,
and still remembering all of the AP index numbers.

i always come to the table with a pocketful of black and green chips
and continually shuffle different chips around
into and out of my pocket. i hardly ever do a total buy-in at the BJ table,
so they really have no idea what i started with and what i am leaving with.
of course they can look at the tape and count the rack if they want to,
but i make sure that they can't casually observe.

one way to get out of a bad shoe, as you mentioned is to take an imaginary call.
just to take that to the next level, i like to try to continue to play
while on the phone so that they actually have to tell me i can't.
then it's their idea that i step away from the table and not mine.
i don't usually wong in as it is not allowed at most high limit games.
i talked earlier about leaving in a positive shoe,
but i will do this close to the cut card and only when it isn't a high count

i stay at the casino for long hours,
i do not hit and run.
but i do not usually play for long sessions at one table.
i take a lot of breaks and go play other games.
mostly craps and midi-bac, but also some higher edge games when i am ahead.
pai gow, roulette, sic bo.

sometimes i play using a players card and sometimes i do not.
i know they can track your play with or without a players card,
so i sometimes let them have it, if they ask. but i prefer not to.

i also like to play dumb on certain hands, and act like i really have to think about it.
i love to pretend that i forget to make the hand signals, especially surrender.
i generally don't think that you can be successful counting and hide the fact by faking marginal errors.
so i usually just play perfect BS, and if i notice that i am killing alot of index points,
i stop and go to another table or another casino.
i have 17 casinos that i play at within two hours of my house.

i try to always be friendly to the dealer, pit and to other players, even the a-holes.
it just seems more natural to most people, that you are there to have fun.
that you aren't at work. i have seen the way dealers and staff talk about the dick players,
and i just think they are more likely to screw over the unpleasant ones.

that's about it.
i generally play at least one day a week.
i have been consistently making money every year for 24 of the last 25 years.
not enough to write a book or a movie about, but enough to never want to stop.
as long as i can find favorable rules and an edge under .5%, i am good to go.

Quote: LonesomeGambler

And no disrespect intended, but to MidwestAP: if you're following all of those plays that you listed above, then you really don't need to worry about cover at all, as you're losing so much EV that you're very likely playing a break even or possible slightly negative game. Insurance alone is the most valuable index play you have. Not taking it correctly every single time has a hugely negative impact on your play, not even considering the other areas where you are simply lighting money on fire. Again, don't take that the wrong way, I just hate to see people laboring over different ways to "fool" the pit when it's not necessary, doesn't really buy you the time that you think it does, and cuts into your already paper-thin edge.

No worries, I was looking for constructive feedback, and appreciate your comments. I certainly don't follow much of the 'Ultimate Gambit', but I still appreciate the book and the way it got me to look at BJ cover in a different way. As far as my play, I agree that the Insurance play is the most detrimental to my return, the only other real 'play' deviation is the split 10's vs 5 or 6 with appropriate count. I know those two 'cover play's' cut into my edge but think it still leave me in a positive EV assuming decent spread, penetration, and correct index plays for the other plays. The other items I listed are not play variations, they are techniques to give the casino staff the perception that I don't count.

I actually followed your fire away suggestion back in 2005 and 2006 (using a $100 base unit) and it got me backed off, so I feel better adding some cover to meet my modest goals. I may modify my insurance cover, your point is well taken.

6 Decks Play
Wong In: Wong in at a decent count at beginining of a session or after a break (telephone break, bathroom break etc). Do not over do it. Go to a table that is just starting. Observe for one deck, if the count gets good sit down of bad leave and if it stays neutral observe for one more deck and act accordingly. Do these for 2-4 tables and then sit down anyway.
Wong Out: Use it more often: Telephone break, bathroom break and losing several in a row break. Bad count and lose several times in a row, perfect oppurtunity to leave. Many players change tables when the dealer is hot! Even better opportunity after another player leaves the table because the dealer is hot and you follows suit (because of the negative count)
Starting the shoe: Often start at double your minimum and occasionaly even higher and leave it as long as you are winining the bet.
Previous Shoe ends with High Count and High Bet: Consider leaving. Or start the next show with a high bet (say 50% of what you finished the previous shoe)
Act like an Average Player: Observe how the average player behaves and act accordingly. Drinking, speaking with other players and dealer, showing emotion when winning or losing and maybe saying something about it especially when losing.
Spread: Do not follow your betting spread like a robot but only as a benchmark which you can bet a bit more or a bit less so that is looks more natural.
Bet Higher than what the Count says when the Pitposs is watching: This is to get more comps.

Quote: LonesomeGambler

2. Play short sessions.

3. Play unrated.

When I played BJ, I never gave them a card. I
always said I won't be there very long, I'm waiting
for a call from my wife. Or I say I gave up on cards
because I never get any good comps. It almost
always works. Only a few times over the years did
some casino drone insist on a card, so I left the
table. Casino floor people aren't usually the brightest
bulbs on the tree, they tend to believe what you tell
them. If you say you won't be there long, you disappear
as a threat to them.

Never buy in at the table you're playing on. I either
have chips from last time, or I buy them at another
pit. I like the Big Wheel as a buy in spot. Get the
chips, make one small bet, lose and say 'this game
sucks' and wander away. Never give casino personnel
credit for too much brain power. Most of them are
bored out of their skulls and aren't thinking about you
at all. They're far more concerned about their next
break or when they can punch out.

Other BJ players are always worried about comps.
I never gave them a thought, I would much rather
play as a non entity than worry about a free buffet.
I never played at any one table long enough to get
rated anyway. I always thought comps are for chumps
and still do. Its like clipping coupons or collecting green
stamps. If comps mean that much to you, the casino
has you right where they want you.

Quote: MidwestAP

No worries, I was looking for constructive feedback, and appreciate your comments. I certainly don't follow much of the 'Ultimate Gambit', but I still appreciate the book and the way it got me to look at BJ cover in a different way. As far as my play, I agree that the Insurance play is the most detrimental to my return, the only other real 'play' deviation is the split 10's vs 5 or 6 with appropriate count. I know those two 'cover play's' cut into my edge but think it still leave me in a positive EV assuming decent spread, penetration, and correct index plays for the other plays. The other items I listed are not play variations, they are techniques to give the casino staff the perception that I don't count.

I actually followed your fire away suggestion back in 2005 and 2006 (using a $100 base unit) and it got me backed off, so I feel better adding some cover to meet my modest goals. I may modify my insurance cover, your point is well taken.

Your ability to take constructive criticism will be an asset to you in this business. I've made many, many adjustments to my play over the years based on constructive criticism, and I actively solicit such criticism from my associates to this day.

Ian Andersen's book is fantastic, and he is a very sharp and successful player in his own right. The problem is that his advice is intended for high-stakes professionals (he often talks about having a private table in his suite, for example) playing with a very degree of scrutiny that even an average high-stakes pro would never encounter. Andersen likes to play with a small edge as a trade off for good, long-standing relationships with casino employees. This is a very specific goal, and it's not one that benefits most high-stakes players or any medium or low-stakes players, in my opinion.

The second problem with his work is that, while it was very innovative when it was first published, it's largely useless now. Playing cover won't fool bosses who don't know the right play anyway, and it certainly won't beat a skills check. Over the course of a career, card counters get nailed for the same reason: betting bigger when the count is favorable and lower when it's not. No amount of playing cover or betting cover will disguise this.

Now, betting black and playing aggressively, you will get backed off. It's a part of the business. Your handle is "MidwestAP," and being an AP unfortunately means occasionally getting the boot for daring to use your brain in a casino. If you play and never get backed off, you're leaving money on the table. That doesn't mean that I advocate playing maximum aggression until you get the tap and then moving on; I'm actually a big fan of longevity, within reason. In areas with more than a couple casinos, there's no reason not to stick to short, anonymous sessions and then disappear before anyone has a chance to determine what your angle is. If they do a tape review and determine that you're a skilled player, there's no name on file to match it to. They can flyer you to the pit, but it'll be weeks or months before the next time you're around and there will be new flyers in place of your old one. That's the only cover you need.

Now, I must insist on the insurance play. That's a very serious leak. I consider never splitting tens to be a big leak too, but I know that some people have convinced themselves that this play is just not possible without the axe coming down on you (important tip: nothing is impossible). Still, there's no excuse for not taking insurance when the count calls for it; it's just too great a loss for you to eat.

Final advice: if the last time you got backed off was 6+ years ago, then you have nothing to worry about. Seriously. Backoffs are annoying and should be avoided, but if you're going to spend your time in casinos trying to beat a card game, at least make it count.

Quote: MidwestAP

I liked where aceofspades 'Trip Report - VEGAS' was going, so I wanted to open up a new thread for card counters to discuss their techniques to cover their activities and avoid being backed off in one form or another

I'm reminded of these threads on Dice Control: some spin the dice to the right to get sevens whereas some players spin the dice to the left to get sevens; meanwhile the casino personnel smile.

Some BJ players seem to compensate, some seem to over compensate and others proudly go around utterly unabashed almost as if they were at a nudist colony: they practically were a sign on their foreheads reading "uncompensating card counter".

Some chat about counting, some profess utter ignorance. I have a feeling that casino personnel seem more concerned about card counters than dice controllers but not particularly dedicated to ridding the world of either one. It may be some casinos, or some personnel or someone who recently attended a seminar or someone who read an article or something. It probably is as variable as a belief in UFOs or something.

I just don't see how anyone can start out talking about card counting and then persistently engage in it, but not get any heat. Perhaps the next shift has a pit boss who believes in Martians and Card Counters. Or the next casino down the road has some newly minted MBA who thinks he is Sherlock Holmes and will detect card counters. It just doesn't seem to be that big a problem to most casinos.

Quote: FleaStiff

It just doesn't seem to be that big a problem to most casinos.

Its not. If you were to ask how many really effective AP's
there are in any specific casino at any specific time, the
answer would be zero more often than not. The key word
is effective.

Quote: FleaStiff

I just don't see how anyone can start out talking about card counting and then persistently engage in it, but not get any heat.

Card counters have a very thin edge. Add sub-optimal betting, a combination of counting and intuition/hunch plays, a weak counting system, games with relatively poor rules, and an insufficient bankroll for the stakes being played, and you can see why the casino has absolutely nothing to worry about. Calling yourself a card counter and being proud that you didn't get heat is very different from playing a strong game with deadly accuracy and making them bleed. No offense intended to aceofspades, who seems to really enjoy what he does, and that's 100% fine; I love to hear about people winning instead of losing, and he seems like a nice guy, to boot. I'm only noting that if the casino decided that he was a player to investigate, their decision to let him continue to play probably had less to do with making a joke about counting and more to do with the other variables that I mentioned.

Quote: LonesomeGambler

Card counters have a very thin edge. Add sub-optimal betting, a combination of counting and intuition/hunch plays, a weak counting system, games with relatively poor rules, and an insufficient bankroll for the stakes being played, and you can see why the casino has absolutely nothing to worry about. Calling yourself a card counter and being proud that you didn't get heat is very different from playing a strong game with deadly accuracy and making them bleed. No offense intended to aceofspades, who seems to really enjoy what he does, and that's 100% fine; I love to hear about people winning instead of losing, and he seems like a nice guy, to boot. I'm only noting that if the casino decided that he was a player to investigate, their decision to let him continue to play probably had less to do with making a joke about counting and more to do with the other variables that I mentioned.

I think that my personality comes into play because I continue to joke and goof off with other players , dealers and pit bosses - they are too busy talking with me to worry about what I'm doing - plus, I normally get up after each $1k win - been doing it for 2 1/2 years now and am +37k

I am by no means a professional player but use a basic system (Speed Count) to add to my playing experience - it just so happens that I usually win when doing this - so, in the end, it is fun and when I reach my goal for a session I stop - it makes me happy :)

Doing what makes you happy is all that matters! And I will absolutely agree that a pleasant personality and good social skills are stronger cover than every other cover play combined.

Edit: for posterity, I would feel irresponsible for warning you not to assume you have an edge just because you have positive results. I've seen variance that boggles the mind—in both directions—with strong edges and solid, professional play. Short-term results (yes, 2.5 years of casual, intermittent play falls under this category) are just that; it would be wise to not infer too much from them.

Quote: LonesomeGambler

Doing what makes you happy is all that matters! And I will absolutely agree that a pleasant personality and good social skills are stronger cover than every other cover play combined.

Edit: for posterity, I would feel irresponsible for warning you not to assume you have an edge just because you have positive results. I've seen variance that boggles the mind—in both directions—with strong edges and solid, professional play. Short-term results (yes, 2.5 years of casual, intermittent play falls under this category) are just that; it would be wise to not infer too much from them.

2 weekends per month of 2 1/2 years

year one +45k
year two -18k
this year +10k

I know all about variance and the trouble it can bring - but also the wins it can bring - I would love to become a full time player and institute Hi-Lo or KO but, it's not worth it to me as I would much rather do it part-time and take small wins

If the TC indicates a raise, don't raise until you win... a parlay looks like gambling.
Decrease your bet according to TC... no delay.

I personally used to limit non BS doubles to those indicated by Hit 17 Rules (I used to play S17 exclusively), When in Stand 17 land, it keeps the heat away.
Standing on 3-card 12 vs. 3, and 3-card 16 vs. 10-values quite OK with most dealers/players.

I like the part where the OP asks the occasional ?, a nice plus.