6/5 blackjack
I.E. Pocket even money and tip the excess, then it matters only to the dealer...
Quote: NareedI don't play BJ, but I wonder: does the 3:2 matter more than the overall house edge given other rule sof the game? I suppose real BJ (3:2) in general pays better than 21 (6:5), but could there be cases where a 21 game has a lower edge than a BJ game? Or that a 21 game will be more profitable to count?
Of course it could, but you will not find a game with all super favorable rules except 6:5.
Quote: Dougray2I will be visiting Las Vegas for the first time at the end of November. I've heard that most bj tables on the strip pay 6/5. Are there any strip casinos that have mostly 3/2 tables? If not, where is the best place to play blackjack with low minimums and 3/2 blackjack? Thanks in advance.
Believe it or not, Bellagio has entirely 3:2 tables, with continuous shufflers and $5 tables at nearly all times. You may not always get a seat but every time I pass by it seemed to have at least one seat open.
Or head downtown to the TEZ and play SD H17 for around the same HE but for 5 min. :) ( Nice to a play a good game w/ a low HE and low min.)
I play the 6D S17 games on the strip as well as the TEZ, thats about it
Good luck, will be there around the same time .
Quote: NareedI don't play BJ, but I wonder: does the 3:2 matter more than the overall house edge given other rule sof the game? I suppose real BJ (3:2) in general pays better than 21 (6:5), but could there be cases where a 21 game has a lower edge than a BJ game? Or that a 21 game will be more profitable to count?
Check the table on Rule Variations at https://wizardofodds.com/blackjack. It shows that, although the average blackjack game is about 1/2 % house edge, adding 6:5 increases the house edge by 1.39% and it's hard to see how any other combination of rules could offset that.
Quote: RoyalBJRiviera pays 7 to 5 for a blackjack.
UGH....This keeps getting worse on the strip. The Rivera was one of the few old school places that you didnt think would try this stuff. But I guess when you are struggling like they are and dont want to be the next Sahara, you try stuff and hope people dont notice.
Well, 7 to 5 IS better than 6 to 5. However, it IS also worse than 3 to 2.Quote: RoyalBJRiviera is proud to say, "7 to 5" is considered better than "6 to 5", not worse than "3 to 2". . .
Quote: BozHarrahs Reno still has 3/2, but most of the time it is $15 and up when the 6/5 is $5 minimum. Guess which one is always full and which one you can play alone against the dealer? The public doesnt seem to care.
Harrah's Reno's Zone 21 (Party Pit / Passion Pit) has been doing 6 to 5 for the 6-, 8-deck shoes BJ for over one year. Sex sells...
Quote: BozHarrahs Reno still has 3/2, but most of the time it is $15 and up when the 6/5 is $5 minimum. Guess which one is always full and which one you can play alone against the dealer? The public doesnt seem to care.
There was a thread somewhere that debated whether Caesars would go to even money on BJs with a high five and a piece of candy given out. It absolutely amazes me that they even try any of this, as the competition in those markets is stiff. But as another person mentioned, sex sells, and lower mins are better than higher mins. I'm a Caesars player, but some of the BS they pull on players drives me up a wall.
Edit: During the day on a weekday, weekends... not enough experience.
Quote: TiltpoulThere was a thread somewhere that debated whether Caesars would go to even money on BJs with a high five and a piece of candy given out..
That is too funny, where is the original thread?
Quote: DrEntropyThat is too funny, where is the original thread?
After about 30 minutes of searching, I finally found it... this is mid-thread, top of third page, but it's darn funny.
6-5 Thread
Quote: TiltpoulAfter about 30 minutes of searching, I finally found it... this is mid-thread, top of third page, but it's darn funny.
6-5 Thread
Thanks for the point out! I think they missed the boat with Halloween. They could have had the dealers dressed up as slutty <insert favorite costume> and giving out halloween candy when you get a blackjack. And of course the high five and even money :0
Quote: DrEntropyQuote: TiltpoulAfter about 30 minutes of searching, I finally found it... this is mid-thread, top of third page, but it's darn funny.
6-5 Thread
Thanks for the point out! I think they missed the boat with Halloween. They could have had the dealers dressed up as slutty <insert favorite costume> and giving out halloween candy when you get a blackjack. And of course the high five and even money :0
Awww heck if you get us some costumes, we could get paid 4-5 on BJs! WOO HOO!
Quote: RoyalBJI just found out, at Harrah's Reno, 8 deck BJ games have been paying 6 to 5, for over one year already.
Did it surprise you at all?
In my experience, the Harrah's-branded buildings seem to be world famous for consistently having the worst gaming odds in the industry and nickle & dime you to death. Video poker? 7/5 @ Jacks or Better (9/6 elsewhere). Craps? 2x on 12 on the field (3x everywhere else). Blackjack? 6/5 (3/2 elsewhere). When I say "elsewhere", I mean walking distance to the joint next door, which is usually nicer.
Having been to many different casinos for poker, including Harrah's at various cities across the country, it used to be a running joke amongst players that you can always tell when you're at a Harrah's from the amount of paper towel coming out of the automatic motion-activated dispenser in the bathroom.
One exception seems to be the Horseshoe, which seems to offer some of the best odds / deals in most games. (With the exception of video poker.)
Quote: y2d2One exception seems to be the Horseshoe, which seems to offer some of the best odds / deals in most games. (With the exception of video poker.)
Though Horseshoe Southern Indiana has 9/6 throughout the casino. Hammond offers 9/6 JoB at the $1 + Progressive, which was over 5000 when I was there in May. The CB properties have either 8/6 or 9/5 JoB which is nearly the same HE.
However, Horseshoe Tunica does have some of the worst VP around, yet has one of the best SD BJ games in the country. For VP, walk 100 feet over to Tunica Roadhouse, where full-pay VP is abundant.
Quote: buzzpaffHe,y both numbers in 6 to 5 are bigger than 3 to 2. What's the big deal ?
Good one Buzz! Reminds me of the time you tried to convince some unlucky gal that your 9 cm was superior to 8 inches.
The 6:5 rule is only shown in very small letters on the bottom of the screen where the table limits are listed. I think this is deceptive since the rule “dealer hits or stands on soft 17” is listed in large letters right on the table. That rule affects the edge by about 0.2 %, while 6:5 raises the edge by about 1.5%. A few years ago I sat at a $25 table and didn’t realize it was 6:5 until I got a blackjack. I made a dated assumption that a $25 table must be 3:2
Proportionally to the edge, the 6:5 rule should be in font seven times the size of the 17 rule, covering about half of the table. Or the game should be called American 21 instead of Blackjack
Quote: Ace2I was in LV over the weekend and did most of my gambling at the Cosmopolitan. There are only a few 3:2 tables left...I had to ask a pit boss where they were.
The 6:5 rule is only shown in very small letters on the bottom of the screen where the table limits are listed. I think this is deceptive since the rule “dealer hits or stands on soft 17” is listed in large letters right on the table. That rule affects the edge by about 0.2 %, while 6:5 raises the edge by about 1.5%. A few years ago I sat at a $25 table and didn’t realize it was 6:5 until I got a blackjack. I made a dated assumption that a $25 table must be 3:2
Proportionally to the edge, the 6:5 rule should be in font seven times the size of the 17 rule, covering about half of the table. Or the game should be called American 21 instead of Blackjack
I think my new response any time I read about 6:5 blackjack, will be "there is no such thing". lol. 6:5 in my opinion, is NOT blackjack and it shouldn't be allowed to even be called blackjack. What 6:5 is, is a glaring example of casino greed.
And the evolving practices around 6:5, that you mentioned are a glaring example of casino industry dishonesty. It used to be at least they displayed right on the felt that the game was 6:5. Then they moved away from that to a much smaller sign off to the side that was less likely to be noticed. Now, many places there is absolutely no mention of it. If it is a place you don't play regularly and know, and you forget to ask, you learn of it when you get a blackjack. Very frustrating!
Quote: kewljI think my new response any time I read about 6:5 blackjack, will be "there is no such thing". lol. 6:5 in my opinion, is NOT blackjack and it shouldn't be allowed to even be called blackjack. What 6:5 is, is a glaring example of casino greed.
When I'm in a sleazy casino (is that redundant?) where the BJ payout isn't evident, I ask the dealer, "Is this blackjack?" Of course he/she answers yes. I then ask, "Is it 3:2?" If yes, great. If not, I say,"No, this is crapjack. I'm looking for blackjack which pays 3:2." The offical name of 6:5 should be Crapjack.
Quote: ChumpChangeThat is so odd, but it might work.
Don't understand your comment. What is odd and what might work?
Quote: 21formeWhen I'm in a sleazy casino (is that redundant?) where the BJ payout isn't evident, I ask the dealer, "Is this blackjack?" Of course he/she answers yes. I then ask, "Is it 3:2?" If yes, great. If not, I say,"No, this is crapjack. I'm looking for blackjack which pays 3:2." The offical name of 6:5 should be Crapjack.
Hey there stranger.
So you know it really isn't the dealers fault right? Lol.
I mean when I get caught in the situation that I don't realize it was 6:5 and get a blackjack, I will usually fake a hissy fit and the dealer may get the brunt of that, but it is really for the pit persons benefit. I want to make sure he/she know why I am leaving. Not that, that does any good either.
BTW, that's the other thing I call it sometimes - short-pay BJ. If another player asks what you mean, you say, "if you bet $100, you should get $150 for a BJ. With short-pay BJ, they short you $30 and you only get $120. Again, every little bit helps... Maybe.
Whaddya know - they were, and still are today.
Despite the rational thought that people would see the tremendous loss of player advantage in 6:5, occasional recreational gamblers did not catch on, or did not care. I've heard so many ignorant ideas about it from players at a 6:5 table that I'm certain that most people don't know it's any kind of disadvantage, or don't care.
There are a lot of other "improvements" to casino games that I think all it took was for one casino to give it a shot and, as usual, the general public bought in.
Where did H17 come from? How about adding one, two - and now, sometimes, THREE! - double-zero slots in roulette? CSMs? Sure, they supposedly reduce the down time in manual shuffling, but the casinos also know that they defeat card counting.
All casino games carry an inherent statistical loss-factor to the player. There are no games being offered, save blackjack, where, eventually, the casino is going to win more than it loses. Walk by every single table or machine, heading to a blackjack game, and every single occupied spot is filled by a loser.
At a 6:5 blackjack table, that's the same deal. Craps players don't let it bother them, and most blackjack players don't either.
I have NO PROBLEM with 6/5, UNLESS the fact is not clear to someone sitting at the table.
OK, I'm not thinking straight, there's no effect on insurance bets.
You have a $10 bet down, you get dealt a BJ, dealer gets dealt an Ace and asks if you want insurance.
If you say no and win the hand, you get paid $12.
If you say no and push the hand, you get paid $0.
If you say yes and push the hand, you get paid $10.
If you say yes and win the hand, you get paid $12 (-$5 insurance) = $7 (instead of $10 in 3:2 BJ). *
You have a $10 bet down, you get dealt a 20, dealer gets dealt an Ace and asks if you want insurance.
If you say no and win the hand, you get paid $10.
If you say no and push the hand, you get paid $0.
If you say no and lose the hand, you lose $10.
If you say yes and win the hand, you win $10 (-$5 insurance) = $5.
If you say yes and push the hand, you get paid $0 (-$5 insurance) = -$5.
If you say yes and lose the hand, you lose $10 (-$5 insurance) = -$15.
*It does hobble you if you're trying to win one unit no matter what if you have a BJ against a dealer ace and the dealer loses.
Quote: ChumpChangeIt screws up insurance bets, especially if you're trying to win BJ-BJ.
OK, I'm not thinking straight, there's no effect on insurance bets.
Another common misconception is insurance. I've heard many supposed learned players say that insurance only makes sense when you have 20.
As if having your two tens is going to improve the chances of there being yet another one under the dealer's ace.
I'm wondering what the next enhancement of house edge is going to be, beyond 6:5 and H17. Whatever it's going to be, the casual player won't be bothered by it.
Quote: PokerGrinderI believe it’s Red Hawk casino in California that deals even money BJ on their $5 tables. It’s 100% normal BJ otherwise.
I think I'm gonna be sick.
If I remember correctly, and feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, but I think 6/5 was introduced with Super Fun 21 to compensate for the liberal rules. Then some casino executive thought "why don't we just vacuum money from customers on conventional blackjack by paying 6/5?"
I get it from a business standpoint, but it sucks as a player to see how prevalent it's become.
One of these days, some casino is going to try "Player BJ is an automatic push (or loss) of the player."
Quote: 21formeA few years ago, I saw a BJ table at the back of Monte Carlo, not far from the retail orridor, offering $5 BJ with a 1:1 payout on BJ.
One of these days, some casino is going to try "Player BJ is an automatic push (or loss) of the player."
I had that on one of those 5 seat video blackjack games just last month. You know...the games with the video dealers that all have big boobs.
This particular game, the next generation of the Angel dealers...the girls look the same but the software has changed. Shuffle point no longer obvious. So anyway, I was playing a few hands while I waited for favorable conditions at the nearby blackjack pit and I got a a blackjack. I was only half paying attention when the dealer drew a 3 card 21 and said "push". "What?!". Yeah I cashed out immediately.
Quote: kewljI had that on one of those 5 seat video blackjack games just last month. You know...the games with the video dealers that all have big boobs.
This particular game, the next generation of the Angel dealers...the girls look the same but the software has changed. Shuffle point no longer obvious. So anyway, I was playing a few hands while I waited for favorable conditions at the nearby blackjack pit and I got a a blackjack. I was only half paying attention when the dealer drew a 3 card 21 and said "push". "What?!". Yeah I cashed out immediately.
If you're killing time by playing -EV games, you've either been in Vegas too long or hanging out on recreational gambling forums too long :-)
(edited for typo)
Quote: 21formeIf you're killing time by playing -EV games, you've either been in Vages too long or hanging out on recreational gambling forums too long :-)
That maybe. Lol.
Actually I have a better response but it will have to wait until I get home later.
