dddkkk1
dddkkk1
Joined: Oct 11, 2019
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October 20th, 2019 at 3:00:11 PM permalink
There is a game of online blackjack that you can count, and I was wondering if it was worth playing, see details below:

Number of decks: Unknown to me, but at least 6
Penetration: You see at least 156 cards before it "shuffles".
Base house edge: 0.615% for 6 decks and it will be a bit higher, if it is more than 6 decks.

Important observations:
Trial 1 (after seeing 159 cards):
2 cards had zero draws, 6 cards had 1 draw, 10 cards had 2 draws, 12 cards had 3 draws, 14 cards had 4 draws, 7 cards had 5 draws, and 1 card had 6 draws.

Trial 2 (after seeing 158 cards):
No cards had zero draws, 5 cards had 1 draw, 13 cards had 2 draws, 17 cards had 3 draws, 11 cards had 4 draws, 4 cards had 5 draws, and 2 cards had 6 draws.
Note: for the above trials, when i say "x cards had 6 draws" i mean the card in both number and suit, eg in trial 1, the 10 of clubs was drawn 6 times before the "shuffle" occurred.

Advantages over counting a live/"brick and mortar" game:
. You can keep track of every card seen.
. You can spread your bets between 1 and 100 units
. There are plenty of online calculators that tell you the best play, for any deck composition
. You can break from basic strategy multiple times, when the count is in your favor to do so, eg splitting 10s
Note: if you did this at a live casino, your future play would probably be scrutinized very closely

Disadvantages ... :
. The penetration is quite bad, 50% or worse, so the max player edge will be a lot lower.
. It is a relatively new casino, so there is an unknown factor of whether or not you are likely to be paid.
. The game could be gaffed, or misleading, eg it may not be shuffling, when it says that it is shuffling the deck.

Note: There could be more advantages or disadvantages that i haven't thought of yet, please expand if you think of any.
Last edited by: dddkkk1 on Oct 20, 2019
OnceDear
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OnceDear
Joined: Jun 1, 2014
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October 20th, 2019 at 4:10:28 PM permalink
Quote: dddkkk1

There is a game of online blackjack that you can count, and I was wondering if it was worth playing, see details below:
Disadvantages ... :
. The penetration is quite bad, 50% or worse, so the max player edge will be a lot lower.
. It is a relatively new casino, so there is an unknown factor of whether or not you are likely to be paid.
. The game could be gaffed, or misleading, eg it may not be shuffling, when it says that it is shuffling the deck.

Note: There could be more advantages or disadvantages that i haven't thought of yet, please expand if you think of any.



The penetration is a killer. You'll hardly ever see a positive count >2 So you'd either waste many many hours or you'd need a robot to play for you.
The casino will have a rule that says basically "At any time we can ban you without good reason and confiscate your entire balance"
The casino will have background card counting counter measures and would spot you in a matter of hours.
.
.
Been there. Got the T-shirt.
If you are enjoying the game, you're already winning.
heatmap
heatmap
Joined: Feb 12, 2018
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October 20th, 2019 at 4:57:29 PM permalink
Quote: OnceDear

The penetration is a killer. You'll hardly ever see a positive count >2 So you'd either waste many many hours or you'd need a robot to play for you.
The casino will have a rule that says basically "At any time we can ban you without good reason and confiscate your entire balance"
The casino will have background card counting counter measures and would spot you in a matter of hours.
.
.
Been there. Got the T-shirt.



since you were counting im assuming you altered your strategy on certain situations correct? you did certain things that might have been against the "book"? ever split 10s?
beachbumbabs
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beachbumbabs
Joined: May 21, 2013
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October 20th, 2019 at 5:36:54 PM permalink
Here's something else - an unregulated online casino with which you are unfamiliar isn't particularly obligated to give you a fair shuffle.

They show an animated shuffle every so often? Why should you believe them? Could be shuffling every hand and playing an infinite deck uncountable game the whole time. You'd never know.
If the House lost every hand, they wouldn't deal the game.
OnceDear
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OnceDear
Joined: Jun 1, 2014
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October 20th, 2019 at 5:44:10 PM permalink
Quote: heatmap

since you were counting im assuming you altered your strategy on certain situations correct? you did certain things that might have been against the "book"? ever split 10s?

I never split tens. But I did play composition dependent strategy and I did ramp my bets and wong in and out.
Observed another card counter while i was playing. He aggressively ramped his bet 5 - 100+ He lasted about a month. I lasted about 4.
If you are enjoying the game, you're already winning.
AxelWolf
AxelWolf
Joined: Oct 10, 2012
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October 21st, 2019 at 2:22:58 AM permalink
Quote: dddkkk1

There is a game of online blackjack that you can count, and I was wondering if it was worth playing, see details below:

Number of decks: Unknown to me, but at least 6
Penetration: You see at least 156 cards before it "shuffles".
Base house edge: 0.615% for 6 decks and it will be a bit higher, if it is more than 6 decks.

Important observations:
Trial 1 (after seeing 159 cards):
2 cards had zero draws, 6 cards had 1 draw, 10 cards had 2 draws, 12 cards had 3 draws, 14 cards had 4 draws, 7 cards had 5 draws, and 1 card had 6 draws.

Trial 2 (after seeing 158 cards):
No cards had zero draws, 5 cards had 1 draw, 13 cards had 2 draws, 17 cards had 3 draws, 11 cards had 4 draws, 4 cards had 5 draws, and 2 cards had 6 draws.
Note: for the above trials, when i say "x cards had 6 draws" i mean the card in both number and suit, eg in trial 1, the 10 of clubs was drawn 6 times before the "shuffle" occurred.

Advantages over counting a live/"brick and mortar" game:
. You can keep track of every card seen.
. You can spread your bets between 1 and 100 units
. There are plenty of online calculators that tell you the best play, for any deck composition
. You can break from basic strategy multiple times, when the count is in your favor to do so, eg splitting 10s
Note: if you did this at a live casino, your future play would probably be scrutinized very closely

Disadvantages ... :
. The penetration is quite bad, 50% or worse, so the max player edge will be a lot lower.
. It is a relatively new casino, so there is an unknown factor of whether or not you are likely to be paid.
. The game could be gaffed, or misleading, eg it may not be shuffling, when it says that it is shuffling the deck.

Note: There could be more advantages or disadvantages that i haven't thought of yet, please expand if you think of any.

I can only think of one thing I would want to know.... What kind of bonuses are they giving, if any, and can you use them on blackjack?

I would not Venture into the situation without something more than just card counting since there's too many unknowns. The risk versus reward just isn't worth it in my opinion.
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
Romes
Romes
Joined: Jul 22, 2014
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beachbumbabs
November 8th, 2019 at 11:39:30 PM permalink
I read OnceDears first literally sentence and stopped. Definitely recommend going back in the blackjack section of these forums. There are approximately 100 threads all started because of counting "online live" games of blackjack where alllllllllll of them are the same... 8D half shoe penetration. And in probably the last 20-30 of these threads I've said the exact same thing: Avoid these games. The low penetration will yield lower fluctuations in counts meaning to make ANY amount of money at the game you'll need a MASSIVE spread from which 99.9% of people do not have the proper bankroll for. Imagine spreading $10 to $500 (and probably getting banned from the site for doing this) and needing a $100k bankroll to pull it off. Good luck.
Playing it correctly means you've already won.

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