gang plants cameras at casino tables for 3 years

I resurected this story from my "making a link active" thread because I thoght it might have got lost in the shuffle. Could something like this happen in a U.S. based casino?

http://koreajoongangdaily.joinsmsn.com/news/article/article.aspx?aid=2950773

OK. I read the article. Cameras in the BlackJack card shoes. Interesting, except...

I beleive the article has one specific detail wrong.

It says the camera was used to aid in card counting.

Counting, even perfect counting as this suggests, doesn't change the odds enough to allow you to make the kind of money they are talking about.


The camera was used to detect the dealer's hole card and/or to read the next card to be dealt.

Either of those things would make a difference in playing strategy, allowing for the kinds of wins they are talking about. However, as a floorperson or surveilance, how dumb do you have to be to see people that are consistantly winning, and NOT using basic strategy, to not eventually get suspicious?

I don't see in the article where it mentions the camera was in a blackjack shoe, in fact the original discovery of the camera was on a baccarat shoe. It would make player/banker decisions pretty easy if a cheater knew the next four cards out of the shoe.

I'd agree witht DJTeddyBear's comments, the casino staff had to be asleep at the wheel to pay out that kind of money without becoming suspicious. I find it mind boggling that it took another player to discover the 'ruse' after it had been going on for THREE YEARS!

Quote: DJTeddyBear

The camera was used to detect the dealer's hole card and/or to read the next card to be dealt.

Either of those things would make a difference in playing strategy, allowing for the kinds of wins they are talking about. However, as a floorperson or surveilance, how dumb do you have to be to see people that are consistantly winning, and NOT using basic strategy, to not eventually get suspicious?

Over 20 years ago I played at Alladin where I could frequently see the dealer's hole card in blackjack. As the big $5 player I was, I then had to figure out what to do with this information. I didn't hit 19 when I knew the dealer had 20. I didn't double on 8 when the dealer had a known 16. But I did stand on 16 against a 7 when I knew the dealer had 15 total. I did every now and then take insurance. I did not split 7's against a 6 when the dealer had a known 11. So I did not take advantage of every opportunity, but selected ones. I won maybe $30 over the course of an hour, had a PaiGowDan moment, and left. There was another player at the table that seemed to be friendly with the dealer, was betting quarters, and I was concerned that perhaps collusion was going on. I certainly wasn't going to say anything, but felt better to just leave. It won't take many 'non basic strategy' plays to shift the odds substantially in your favor if you know the dealer's hole card, even if you dont use that info every time.

This has nothing to do with hole card play. Just a guess, but look at where the camera is located in the shoe, and then look at a playing card. Pretty easy to figure out the play here (note that the game mentioned was baccarat).

Baccarat would be the target because not only is it so popular there but it is the game with the greatest sensitivity to a slug of known cards.

Given the usual exaggerations in Korean journalism I would say the camera was probably in use for three weeks not three years.

Reported by a rival gang? Heck, if one player saw it, others would have seen it too.

Would they want a peek at a card about to be dealt or a peek at the cards as they entered the shoe? Now that would give them one heck of a "slug" of known cards. Randomly shuffled but known to the entire table ... clean out the casino real quick.