Counter's Age Poll

I'd like to know roughly how old some counters are around here. (Average seems to be about in his mid 40's and Caucasian...no sh*t.) It'd be nice to know what's going on around here and to see whether or not young blood is coming into the "game" or not. (Of course you're more likely to be suspected of counting if you're a young kid with cash to spare.)

Please share

46?... 47? 48? 49?

Quote: Edge21

I'd like to know roughly how old some counters are around here. (Average seems to be about in his mid 40's and Caucasian...no sh*t.) It'd be nice to know what's going on around here and to see whether or not young blood is coming into the "game" or not. (Of course you're more likely to be suspected of counting if you're a young kid with cash to spare.)

Please share

Well, I feel you might find a difference in "counters" to "AP players" to just "gamblers" on this site. My guess would be that the "counters" on this site have a slightly less average age than "AP players", which have a slightly less average age than "gamblers." Perhaps this shows the progression of age LOL... We all start serious, counting for 1%, then we grow up a bit and move to AP plays, finally understanding EV/CE/etc, and finally once we've seen the majority of things there is to see we turn in to gamblers and play the games we have the most fun at when we're retired =p.

Correct though that the overall average age of the site 'feels' to be about 45, at least from my perspective.

Quote: Edge21

I'd like to know roughly how old some counters are around here. (Average seems to be about in his mid 40's and Caucasian...no sh*t.) It'd be nice to know what's going on around here and to see whether or not young blood is coming into the "game" or not. (Of course you're more likely to be suspected of counting if you're a young kid with cash to spare.)

Please share

Your categories are overlapping, and you are missing some as rainman pointed out. What if I'm 30 or 40 or 25? Two check boxes for each. If you get the categories sorted correctly, you should use a radio button poll and not a checkbox poll, since one person can't be two ages (uncheck the "Allow people to vote for more than one item" box to do that).

I suggest you start over with a new poll; I'm not voting due to the issues above.

Quote: rainman

46?... 47? 48? 49?

Nope, not possible be that age AND be a counter. I know a lot of people who are 45 and count. I know a lot of people who are 50 and count. But 47? That just doesn't make any sense.

Quote: Romes

Well, I feel you might find a difference in "counters" to "AP players" to just "gamblers" on this site. My guess would be that the "counters" on this site have a slightly less average age than "AP players", which have a slightly less average age than "gamblers." Perhaps this shows the progression of age LOL... We all start serious, counting for 1%, then we grow up a bit and move to AP plays, finally understanding EV/CE/etc, and finally once we've seen the majority of things there is to see we turn in to gamblers and play the games we have the most fun at when we're retired =p.

Correct though that the overall average age of the site 'feels' to be about 45, at least from my perspective.

I doubt any serious APer turns into a sucker.

Quote: sc15

I doubt any serious APer turns into a sucker.

Well I should hope the smiley faces showed the sarcasm =). I don't think I could ever turn in to a "gambler." That's just not how my brain works. Now if I lose my mind when I'm 90, who knows... but I agree. Anyone who's actually an AP probably won't ever be a "gambler."

I always heard the average age for an
AP is 25-40. After 45 most are burned
out or have moved on. 25-35 is what
casinos look for in an AP, or so I've
read. I've also read that men in their
mid 50's or older are almost invisible
to a casino as far as AP's go.

Quote: EvenBob

I always heard the average age for an
AP is 25-40. After 45 most are burned
out or have moved on. 25-35 is what
casinos look for in an AP, or so I've
read. I've also read that men in their
mid 50's or older are almost invisible
to a casino as far as AP's go.

Well said man...I've heard/seen the same.

46-49 is officially called the age of no counter

I'm 25. Should I say I'm 20-25 or 25-30?

Quote: hitthat16

I'm 25. Should I say I'm 20-25 or 25-30?

Have you been 25 for more than 6 months?

Slightly less, but on the cusp. I thought stating your age in fractions of a year ended at age 10? Haha

Of the APs I know, I'd say the average is about 28-35. I don't know their actual ages, but that's what it seems like.

On this site, it "feels" like the average age of an AP is 35-40. Average age on site for a BJ CC I'd say is about 25-35.

I feel like there is a natural progression. IMO, most start out as counting cards, since it is the easiest to gain information on, learn about, and is the most well known. When I was 19, I knew basic strategy (actually learned it when I was almost 18). But at 19, I thought, "if there's a basic strategy, what's the intermediate or advanced strategy?".

At the time, I found nothing via Google for advanced/intermediate BJ strategy. I was bored one morning and googled " how to count cards", went through the BJ school thing (free) on blackjackinfo.com. Few weeks later, with little knowledge of what I was getting into, I gave it a shot. Didn't have a big spread (1-8 on shoes)....and quickly realized, even if my EV is $3/hour, this is something I wanna get into seriously. From then on, I bought a bunch of books, read all I could on forums, and eventually started posting on forums. I started meeting up with APs when we were nearby, and we'd share information -- not much, mostly just techniques and stories. Like ways to be more efficient, how to make it look like your spread isn't that large, etc. One AP told me about holecarding. Then I knew there was serious money to be made. Started looking into machine play and realized playing BJ was practically a joke compared to machine play, HCing, and just figuring sh*t out on my own. See a casino that has some promotion. Most say "that promotion sucks its only worth 0.5%".... do some thinking outside the box and realize if you twist it just a little bit, you can get a huge edge.

Start off with CCing BJ. Then moved to HC and machine play. Then moved to just finding promotions that can be raped. Promos are hard to figure out, and admittedly I'm not the best at this. I still do all of these things, even BJ from time to time, although that's about to be exctinct from my play. HCing not so much, unless I find the opportunity, which is quite rare, at least in these neck a the woods.

Quote: hitthat16

I'm 25. Should I say I'm 20-25 or 25-30?

I think if you are 24 years, 11 months, and 29 days old, you really are 25...and go in the 20-25 category. If you are 25 and 4 hours old, you go in the 25-30 category. I am not confused by the categories. Had he used 20-24, 25-30, etc., someone would surely be asking where they should go since they are 24 years and 6 months old. This entire line of questioning is absurd.

"Started looking into machine play and realized playing BJ was practically a joke compared to machine play, HCing, and just figuring sh*t out on my own. See a casino that has some promotion. Most say "that promotion sucks its only worth 0.5%".... do some thinking outside the box and realize if you twist it just a little bit, you can get a huge edge."

What do you mean by machine play? Video poker?
And hole carding while counting? Or just playing normally?

Been reading for the past two - three months; and my first post. Go easy on me lol

Quote: gav

"Started looking into machine play and realized playing BJ was practically a joke compared to machine play, HCing, and just figuring sh*t out on my own. See a casino that has some promotion. Most say "that promotion sucks its only worth 0.5%".... do some thinking outside the box and realize if you twist it just a little bit, you can get a huge edge."

What do you mean by machine play? Video poker?
And hole carding while counting? Or just playing normally?

Been reading for the past two - three months; and my first post. Go easy on me lol

Informally welcome to 'posting' on the forums =P... Well, in my experience I think I can point you in the right direction, but I too have a question about it. Machine plays/promotions can be VERY profitable. For a prime example, anytime you see/hear the words "loss rebate" you should think cha-ching! I recently signed up at a new place that had a $100 loss rebate promotion. If at any point in time you were down $100 dollars, you could take your card to the players club, and get $50 in slots free play (or video poker of course) loaded on the card. In 7 days another $50 would be loaded on to the card (totaling $100 in "free" slot play). Well, one of the things I do is the apparently 'old fashioned' counting cards =). So while I was playing of course you have ups and downs. When I was down $100 at one point I got my card loaded with the free play. I ended my first BJ session even, but my card would be loaded with $100 in free slot play. Think about it... If you play a decent video poker game with the Wiz's simple strategy, that's almost 99.5% payback! Thus, on the FREE $100 they gave me, I could expect back about ~$99 in the long run (if I were to do this over and over and over again until the cows came home, for each $100 free play I would get ~$99 back).

I assume you're familiar, but in case you aren't or someone whom isn't reads I'll explain the free play from the loss rebate. You can't just put it in a machine and click cash out, you have to play it. Thus, if you have $50 in free play, you have to bet $50 in total. So if on the first hand of jacks or better I bet $1.25 (max coin on a 25 cent machine), say I get a pair of jacks and "push." No, what I've really done is converted $1.25 of the $50 free play to be able to cash out, because I bet it prior to the hand. So all you have to really do is just "push" after about 10-20 min, and you can cash your money out. An extreme easy way to realize this is let's say there's a $50 VP machine. You play 1 spin of $50, get a pair of jacks which is a "push" but now you can cash your $50 out because you played it.

Now My Question

Quote: RS

...Started looking into machine play and realized playing BJ was practically a joke compared to machine play, HCing, and just figuring sh*t out on my own. See a casino that has some promotion. Most say "that promotion sucks its only worth 0.5%".... do some thinking outside the box and realize if you twist it just a little bit, you can get a huge edge.

Start off with CCing BJ. Then moved to HC and machine play. Then moved to just finding promotions that can be raped. Promos are hard to figure out, and admittedly I'm not the best at this. I still do all of these things, even BJ from time to time, although that's about to be exctinct from my play. HCing not so much, unless I find the opportunity, which is quite rare, at least in these neck a the woods.

I'm quite familiar with promotions, and some machine plays... but to me these are few and far between. Is this more of a Vegas, or AC scene where a different casino has a different promotion every other day? In my neck of the woods I have a few casinos available to me on any given day... but I doubt if there's an AP promotion to be taken advantage of daily. My concern with this has always been availability. Am I just not looking in to their promotions enough? Would you be willing to share a couple "old" or "obvious" promotions as an example?

Quote: Sonuvabish

I think if you are 24 years, 11 months, and 29 days old, you really are 25...and go in the 20-25 category. If you are 25 and 4 hours old, you go in the 25-30 category. I am not confused by the categories. Had he used 20-24, 25-30, etc., someone would surely be asking where they should go since they are 24 years and 6 months old. This entire line of questioning is absurd.

The nerve of me!