FCBLComish
FCBLComish
Joined: Apr 11, 2010
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February 5th, 2019 at 5:57:15 PM permalink
Quote: gamerfreak

Almost certainly in the case of live Poker.



Absolutely!
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KevinAA
KevinAA
Joined: Jul 6, 2017
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February 6th, 2019 at 1:17:25 AM permalink
At the casino where I work, we employ the following strategy for stopping card counters -- if you increase your bet by a lot because the count is +, we "break the deck" (i.e. re-shuffle). The result is that the player only plays zero or negative counts. It's even more effective than barring, because who would want to play there?

I count but I'm not aggressive about it. If I were playing at a table with an aggressive card counter, and the dealer re-shuffles the deck way too early as a result, I'll just leave and play at another table, because I refuse to play a BJ game where the the hands dealt are all count 0 or negative. This is one reason I prefer to play heads-up (the other being that I get more penetration when there's only one player). Unfortunately it's hard to find a table with no one else there.
FCBLComish
FCBLComish
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ChumpChangekgb92
February 6th, 2019 at 3:22:26 PM permalink
Quote: KevinAA

At the casino where I work, we employ the following strategy for stopping card counters -- if you increase your bet by a lot because the count is +, we "break the deck" (i.e. re-shuffle). The result is that the player only plays zero or negative counts. It's even more effective than barring, because who would want to play there?

I count but I'm not aggressive about it. If I were playing at a table with an aggressive card counter, and the dealer re-shuffles the deck way too early as a result, I'll just leave and play at another table, because I refuse to play a BJ game where the the hands dealt are all count 0 or negative. This is one reason I prefer to play heads-up (the other being that I get more penetration when there's only one player). Unfortunately it's hard to find a table with no one else there.



Ever consider that the counter will just fake a large bet on a negative situation to force a shuffle?
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TigerWu
TigerWu
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kgb92
February 6th, 2019 at 3:41:07 PM permalink
Quote: FCBLComish

Ever consider that the counter will just fake a large bet on a negative situation to force a shuffle?



Haha... genius...

Somebody should run the numbers on that to see how the math works out.
billryan
billryan
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February 6th, 2019 at 4:00:43 PM permalink
Quote: TigerWu

Haha... genius...

Somebody should run the numbers on that to see how the math works out.




It's not a secret and if done effectively it cost nothing because the dealer will shuffle and you pull back your bet. You slowly train your dealers. Put out a tip for him when the count is high and its time to shuffle. Pull the tip if he shuffles instead of dealing. He'll get the idea after a few times and if he doesn't play ball, move and find a dealer who will.
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KevinAA
KevinAA
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ChumpChange
February 7th, 2019 at 12:55:11 AM permalink
Quote: FCBLComish

Ever consider that the counter will just fake a large bet on a negative situation to force a shuffle?



I wrote "because the count is +" not just that someone suddenly makes a large bet. Some people randomly make large bets. We don't care about that. It's when surveillance and/or the pit boss is counting along and knows why the player makes a large bet that I re-shuffle.
darkoz
darkoz 
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ChumpChangekgb92
February 7th, 2019 at 4:20:18 AM permalink
Quote: KevinAA

I wrote "because the count is +" not just that someone suddenly makes a large bet. Some people randomly make large bets. We don't care about that. It's when surveillance and/or the pit boss is counting along and knows why the player makes a large bet that I re-shuffle.



It has still been taken advantage of.

Gotta find the article but there was a casino that got hit HUGE doing that

Everytime the player had a +ev high count he put a large bet in which caused a card shuffle because the house had a CC person or device themselves.

The only time they allowed a few large bets to play was immediately after the shuffle when the count was neutral or when the count was negative (like you said)

The guy was blasting them for tens of thousands and then after a few days hundreds of thousands. Im not sure how much he cleaned up. Gotta read the article again

Basically he was a CC who mastered ace tracking and clumps and everytime he saw the aces and tens in a clump he purposely threw out a large bet so the house tracking him would reshuffle. He followed the clump, stuck the cut card so the clump was near the top and threw out large bets early in the negative/neutral count

Casinos will never overcome smart AP's lol.
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Joeman
Joeman
Joined: Feb 21, 2014
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February 7th, 2019 at 6:17:39 AM permalink
Quote: darkoz

...the house had a CC person or device themselves.

Is the house legally allowed to use 'devices' to count cards? Shouldn't they be subject to the same rules as the player as far as 'counting devices' are concerned?
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darkoz
darkoz 
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February 7th, 2019 at 7:37:58 AM permalink
Quote: Joeman

Is the house legally allowed to use 'devices' to count cards? Shouldn't they be subject to the same rules as the player as far as 'counting devices' are concerned?



It has been challenged in court successfully. But to my knowledge there are no regs or laws against it. Not 100% on thst though
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terapined
terapined
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ChumpChange
February 7th, 2019 at 8:24:11 AM permalink
Quote: Joeman

Is the house legally allowed to use 'devices' to count cards? Shouldn't they be subject to the same rules as the player as far as 'counting devices' are concerned?



Why would they need a device
I was at the El Cortez
The pit boss was suspicious of a bettor. She simply went through the discard pile to see what the count was
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