Jumboshrimps
Jumboshrimps
Joined: Jan 11, 2010
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January 27th, 2020 at 3:12:11 PM permalink
This observation/gripe is now at least a decade in the making. At several casinos, now including the Trop in LV and casinos in Missouri and Kansas, the treatment of match play coupons is. . . questionable. If the coupon wins, these casinos (usually) replace the coupon with its face value and that's it. In other words, If I play a $10 match play coupon and put two red chips on it, and win an even money bet, the dealer removes the coupon and replaces it with two red chips and pays two more red chips to my two. So my $10 + coupon yields $30. In other casinos (including one in MO and every LV casino until the Trop a few weeks ago), the "match" bet is treated as having cash value. So my $10 + coupon bet yields $40. Significantly, ALL the coupons have fine print saying "no cash value." Perhaps just as significantly, I'm fairly sure many dealers and pit employees have no idea which is the correct way to pay these coupons. I see the same inconsistency with free play coupons. Any insights?
BedWetterBetter
BedWetterBetter
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January 27th, 2020 at 3:43:03 PM permalink
Quote: Jumboshrimps

This observation/gripe is now at least a decade in the making. At several casinos, now including the Trop in LV and casinos in Missouri and Kansas, the treatment of match play coupons is. . . questionable. If the coupon wins, these casinos (usually) replace the coupon with its face value and that's it. In other words, If I play a $10 match play coupon and put two red chips on it, and win an even money bet, the dealer removes the coupon and replaces it with two red chips and pays two more red chips to my two. So my $10 + coupon yields $30. In other casinos (including one in MO and every LV casino until the Trop a few weeks ago), the "match" bet is treated as having cash value. So my $10 + coupon bet yields $40. Significantly, ALL the coupons have fine print saying "no cash value." Perhaps just as significantly, I'm fairly sure many dealers and pit employees have no idea which is the correct way to pay these coupons. I see the same inconsistency with free play coupons. Any insights?



It's Even worse with matchplay coupons in Blackjack now, you can't double down for the total value, only the original chip wager. So if your coupon is $20 and you put $20 in chips on top and you get a double down hand, you're only permitted to double for up to $20. You also can't use another matchplay to double down and worst of all, if you are dealt a winning Blackjack, you only get paid even money on the coupon and not 3:2 or 6:5.
sodawater
sodawater
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January 27th, 2020 at 4:30:41 PM permalink
A $10 match play coupon that wins an even-money bet should "yield" $30 to use your terminology. You get a $10 payoff for your $10 in chips, a $10 payoff for your coupon. Your $10 chips bet remains, and the dealer takes the coupon on any win or lose decision. This is correct.

If you find a casino that replaces a winning match play coupon with chips and also pays it, it's making a mistake and the coupon is worth full face value instead of the normal half face value.

A similar situation is if the casino lets you bet the coupon on a single number on roulette, in which case it is worth nearly full face value.
Jumboshrimps
Jumboshrimps
Joined: Jan 11, 2010
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January 28th, 2020 at 7:09:57 AM permalink
Quote: BedWetterBetter

It's Even worse with matchplay coupons in Blackjack now, you can't double down for the total value, only the original chip wager. So if your coupon is $20 and you put $20 in chips on top and you get a double down hand, you're only permitted to double for up to $20. You also can't use another matchplay to double down and worst of all, if you are dealt a winning Blackjack, you only get paid even money on the coupon and not 3:2 or 6:5.



Seems designed to make players dislike the casino. Thanks for responding.
Jumboshrimps
Jumboshrimps
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January 28th, 2020 at 7:13:41 AM permalink
Quote: sodawater


If you find a casino that replaces a winning match play coupon with chips and also pays it, it's making a mistake and the coupon is worth full face value instead of the normal half face value.



Thanks. Fifteen years ago, every LV casino I played at also paid the coupon (10 yields 40). And I played a lot of match play coupons. Admittedly, it did seem generous.
SOOPOO
SOOPOO
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Jumboshrimps
January 28th, 2020 at 8:06:23 AM permalink
I've had both type of coupons. The 'match play' you describe is typical; it is really worth half its face value minus whatever -EV you are playing. Big roller that I am, I now only get a $5 match play per visit, and not every visit. The casino is paying me $2.40 or so to show up. I don't think I can play it at a non even money bet, by the way.

I don't remember where, but I had a 'free play' coupon, which was essentially the same as cash. If I won the hand, I got paid the value of the coupon, plus they did not take the coupon until I lost a hand. Match play makes much more sense for a casino; it requires a player to get chips to at least play some money to harvest the value of the match play. The 'free play' coupon you could just lay it down without any of your own money invested.
AcesAndEights
AcesAndEights
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Jumboshrimps
January 28th, 2020 at 8:18:46 AM permalink
Quote: SOOPOO

I've had both type of coupons. The 'match play' you describe is typical; it is really worth half its face value minus whatever -EV you are playing. Big roller that I am, I now only get a $5 match play per visit, and not every visit. The casino is paying me $2.40 or so to show up. I don't think I can play it at a non even money bet, by the way.

I don't remember where, but I had a 'free play' coupon, which was essentially the same as cash. If I won the hand, I got paid the value of the coupon, plus they did not take the coupon until I lost a hand. Match play makes much more sense for a casino; it requires a player to get chips to at least play some money to harvest the value of the match play. The 'free play' coupon you could just lay it down without any of your own money invested.


Those "play 'till you lose" coupons are the most valuable, also known as non-negotiable chips or dead chips. This gambling expert on the 'net has a great page about all the different kinds of these things. Have you guys heard of him? Used to be an actuary, has a great reference site on gambling :P

https://wizardofodds.com/gambling/promotional-chips/
"So drink gamble eat f***, because one day you will be dust." -ontariodealer
billryan
billryan
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odiousgambit
January 28th, 2020 at 8:37:33 AM permalink
Isn't that the guy who pays for rooms in Laughlin?
Jamespatrick12
Jamespatrick12
Joined: Nov 18, 2019
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January 28th, 2020 at 10:12:50 AM permalink
You can also find so kind of these guys in doha

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