billryan
billryan 
Joined: Nov 2, 2009
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Minty
February 9th, 2021 at 8:25:44 AM permalink
Quote: fantom

You are new here. That explains your confusion. Thread titles have a relevant shelf life of about four posts. At which point the thread has devolved into one of about a half dozen totally unrelated topics that have absolutely nothing to do with either Las Vegas, gambling, or. often, reality.

When browsing, don't rely on the title of a thread to be indicative of anything once it's more than a few days old.

That a cited article is obsolete is also par for the course. You'll note that many of the subtopics referencing specific Las Vegas casinos are also very old. It is also "safe to assume... [they are] no longer accurate."

A few years ago this forum was timely, valuable, and current, with interesting, often accurate posts from many different members.




This might mean something if it weren't coming from someone who joined in December and who has made under forty posts.
The difference between fiction and reality is that fiction is supposed to make sense.
MJGolf
MJGolf
Joined: Aug 17, 2016
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IndyJeffrey
February 9th, 2021 at 8:38:01 AM permalink
The simple fact is "post Covid" minimums have increased and conditions have worsened. Even since I was here in Oct, conditions have seriously worsened. Used to be DD games at Caesars properties, with $25 minimums during day and $50 at least at night, you still have 3-2 games (nDAS-hit 17) games. NOW they are almost ALL gone. They are 6-5 monstrosities. With still high limits. At Paris for example, no 3-2 unless playing high limit table DD $100 minimums. Cromwell advertises 3-2 BJ on their signs, so they have to have it, right? Well only during the early hours and they they convert to 6-5. Flamingo seemed to be the same. You can still get 3-2 on 8 shoe games but you have to watch because they will be right next to a 6-5 game. You would think that John Q Public would be able to figure out the difference but apparently NOT.

I will confirm that TI had one $15 DD table but it was limited to 3 players and full the times I walked through. I am here currently for Superbowl and for the couple days after. The Strip is a weird place at moment. Very low class, Los Angeles or Southern Calif clientele. I think it's because they have very cheap room rates. But food prices are very, very high........even from my last trip. And they are limiting capacity in restaurants (or the ones you would like to eat at) to 25%. I do not think I will be back for awhile, even though I have friends here. At least to the Strip.
fantom
fantom
Joined: Dec 19, 2020
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February 9th, 2021 at 9:06:23 AM permalink
Quote: billryan

This might mean something if it weren't coming from someone who joined in December and who has made under forty posts.



Maybe I have been lurking here for a long time without joining. I think that's allowed, and in fact I'll bet a lot of folks do exactly that.

Maybe I am someone who has read thousands of posts, noticing how often, after a few relevant responses, the usual thread degenerates into a back-and-forth between a few habitual posters who spend most of their time either taunting each other or exchange messages as if they were talking on the telephone.

Regardless of how long it appears I have been around here, it did not take me long to wish for a rule on this forum that responses had to be relevant to the topic in question.

But of course that might leave some of you with nothing to talk about,

Here I am, guilty myself of taking this thread off-topic. Let's see if it goes even farther afield...
kewlj
kewlj
Joined: Apr 17, 2012
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February 9th, 2021 at 9:29:21 AM permalink
Quote: MJGolf

The simple fact is "post Covid" minimums have increased and conditions have worsened. Even since I was here in Oct, conditions have seriously worsened. Used to be DD games at Caesars properties, with $25 minimums during day and $50 at least at night, you still have 3-2 games (nDAS-hit 17) games. NOW they are almost ALL gone. They are 6-5 monstrosities. With still high limits. At Paris for example, no 3-2 unless playing high limit table DD $100 minimums. Cromwell advertises 3-2 BJ on their signs, so they have to have it, right? Well only during the early hours and they they convert to 6-5. Flamingo seemed to be the same. You can still get 3-2 on 8 shoe games but you have to watch because they will be right next to a 6-5 game. You would think that John Q Public would be able to figure out the difference but apparently NOT.

I will confirm that TI had one $15 DD table but it was limited to 3 players and full the times I walked through. I am here currently for Superbowl and for the couple days after. The Strip is a weird place at moment. Very low class, Los Angeles or Southern Calif clientele. I think it's because they have very cheap room rates. But food prices are very, very high........even from my last trip. And they are limiting capacity in restaurants (or the ones you would like to eat at) to 25%. I do not think I will be back for awhile, even though I have friends here. At least to the Strip.



Well the strip is the strip. lol. It has been mostly unplayable for years. I was mostly talking about the off strip and even downtown locations that are in my rotation when I said as good as anytime since I have been in Las Vegas (12 years).

The only place on the strip that I played post covid was TI in September and October. In addition to the $15 DD game, they have, a $15, 6 deck game with late surrender, or at least did back in Sept/Oct. And yes, they only had 1 DD and 1 or 2, 6 deck tables open on weekdays when I played, but that is all they needed. They were never crowded. I could usually even play heads up.
camz1969
camz1969
Joined: Dec 6, 2016
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February 9th, 2021 at 10:58:47 AM permalink
KJ, why have you considered the Strip unplayable? Pre covid there were plenty of beatable $15/25 games. Obviously they werenít great rules but the advantage is you can blend in easy vs some little hole in the wall casino. If you can hop around a lot in short sessions you can get big bets out there without getting caught. Iím concerned about current times though with 6:5. I usually donít rent a car so Iím kind of limited to the Strip and Fremont...sounds like I should stay on Fremont next time I go.
kewlj
kewlj
Joined: Apr 17, 2012
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February 9th, 2021 at 11:36:32 AM permalink
Quote: camz1969

KJ, why have you considered the Strip unplayable? Pre covid there were plenty of beatable $15/25 games. Obviously they werenít great rules but the advantage is you can blend in easy vs some little hole in the wall casino. If you can hop around a lot in short sessions you can get big bets out there without getting caught. Iím concerned about current times though with 6:5. I usually donít rent a car so Iím kind of limited to the Strip and Fremont...sounds like I should stay on Fremont next time I go.



Ok, that is probably my bad. When I say "unplayable", that sounds like I am saying "unbeatable", which is not what I am implying. While there is a lot of 6:5 on the strip at most of the Caesars and MGM properties (which basically is unplayable and unbeatable), there are games, 8 decks at lower limits, 6 decks at some higher limits that certainly are beatable, but I don't play. I don't play them because there are better opportunities for me, 6 deck, 3-2 games, some with surrender, with better penetration and less crowded conditions that the strip (during normal times).

I have my rotation which consists of about 10-12 of my best games that weekly, 1 or 2 twice weekly and another 15-20 or so that I consider my supplemental rotation, that I play twice a month. Not as good as my best games, but it stops me from overplaying my best few games.

I should be more careful using unplayable. (technically 6:5 is playable if you use a huge spread). Instead I should say less desirable to me, when there are better opportunities and games.
camz1969
camz1969
Joined: Dec 6, 2016
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February 9th, 2021 at 7:15:28 PM permalink
I understand. Do you think some of the casinos in your rotation know by now that youíre a counter and are just tolerant? I donít see how they wouldnít know as frequently as you play for as many years as youíve played. Even in short sessions at different times it seems like after years they would remember you and that you scale bets before leaving. The problem is the casinos with the great rules tend to be the sweatiest. Even just playing greens with no desire of a players card at some places is an obvious red flag to them.
kewlj
kewlj
Joined: Apr 17, 2012
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camz1969
February 9th, 2021 at 8:30:41 PM permalink
Quote: camz1969

I understand. Do you think some of the casinos in your rotation know by now that youíre a counter and are just tolerant? I donít see how they wouldnít know as frequently as you play for as many years as youíve played. Even in short sessions at different times it seems like after years they would remember you and that you scale bets before leaving. The problem is the casinos with the great rules tend to be the sweatiest. Even just playing greens with no desire of a players card at some places is an obvious red flag to them.



Definitely some both pit and dealers in my regular rotation recognize me. I am sure they know me as a local or regular player. And more than likely some have me pegged as a card counter. I try to spread it around, play different dealers maybe avoid a pit guy, especially after a bigger score. Even more important is to play short sessions which will result in more smaller wins and losses and less of the really big wins that draw attention and someone has to answer for. That is really what my whole game and plan of attack is about. Identifying and playing levels that are well tolerated and keeping it short, to avoid big wins and losses.

If you do that some, not all, but some pit folks will definitely look the other way. Problems arise when you are creating a situation that they have to answer for.

And there are all sorts of little tricks. I play my regular casinos with a chip inventory. This means I don't have to buy in, which means I have avoided the first interaction between player and pit. Now it is still the pit guys job to come over and ask about a new player, what he bought in for, in my case the dealer will say he started play with chips. Maybe the pit guy will ask me. Maybe he just marks down what I have in front of me at that moment. If he asks, I always inflate, which will make my win seem smaller or loss bigger. Kind of related to rat holing. Now sometimes if it is busy and the pit guy is doing other things like a fill or changing cards, I can get in (with chips in hand) and out without ever interacting with him.

And of course exiting at the shuffle after showing your bigger bets is a must. This mean, they never see me retreat back to smaller or waiting bets at the shuffle, and THAT is the really big tell of a card counter not raising bets. All sorts of players raise bets, progressive players, players chasing losses, players chipping up after wins, all raise bets. AND the casinos love every damn one of them. But a player retreating back to small bets at the shuffle...that is the big tell of a card counter.

So, way to late for the short answer, but yeah, no doubt some pit and dealers recognize me as a regular player, maybe a half assed card counter. But I don't rock the boat and create situations they have to answer for and so far that has equaled longevity.
HiOpt2Poor
HiOpt2Poor
Joined: Mar 28, 2021
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March 28th, 2021 at 10:28:44 PM permalink
Update for February 2021.

Double Deck $50 Minimum Noon to 3 or 4am Friday and Saturday. $25 Min Weekend mornings. Was not there on any weekdays and I didn't see any single deck.
HiOpt2Poor
HiOpt2Poor
Joined: Mar 28, 2021
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March 29th, 2021 at 5:33:24 PM permalink
Sorry My post here about the $50 weekend nights and $25 mornings was for the Wynn Las Vegas Feb 2021

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