My first backroom treatment
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November 12th, 2013 at 4:20:19 PM
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Hi Everyone,
I have been lurking this forum for three years and I finally decided to become a member.
First of all, I want to thank Michael for his hard work and dedication to the gaming analysis and
sharing these valuable information with the public.
I am a recreational/part-time bj counter. Recently, I spread my actions with three casinos. I lost miserably
in the Casino A and moderately in Casino B. But I was extremely lucky in Casino C and my winnings
there was way above the EV. Therefore, I still could make some profits even though I lost in other two casinos.
Anyways, I know 86 was coming soon but there was nothing that I could do. On the last day, when the count was +10,
I got tapped on the shoulder. I had about $2K chips on the table. So that, I could not just leave. They informed me that
I am 86ed permanently and lured me to the backroom. When they wanted to shut the door, I told them that I would call my
lawyer if they shut the door. So that, the door was remained open. Then they asked me to sign some trespassing agreement and
I refused to sign. At last they wanted to use the digital camera to take a detailed picture of me and I refused that also. After 20 minutes of the talk about trespassing and citation in the future, they finally released me and I could cash out at cage.
The Casino C is filled with amateur counters and those people make tons of mistakes. I even saw one of them received a loss rebate from a host. I believe that Casino C really loves counters but they just don't like the ones that are winning.
I have been lurking this forum for three years and I finally decided to become a member.
First of all, I want to thank Michael for his hard work and dedication to the gaming analysis and
sharing these valuable information with the public.
I am a recreational/part-time bj counter. Recently, I spread my actions with three casinos. I lost miserably
in the Casino A and moderately in Casino B. But I was extremely lucky in Casino C and my winnings
there was way above the EV. Therefore, I still could make some profits even though I lost in other two casinos.
Anyways, I know 86 was coming soon but there was nothing that I could do. On the last day, when the count was +10,
I got tapped on the shoulder. I had about $2K chips on the table. So that, I could not just leave. They informed me that
I am 86ed permanently and lured me to the backroom. When they wanted to shut the door, I told them that I would call my
lawyer if they shut the door. So that, the door was remained open. Then they asked me to sign some trespassing agreement and
I refused to sign. At last they wanted to use the digital camera to take a detailed picture of me and I refused that also. After 20 minutes of the talk about trespassing and citation in the future, they finally released me and I could cash out at cage.
The Casino C is filled with amateur counters and those people make tons of mistakes. I even saw one of them received a loss rebate from a host. I believe that Casino C really loves counters but they just don't like the ones that are winning.
Leave Katie alone.
Rasul: Or what?
Or I come back and break your F** legs
November 12th, 2013 at 4:22:35 PM
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Was this in Vegas?
Fighting BS one post at a time!
November 12th, 2013 at 4:27:11 PM
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No but I don't want to post the region name publicly because it is a small place.
If I am in Vegas, I would spread actions with 30 casinos without a player's card.
If I am in Vegas, I would spread actions with 30 casinos without a player's card.
Leave Katie alone.
Rasul: Or what?
Or I come back and break your F** legs
November 12th, 2013 at 4:29:12 PM
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Thanks for the kind words. I'm not an attorney, but it is my understanding that if you broke no law then the casino had no right to detain you at all. Granted, I've heard worse stories, but this still seems actionable to me, assuming it happened in the U.S.. If you need Bob Nercesian's phone number, send me a Private Message.
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
November 12th, 2013 at 4:31:43 PM
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Imagine how much manpower, surveillance operators and the like ws spent on getting one card counter off a table.......
That is why I'm saying, certain casino operators really have no clue about what they are doing. While this was going on and attention in the Surveillance room was diverted I bet they got hit by 3 hole card teams and a whole host of other things because they were so concerned with this one dude.....
If you don't want someones action, tap him on the shoulder, tell him to collect his chips and ask him nicely to cash out. In fact, give him a free buffet pass and tell him he can play any other gaming device or table on the property but BJ.
The counter will leave, enjoy his buffet and be done with it.
He may even play slots after the buffet if he has no self control :)
How hard can it really be????
That is why I'm saying, certain casino operators really have no clue about what they are doing. While this was going on and attention in the Surveillance room was diverted I bet they got hit by 3 hole card teams and a whole host of other things because they were so concerned with this one dude.....
If you don't want someones action, tap him on the shoulder, tell him to collect his chips and ask him nicely to cash out. In fact, give him a free buffet pass and tell him he can play any other gaming device or table on the property but BJ.
The counter will leave, enjoy his buffet and be done with it.
He may even play slots after the buffet if he has no self control :)
How hard can it really be????
“There is something about the outside of a horse that is good for the inside of a man.” - Winston Churchill
November 12th, 2013 at 4:43:21 PM
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A polite 86 also happened to me. I shook hands with their managers in other casino and I was told not to play BJ anymore. I simply followed their rules because there are tons of opportunities out there.
I think that Casino C was hoping to kick me out when I lost some money back. But what happened was that my winning session rate was above 90%.
I think that Casino C was hoping to kick me out when I lost some money back. But what happened was that my winning session rate was above 90%.
Leave Katie alone.
Rasul: Or what?
Or I come back and break your F** legs
November 12th, 2013 at 5:06:51 PM
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Quote: WizardI'm not an attorney, but it is my understanding that if you broke no law then the casino had no right to detain you at all.
He said they "lured" him into the back room, and never closed the door.
Seems to me he went voluntarily and was free to go whenever he wanted.
So, where's the beef?
"What, me worry?"
November 12th, 2013 at 5:15:57 PM
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No back rooming of any type for AP's should be happening in my opinion, you should never have to be taken to a "backroom" for being an AP. If you cheated or broke some other rule I can understand but otherwise just ask them to leave and leave it alone.......
Why risk lawsuits and general unhappiness. You know whose side the law is on
Why risk lawsuits and general unhappiness. You know whose side the law is on
“There is something about the outside of a horse that is good for the inside of a man.” - Winston Churchill
November 12th, 2013 at 5:16:39 PM
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I told them that I wanted to cash out the chips and leave but they told me that they needed to talk to me first.
The meeting location happened to be their backroom. I did not try to run to cage and cash out. Did I voluntarily
go to their backroom if I know that? I don't think so. At that time, I was only concerned that my chips could be cashed out and
I did not have any backroom experience.
The meeting location happened to be their backroom. I did not try to run to cage and cash out. Did I voluntarily
go to their backroom if I know that? I don't think so. At that time, I was only concerned that my chips could be cashed out and
I did not have any backroom experience.
Leave Katie alone.
Rasul: Or what?
Or I come back and break your F** legs
November 12th, 2013 at 5:26:18 PM
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Quote: MrVHe said they "lured" him into the back room, and never closed the door.
Seems to me he went voluntarily and was free to go whenever he wanted.
So, where's the beef?
I didn't catch the word "lured." If he went on willingly then, yes, he would have a weak to no case.
Quote: KickassI told them that I wanted to cash out the chips and leave but they told me that they needed to talk to me first.
The meeting location happened to be their backroom. I did not try to run to cage and cash out. Did I voluntarily
go to their backroom if I know that? I don't think so. At that time, I was only concerned that my chips could be cashed out and
I did not have any backroom experience.
I want to stress I'm not an attorney, so don't take my legal advice with much heed. That said, I think since they didn't force to go, and you never said "no," your case is very weak. I don't think an attorney would deem your odds in court enough to take it on retainer.
Of the many times I've been backed off, it was handled very politely about half the time, and the other half rudely, but never beyond that.
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
November 12th, 2013 at 5:30:04 PM
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I was backroomed only once, at Circus Circus. It
was over a slot my wife played and it wasn't fun.
They were very intimidating and treated us like we
were crooks, when it was their machine that
malfunctioned. The funny part was, my wife is the
most honest person I've ever met, and she was appalled
at being treated like she had done something wrong.
was over a slot my wife played and it wasn't fun.
They were very intimidating and treated us like we
were crooks, when it was their machine that
malfunctioned. The funny part was, my wife is the
most honest person I've ever met, and she was appalled
at being treated like she had done something wrong.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
November 12th, 2013 at 5:38:30 PM
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I think there is no case too. If I had more experience about 86s and backrooming, I might be able to avoid this one from happening.
But I hope this thread can help the others. I am surprised that no one has shared their backroom stories in these three years.
But I hope this thread can help the others. I am surprised that no one has shared their backroom stories in these three years.
Leave Katie alone.
Rasul: Or what?
Or I come back and break your F** legs
November 12th, 2013 at 5:52:36 PM
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Kickass, I think there is some question about the word "lured" that you used.
To the best of your memory, can you recall the actual words used? And the tone used? Were there multiple persons there? Were you lured with intimidation or lured with the promise of cocktails?
Someone who was lured with intimidation might certainly have a case. Threats do not have to be physical, or even spoken. Even the presence of several "guards" could definitely be intimidating, and when you say you were lured perhaps you really meant you were intimidated into going with them?
If indeed you wanted to cash out your chips and leave, but they insisted on having a discussion first you weren't lured but you were pressured and intimidated.
So again, please give us as much precise detail as possible. This could be very informative even without telling us the name of the casino.
To the best of your memory, can you recall the actual words used? And the tone used? Were there multiple persons there? Were you lured with intimidation or lured with the promise of cocktails?
Someone who was lured with intimidation might certainly have a case. Threats do not have to be physical, or even spoken. Even the presence of several "guards" could definitely be intimidating, and when you say you were lured perhaps you really meant you were intimidated into going with them?
If indeed you wanted to cash out your chips and leave, but they insisted on having a discussion first you weren't lured but you were pressured and intimidated.
So again, please give us as much precise detail as possible. This could be very informative even without telling us the name of the casino.
November 12th, 2013 at 6:15:44 PM
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When we were backroomed, they kept asking the same
questions over and over. Are you sure it was a $50 bill.
Are you sure this is your story. Over and over and over.
It was insane, and they had no humor at all about it. Told
us we could go to jail about 20 times. After 30min, the
fat one walked in, laid a 50 on the table without a word,
and walked out. Not a word. We checked out and haven't
been back.
questions over and over. Are you sure it was a $50 bill.
Are you sure this is your story. Over and over and over.
It was insane, and they had no humor at all about it. Told
us we could go to jail about 20 times. After 30min, the
fat one walked in, laid a 50 on the table without a word,
and walked out. Not a word. We checked out and haven't
been back.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
November 12th, 2013 at 6:20:19 PM
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In the casino floor, three guys with the business attire were standing about 10 yards from the BJ table. One of them came to me and tapped my shoulder. This guy basically did all the talking in the casino floor. I went to them and they told me I am 86ed permanently.
I told them that "I understand. So that, can I cash out and leave?" And that guy said "Yes, but we need to talk to you first" using a polite tone. Then, I said " OK, can I at least color up and carry the chips?" and he paused then said "Yes". I thought we are going to a quiet area in the casino floor to tell me about the future trespassing citation if I come back. But we went to the backroom and the room has a bench with the straps. The straps look like the ones that you used in the airplane. After that, there were two guys and one female in the room. I also noticed that there were couple security guard outside the door later. I pretended that I was not nervous but I was very nervous. When they wanted to take a picture of me, I walked quickly to the door but I noticed there were two security guards outside. The security guards might be a bluff but it works on me and I did not walk out from the door.
I told them that "I understand. So that, can I cash out and leave?" And that guy said "Yes, but we need to talk to you first" using a polite tone. Then, I said " OK, can I at least color up and carry the chips?" and he paused then said "Yes". I thought we are going to a quiet area in the casino floor to tell me about the future trespassing citation if I come back. But we went to the backroom and the room has a bench with the straps. The straps look like the ones that you used in the airplane. After that, there were two guys and one female in the room. I also noticed that there were couple security guard outside the door later. I pretended that I was not nervous but I was very nervous. When they wanted to take a picture of me, I walked quickly to the door but I noticed there were two security guards outside. The security guards might be a bluff but it works on me and I did not walk out from the door.
Leave Katie alone.
Rasul: Or what?
Or I come back and break your F** legs
November 12th, 2013 at 6:23:36 PM
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DUHHIIIIIIIII HEARD THAT!
November 12th, 2013 at 6:26:25 PM
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There is no way ANY casino person should be taking you to the holding room for any reason that you had described. As I mentioned before the only time I would understand is if you had commited a crime, gaming or otherwise or if you had been unruly, aggressive or argumentative.
I know that wording and situational awareness is everything here but to take you to the holding room......no, there is never a need for that!
I know that wording and situational awareness is everything here but to take you to the holding room......no, there is never a need for that!
“There is something about the outside of a horse that is good for the inside of a man.” - Winston Churchill
November 12th, 2013 at 6:27:21 PM
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Quote: KickassI think there is no case too. If I had more experience about 86s and backrooming, I might be able to avoid this one from happening.
But I hope this thread can help the others. I am surprised that no one has shared their backroom stories in these three years.
No bet restriction, no done for the day, straight to the back room? The reason no one has shares backroom stories is probably because it is extremely rare. I've been "invited" to a few back rooms but never went and it took a lot more than having a couple of thousand dollars on the table.
This makes no sense unless it was a small hole in the wall. If it was Indian be very careful. You can lose your rights on sovereign land and things can go south quickly.
Many people, especially ignorant people, want to punish you for speaking the truth. - Mahatma Ghandi
November 12th, 2013 at 6:28:51 PM
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Kickass, so you had no idea they were taking you to a security room? You were surprised there was a bench with restraints? there were several people in the room plus two guards standing outside? You were nervous. Were you also fearful? Did you feel intimidated?
Wow. Maybe the "lawyers" here won't agree with me, but I would report that not only to whatever gaming officials there are, but I would also file a police report (the real police) and talk to a lawyer. You would want your side of the story "on the record" with the police and with gaming just in case there is a pattern of this happening before.
There was no need to take you into a backroom with a bench and restraints and to have guards posted outside the door, with others inside the room with you. Just the sight of a bench with restraints is intimidating enough. The presence of guards and others adds to the intimidation. They just as easily could have let you cash out, hand you a piece of paper that explains their trespass rules, and walked you to the door.
Wow. Maybe the "lawyers" here won't agree with me, but I would report that not only to whatever gaming officials there are, but I would also file a police report (the real police) and talk to a lawyer. You would want your side of the story "on the record" with the police and with gaming just in case there is a pattern of this happening before.
There was no need to take you into a backroom with a bench and restraints and to have guards posted outside the door, with others inside the room with you. Just the sight of a bench with restraints is intimidating enough. The presence of guards and others adds to the intimidation. They just as easily could have let you cash out, hand you a piece of paper that explains their trespass rules, and walked you to the door.
November 12th, 2013 at 6:30:42 PM
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The overall winning was in the low 5 figure range.
Leave Katie alone.
Rasul: Or what?
Or I come back and break your F** legs
November 12th, 2013 at 6:31:05 PM
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After they said you were 86'ed, you should have simply stated, "I'm going to cash out & leave," and done just that.
Fighting BS one post at a time!
November 12th, 2013 at 6:32:32 PM
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Quote: 1BBIf it was Indian be very careful. You can lose your rights on sovereign land and things can go south quickly.
I really don't understand why people think they lose their rights on Indian land. Indian sovereign rights end with federal and state laws.
November 12th, 2013 at 6:33:19 PM
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DUHHIIIIIIIII HEARD THAT!
November 12th, 2013 at 6:38:53 PM
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Quote: KickassI think there is no case too. If I had more experience about 86s and backrooming, I might be able to avoid this one from happening.
But I hope this thread can help the others. I am surprised that no one has shared their backroom stories in these three years.
Did they positively ID you and did they read you any type of trespass act?
Many people, especially ignorant people, want to punish you for speaking the truth. - Mahatma Ghandi
November 12th, 2013 at 6:40:36 PM
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I was at the Isle in Blackhawk one crowded Saturday night. On way there this new cocktail waitress was not looking where she was going and I actually bumped into a seated player. I said something like, Watch it , hon. And nicely at that.
About 30 minutes later I get a tap on the shoulder and this suit asks to talk yo me. No bigee, until I notice 2 security guys against the wall. He asks me if I had a "problem" with a cocktail waitress. I gave him a puzzled look. " Never volunteer information" my Dad always told me. He says someone knocked into the waitress, causing her to spill a tray full of drinks. I just shrugged my shoulders.
Then this big security guard decided to get in on the act. Gets in my face and says " You fit her description "
I said " Barney, go watch the tapes. " turned my back and walked 3 steps back to BJ table. Waiting to be touched again and wondering
if the cops I knew when I worked at the Uereka were on duty. But nothing happened and I played for a little while longer, just because. Not saying I would have popped anybody if they touched me on the way back to the table, but you just never know what you will do sometimes till you do it.
Blackhawk jail is still next to the Eureka casino. Doubt I would have had to do anything more than post a bond. The Barney Fife syndrome is very prevalent among wanna-be cops.
Can only imagine the reports security writes praising their efforts at protecting the casino's money.
About 30 minutes later I get a tap on the shoulder and this suit asks to talk yo me. No bigee, until I notice 2 security guys against the wall. He asks me if I had a "problem" with a cocktail waitress. I gave him a puzzled look. " Never volunteer information" my Dad always told me. He says someone knocked into the waitress, causing her to spill a tray full of drinks. I just shrugged my shoulders.
Then this big security guard decided to get in on the act. Gets in my face and says " You fit her description "
I said " Barney, go watch the tapes. " turned my back and walked 3 steps back to BJ table. Waiting to be touched again and wondering
if the cops I knew when I worked at the Uereka were on duty. But nothing happened and I played for a little while longer, just because. Not saying I would have popped anybody if they touched me on the way back to the table, but you just never know what you will do sometimes till you do it.
Blackhawk jail is still next to the Eureka casino. Doubt I would have had to do anything more than post a bond. The Barney Fife syndrome is very prevalent among wanna-be cops.
Can only imagine the reports security writes praising their efforts at protecting the casino's money.
Shed not for her
the bitter tear
Nor give the heart
to vain regret
Tis but the casket
that lies here,
The gem that filled it
Sparkles yet
November 12th, 2013 at 6:45:21 PM
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Does every casino have a bench with straps in the back room? Am I the only one who wants to put up a big "group w" sign over such a bench?
In my one and only backroom experience, which followed a foolish but very innocent cash-related move on my part, I was "lured" to the back room by a guy in a suit who was carrying my cashout slips. I could have refused to follow him, but I'd have forfeited the money.
In my one and only backroom experience, which followed a foolish but very innocent cash-related move on my part, I was "lured" to the back room by a guy in a suit who was carrying my cashout slips. I could have refused to follow him, but I'd have forfeited the money.
"So as the clock ticked and the day passed, opportunity met preparation, and luck happened." - Maurice Clarett
November 12th, 2013 at 6:53:31 PM
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They took us down a long hallway to a room
that looked like Louie DePalma's office on Taxi.
Glass and very small. My wife was terrified when
they started talking about jail and wanted to leave.
I said no way, lets see how far they go. Women..
that looked like Louie DePalma's office on Taxi.
Glass and very small. My wife was terrified when
they started talking about jail and wanted to leave.
I said no way, lets see how far they go. Women..
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
November 12th, 2013 at 7:07:21 PM
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Women : I finally got Josie to call people jerks when they are acting like one. Gets them just as mad as calling him an asshole, but
is more polite. Love to use that word on management in grievance meetings. Last time I remember using it was when
Denver office was closing and got this phone call from Phoenix 2nd level. Wanting to know why only 2 people in ALL OF
DENVER were working on tickets. This was at 2pm and we were to switch control to Phoenix at 3pm. Was Saturday, 2 guys
called in sick. I told him it was because there were only 2 guys workin in all of Denver and 1 was busy talking to a jerk, but no longer.
He was hollering something when I hung up. 10 minutes to 3 and my second level came in from home. She asked me why
I called him a jerk and I said because he was acting like one with that all of Denver remark. She wanted me to call him and
apologize. Yeah, like that was gonna happen.
When I came back to work Sunday half expected my key card to not let me in the testboard. That's how some managers tell
an employee he is no longer employed. Some places just walk you to your desk , watch you pack up your shit and walk you
out the door. Some just have the security guard do it.
Always bothered me that whenever there was a bomb threat, it was the custodians ( lowest paid employees ) who were
to walk thru building looking for suspicious packages.
is more polite. Love to use that word on management in grievance meetings. Last time I remember using it was when
Denver office was closing and got this phone call from Phoenix 2nd level. Wanting to know why only 2 people in ALL OF
DENVER were working on tickets. This was at 2pm and we were to switch control to Phoenix at 3pm. Was Saturday, 2 guys
called in sick. I told him it was because there were only 2 guys workin in all of Denver and 1 was busy talking to a jerk, but no longer.
He was hollering something when I hung up. 10 minutes to 3 and my second level came in from home. She asked me why
I called him a jerk and I said because he was acting like one with that all of Denver remark. She wanted me to call him and
apologize. Yeah, like that was gonna happen.
When I came back to work Sunday half expected my key card to not let me in the testboard. That's how some managers tell
an employee he is no longer employed. Some places just walk you to your desk , watch you pack up your shit and walk you
out the door. Some just have the security guard do it.
Always bothered me that whenever there was a bomb threat, it was the custodians ( lowest paid employees ) who were
to walk thru building looking for suspicious packages.
Shed not for her
the bitter tear
Nor give the heart
to vain regret
Tis but the casket
that lies here,
The gem that filled it
Sparkles yet
November 12th, 2013 at 8:08:20 PM
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Quote: EvenBobWe checked out and haven't been back.
EvenBob, I don't want to make light of your experience because it was probably very unpleasant to see your innocent wife be falsely accused. But look on the bright side: Circus Circus is an absolute shithole, so at least it's not much of a sacrifice to never set foot in that dreadful place for as long as you live. I'd be genuinely frustrated if I had to avoid Bellagio or Wynn forever, but a Circus Circus boycott would be easy (and amusing).
November 12th, 2013 at 8:13:36 PM
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Quote: renoEvenBob, I don't want to make light of your experience because it was probably very unpleasant .
I rather enjoyed it, actually. I wanted to see how
far they would go. I had always heard about
backrooming. They acted just like cops on TV,
trying 15 times to get you to change your story.
They thought we were con artists, so we were
guilty in their minds. They were never friendly,
never apologetic. It was just like you see on TV
when people get arrested and grilled.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
November 12th, 2013 at 9:50:49 PM
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I was playing high limit double deck BJ last week at the Wynn. I was sitting with a French pro poker player. In about 25 minutes he won about 40k. We both left and I started to play craps and he joined the game soon after. We were both playing and suddenly a gentleman introduced himself as the asst casino Manager for the Wynn and Encore. he was very nice and asked the guy not to play 21 anymore. He said "you can play any game you want just no BJ" The guy said ok and that was it. Never saw that before. Pretty cool. I did ask my new French friend if he would go with me on a road trip up and down the strip!
November 12th, 2013 at 9:55:02 PM
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Quote: mdsI was playing high limit double deck BJ last week at the Wynn. I was sitting with a French pro poker player. In about 25 minutes he won about 40k. We both left and I started to play craps and he joined the game soon after. We were both playing and suddenly a gentleman introduced himself as the asst casino Manager for the Wynn and Encore. he was very nice and asked the guy not to play 21 anymore. He said "you can play any game you want just no BJ" The guy said ok and that was it. Never saw that before. Pretty cool. I did ask my new French friend if he would go with me on a road trip up and down the strip!
Poker players are generally the first to be targeted by casino execs for a varying amount of reasons.
1) The usually look to play with an edge
2) They are suually mathematically pretty sound but more sound with regards to bankroll management.
My concern is that most poker players are degenerate gamblers, not all obviously, just most.
Give them the opportunity to play anything and they most assuredly will. Phil Iveys favorite table is the Craps game at the Venetian, tell me they would back him off of playing BJ where he may win $100k when he will lose triple that on the craps game......no sirreeeee bob :)
“There is something about the outside of a horse that is good for the inside of a man.” - Winston Churchill
November 12th, 2013 at 9:56:38 PM
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Quote: mdsI was playing high limit double deck BJ last week at the Wynn. I was sitting with a French pro poker player. In about 25 minutes he won about 40k.
What the heck was his spread to win that much so fast.
"It's not called gambling if the math is on your side."
November 12th, 2013 at 10:02:49 PM
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Quote: EvenBobWhat the heck was his spread to win that much so fast.
That's pretty easy to do actually.
One hand at $1000 spread to two hands at $5000 each. 1 to 10 spread isn't huge but you don't have to win too many hands at that level to be up $40k.
Win one split and one DD or get a BJ on the big wager and you are almost halfway there.
I remember watching a very prominent NFL star of bygone days betting $25k a hand over 3 spots. Now those are some swings in your result right there :)
In Macau in the some private rooms they will let you bet an aggregate of $300k, 3 spots at $100k per spot. On Bacc they will allow you $500k per hand.
You have to have a bankroll in excess of $10 million mind you. Pocket change for some players there
“There is something about the outside of a horse that is good for the inside of a man.” - Winston Churchill
November 12th, 2013 at 10:03:05 PM
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DUHHIIIIIIIII HEARD THAT!
November 12th, 2013 at 10:07:06 PM
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Quote: IbeatyouracesI'll bet they'll get nervous if he sits at a bac table with a female.
I was waiting for someone to make that comment :)
The reason he went to England is because there is NO WAY he gets away with that in Vegas now. Aria got hit and the shutters got put up. No more edge sorting for Vegas unless you let some pratt (read schmuck) marketing VP make the call.
“There is something about the outside of a horse that is good for the inside of a man.” - Winston Churchill
November 12th, 2013 at 10:45:14 PM
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He started with 1k a hand. I sat out. it was all one on one. He had some loses but mostly won the 3k, 4k and 5k bets.
November 12th, 2013 at 10:54:36 PM
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Quote: mdsHe started with 1k a hand. I sat out. it was all one on one. He had some loses but mostly won the 3k, 4k and 5k bets.
Do you know if he definitely was counting or just having a winning streak?
“There is something about the outside of a horse that is good for the inside of a man.” - Winston Churchill
November 12th, 2013 at 11:14:25 PM
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Apparently the Casino were watching him already. I would think the Wynn wouldn't care if he won unless he was counting. I have seen many players win 10s of thousands on hot streaks in my life but this was different. This poker player was really sharp. He had an edge of some sort. It was really amazing to see. He was a pro! The way he was wagering, and his confidence was truly different then someone on a hot streak. He was speaking French with his buddies and laughing but very professional and polite. They were all in there 20s maybe 25ish..
November 12th, 2013 at 11:20:02 PM
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Quote: mdsApparently the Casino were watching him already. I would think the Wynn wouldn't care if he won unless he was counting. I have seen many players win 10s of thousands on hot streaks in my life but this was different. This poker player was really sharp. He had an edge of some sort. It was really amazing to see. He was a pro! The way he was wagering, and his confidence was truly different then someone on a hot streak. He was speaking French with his buddies and laughing but very professional and polite. They were all in there 20s maybe 25ish..
It does seem to me like he is a typical poker player. Young, large or at least stable bankroll, confident, knows the games including the maths of card counting.
I would need to know a few more details about his play though. How many spots was he wagering? If he started at $1k, what was his maximum wager on 2 spots if he did spread to two?
What game did he play, DD, 6 deck. What were the game rules, if you can recall or do have access to them?
Anyway, I'm sure he was super slick, but simply so wouldn't make him a counter or anything other than a professional gambler.
Did he play craps outside with you when approached? If he bets other games apart from BJ, I would let him play, no problems.
“There is something about the outside of a horse that is good for the inside of a man.” - Winston Churchill
