djatc
djatc
Joined: Jan 15, 2013
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October 21st, 2016 at 8:26:42 AM permalink
Quote: mcallister3200


-Learn to network effectively
    I recently went on a trip where I had never been, had excellent information from a friend with vast playing experience in the area. The first or second game I would have hit I was advised to play on way out as there would be ramifications elsewhere. A place I may or may not have played without additional info I knew I'd be able to get as many hours as I pleased more or less. I ended up not playing a lot due to illness, but friends can be very helpful! Trust but verify, we're all out to make $ but we all have our own approach. Some people mean you no harm but won't share info on good games. Those guys can be great. When they say somethings bad, it's the first place I check. It can be a tell.



+1000

Find people you can TRUST. One of the biggest ways to skyrocket yourself from FPDW grinder to big time AP.

It's a lot easier to teach people to learn the ins and outs of AP then to teach them to be trustworthy. Trustworthy people are worth a ton for your AP career. These days it's more about team play then it is solo, at least for the machine aspect. I spoke about a thread earlier where it's a lot better to get 4 people on a $500/hr play then it is to do a $1500/hr play yourself.

There has been a shift in casinos where new players > volume. You get all your value in a small of time as opposed to an all day event, for most cases.
"Man Babes" #AxelFabulous
Joeshlabotnik
Joeshlabotnik
Joined: Jul 27, 2016
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October 21st, 2016 at 10:05:08 AM permalink
Quote: FDEAD3709

My best advice : CHOOSE A DIFFERENT CAREER FIELD.

I believe AP's will concur ?



Actually, I do concur, and I made my living AP'ing for the better part of eight years. The concept you have to assimilate is opportunity cost. Let's assume that you're talented, diligent, and disciplined enough to be a successful AP. That almost certainly means that you're sufficiently skilled to do well in a number of other fields. And jobs, or entrepreneurship, in those other fields have benefits that AP'ing doesn't. Not to mention the fact that if you turned your AP talents in a different direction, you might make MUCH more money than you would sitting at a blackjack table or vulturing Ultimate X.

Alos, AP'ing involves travel, long hours of sitting, inhaling huge volumes of cigarette smoke, and subsisting on casino coffee shop food. I know dozens of APs, and not one of them is in decent physical shape. Some of them look like walking corpses. I was in pretty bad shape myself when I quit. I still might develop cancer from all the exposure to toxins.

Then there's the fact that an AP life is a lonely life. You operate solo most of the time, and whatever company you have at times is other APs, who are sometimes directly competing with you for whatever crumbs are available. And frankly, most APs, while on the job at least, are not great company.

I don't think that when you're an AP, even if you're successful--particularly if you're successful--you grow or develop personally in any meaningful way. Yes, you make money (hopefully). But is that all you want out of life? It's a grind job, and yes, you might view the money as the means to some delightful end. But I've never known anyone who made his/her stash and then quit to enjoy it. In fact, I know someone--very talented---who hit his personal $250K goal after eight years of effort but kept playing, and was wiped out in three months.
CasinoKiller
CasinoKiller
Joined: Jul 22, 2016
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October 21st, 2016 at 11:50:44 AM permalink
Quote: Joeshlabotnik

Actually, I do concur, and I made my living AP'ing for the better part of eight years. The concept you have to assimilate is opportunity cost. Let's assume that you're talented, diligent, and disciplined enough to be a successful AP. That almost certainly means that you're sufficiently skilled to do well in a number of other fields. And jobs, or entrepreneurship, in those other fields have benefits that AP'ing doesn't. Not to mention the fact that if you turned your AP talents in a different direction, you might make MUCH more money than you would sitting at a blackjack table or vulturing Ultimate X.

Alos, AP'ing involves travel, long hours of sitting, inhaling huge volumes of cigarette smoke, and subsisting on casino coffee shop food. I know dozens of APs, and not one of them is in decent physical shape. Some of them look like walking corpses. I was in pretty bad shape myself when I quit. I still might develop cancer from all the exposure to toxins.

Then there's the fact that an AP life is a lonely life. You operate solo most of the time, and whatever company you have at times is other APs, who are sometimes directly competing with you for whatever crumbs are available. And frankly, most APs, while on the job at least, are not great company.

I don't think that when you're an AP, even if you're successful--particularly if you're successful--you grow or develop personally in any meaningful way. Yes, you make money (hopefully). But is that all you want out of life? It's a grind job, and yes, you might view the money as the means to some delightful end. But I've never known anyone who made his/her stash and then quit to enjoy it. In fact, I know someone--very talented---who hit his personal $250K goal after eight years of effort but kept playing, and was wiped out in three months.



Agreed x100 about description of other AP'S
What goes around always comes back around
FDEAD3709
FDEAD3709
Joined: Oct 1, 2016
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October 21st, 2016 at 3:38:39 PM permalink
Speaking of career choices, had I a do over, never would have switched to the dark side, AKA, job with a paycheck and paying taxes.
Would have gone for being a steeplechase jockey, and if survived that a horse race trainer.

But as for choosing to be an AP. It's seldom a choice, just seems to happen. Perhaps motivated after being kicked in head in parking lot of Cue Club, I might guess
AxelWolf
AxelWolf
Joined: Oct 10, 2012
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October 22nd, 2016 at 2:59:56 AM permalink
Quote: Joeshlabotnik

Actually, I do concur, and I made my living AP'ing for the better part of eight years. The concept you have to assimilate is opportunity cost. Let's assume that you're talented, diligent, and disciplined enough to be a successful AP. That almost certainly means that you're sufficiently skilled to do well in a number of other fields. And jobs, or entrepreneurship, in those other fields have benefits that AP'ing doesn't. Not to mention the fact that if you turned your AP talents in a different direction, you might make MUCH more money than you would sitting at a blackjack table or vulturing Ultimate X.

What benefits?

I don't consider someone vulturing UX really an AP.
If that's someone's main play I think they are in trouble.
I don't personally know anyone who spends much time actually running around looking for them.
Most successful AP's don't even bother with them unless they just happen to be walking by and then they might check them just for kicks. UX is the last thing on my mind when I'm in a casino.
May I ask....
During what year's were you an AP?
What did you mainly play and concentrate on?
What were some of the good plays were you on?

Excluding people who just concentrated on low or mid level BJ, Pre 2003 there were not really that many AP's, especially people who were supporting themselves.

Most all the Vegas, Laughlin, Reno AP's kind of knew each other and many of the guys from out of state, even the weekend warriors.

You couldn't help but to get know everyone, at least somewhat. You would run into them constantly on plays like when there was a progressive up, a promotion, a good game, a drawing, free slot tournaments, contests, special events, you would see people over and over again. Oftentimes there were only a few banks of playable machines worth playing.

I can usually remember what the play was, who all was there and what they played if it was anything significant or noteworthy.
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
Ibeatyouraces
Ibeatyouraces
Joined: Jan 12, 2010
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October 22nd, 2016 at 8:30:47 AM permalink
Vegas sucks for UX. Many better locations out there.
DUHHIIIIIIIII HEARD THAT!
Joeshlabotnik
Joeshlabotnik
Joined: Jul 27, 2016
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October 22nd, 2016 at 8:47:52 AM permalink
Quote: AxelWolf

What benefits?

May I ask....
During what year's were you an AP?
What did you mainly play and concentrate on?
What were some of the good plays were you on?



If you worked for a company, you could get health insurance, for one thing (being self-employed, I never could, though there were a couple of outrageously priced options out there on occasion). When I worked for Bank of America, we got paid vacation, paid sick days, an employee stock program, a 50% contribution to our IRAs, and the bank paid half of our premiums on its health plan. You work as an AP, your benefits are whatever you accumulate on your slot club card. Until they cancel your account, of course.

I operated in that realm mostly from 1995-2005, and again briefly in 2011-2012. I worked 80% Vegas and 20% Reno and some CA locations. In the earlier period, I worked mostly VP-related promos. The games were pretty good in and of themselves, but there was always some kind of good promo somewhere--usually several at once. Plus, mailers and bounceback were excellent. If you couldn't find a 2% advantage play, you weren't trying very hard. Later in the period, I made a LOT of money playing poker.

I don't remember too many specifics of plays, but I remember one place that had FPJW, an inherent .25 cashback, 3X points on the weekends, and hourly drawings that were worth at least $20 each. That was a quarter play that was worth over $35 an hour. Another was a Rio scratch card promo for any win $25 or over. We played $1 10/7 DB and got a scratch card for every straight or better. They were worth an average of $7 each.

There was even some stuff back then that was worth driving to Laughlin for, but one particular greedy pro made it her base of operations, ferrying carloads of fleas down there with her to exploit promos, and she eventually burned everything out.
AxelWolf
AxelWolf
Joined: Oct 10, 2012
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October 23rd, 2016 at 4:10:05 PM permalink
Quote: Joeshlabotnik



I don't remember too many specifics of plays, but I remember one place that had FPJW, an inherent .25 cashback, 3X points on the weekends, and hourly drawings that were worth at least $20 each. That was a quarter play that was worth over $35 an hour. Another was a Rio scratch card promo for any win $25 or over. We played $1 10/7 DB and got a scratch card for every straight or better. They were worth an average of $7 each.

Don't have a lot of time right now. But wow Scratch card promo where you got to play 10/7 100.2 $1 with a straight or better playing an extra $7 a pop? What could be better. Hopefully you got a lot of time in on that.

IBBL.
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
Joeshlabotnik
Joeshlabotnik
Joined: Jul 27, 2016
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October 23rd, 2016 at 6:49:23 PM permalink
Quote: AxelWolf

Don't have a lot of time right now. But wow Scratch card promo where you got to play 10/7 100.2 $1 with a straight or better playing an extra $7 a pop? What could be better. Hopefully you got a lot of time in on that.

IBBL.



Axel, Axel, you say the silliest things sometimes. You get a straight or better about once every 29 hands at DB. So aside from the small inherent advantage of the game and the points earned, you would get an extra $7 for roughly every $145 of coin-in. You're a math whiz; you figure out how much that was worth.

Edit: I am assuming from your tone that you are being sarcastic.
RS
RS
Joined: Feb 11, 2014
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October 23rd, 2016 at 8:11:13 PM permalink
Axel was actually telling me about that a week or so ago. All the "smart APs" went to the 10/7, but there was something much better right around the corner.

You'd get a straight every 59 hands or no. Not 29.

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