Betting variation on basic blackjack strategy

Without counting cards.

Any suggestions?

If you have an appreciation for the effects of card removal (i.e. better if lots of Aces/Tens to come) you can sometimes feel there haven't been many Aces rather than count them and adjust your bets/play accordingly. Similarly just looking at other players' hands if you're on third base might help some close plays. For instance if there were lots of cards used in the last round that would suggest there weren't many tens. However unless you know the odds are in your favour it's better to flat bet the minimum.

At a full table, look for 4s and 5s If several are out, stay on 15-16.

Quote: Mywifegambles

Without counting cards.

Any suggestions?

My take, if you are not going to count and are just going to play good BS, then it doesn’t really matter if you flat bet or vary your bet with the average bet being your flat bet amount. Since flat betting is super boring, you should vary it to increase entertainment value.

Find someone at your table who looks like they are counting. Vary your bets the way that they do, bet insurance when they do.

Though it adds absolutely zero financially, I find it amusing to do a little bit of gently progressive wagering, e.g. with a buy in of 200 I might play 5 a hand, but if I lose, follow that with a 10 and when that loses, push to 15, but then max out at that 15, not increasing further into the loss or just drop back to 5. It increases your average bet a little and is far more fun than flat betting 5 or 10. Obviously watch out for the odd hand that gets doubled or resplit because those hands can make or break you.
Another way of adding amusement is to make each wager a rough percentage of your running bankroll. E,g if you are at a $5 min table with a buy in of 200, maybe divide your bankroll by 20 and round down ( rough estimate), so first bet is 10 and your next bet is either 9 or 11. That can see you lurch ahead occasionally and when you are up to 400, you will be wagering 20 a hand. Just beware that your bankroll will tend to head downwards over time. That 10% level of wagering can usually see 200 last you several hours before you bust out or chicken out. It was 10% wagering on my first day that turned my 100 into 6000 . . . but I was very lucky that day.

If the game is fun and you can afford it and you are enjoying it, then you are already a winner.

You must vary your bet with the cards if you are going to win. Place the same bet and over time at a minimum the house advantage will put you under, not to mention bad luck streaks.

If I am playing to win, which actually these days I am just playing for comps, but anyway, WHEN I used to play to win, if the card count was good I'd either jump the bet all the way to the table limit, or, if I didn't necessarily feel it that strongly, I'd triple my bet for three hands in a row, then back off:

100
300
900

or even
500
1500
4500

If you can't win three in a row, you're probably going to go under anyway, so might as well give it your shot when you feel it. When you feel it, includes when you're talkative, happy and everything is just going your way.

What you DON'T want to do is jump the bet when things are going against you, just to catch up. Sure it works sometimes, but there is a reason why you are losing - the cards are going against you, so all you're doing at that point is trying to squeeze in a winner when you're actually probably barely winning 1/3 hands. You want to jump your bet when you're winning, not when you're losing. Sounds easy enough, but how many actually follow this simple logic?

To actually earn a profit, the one bet-sizing strategy that I know of outside of counting is "comp hustling." Bet large during the times when it most likely effects rating, and small when it doesn't.

Quote: TomG

To actually earn a profit, the one bet-sizing strategy that I know of outside of counting is "comp hustling." Bet large during the times when it most likely effects rating, and small when it doesn't.

:-)

Is it a strategy you usually use?

Quote: MDawg

<snip>You want to jump your bet when you're winning, not when you're losing. Sounds easy enough, but how many actually follow this simple logic?

MDawg,

Kindly expand on this concept. By "when you're winning", do you mean when your chip total exceeds your buy-in, or do you mean when you've just won a few (or several?) consecutive hands?

Dog Hand

P.S. Always nice to encounter another canine on this website!

Try this one, bet 10 till win then 40-50-70-90-100-110-120ect. when you loose a hand go back to 10 if you push a hand or hit the end of a shoe go back to 10, only double or split after a win, stand on hard 12 vrs 10, always stand on soft 18 if there are more than two other hands being played at the table besides you leave. Buy in with 300 if that is lost change tables, if doubled color up 500 and play with remaining 100 till lost or if turned into 300 color 200 and do it again. There you go good luck, if thats too high cut everything in half or too low double everything.

Quote: dwight56

Try this one, bet 10 till win then 40-50-70-90-100-110-120ect. when you loose a hand go back to 10 if you push a hand or hit the end of a shoe go back to 10, only double or split after a win, stand on hard 12 vrs 10, always stand on soft 18 if there are more than two other hands being played at the table besides you leave. Buy in with 300 if that is lost change tables, if doubled color up 500 and play with remaining 100 till lost or if turned into 300 color 200 and do it again. There you go good luck, if thats too high cut everything in half or too low double everything.

This advice is molten horse poop. I don't mean to be confrontational, but I just want to warn casual readers that strategies like "stand on hard 12 vrs 10" and "only double or split after a win" will quickly cause you to lose money faster - maybe not immediately, but soon and for the rest of your life.

Quote: dwight56

Try this one, ... There you go good luck, if thats too high cut everything in half or too low double everything.

I have to believe that Dwight was being humorous in giving such totally bad advice to a player who already seems to have some bad ideas of his own

Maybe both members just like to find amusing ways of losing money faster: No issue with that.

Thought that might set someones hair on fire LOL, seriously try it sometime might surprise you

Quote: dwight56

Thought that might set someones hair on fire LOL, seriously try it sometime might surprise you

Dwight, I'm a guy that Martingales for fun. That does not increase the house edge against me and it's amusing. I'd rather do that than employ a strategy that is guaranteed to increase the house edge. No fun for me in that.

I use a modified martingale with some success. I use a 3 loss system where I will quadruple the bet after 3 losses. I buy in for $1000 and play a $25 table, I take 3 chips and remove from the stack. Bet until I lose those 3 chips. Never add to those chips to go above 3. Assume you win the first bet. Add that win to the main pile. Keep your bets to the 3 chips. Lose the next 2 bets so you are down to 1 chip. Win a blackjack. Add the $12.50 to the main pile and the 1 chip to the 3 so you now still have 2 chips. Win again your back to 3, win again and that win goes to the main pile. Never go above 3 in your betting pool. Lose 1 and your down to 2 left. Next hand should be split and you lose both, you now have lost all 3. Now take 3 $100 chips and repeat the process. If you win the first bet with the $100 chip, drop back to the 3 $25 chips. If you lose the 3 $100 chips, I then go to 3 $500 chips. Again should you win the first bet go back to 3 $25 chips. Even if you lose the first $500 bet so your at 2 chips, but win the next 2 bets, you would then drop back to $25 chips. The goal is to go plus 1 at any level and return to the basic bet. After 3 loses at $500 go to $2000. I never go to the next level of $8000 I leave after 3 loses at $2000.

Always play the hand, not the bet. Exception to that is I will not split 2 tens on the first bet at a new level against any dealer up card. I also will not double down on that first bet. My goal is to get back to the basic bet level ASAP.
Have a large enough bank roll and a high enough table limit to support the system. I like to have 8K bank and a 10K table limit.
Practice this system with online free games until you can do it in your sleep and it becomes automatic.
Using this system you will almost always win. However you can and I have lost 12 hands in a row this system supports. It does happen and you lose $8000. 3 at $25, 3 at $100, 3 at $500 and 3 at $2000. I go home when that happens even one time.
I have also played all night and never went beyond the $100 chips.
Over 1000's of hours of play I am ahead over 250K.
You must be VERY disciplined in your play and bets for this system to work.
I also do some very basic card counting, more like card watching to help with splits and doubles when at the higher bet levels. That is why the betting system must be automatic.
I will also move from a $25 basic level to $50 or $100 basic level when I get far enough ahead to be playing with house money. At the $100 level you should be ahead by 32K and at a 10K bet limit table.
You can build a spread sheet to show the betting level and bank required for any bet level and table limit.
Start low to prove the system. A $5 or $10 basic bet starting point is a lot easier to mange when you first do this. I like the $25 start as in many places that is a 2 deck shoe and a higher table limit.
This system works very well for the weekend casino trips. But if you play long enough and don't have the discipline to walk away you will lose it all.
Practice practice practice before going to a real live table.

Very interesting but an awful fast jump, the thing I posted was just something I read somewhere in the past I have never had the guts to try at the casino, it really relies on a run to work. As for your way of playing if you tried it at my casino you could only do three levels and you would hit the table max. 10-300. so it would be 10-40-200, done, I will play around with it though for fun I LIKE EXPERIMENTING. I have been playing hi-lo for the past couple of years with lots of ups and downs

Quote: Chris

I use a modified martingale with some success.
Always play the hand, not the bet. Exception to that is I will not split 2 tens on the first bet at a new level against any dealer up card. I also will not double down on that first bet. My goal is to get back to the basic bet level ASAP.

Quote: Chris

I have also played all night and never went beyond the $100 chips.

Quote: Chris

Over 1000's of hours of play I am ahead over 250K.
You must be VERY disciplined in your play and bets for this system to work.

Quote: Chris

Practice practice practice before going to a real live table.

Welcome to the forum
You said earlier...

Quote:

I win a lot. In the past 5 years I have only left one casino down.

One casino, but how many times (rhetorical) Quite unbelievable. You could have been a believable lucky outlier till I read that snippet. I call BS to that! and I don't mean Basic Strategy.

So you played 1000s of hours over 30 years, You're ahead over 250k... And you spout BS about the times you don't split tens or don't double down a first hand.

I'm happy that you have found your own fun system for losing money. I'm impressed that you augment it by ignoring Basic strategy: Who'd want to double down a soft 18 against a dealer five, just because some pesky basic strategy says you should. Ignore Basic strategy. Chris knows better BS.

Is that gold coloured bridge you have for sale?

Note to new forum visitors whose name is not Chris. What he describes is a great way to lose money. Replicate it at your peril.

Quote: Chris

Over 1000's of hours of play I am ahead over 250K.
You must be VERY disciplined in your play and bets for this system to work.

No, you must be lucky. It's simple as that.

Quote: BlackjackLover

No, you must be lucky. It's simple as that.

Luck is for wimps. He has a SYSTEM. It may not work on paper, or in a simulation but that doesn't change the fact it works for him. He's 250,000K ahead.

Quote: billryan

Luck is for wimps. He has a SYSTEM. It may not work on paper, or in a simulation but that doesn't change the fact it works for him. He's 250,000K ahead.

And lest we forget

Quote:

I win a lot. In the past 5 years I have only left one casino down.

This would work fine but not sure it will overcome the times you are knocked out which at a 10 dollar table would cost 750. you are basically grinding out 10 dollar wins and hoping not to hit a bad run which if you have played much Blackjack you know they happen a lot. If you win at second level you gained 10, win at 3rd level gain 50. Interesting but somehow doubting your success. My casino for 25 table maxes at 1000. so impossible to play past 3rd level which would be asking for big loss anyway.

i am for whatever reason testing it for 10 on my game it is + 700 and have been to 3 rd level 3 times and within 1 loss of being knocked out once. Like I said I like to experiment

Quote: dwight56

This would work fine but not sure it will overcome the times you are knocked out which at a 10 dollar table would cost 750.

No, it won't.

Quote: dwight56

i am for whatever reason testing it for 10 on my game it is + 700 and have been to 3 rd level 3 times and within 1 loss of being knocked out once. Like I said I like to experiment

If you like to experiment, you should record your results. When you have a large data set, you can test any system with it.

Go to any free blackjack site and try it. Then you can make those snide remarks if you lose. The OP asked a legitimate question and I gave him an answer. And I also said if you can't walk away you will lose everything. So take things out of context that you don't agree with, on a system you have never tried, and place it someplace the sun doesn't shine. I guess this isn't a place looking for people to communicate openly about what they have found that works for them. I will never post on this site or read anything here again.

Quote: Chris

Go to any free blackjack site and try it. Then you can make those snide remarks if you lose. The OP asked a legitimate question and I gave him an answer. And I also said if you can't walk away you will lose everything. So take things out of context that you don't agree with, on a system you have never tried, and place it someplace the sun doesn't shine. I guess this isn't a place looking for people to communicate openly about what they have found that works for them. I will never post on this site or read anything here again.

It would be much more productive for you to spend your time turning your 250K profit into 2.5M or more. You shouldn't waste your time reading or posting on this forum.

I'll start with 10 units and add 1 unit to my betting every 5 hands I'm ahead; but after I get past 4 betting units, I'll add 2 units every 5 hands until I'm 5 hands past the 10 unit betting balance which is 60 units above 120 units. I'll be up 170 units after winning 35 hands.

Tried Chris's system for about 2 hours playing probably 5 hands a minute or more at one point I was up 700 playing for a 10 dollar bet, then crash down to even up 200 crash finished down 700, and that was just doing 3 levels and quiting had I done four it would have been a disaster, glad it was for fun, I will stick with counting

Quote: dwight56

Tried Chris's system for about 2 hours playing probably 5 hands a minute or more at one point I was up 700 playing for a 10 dollar bet, then crash down to even up 200 crash finished down 700, and that was just doing 3 levels and quiting had I done four it would have been a disaster, glad it was for fun, I will stick with counting

What did you consider your session bankroll to be ( I realise it's finger in the air with pretend play and unlimited free top-ups )

Quote: dwight56

Tried Chris's system for about 2 hours playing probably 5 hands a minute or more at one point I was up 700 playing for a 10 dollar bet, then crash down to even up 200 crash finished down 700, and that was just doing 3 levels and quiting had I done four it would have been a disaster, glad it was for fun, I will stick with counting

You just tried it for about 2 hours. If you try it for 1,000 hours, you may be ahead by 250K if you're extremely lucky.

Well if you quit after 3rd level loss at a 10 dollar unit, hat would be a 750 dollar loss, so you would have to take 750 to the table to complete his system and if you went another step which he claims he does but where I play the max would get you. if not step 4 would be 3x800 but anyone know playing for 10 going to 40 then all of a sudden 200 is gonna draw attention, stupid to do anyway, blind man could come up with a better plan than this

Quote: BlackjackLover

You just tried it for about 2 hours. If you try it for 1,000 hours, you may be ahead by 250K if you're extremely lucky.

Well, if you are extremely lucky you may win from the lottery instead :D