dutchman
dutchman
Joined: May 25, 2016
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June 27th, 2016 at 8:16:22 PM permalink
So let's say you come into a Blackjack game and haven't been checking it out beforehand: What do you start the count at? I'm new to all this so I'm not sure how I'd get anything close to an accurate count if I wasn't backcounting beforehand.
Greasyjohn
Greasyjohn
Joined: Dec 8, 2013
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June 27th, 2016 at 9:07:29 PM permalink
Answer: Zero.

But once about 15 years ago when they had single-deck at the Golden Nugget in Las Vegas I walked up to the table and saw a bunch of small cards on the first round all sitting on the table face up. I bought in for $300, but the dealer and pit didn't know that when I put $100 out there on the next round that it was my high bet (I would have spread $25 to $100). I won the hand. I probably had about a 4% advantage and could easily of lost the hand, but because it all happened like it did it's one of those things you just remember. I was just about breaking even for the trip up until that point so that hundred dollars really helped. I don't think I stayed more than a hand or two.
Last edited by: Greasyjohn on Jun 27, 2016
billryan
billryan
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June 27th, 2016 at 9:34:01 PM permalink
Treat any cards you haven't seen as if they are yet to be played.
sabre
sabre
Joined: Aug 16, 2010
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June 27th, 2016 at 9:51:52 PM permalink
Quote: dutchman

So let's say you come into a Blackjack game and haven't been checking it out beforehand: What do you start the count at? I'm new to all this so I'm not sure how I'd get anything close to an accurate count if I wasn't backcounting beforehand.



This is a strange question.
Romes
Romes
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June 29th, 2016 at 8:19:39 AM permalink
Quote: billryan

Treat any cards you haven't seen as if they are yet to be played.

This is correct. So if there's 2 decks in the discard tray, and 1 deck behind the cut card... in a 6D game you're essentially playing that shoe with 50% penetration (because you'll never see 3 of the decks).

They're just as likely to be low as high cards, so any unseen card is treated as just that, an unseen card.
Playing it correctly means you've already won.
TwoFeathersATL
TwoFeathersATL
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June 29th, 2016 at 11:01:39 AM permalink
Quote: Romes

This is correct. So if there's 2 decks in the discard tray, and 1 deck behind the cut card... in a 6D game you're essentially playing that shoe with 50% penetration (because you'll never see 3 of the decks).

They're just as likely to be low as high cards, so any unseen card is treated as just that, an unseen card.

That is a strange answer, but in a response to strange question, might be more than adequate.
'People are strange, when you're a stranger, faces look ugly, when you're alone', or sumptin like that ;-)
Youuuuuu MIGHT be a 'rascal' if.......(nevermind ;-)...2F
billryan
billryan
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June 29th, 2016 at 11:13:08 AM permalink
My favorite place to play low roller BJ does this weird thing where after a shuffle, they turn over a card. Whatever card it is, they then burn that many cards. If its a picture card, they burn ten plus the original burn. If its an Ace, they burn one plus the original card. They offer Lucky ladies as a side bet, and think burning the cards prevents people from tracking tens.
Romes
Romes
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June 29th, 2016 at 11:56:47 AM permalink
Quote: billryan

My favorite place to play low roller BJ does this weird thing where after a shuffle, they turn over a card. Whatever card it is, they then burn that many cards. If its a picture card, they burn ten plus the original burn. If its an Ace, they burn one plus the original card. They offer Lucky ladies as a side bet, and think burning the cards prevents people from tracking tens.

If you're referring to vegas I'm pretty sure I know where this is =)... $3 min bets, right?
Playing it correctly means you've already won.
Romes
Romes
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June 29th, 2016 at 12:17:07 PM permalink
Quote: TwoFeathersATL

That is a strange answer, but in a response to strange question, might be more than adequate.
'People are strange, when you're a stranger, faces look ugly, when you're alone', or sumptin like that ;-)

You'd be surprised how common this question actually is. Every new counter knows "start with a fresh deal and a 0 count..." but what happens when you hop on a table in the middle of a shoe? That throws all new counters for a loop. Sometimes they'll INCORRECTLY take the discards in to account... So if they get a RC of +3 and there's 3 decks THEY DIDN'T SEE in the discard, they'll treat that as a TC +1, when it should be a TC +.5 because the 3 additional decks are the same as being behind the cut card.

2F I thought your first remarks to me would be something funky about the GWAE radio show =).
Playing it correctly means you've already won.
MrGoldenSun
MrGoldenSun
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June 29th, 2016 at 12:47:37 PM permalink
Quote: Romes

So if they get a RC of +3 and there's 3 decks THEY DIDN'T SEE in the discard, they'll treat that as a TC +1, when it should be a TC +.5 because the 3 additional decks are the same as being behind the cut card.



Why is that? It's not intuitive to me.

I would think it's not really the same as being behind the cut card, because the smaller the remaining shoe, the greater the impact of each change in the TC, and that is true regardless of whether you saw the first part of the shoe.

However, it also doesn't seem like it should be +1, because if you see a bunch of small cards, it is more likely that you didn't see a negative part of the shoe. So I think +1 would be overly optimistic given that you see small cards more often when the count is negative.

In other words, both ways seem wrong to me. :-/

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