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gpl2112
gpl2112
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Joined: Jul 17, 2013
October 29th, 2013 at 12:25:17 PM permalink
first off I have read many forums ,I understand better than most people , probability odds & mathematics .I have been gambling 30 years ,tested all sorts of systems. this system requires four players .whereas I could see and understand why every other system failed ,also now understand why this wins .it works within the confines of time limit and betting limits.it requires a very substantial bankroll to operate ,a bankroll that I currently do not have .I am willing to take any challenge ,and I am hoping to discuss this further with experience gamblers .so far I have found only 3000 shoes with which to test this and did generate enough profit to make it more than worth while .it is a very complex system as far as systems go if anyone knows how I can get a thousands more shoes to test on I would greatly appreciate it .I know there will be people who don't believe hey baccarat system can work but so far to 3000 shoes and untold amounts of shoes at my residence ,it perseveres to the point where I have generated 100 times the possible session loss.during my testing I have reached a stop-loss limit only one time out of all of the shoes. of course now I have the problem that I cannot tell anybody specifically step by step with the system is that would be idiotic. so I'm sort of stuck ,but I would certainly be willing to discuss it further with anyone who has genuine interest possibly partnering up .I would not be wasting my time if I did not truly know what I have. thank you in advance for any curious or positive responses .seen enough negative responses to systems ...and frankly they are correct , have been around long enough to know when something works or does not
thecesspit
thecesspit
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October 29th, 2013 at 12:32:56 PM permalink
Right some code to shuffle 6-8 decks, and you can create as many shoes as you need.

It's not particularly hard... making sure you have a proper shuffling algorithm, use a source of chaos from the internet to make the random number generator effective and you'll be good.
"Then you can admire the real gambler, who has neither eaten, slept, thought nor lived, he has so smarted under the scourge of his martingale, so suffered on the rack of his desire for a coup at trente-et-quarante" - Honore de Balzac, 1829
Wizard
Administrator
Wizard
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October 29th, 2013 at 12:36:04 PM permalink
I have 1,000 shoes here.

I'll post more for a donation to the Three Square Food Bank. $50 for every 1,000 shoes.

Quote: thecesspit

Right some code ...



I tend to think the percentage of the English-speaking population who can Write code is less than 1 in 100. Somehow I think the odds in this case are even less.
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
tringlomane
tringlomane
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October 29th, 2013 at 12:46:25 PM permalink
Quote: Wizard


I tend to think the percentage of the English-speaking population who can Write code is less than 1 in 100. Somehow I think the odds in this case are even less.



You're right about your assumption about those who could write code. And even those with coding experience like me, it will still be a decent undertaking if they haven't kept themselves somewhat "fresh", like me, ugh. I like the donation offer too.
thecesspit
thecesspit
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October 29th, 2013 at 12:50:10 PM permalink
Quote:


I tend to think the percentage of the English-speaking population who can Write code is less than 1 in 100. Somehow I think the odds in this case are even less.



TheCesspit is shame faced on his spelling mistake.

I do realize that sitting around in a developer environment means I am a tad biased, but it is a worthwhile undertaking to learn... you may discover you don't have a winning system, but you do learn better how these pesky computers work.
"Then you can admire the real gambler, who has neither eaten, slept, thought nor lived, he has so smarted under the scourge of his martingale, so suffered on the rack of his desire for a coup at trente-et-quarante" - Honore de Balzac, 1829
petroglyph
petroglyph
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October 29th, 2013 at 1:00:17 PM permalink
Quote: Wizard

I have 1,000 shoes here.

I'll post more for a donation to the Three Square Food Bank. $50 for every 1,000 shoes.



I tend to think the percentage of the English-speaking population who can Write code is less than 1 in 100. Somehow I think the odds in this case are even less.





Everybody in the Yukon knows about code, that's why they come down here. [sniff, tissue, sniff]

It's code all the time.
Wizard
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Wizard
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October 29th, 2013 at 7:20:47 PM permalink
I'm thinking of throwing up some more shoes on my site anyway. The 2,000 I have now show every card, which may be more information that is needed. What do you think of this format:

1-PPBBPPPBBBBPBPPTPPBPPPBPPBTTBPBPBBBBBBPPBBBPBBTBBTPBPBBBBBBPTBPBPBBTBBBTBBBBBPPTP
2-PBBPPTPPPBBPBPBPTPPTPPTPBBPPBBBPBBBPBBPPBPPPPBBPPPPPTBPBPBBBPBPBBBPPPBPBPBTBBBBPPPP
3-PPPBPBBBBBPBBBPBBBBBPPBPPPBPBPBPBTPPBTPBPBBTPBBBBBBPBPPPPPPPBPPBPBPPPPBPPTBPBBTTBBP
4-PBPPBTBBBBTTBPBBBTPPPPPBPPPBPBBBBBPPPPBPBPBPBPBBPBBPPTTBPBPBBPPPPBBBBPTPBBPPPBBPTB
5-BBPBBPPPBBBPTPTBBPPBBPPPPTBPPBPBBBPPPBBTBBPBBBPPBPPBPBPPPBPBBTBPBBTBBPBTBBBPBBTPBBP
6-PPPBPBBPTPBBBPBBPTBBBPBPPBBBBBPPTBPPTBPBPTBPPBPPBBPPBBTBPBBPTBBPBBBPPBPBPBBTBPBPPBT
7-BBPBBBBTBTPPPPBBPTPBBBBPBPPPBBBPBPPPPPPBBTBBPBBBPPBBPBBTPBBBPBPBPBPPBBPBPBBBBTBBB
8-PPPPBPBPPPBBPPTBBBTPBPPBBPBTBBBTPPBPTBPTPPBTBTBBPBPBPBBPBBPBBPBPPBPPBBBBPBPPBTBPPPPB
9-BPBBPPPPPTBBPBPTPBBPBPBPPPBPBPPBBPTBBPPBPPPBPPTPBPBTBPTBPBBPPBPBBBBBTPPBPPBBBPPPTTBP
10-BPBBPPBPPBPPBBPBPPBBPPBPPPBPBBPPBBBPPPPPTPPBPBTBBPTBPBPPBPBBBPBPPTPTPPBPBPPPTBPPBBPP
11-PTBBBPBTBBBPPPPBBBBBBBPBPBPBBBBPPPPPBPBBBBBBPBPPBBBBPPBPTPPBBBPTPBBPPBBPBBTBPBBBBBP
12-PPBBBPBPPPPBPBTTBPBBBPBPPPTPBPBBBBPBPBBBPBBPBPTPPPPPPBPBBBBTPTPBBBPPBPBPBBBPTPPBBP
13-PPPBPBBBPPPPBPTPPBPBPPBPPPPPPPPTPPBTBBPBPPBPBBBPBTPPPPPTPPTTTBTPPBBPPPPPPBPBBPPP
14-BPPPBPPPBBPPPBBPPBPTPBPBBPPPTPBBBPTPPPBPTBPTPBTPBBBBBTPBPPPBPPPBBPBPPBBBPPPPBBBBPP
15-BPPPTBPTBBPBBTBBBBTPBBPPBBPPPBTPBPPPPBPBBBPBBTPBBPTTBPPBTPBBBBPPPBPBBBPBBPPPPBBP
16-BPTBBBPBPPPTPBPBTBBPPPPPTPBPPPTBPPPBBBPBPPBPBTBPPPPTPBBPBPPBBPPPBBPBPBPTPBPTBPPPPBB
17-BPPPPPPPPPBBTTBPBPBTBBBPPPBPBBPPBBBBBTPBTBBPPBBTBBPPBBPPBPBBBTBBPTPBPPTPBBPBBPPB
18-PBBPPBBPBBPBPBTBPPPPPBTBPTTTPTPTPPPPBPBBPBPPPTBPBTTBBBBTPPBBPPPPBBTPBBBBBPPBBBPP
19-TPPBTPPBBPPBBPBBPPBBBTPBPBPPPBTPBBPBPPBBBTTBTPPBPPPBPBBBPTBPBBPPPBBPPBPPTPTPBBPBBB
20-PBPPPBTBPPBBBBBBBPPTBPTPPPBBTBBTPBPPBPBBPPPPBBBPPPBTBBBPBPPBBBTBBPPBTBBBBBPBBPBBB
21-PBPBTBBPBBTPTBBPBBBPPBTPBTPPBPPPPTBPBBPPBPPPTPBBPPPBTPPBPPPPBPPTTTPPBBBBPBBBPBPP
22-BPBPBPBBBPPBBPBPBPTPBBBTBPPPBPBPPBBBBPPPPBBPBPBBBPPPPBBBBBBPPPPPPPPBPBBPPPBPBPBPBBBPTP
23-PPTBBBPTBBBPPBBPBBBPPBPPBBTPPBBBPPPBPPBTPBBBPPPBPBPBPPPBPTBPPBBTPBPPPBBBPTBPPBPTTB
24-BPBBPPTTBBBPPPBBPBPBPPBBPPTPPBBBPBBTPBPBBTBBBPBTPBPBBTPPPPTPPBPBPTBPBPPPPPBTBBBPPPB
25-PBPTPPPBBBBBPPBPBTTPBPPPPTBPBPPPBBPPBBBTBBBBPPPPPBPPBBPBPBBBPBBBPPBPBBPBPPPPBBBPB
26-TPBBBPBPPBPPPTBBPPTPPPTPPBBTPPPPPPPBPBPBPBPPPPBPPPPPBPTPBBBBBPBBPBPTPBBTPPBBBPTT
27-PBTPPTTBBBPPPBPBPBPBBPBPBBTPBPPBBBBBPPBPPPBBPBBBBPBBPBBPPPBBPTBPPPBTBBTBBTTTBBBTBBPP
28-PTBPTBBPBPBBPTBBBPPPTBPPTBTBBPPBBTBTBBPPBPPPPBPBTBTPBPPPPPBPBBPPBPPBBPBPPBPBPPBBTPB
29-BPBPTPBPPPBBBBPBPPBBBBPPBBBBBPBBPBBPPPTBBBBPBBPPPBPPPPPBPBBPBPPBPPTPPBPPBPPBBPTBB
30-PBPPPBBBBBPPPBTPPPTPBPBBTTBPTBBPTPBPPBTBTBPPPBBBTBPBPPPBBBPBPPBPBPPTPBBBBPPBBPBBPBP
31-PBBPBBBBBBPBPBBTPTPTBBPPTTPTBBBPPPPTPBTTBBPBBPPPBBPBBBTBBPPBBBBPPBBBTBBBPPBPTBBTPB
32-PBBPBTPBPPTPPPPPBPTBPPBBBBBBBBBBTBPBBPPTBPPPTPPBBPBBBBBPBPPBPPPBBPBBPBPPPBBBPTPPBPPP
33-PPBPBPBBPBPBBPPBPBPBPPBPPBPPPPBPPPBPBBBPBPBPPBBPBPBPBTPBBPBBPBBBBPBPBPPBPBPPPBPBPPB
34-BPPBTTPBPPPPBBPBBPBBTPTBTTBBBBTPBBPPPPBPBBBBPPBBBBPPPPTBBBPPPPPBBPBPPTBTPBBPPPPPTBPP
35-TPTBPPPBBBPBBPBBPPPBPPPBPPPPPPBPPTPBTTPTPPBPPPBBBPPPPPPBBPBPBPPTBBPPPPBTTTPBBPPBPB
36-BBTBBPPPBPPPPPBBPPPPBPPPBBBPPPBTPPBBPPBTTBPBPPPPBBPPBPBBPPPPBPPBBPPBPPTBBBPPBTPBPB
37-PPBPPBBTBPPBBTTBBBBPBPPPBPPBBPPPTTPBPPBTPBPPPBPPPBPPPPBPPBBPBBBPPBPPBPBPBBBBBPBBBTBPB
38-BBBPPPPBPPPBPBPBPTPBBPBPPBTBPPPPPPPTPBBBPPBPBBBTPBBTPTPBBPPPBBBBPBBBBPTPBBBBBBTBPBT
39-BTBBBBPBBPBPBBPPPPPBPBBPPBPBBPPPTBBTTPBBPPPPPTPPPBBPBBBBPTBPPBPPPBPBPBBBPPPTPBBBBPPB
40-PPPBBPPBTBBBTPPTTPPBBPTPPBBPBBBPBBBBBBBBBBPPPBBBPBPBBBPBBBBPPBBPPPTBPBBPPBPBBBBBP
41-PBBBPBBBBBBBBBBTPPPPBPBBPBPBBBBPBPBTTBBPBPBBBPBBPPBBPPBPBBPPBBPPBBBBTBPTBPBBTBBPBPPBT
42-TBPBPTPBPBBBBPTBBPPPPBBTPBBPTPPPBBTBPPBBBBPBBBBBPBPBTPPPBBBPBPBPBBPPBPBBPBBBBBPPBBTBPBT
43-BBBBPPPPPPPPPPBPBTTPBPBPBTBPBBPBPBBPBPTBPTBTTPBBBBBPTPPBBPBBTBBPPTPPPPTBPBBBTBBBPTT
44-PBPBTTBBBPPPBPPBPBPPBBPBBPPPPBPBBBBPBPBTPPBBPBBPBBPBPTPTBBPPPPPBPPBPBPBPPBPPBPPPBPPB
45-PPBPBPBTPBBPPPTPPBTBPPPBBBBPBBTPBPPBPPBBBBBPPTPBBPPBPBPTPPBBPTBBPBBBBBTBTTPBBPBTBBPPB
46-PBBBBPBBPBBPBPPBPBBBBPBBBTPBPPPBBPPBTPPPPBPPBPBPPBPTBBPPPPBPPPTPBBBPPPPBPPBBPBPBBB
47-PBBBPBPTBPBPBBBTPPBPBPPPTBBPPBBPBTTBPBBTPPBTBBPPPPBBPBPBBBBPBPPBBBPPPBPBBPTPBBTBPBPP
48-PPBTBPPPBPBBBBBBTBTBBPBBPTPPBPBPBBBTBPBPBPPBBBPPBBBTBPBPBBTBBPPBPBBPBPPPPBPPBBPTP
49-BBPTPBPPBPTPBPPPBBBBPPBBBPPBTPPBPBPBPPPBBBBTPPPBBBBBBTBTBPBPBPBBTTBPBPTBBBBTPPBBPPPBPP
50-PBTTBBBBPPBTTTPBPBBTTPBBPBPTBTBBPPPBBBBPPPBBBPPPTPBBPPTTBPPBPPBBBPPBBBPPPBBBBTBPB
51-BBPPBBPPTBBBPBBBPPPPPBBTBTPBPBPPPPBBBPPBBBPPBPTBPBBPPBPPBBPPBPTBPBPBBBBPPBPPTBBBBPBPBP
52-BBTPBPBPPPPBBPBBPPTBPPPPBTPPBPBPTBBPBBBPPBPBBPPPBTPBBBBPBBBPPBBBPPPBPPPPBBTPPPPPPTB
53-BTPPBPPBTBBPBBBPBPBPBBBBPPTBPTPBTBBTTBPBPBBBBPBPBPBBBBPPPTBTPBPBBBPBTBBPPBBBBBPB
54-PBTBBBPBPPPBBBBBBPPPBBBBBBBBPBBPPBBPPPPBBBBPPPPBBPTPBPBPPPPBTTBPBPPBPPPBBPPPPBPPBPBP
55-PBBBPPBBBBBPPPPPBPPTPTPBTPBPPPPPBBPBPPPPBPTPBPPBTPPPPPBPPPBTPTBBPBPBBBPBBBBBPBPB
56-BTPBBPBTBPBPTBPBTPPPPPBTPBPBPPBBBBBPBPTTBBPPBTBPPTBPBBPBBPBPBPPPBPBPPPBBBBBTBPTPB
57-PPPBPBBBBPTPPPBTPBTPBBPBPTBPTBPPBTBPPPBPBPPTBPBBBTBPBPBPBPTBPBBTPPBPBBBPBPPPPPBPBPP
58-PPPPBPTBBBBPBPPPBPBBBBBBPPBTPTPPBPPBTBPPBPPPPBBPBBPBTBPTTPBBPPBPPBPBBPPPBBBPPPPBT
59-BPBBBBBPBBBBPBBPBPPBBBBPPBPBBPTBPPPTBPBPPBPPBBPPPBPPPBTBBPPBPPBBPBBBBBTPPPPPPBPP
60-BPBBPPPPBPPPTTPTPBBTBBBTPBBBBPBPPTBBTPBBPBPBBPPPBBBBPBBBBPPPBPBPPBBPBPBBTBBBPBBTPBP
61-PTPBBBPPBPPPBPBPPBPBBBPBPPPTPBBPTBTBBPBBBBPPBPPPPBTTBTBPPPPPBBBBBPBPBPPTPPPBPPBPBBBBB
62-BPPPPBPPPBTBBPPBPBPTBPPBBBPBPBPTBBTBPTBBBTBBPBPBTPBPBPPPPBBPPPBPPPPPTBPPPBPBBBBP
63-BBPTBPPPPPBBBTBPBPPBBBBPBBTPBPBBPPPBBBPPPPPPPBBBPPBPPPPPBPPPPPPPPPPPPPTPBBPBPBPBBT
64-BPPPBPPPBPBBBPBBBBBPTPBBTBPBBBBBPPTBBBPTPBPPPBPBBPBPBBPPPPBPPPPPTBPBBTBPPBPBBBBBBP
65-BBBPBPPTPBTBPPTPBPPPPPBPBBBPTPBBPBBBPBBPBBBPTPBPBTPBPBBBBBBPBPPBBPBBTPPPPBPBPPBT
66-BTBBBBTTBPPPBPPPPPPPBBPBBPBPPPPPBBBPPBPPPBTBBPBBPPBBPPPTBBPPBPBPBPBBBBPTTBBBBBBBB
67-TPPBBPBBPPBPPBPPPBBPBBPPBPBPPPPBPBBPTBPBTBBBBBBPBPPPPPPBBBPPPPBTPBBPBPBBBPPBPBPPPBB
68-BBPPBBPBPPTBBBPTBPPBPTPBPPPBTBPPPBBBPBBBBBBPBPBPPBPBPBBPBBPTPBPPBTBTBPTPBPBPBPBPBBB
69-PBPBBBBPBPBBBPBBBPBBPBBTPTPBBBTPPBPPTPBPBBPBPPPBBPBBBPBBBBBBBPPBBPBBBPPPBPPPBBBPBPPP
70-BPPPBBTPPBPBBPPPBPBBBPBPPBBBBTPBBPBBBPPBBPTPTBBPBBBBBBTPBBBTBBBPPPPPBPPBPBBPBPBPBPB
71-BBTTPBPPBBPPPBTPTPBPPPBBBBBPBPBTPPBTPPPPPPTBTPBBPTPPPPPBPPPTBTPBBBBPPPBTPBBBPBTBT
72-BPBBPBBPTBPPTBPPPBPBTBBBPBPPPBTPBBPPBBBPPBPTBBPBBBBBPBPPPTBPTPBTPPBBBTBBPBPPPPBPPBBBBP
73-BPBPPPPBBPTTPBBBPPBBBBBBPBTPBPBBPBPPBBBPBTPBPPPBTBPBPPBPPBBBPBPPTPPBBPBTPPBTTPTPBBP
74-PTBTTBPPPTPPPPPBPTBPBBBPTBPPPTBPBPPBPPPBPTPPPBBBPBBPPPPBPBPPBTPBBTPBBPPBPBPTBTTBPB
75-BTPPBBPBTBPBPPPPBPPPPPTBPBTTTTBPBPBBTBBPPTPPPTBBBPBBPPPBPPPBBPBBPPPTBBBPPBPBPPPPPPB
76-PBBBBBBPPPBBBBPBPBPBBPPBTBBPBPPPBBBBPPPPPTBPBPPPPBPBPTBPPBBBPPPTTBTBPBPBPPBBBPTTBBPB
77-BTBBBBBPBBTPPPBBPPBTTBPPPBPTBBBBBPPPPPPBTTBPPPBBPPBBBBPPBTBBPPBPPPBBBBPBBBPBPBBPBPP
78-BPBBPPPBBPPPBBPPBPBPPPPPPPPPPPTPPPPPPBBBPTPPTBPTBTBPPBPBTPBBPBPPPPBTPPPBPBBPBBPBP
79-BBPTBPPPBTPBPPBBPBBBTBPBTBPBBBBBPPPPTPPBTBBPBBBPPBTBPPPPBTPPPPBBBBPPBPBPBBBBPTBPBPBBB
80-PPBBBPPPPPBPPTPBPPBPPPBTPPBBTBBTBBBPTBBBPBBPBBBPPPPTPPBPBBPPPBBPPTPTPPPPPBBBPBBBBBP
81-BPPBBPBBBBPPBBPBPTPBPBBTBPBPBBBPBBPPBPPBPBPBBPBBPBPPBBPBBBPPPPBBPTBBBBPPPTPBBBBTPBP
82-PPBPPBBBBTPPPBPBBBTPBBPPTPPPPBBPBPBPBPTBBBTTPBPBTBPTBBBBBPBPPBPPPPBBBBBTBBPPBBBBBPP
83-PPBPBBPPBPPBPPPTBBBPPBPPPPBBPBPPPPBBBTPPPBPPPPPPBPBBBPPBBPPPPTPBBTPTPPBPBPTBBBBBPP
84-PBBBBPPPBPPTTBBBBTBPPTBPPPBPBPTPBBPBBPPPBBPPBTPBPBPPPBBPPPTBBPPBBBPBBBPBBPBBPPBTPBPP
85-PPTBBPBTPBPPPPPBBBBPBTPTPPPPBBBPBBBBPBBPPPBTBPBBPBBBBPBTBTBTPPTBPBBTBBPTBPPPPBBPPP
86-BBBPPBBPBPPBPPPBBPPPBBBBPPPBBPBPBBBBPBBBPPPPBBBPBPBBBPPTBBBTPBBBBBBBBPPPTBPTPPPBBPPP
87-BPPPBPBBPBBTPBPPTBPPBBBBPPPPTBBBPPPPBBBBBBPBBBBBBPPBBTPPBBBPBPPTPBPPTTPPTPBBPBPPPPT
88-BBBBBBTTPBPBPPPPPTBBPPBPPPPBPTPBBBBBBPBTPBPBBBPPBBBTPPPTBBBBBPTPBBPPBBPBBPBBPPPPBBP
89-BPBPBBPPTBPPBBBBPBBBPBPPPPBBBPPPPBBBPTBBPBBPBPPBPBTPBBBPPTBBPPBPBPPBBPPBPBPPTPPBBBPPPTP
90-PBPBTBPBPPPBPPTBPPPPBPPBBPPBBBBPBPPBBPTPBBPBBPBBBBTPPPPPPPBPTBBBBBPBPBPBBBBPPPBPBPPTBBPP
91-BBTPBTPBBPBBPBBBPPPPBBBBBBBBPBPTBPPBBBPBBBBPBBPPPBBPPPPBBBPPBBBPBBBPPBBPBTPBBPBPPPPT
92-PPBPBBPBBPPBPBBTBPBPPBPPTBBPPBBBBPBBBBBBPPBBTPPPBPPPBPBPPPBBPTBPBPBTBPBBPPBTBPBBP
93-BBBPPBBBBBPBBPPBBPTBBTPBPPPTPBBPPPBBBTBPBPPBPPPBBBBPBPPPPBBBTBBPPPPBBPBPPBBPBBPPPBPB
94-BPBPPBPPPBTBPBBBBBTBTBBPPPBTBBPPPPBBPPBBPBPBPBPBPBPTPBBBPBPBBBPBBBPBBPPBBPPBPPBBBP
95-PBPBBBPPBPBBBBBPPBPBPBBPPBBPBPTBPPPPTBPPPBPPPPTBTBBBBPBBTPBBPPPBPTBPPPBPPBPBBPBTBB
96-PBTPTBBPPBPPBPBBPBPPPBPBTBBTBBBPPBPPBBPPPPPBPBBBBBPTPBBPPBPPBPPPPPBBPPPTPPBBBBPTPB
97-BBBBBPTBBPBBPPPBBPPBPPBPBBBPTBBPBPPPBPPPPPPPPTTBTPBPBBPPPPBPBBPBBPPPBPBBBBPBBPPPPBBB
98-TPBBBTBPPBBBTPPTBPPBPBPPPPPPPBPBBBPPPPPBBBBBBPPPPBBPBPBTPTTPBBPPPPPBPBPBBPPPPPBBP
99-PTPPPPBBPPBPPTBBBPBBPPBBPPBPPPBPPBPPBBBPPBPBBPBBPBTBPTPPBPTPPPTTPBPTTPPBPBBPPTPBB
100-TTTBPBTTTPPPBPPTBBBPPPPBBBPBBTBBBBPPBPTPPBPBBTBPPBBPPBBPPPPPBPTBTTBPBPPBBPPPBBBPB
Total player wins = 3689, ratio = 0.446178
Total banker wins = 3788, ratio = 0.458152
Total tie wins = 791, ratio = 0.095670
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
rainman
rainman
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October 29th, 2013 at 7:31:13 PM permalink
I think I see a pattern developing. Hmmm... perhaps this could be the start of a winning system. :)
AxelWolf
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October 29th, 2013 at 7:46:59 PM permalink
Quote: gpl2112

first off I have read many forums ,I understand better than most people , probability odds & mathematics .I have been gambling 30 years ,tested all sorts of systems. this system requires four players .whereas I could see and understand why every other system failed ,also now understand why this wins .it works within the confines of time limit and betting limits.it requires a very substantial bankroll to operate ,a bankroll that I currently do not have .I am willing to take any challenge ,and I am hoping to discuss this further with experience gamblers .so far I have found only 3000 shoes with which to test this and did generate enough profit to make it more than worth while .it is a very complex system as far as systems go if anyone knows how I can get a thousands more shoes to test on I would greatly appreciate it .I know there will be people who don't believe hey baccarat system can work but so far to 3000 shoes and untold amounts of shoes at my residence ,it perseveres to the point where I have generated 100 times the possible session loss.during my testing I have reached a stop-loss limit only one time out of all of the shoes. of course now I have the problem that I cannot tell anybody specifically step by step with the system is that would be idiotic. so I'm sort of stuck ,but I would certainly be willing to discuss it further with anyone who has genuine interest possibly partnering up .I would not be wasting my time if I did not truly know what I have. thank you in advance for any curious or positive responses .seen enough negative responses to systems ...and frankly they are correct , have been around long enough to know when something works or does not

How much of your own money are you going to put up? Or are you wanting other people to put up the funds for your information? AKA a free roll?
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
AxelWolf
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October 29th, 2013 at 7:49:27 PM permalink
Quote: AxelWolf

How much of your own money are you going to put up? Or are you wanting other people to put up the funds for your information? AKA a free roll?

If your system works just play it online at small stakes, build up your bankroll then move up limits. You don't need other people.
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
petroglyph
petroglyph
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October 29th, 2013 at 7:56:12 PM permalink
Quote: rainman

I think I see a pattern developing. Hmmm... perhaps this could be the start of a winning system. :)





Stair at it long enough you can make out a face.
AxelWolf
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October 29th, 2013 at 7:56:53 PM permalink
Wizard I think you should have a specific rule that states you may not use this site to entice or recruit players in any way, for any mathematically unproven system.
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
Tanko
Tanko
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October 29th, 2013 at 7:57:16 PM permalink
Quote: Wizard

I'm thinking of throwing up some more shoes on my site anyway. The 2,000 I have now show every card, which may be more information that is needed. What do you think of this format:

1-PPBBPPPBBBBPBPPTPPBPPPBPPBTTBPBPBBBBBBPPBBBPBBTBBTPBPBBBBBBPTBPBPBBTBBBTBBBBBPPTP



Perfect format.

Too bad we don't see streaks like those with real cards.

Maybe in Canada.
MathExtremist
MathExtremist
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October 29th, 2013 at 8:19:26 PM permalink
Quote: Wizard

I'm thinking of throwing up some more shoes on my site anyway. The 2,000 I have now show every card, which may be more information that is needed. What do you think of this format: (snip)


I'd use a CSV format for at least the data, and probably also the summary data for comparison. How about:
ShoeNumber, Hand1, Hand2, Hand3, Hand4, ..., HandN
ShoeNumber, Hand1, Hand2, Hand3, Hand4, ..., HandN
...
ShoeNumber, Hand1, Hand2, Hand3, Hand4, ..., HandN
Player, 3689
Banker, 3788
Tie, 791
You can dump that directly into Excel and compute various things from it, including the P/B/T ratios. But the initial structure requires more parsing than CSV.
"In my own case, when it seemed to me after a long illness that death was close at hand, I found no little solace in playing constantly at dice." -- Girolamo Cardano, 1563
Wizard
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Wizard
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October 29th, 2013 at 8:37:38 PM permalink
Quote: MathExtremist

I'd use a CSV format for at least the data, and probably also the summary data for comparison.



I argued with myself about that. If I put a delimiter between each hand it will double the size of the file.
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
Mission146
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October 29th, 2013 at 9:25:32 PM permalink
Quote: AxelWolf

Wizard I think you should have a specific rule that states you may not use this site to entice or recruit players in any way, for any mathematically unproven system.



Every system is mathematically proven, just not the way the system player wants it to be!
https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/off-topic/gripes/11182-pet-peeves/120/#post815219
Buzzard
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October 29th, 2013 at 9:29:56 PM permalink
While I am not opposed to intelligent discussion and mathematical soundness, it does get boring after a while.

The system is only unproven until it arrives here for inspection.
Shed not for her the bitter tear Nor give the heart to vain regret Tis but the casket that lies here, The gem that filled it Sparkles yet
MathExtremist
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October 29th, 2013 at 11:11:54 PM permalink
Quote: Wizard

I argued with myself about that. If I put a delimiter between each hand it will double the size of the file.


True, but it's not the 1980s anymore. The distinction between 1 vs 2 MB is negligible w.r.t. modern storage limits, and that's far more data than you're likely to generate. These days I almost always favor saving time over space.
"In my own case, when it seemed to me after a long illness that death was close at hand, I found no little solace in playing constantly at dice." -- Girolamo Cardano, 1563
AxelWolf
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October 30th, 2013 at 1:36:58 AM permalink
Quote: Mission146

Every system is mathematically proven, just not the way the system player wants it to be!

ok add the word winning. and I was serious about that. Why are people allowed to openly try to recruit people here? I have a feeling a rule concerning that would discourage some people.
♪♪Now you swear and kick and beg us That you're not a gamblin' man Then you find you're back in Vegas With a handle in your hand♪♪ Your black cards can make you money So you hide them when you're able In the land of casinos and money You must put them on the table♪♪ You go back Jack do it again roulette wheels turinin' 'round and 'round♪♪ You go back Jack do it again♪♪
Wizard
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October 30th, 2013 at 7:07:39 AM permalink
Quote: MathExtremist

True, but it's not the 1980s anymore. The distinction between 1 vs 2 MB is negligible w.r.t. modern storage limits, and that's far more data than you're likely to generate. These days I almost always favor saving time over space.



True. However, old habits from the punch card days are hard to break.

Here is another 25,000 shoes. Just 4.06 MB. I checked if it was too big for Excel, but it took only a second or two to load.

For those with a slow Internet connection, here are the first 10 shoes:

1,P,B,P,B,B,P,P,P,P,P,P,B,B,P,B,P,P,P,P,P,B,B,P,B,P,P,P,T,B,T,B,T,B,B,P,P,P,P,B,P,B,P,P,P,P,B,B,P,B,B,P,P,P,P,P,P,B,T,B,P,B,P,T,P,P,P,P,B,P,P,P,B,B,B,B,P,T,P,P,B,B,P,B
2,B,P,B,B,P,B,P,P,P,P,B,T,B,P,B,B,B,P,B,P,P,B,B,P,B,B,P,P,B,P,P,T,P,P,B,P,P,P,P,B,P,B,P,B,P,P,B,B,B,B,P,B,P,B,B,P,P,B,P,B,B,P,B,B,P,B,P,B,P,B,P,B,P,B,P,P,B,B,T,P,B,B
3,B,T,B,P,P,B,P,P,P,P,P,P,B,T,P,P,T,B,B,P,P,P,P,B,P,P,P,P,P,P,B,B,P,B,P,P,T,B,P,P,B,B,B,P,B,P,T,P,B,B,B,P,B,P,P,P,P,B,T,P,P,P,T,B,P,P,B,P,B,P,T,B,P,P,B,B,T,P,B,B,P,B
4,P,B,B,B,P,P,B,B,P,B,B,P,B,P,B,P,P,P,B,B,P,P,B,T,B,P,P,T,B,B,P,B,P,T,B,B,B,B,B,P,P,B,P,B,P,P,B,B,P,T,B,T,P,P,P,P,P,P,T,B,P,P,B,T,P,B,B,B,B,P,B,P,P,P,P,B,P,P,P,P
5,P,P,P,P,P,P,T,P,T,B,B,P,B,B,B,B,B,P,P,B,P,B,B,P,P,P,P,B,T,P,T,B,P,B,P,B,B,T,B,P,B,B,P,P,B,T,P,B,P,B,T,B,B,B,B,P,P,B,P,P,P,P,T,B,P,B,P,P,B,P,B,P,B,T,P,P,B,P,P,B,B,B,P
6,P,P,B,P,T,B,B,P,B,P,P,B,T,P,B,B,B,T,B,B,P,B,B,P,T,B,P,B,P,B,T,B,P,B,B,B,P,B,P,P,P,P,B,B,T,P,B,P,T,B,P,B,P,B,B,P,B,B,P,B,B,P,P,P,P,B,B,B,B,B,P,B,B,B,B,B,P,P,P,B
7,P,B,P,B,T,B,B,B,B,T,P,P,P,P,B,B,T,B,B,P,T,P,B,B,T,B,P,T,P,B,B,B,B,B,P,P,P,B,B,P,P,P,P,B,B,P,B,P,P,T,P,P,B,P,P,B,P,P,B,B,T,B,T,P,P,P,T,B,B,B,P,P,P,B,P,B,B,B,B,P,T,B,T,P,B,P,B,B
8,B,B,P,B,B,B,B,P,P,B,T,P,B,B,P,P,B,P,B,P,P,T,B,P,P,B,B,B,P,P,B,P,B,P,P,B,P,B,P,P,B,B,P,P,T,B,T,P,P,B,B,B,P,T,B,B,P,P,P,P,P,P,B,B,P,P,P,B,T,P,P,B,B,B,B,P,P,B,P,B,B,T
9,P,P,P,B,B,B,B,B,B,P,P,P,T,P,P,B,B,B,B,B,B,P,B,P,P,B,P,B,P,B,B,B,B,B,B,B,T,B,P,B,P,B,P,P,B,B,T,P,B,B,B,P,P,P,B,B,B,T,B,B,B,B,P,B,P,B,B,P,P,B,P,P,B,B,B,P,T,P,B,B,P
10,T,P,P,T,B,P,B,B,P,B,P,P,B,T,P,B,P,T,P,P,P,P,P,P,P,P,B,P,P,P,B,P,B,B,P,T,P,P,B,B,P,B,P,B,B,B,P,P,B,B,B,B,B,P,P,P,B,B,P,B,P,T,T,T,T,P,P,B,B,P,P,B,B,P,P,P,P,B,P,P
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
Ahigh
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October 30th, 2013 at 7:10:34 AM permalink
Quote: Wizard

True. However, old habits from the punch card days are hard to break.

Here is another 25,000 shoes. Just 4.06 MB. I checked if it was too big for Excel, but it loaded it took only a second to load it.

For those with a slow Internet connection, here are the first 10 shoes:

1,P,B,P,B,B,P,P,P,P,P,P,B,B,P,B,P,P,P,P,P,B,B,P,B,P,P,P,T,B,T,B,T,B,B,P,P,P,P,B,P,B,P,P,P,P,B,B,P,B,B,P,P,P,P,P,P,B,T,B,P,B,P,T,P,P,P,P,B,P,P,P,B,B,B,B,P,T,P,P,B,B,P,B
2,B,P,B,B,P,B,P,P,P,P,B,T,B,P,B,B,B,P,B,P,P,B,B,P,B,B,P,P,B,P,P,T,P,P,B,P,P,P,P,B,P,B,P,B,P,P,B,B,B,B,P,B,P,B,B,P,P,B,P,B,B,P,B,B,P,B,P,B,P,B,P,B,P,B,P,P,B,B,T,P,B,B
3,B,T,B,P,P,B,P,P,P,P,P,P,B,T,P,P,T,B,B,P,P,P,P,B,P,P,P,P,P,P,B,B,P,B,P,P,T,B,P,P,B,B,B,P,B,P,T,P,B,B,B,P,B,P,P,P,P,B,T,P,P,P,T,B,P,P,B,P,B,P,T,B,P,P,B,B,T,P,B,B,P,B
4,P,B,B,B,P,P,B,B,P,B,B,P,B,P,B,P,P,P,B,B,P,P,B,T,B,P,P,T,B,B,P,B,P,T,B,B,B,B,B,P,P,B,P,B,P,P,B,B,P,T,B,T,P,P,P,P,P,P,T,B,P,P,B,T,P,B,B,B,B,P,B,P,P,P,P,B,P,P,P,P
5,P,P,P,P,P,P,T,P,T,B,B,P,B,B,B,B,B,P,P,B,P,B,B,P,P,P,P,B,T,P,T,B,P,B,P,B,B,T,B,P,B,B,P,P,B,T,P,B,P,B,T,B,B,B,B,P,P,B,P,P,P,P,T,B,P,B,P,P,B,P,B,P,B,T,P,P,B,P,P,B,B,B,P
6,P,P,B,P,T,B,B,P,B,P,P,B,T,P,B,B,B,T,B,B,P,B,B,P,T,B,P,B,P,B,T,B,P,B,B,B,P,B,P,P,P,P,B,B,T,P,B,P,T,B,P,B,P,B,B,P,B,B,P,B,B,P,P,P,P,B,B,B,B,B,P,B,B,B,B,B,P,P,P,B
7,P,B,P,B,T,B,B,B,B,T,P,P,P,P,B,B,T,B,B,P,T,P,B,B,T,B,P,T,P,B,B,B,B,B,P,P,P,B,B,P,P,P,P,B,B,P,B,P,P,T,P,P,B,P,P,B,P,P,B,B,T,B,T,P,P,P,T,B,B,B,P,P,P,B,P,B,B,B,B,P,T,B,T,P,B,P,B,B
8,B,B,P,B,B,B,B,P,P,B,T,P,B,B,P,P,B,P,B,P,P,T,B,P,P,B,B,B,P,P,B,P,B,P,P,B,P,B,P,P,B,B,P,P,T,B,T,P,P,B,B,B,P,T,B,B,P,P,P,P,P,P,B,B,P,P,P,B,T,P,P,B,B,B,B,P,P,B,P,B,B,T
9,P,P,P,B,B,B,B,B,B,P,P,P,T,P,P,B,B,B,B,B,B,P,B,P,P,B,P,B,P,B,B,B,B,B,B,B,T,B,P,B,P,B,P,P,B,B,T,P,B,B,B,P,P,P,B,B,B,T,B,B,B,B,P,B,P,B,B,P,P,B,P,P,B,B,B,P,T,P,B,B,P
10,T,P,P,T,B,P,B,B,P,B,P,P,B,T,P,B,P,T,P,P,P,P,P,P,P,P,B,P,P,P,B,P,B,B,P,T,P,P,B,B,P,B,P,B,B,B,P,P,B,B,B,B,B,P,P,P,B,B,P,B,P,T,T,T,T,P,P,B,B,P,P,B,B,P,P,P,P,B,P,P



Wizard's got shoes!!!

aahigh.com
DeMango
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October 30th, 2013 at 7:15:02 AM permalink
So now somebody will take these results and see if our Canadian friend system works, no?
When a rock is thrown into a pack of dogs, the one that yells the loudest is the one who got hit.
ewjones080
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October 30th, 2013 at 7:22:14 AM permalink
Quote: Wizard

I have 1,000 shoes here.

I'll post more for a donation to the Three Square Food Bank. $50 for every 1,000 shoes.



I tend to think the percentage of the English-speaking population who can Write code is less than 1 in 100. Somehow I think the odds in this case are even less.



I would say more like 1 in 1000
Wizard
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October 30th, 2013 at 8:54:59 AM permalink
Quote: gpl2112

so far I have found only 3000 shoes with which to test this and did generate enough profit to make it more than worth while .



Okay, I hope you're happy. I just created 250,000 shoes for you. Let's see if your system can survive that.
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
mustangsally
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October 30th, 2013 at 8:59:55 AM permalink
removed
silly
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thecesspit
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October 30th, 2013 at 9:41:45 AM permalink
Quote: Tanko

Perfect format.

Too bad we don't see streaks like those with real cards.

Maybe in Canada.



What makes you say that you don't see streaks like that with real cards? What do you think is different in the way these shoes are generated and real casino shoes?

Do you think you could tell them apart?
"Then you can admire the real gambler, who has neither eaten, slept, thought nor lived, he has so smarted under the scourge of his martingale, so suffered on the rack of his desire for a coup at trente-et-quarante" - Honore de Balzac, 1829
mustangsally
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October 30th, 2013 at 10:55:34 AM permalink
Quote: thecesspit

What makes you say that you don't see streaks like that with real cards? What do you think is different in the way these shoes are generated and real casino shoes?

Do you think you could tell them apart?

Telling them apart may not even matter.
What matters is a computer shuffle or sort makes it very possible that every permutation
has the same chance of being used.
In an 8 deck shoe that would be only 416!
possible equal shoes.
416! contains 911 digits
38, 463, 133, 877, 199, 574, 902, 843, 538, 980, 106, 435, 601, 992, 165, 963, 595, 262, 280, 224, 253, 772, 051, 216, 830, 119, 587, 376, 011, 871, 951, 141, 455, 494, 843, 512, 974, 439, 365, 557, 046, 418, 700, 007, 675, 724, 725, 364, 528, 374, 097, 426, 274, 437, 336, 984, 117, 135, 035, 840, 319, 087, 095, 437, 432, 094, 931, 902, 980, 202, 366, 306, 154, 424, 773, 842, 047, 575, 571, 737, 037, 805, 740, 375, 362, 781, 672, 723, 510, 947, 332, 759, 924, 799, 623, 394, 258, 294, 999, 190, 552, 593, 923, 779, 953, 277, 382, 928, 121, 926, 080, 790, 201, 956, 010, 980, 036, 512, 902, 008, 036, 318, 563, 018, 670, 503, 175, 208, 286, 850, 697, 621, 763, 497, 465, 759, 438, 572, 651, 262, 059, 691, 891, 197, 462, 920, 180, 710, 682, 630, 787, 009, 442, 262, 814, 745, 990, 335, 735, 810, 444, 461, 475, 006, 571, 643, 055, 395, 889, 497, 608, 863, 338, 763, 726, 588, 615, 254, 646, 135, 765, 127, 241, 917, 235, 548, 497, 470, 200, 746, 507, 030, 893, 989, 410, 145, 745, 270, 947, 236, 290, 256, 577, 398, 824, 863, 164, 336, 775, 932, 067, 755, 883, 734, 263, 503, 669, 074, 103, 295, 837, 766, 210, 948, 342, 554, 534, 683, 798, 166, 200, 789, 864, 427, 317, 910, 523, 544, 907, 487, 561, 256, 292, 196, 310, 045, 039, 490, 997, 277, 577, 283, 556, 051, 331, 131, 237, 311, 106, 789, 491, 739, 684, 263, 103, 767, 424, 452, 788, 224, 000, 000, 000, 000, 000, 000, 000, 000, 000, 000, 000, 000, 000, 000, 000, 000, 000, 000, 000, 000, 000, 000, 000, 000, 000, 000, 000, 000, 000, 000, 000, 000, 000, 000

well, we also should know many trillions and trillions and many trillions of those shuffles a computer could produce
would never come to pass or even be allowed in a regular casino.
Did it not just recently happen that players won lots of money at
Baccarat playing a shoe that was not shuffled?
even thought it is one of the 416! possible shoes that could be seen?


Look here.
I have a 4 card deck for a casino game I developed.
1,2,3,4
yep, looks nice right out of the box.

4! possible shuffles exist (4*3*2*1)

1 2 3 4
1 2 4 3
1 3 2 4
1 3 4 2
1 4 2 3
1 4 3 2
2 1 3 4
2 1 4 3
2 3 1 4
2 3 4 1
2 4 1 3
2 4 3 1
3 1 2 4
3 1 4 2
3 2 1 4
3 2 4 1
3 4 1 2
3 4 2 1
4 1 2 3
4 1 3 2
4 2 1 3
4 2 3 1
4 3 1 2
4 3 2 1


Many players would cry 'foul' if shuffle 1 or 24 was shown!
The cards were not shuffled!
1,2,3,4 is exactly how the cards came out of the box
and that shuffle has a 1/24 chance of being seen, just like the rest.

They might also squeak about shuffle #2: 1,2,4,3 and #23: 4,3,1,2


But the players still would say
2 4 3 1
is a more random shuffle than
1 2 3 4

The Blackjack program by QFIT allows a user to specify a casino type shuffle.

Sally says give the players what they want
and let them see the differences of both!
I Heart Vi Hart
Mission146
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October 30th, 2013 at 11:00:57 AM permalink
MustangSally,

People come and people go, that said, I don't think I have been as elated to see anyone come back after being gone for awhile as I am to see you.
https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/off-topic/gripes/11182-pet-peeves/120/#post815219
Canyonero
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October 30th, 2013 at 11:57:11 AM permalink
Quote: mustangsally


In an 8 deck shoe that would be only 412!
possible equal shoes.



First, lets take out the equivalent shoes by removing the ones that are only different by suit or face card (zeroes). How many now?



Now here's a fun question: How many different outcomes of Baccarat shoes exist? We are only looking at the sequence of P,B,T now, as posted by the Wizard. Probably easy to do if you can narrow down the possible lengths of a shoe / sequence to just a few numbers.

Another way to look at it: For each outcome of a baccarat shoe, how many shuffles exist that will lead to exactly that outcome?

Are there outcomes that are more likely than others? If so, I can improve my odds by a negligible-but-greater-than-zero amount by betting the most likely sequence.
beachbumbabs
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October 30th, 2013 at 11:59:52 AM permalink
Quote: Mission146

MustangSally,

People come and people go, that said, I don't think I have been as elated to see anyone come back after being gone for awhile as I am to see you.



MustangSally,

I am thrilled to see you check back in! Very much enjoyed your past posts and have been watching for you. We haven't met; I've only been around a few months.
If the House lost every hand, they wouldn't deal the game.
mustangsally
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October 30th, 2013 at 12:10:01 PM permalink
removed
silly

Sally
I Heart Vi Hart
miplet
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October 30th, 2013 at 12:18:39 PM permalink
Quote: DeMango

So now somebody will take these results and see if our Canadian friend system works, no?


http://miplet.net/bz/play.php and paste in your shoe. I used 25, 50, 75, 50, 75, 100, 150, 100, 200, 250, 300, 400, (+100 each win after) for the progression. No stop loss/win, but I give a running total so you can decide when you've won/lost/played enough.
“Man Babes” #AxelFabulous
mustangsally
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October 30th, 2013 at 1:46:18 PM permalink
Quote: miplet

http://miplet.net/bz/play.php and paste in your shoe. I used 25, 50, 75, 50, 75, 100, 150, 100, 200, 250, 300, 400, (+100 each win after) for the progression. No stop loss/win, but I give a running total so you can decide when you've won/lost/played enough.

very nice miplet

I did the same in Excel using
bet both on hand one,
bet 0 on hand one if they did not have to bet as that Bac player mentioned and
what I call FLB, follow last bet - bet last winning hand only. to alternate between the winning side. the other side no bets.

I have all the results for his shoes he posted along with the first 10 shoes in the
Wizard's 1k 8 deck collection as that Bac player "v" said to look into to test his system.

I can post later in that thread all my results

Here is the results for the first 10 wizard 8 deck shoe
Miplet's page results matched my Excel results of -8.75 :)
Just FLB produced a win of 8.75
Not betting the first hand but both sides after the first net -7.50

That Bac player (call him v, I like his wife and the cat!)
said he won $25 minus commission and the commission is not to even be considered.
he thinks nothing of that small 5% Banker fee!
The casino loves him!
I used player v posted progression to 12 bets
0=25/25
1=50/25
2=75/25
3=50/25 (at this point you are betting strictly Casino Profits)
4=75/25
5=100/25
6=125/25
7=150/25
8=200/25 (At this point you should have colored up to get a 500 Chip)
9=100/25
10=150/25
11=200/25 (At this point you should color up another 500 Chip)

The first shoe as seen in my Excel
Using FLB (follow last winning bet)

Betting BOTH sides

Betting BOTH sides but NOT the first hand


# shoe (end hand - longest run)
FLB (follow the last winning bet)
Bet both (including 1st hand)
Bet both (no bet on 1st hand)

#1 (23 - B5)
8.75
-8.75
-7.50

#2 (13 - P3)
-202.5
-211.25
-210

#3 (18 - P7)
147.5
140
141.25

#4 (21 - B4)
-160
-175
-175

#5 (14 - B9)
467.5
453.75
455

summary First 5 shoes
265
197.75
203.75
Nice
The long streaks pulled out a net win.
Not $200 per shoe average but more than $1

#6 (22 - P4)
-202.5
-212.5
-211.25

#7 (20 - P5)
-52.5
-60
-58.75

#8 (20 - B5)
-82.5
-93.75
-93.75

#9 (21 - B4)
-33.75
-46.25
-46.25

#10 (21 - B3)
-158.75
-172.5
-172.5

summary First 10 shoes
-265
-387.25
-378.75

summary

-1063.75 , follow last bet!
-1448.5 , player v method
-1426.5 , player v method
29 shoes including the first 10 of the Wizards


the 19 shoes that player v posted
-795 FLB (bet only the same as the last winning bet)
-1062.25 (bet both sides)
-1047.5 (bet both sides but never the first hand)
19 shoes

Notice the BIG difference between betting both sides and paying more commissions
verses just following the last winning bet and no bet the other side.

Excellent results player v!
more to post in that thread
again, the casino loves player v!

Have Fun!
Sally
I Heart Vi Hart
itronix
itronix
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October 30th, 2013 at 5:18:48 PM permalink
Quote: mustangsally

very nice miplet

I did the same in Excel using
bet both on hand one,
bet 0 on hand one if they did not have to bet as that Bac player mentioned and
what I call FLB, follow last bet - bet last winning hand only. to alternate between the winning side. the other side no bets.

I have all the results for his shoes he posted along with the first 10 shoes in the
Wizard's 1k 8 deck collection as that Bac player "v" said to look into to test his system.

I can post later in that thread all my results

Here is the results for the first 10 wizard 8 deck shoe
Miplet's page results matched my Excel results of -8.75 :)
Just FLB produced a win of 8.75
Not betting the first hand but both sides after the first net -7.50

That Bac player (call him v, I like his wife and the cat!)
said he won $25 minus commission and the commission is not to even be considered.
he thinks nothing of that small 5% Banker fee!
The casino loves him!

I used player v posted progression to 12 bets
0=25/25
1=50/25
2=75/25
3=50/25 (at this point you are betting strictly Casino Profits)
4=75/25
5=100/25
6=125/25
7=150/25
8=200/25 (At this point you should have colored up to get a 500 Chip)
9=100/25
10=150/25
11=200/25 (At this point you should color up another 500 Chip)

The first shoe as seen in my Excel
Using FLB (follow last winning bet)

Betting BOTH sides

Betting BOTH sides but NOT the first hand


# shoe (end hand - longest run)
FLB (follow the last winning bet)
Bet both (including 1st hand)
Bet both (no bet on 1st hand)

#1 (23 - B5)
8.75
-8.75
-7.50

#2 (13 - P3)
-202.5
-211.25
-210

#3 (18 - P7)
147.5
140
141.25

#4 (21 - B4)
-160
-175
-175

#5 (14 - B9)
467.5
453.75
455

summary First 5 shoes
265
197.75
203.75
Nice
The long streaks pulled out a net win.
Not $200 per shoe average but more than $1

#6 (22 - P4)
-202.5
-212.5
-211.25

#7 (20 - P5)
-52.5
-60
-58.75

#8 (20 - B5)
-82.5
-93.75
-93.75

#9 (21 - B4)
-33.75
-46.25
-46.25

#10 (21 - B3)
-158.75
-172.5
-172.5

summary First 10 shoes
-265
-387.25
-378.75

summary

-1063.75 , follow last bet!
-1448.5 , player v method
-1426.5 , player v method
29 shoes including the first 10 of the Wizards


the 19 shoes that player v posted
-795 FLB (bet only the same as the last winning bet)
-1062.25 (bet both sides)
-1047.5 (bet both sides but never the first hand)
19 shoes

Notice the BIG difference between betting both sides and paying more commissions
verses just following the last winning bet and no bet the other side.

Excellent results player v!
more to post in that thread
again, the casino loves player v!

Have Fun!
Sally



if you are talking about the Player v correct way then I would suggest using the proper figures.
1) betting progression starting at:

0 > bet = 25
1 > bet = 50
2 > bet = 75
3 > bet = 50
4 > bet = 75
5 > bet = 100
6 > bet = 125
7 > bet = 150
8 > bet = 200
9 > bet = 100
10 > bet = 150
11 > bet = 200

2) Hand limit = 20

Example: PBBPPPBBBTBBBTPPPBPB

Special Thank you to Wizard for the awesome amount of shoes provided as I will be making a $400 Donation to the Food Bank on behalf of the members in this thread.

Thank you for providing the Exact information I've been looking for.
I new you guys could do it!!!!!

any members continuing to work on this Baccarat project:
Please email me directly (arv_kit_varmenti@hotmail.com) or Call 289-932-9270 if you would also like a contribution to this project (Be sure to include Payment method) I will gladly compensate for your time.
DeMango
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October 30th, 2013 at 5:40:04 PM permalink
Fly on the wall at that food bank to see if $400 comes in?
Anyone gonna test his system with these shoes?
When a rock is thrown into a pack of dogs, the one that yells the loudest is the one who got hit.
mustangsally
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October 30th, 2013 at 5:46:50 PM permalink
Quote: mustangsally

I used player v posted progression to 12 bets
0=25/25
1=50/25
2=75/25
3=50/25 (at this point you are betting strictly Casino Profits)
4=75/25
5=100/25
6=125/25
7=150/25
8=200/25 (At this point you should have colored up to get a 500 Chip)
9=100/25
10=150/25
11=200/25 (At this point you should color up another 500 Chip)


Quote: itronix


if you are talking about the Player v correct way then I would suggest using the proper figures.
1) betting progression starting at:
0 > bet = 25
1 > bet = 50
2 > bet = 75
3 > bet = 50
4 > bet = 75
5 > bet = 100
6 > bet = 125
7 > bet = 150
8 > bet = 200
9 > bet = 100
10 > bet = 150
11 > bet = 200

2) Hand limit = 20

Your progression was followed exactly.
Please take the time to look.

Your method of play lost big time over the 29 shoes I ran
(including your shoes you showed)
and also just the 19 shoes you posted in your thread.
Do not worry, I will add all this to your thread soon.

But you have to follow the rules here.
Ignore the haters and show what you do.
But it looks to be too late for that

I will look for you at the Baccarat tables when I'm on vacation
next year
Sally
I Heart Vi Hart
mustangsally
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October 30th, 2013 at 5:56:27 PM permalink
Quote: DeMango

Fly on the wall at that food bank to see if $400 comes in?
Anyone gonna test his system with these shoes?

sure, has been done with other shoes he provided.
that player v example
Example: PBBPPPBBBTBBBTPPPBPB

3 methods of play (FLB = mine)
FLB: $112.5
His method #1: $100
His method #2 no first bet: $100
I win.

When he wins, he wins LESS than just betting the side that won the last hand.
He has already been told this by others.

You can lead a horse to water

Sally
food and drinks and baseball!
Go Angels!
I Heart Vi Hart
Wizard
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October 31st, 2013 at 2:46:52 AM permalink
By the way, I changed the 250,000 shoes I link to on my baccarat page. The old ones I maintain are fine, but I redid the simulation using a Fisher Yates shuffling algorithm, which is discussed in another thread.

The 100 I posted here directly remain the same.
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
Tanko
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November 1st, 2013 at 5:33:05 AM permalink
Quote: thecesspit

What makes you say that you don't see streaks like that with real cards? What do you think is different in the way these shoes are generated and real casino shoes?

Do you think you could tell them apart?



I could never tell them apart from real card shoes, except by playing them and and observing the results.

I only completed the first fifteen shoes.

Compared to my real card play, these shoes were mostly smooth and exceptionally profitable.

I would expect a few dogs in fifteen shoes.

Not a single one here.

I would also expect consecutive dogs in fifteen shoes.

I stopped at fifteen because glancing at the patterns of the remaining shoes; I believe they would perform just as well.

I may be mistaken, but in the first twenty shoes, I only detected one chop string as long as PBPBPB

The others were shorter.

I do see shoes and streaks like these with real cards, but not with this consistency.
rob45
rob45
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November 1st, 2013 at 8:46:18 AM permalink
Quote: Tanko

I could never tell them apart from real card shoes, except by playing them and and observing the results.

I only completed the first fifteen shoes.

Compared to my real card play, these shoes were mostly smooth and exceptionally profitable.

I would expect a few dogs in fifteen shoes.

Not a single one here.

I would also expect consecutive dogs in fifteen shoes.

I stopped at fifteen because glancing at the patterns of the remaining shoes; I believe they would perform just as well.

I may be mistaken, but in the first twenty shoes, I only detected one chop string as long as PBPBPB

The others were shorter.

I do see shoes and streaks like these with real cards, but not with this consistency.


Sample size is everything.
Highly doubtful that all of us together have played enough "real life" to compare; additionally, one cannot make a comparison based on the assumption that the first fifteen shoes are indicative of the whole.
mustangsally
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November 1st, 2013 at 9:41:41 AM permalink
Quote: Tanko

I could never tell them apart from real card shoes, except by playing them and and observing the results.

I only completed the first fifteen shoes.
I stopped at fifteen because glancing at the patterns of the remaining shoes; I believe they would perform just as well.

I may be mistaken, but in the first twenty shoes, I only detected one chop string as long as PBPBPB

I agree you are mistaken.
I count 13 such PBPBPB patterns (not including a Tie) in the completed first fifteen shoes.
But I have a feeling you would not count P,PBPBPB as one of them
only...B,PBPBPB counts
Those are even longer patterns
I count 1 in shoe1,shoe7,shoe8,shoe11 for those longer patterns
can we see them in the photo below?
(I also counted 10 BPBPBP but only 3 were ...P,BPBPBP)


That then brings up the question
How many PBPBPB chops are we to expect per shoe(s)?

the Baccarat experts should know that answer
Sally
I Heart Vi Hart
Wizard
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November 1st, 2013 at 10:25:25 AM permalink
Quote: mustangsally

How many PBPBPB chops are we to expect per shoe(s)?



If this sequence were observed, PPBPBPBPBB, would that count as one sequence or two? If other words, what do you do with overlapping sequences?

For the benefit of anyone else interested in the answer, it may be worthwhile to know there are 82.4 hands per shoe, on average. Not counting ties, there are 74.6 average hands per shoe.
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
GoldMember
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November 4th, 2013 at 12:34:45 AM permalink
Quote: AxelWolf

If your system works just play it online at small stakes, build up your bankroll then move up limits. You don't need other people.



You can not play any form of system online.
You will get wiped out just shortly after.
For some reason, and I now this is hard to believe, but the algorithms get recognized and blacklisted.

Save your money and never play online.
GoldMember
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November 4th, 2013 at 12:38:55 AM permalink
Quote: mustangsally

I agree you are mistaken.
I count 13 such PBPBPB patterns (not including a Tie) in the completed first fifteen shoes.
But I have a feeling you would not count P,PBPBPB as one of them
only...B,PBPBPB counts
Those are even longer patterns
I count 1 in shoe1,shoe7,shoe8,shoe11 for those longer patterns
can we see them in the photo below?
(I also counted 10 BPBPBP but only 3 were ...P,BPBPBP)


That then brings up the question
How many PBPBPB chops are we to expect per shoe(s)?

the Baccarat experts should know that answer
Sally



There are chops like this 100% of the time at all tables in all games. It's just part of the "Random" shuffle.
you can get around this very easy by simply altering your betting method to follow the "Bet Before Last"
example; if:

PPB > bet P
PBP > bet B
BBB > bet B
PPP > bet P
BPB > bet P

You will cover both Vertical and Horizontal Runs this way.
GoldMember
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November 4th, 2013 at 12:43:49 AM permalink
Quote: Wizard

If this sequence were observed, PPBPBPBPBB, would that count as one sequence or two? If other words, what do you do with overlapping sequences?

For the benefit of anyone else interested in the answer, it may be worthwhile to know there are 82.4 hands per shoe, on average. Not counting ties, there are 74.6 average hands per shoe.



Correction Wizard.

Many 8 deck shoes are cut by the player at least 1 deck and then dealer cuts appox 1/2 to 3/4 deck that goes to the back and is not in play resulting between 72 - 80 hands per shoe depending on the Very first card count shown (Example if 10 is shown after cut, then the casino burns 10 cards) and then depending on the (2 card naturals resulting usually 1 in 4 deals average) also factor in to the count.
GoldMember
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November 4th, 2013 at 12:54:08 AM permalink
Quote: rob45

Sample size is everything.
Highly doubtful that all of us together have played enough "real life" to compare; additionally, one cannot make a comparison based on the assumption that the first fifteen shoes are indicative of the whole.



many baccarat players play an average of 6-8 full shoes per day. I see at least 100 shoes per day on the gaming floor and play an average of 12 tables partial shoes approx 20 hands per day. It is very easy to determine what a shoe will look like after seeing so many day after day.

My average i see on a daily basis (Real Shoes) is:

average table runs of 3 = 9 times per shoe 85% of the time
runs of 4 = 3x 85% of the time
runs of 5 = 1x 85% of the time
runs of 6 = 1x 50% of the time
runs of 7 = 1x 40% of the time
runs of 8 = 1x 25% of the time
runs of 9 or more = 15% of the time

If you mix your math with the averages along with altered betting, you may in fact be able to determine a winning strategy.
Wizard
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November 4th, 2013 at 6:37:41 AM permalink
Quote: GoldMember

Correction Wizard.

Many 8 deck shoes are cut by the player at least 1 deck and then dealer cuts appox 1/2 to 3/4 deck that goes to the back and is not in play resulting between 72 - 80 hands per shoe depending on the Very first card count shown (Example if 10 is shown after cut, then the casino burns 10 cards) and then depending on the (2 card naturals resulting usually 1 in 4 deals average) also factor in to the count.



Thanks. I did neglect to burn any cards at the beginning of each shoe. I just reran the simulation to do that. I still follow the usual procedure of placing the cut card 16 cards from the end of the shoe, shuffling one final hand after it is reached, except if comes out the first card of a hand, in which case, one more hand only.

Now the average hands per shoe is 80.9.
"For with much wisdom comes much sorrow." -- Ecclesiastes 1:18 (NIV)
Beethoven9th
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November 4th, 2013 at 6:46:59 AM permalink
Quote: GoldMember

There are chops like this 100% of the time at all tables in all games. It's just part of the "Random" shuffle.
you can get around this very easy by simply altering your betting method to follow the "Bet Before Last"
example; if:

PPB > bet P
PBP > bet B
BBB > bet B
PPP > bet P
BPB > bet P

You will cover both Vertical and Horizontal Runs this way.


I don't know which is dumber, the 'system' above or the (nuked) guy who created it. lol
Fighting BS one post at a time!
rdw4potus
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November 4th, 2013 at 6:49:32 AM permalink
Quote: Beethoven9th

I don't know which is dumber, the 'system' above or the (nuked) guy who created it. lol



The system is no better or worse than any other string of bets. It doesn't improve or worsen the likelihood of success. So, it's not really dumb, at least not in the way that doubling a hard 14 in BJ or playing the Big 6/8 in craps is dumb. Now, the guy who actually thinks this system has merit? Well, yeah...
"So as the clock ticked and the day passed, opportunity met preparation, and luck happened." - Maurice Clarett
Beethoven9th
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November 4th, 2013 at 6:53:37 AM permalink
Quote: rdw4potus

Quote: Beethoven9th

I don't know which is dumber, the 'system' above or the (nuked) guy who created it. lol

The system is no better or worse than any other string of bets. It doesn't improve or worsen the likelihood of success. So, it's not really dumb, at least not in the way that doubling a hard 14 in BJ or playing the Big 6/8 in craps is dumb. Now, the guy who actually thinks this system has merit? Well, yeah...


That's true, so I guess I have my answer.....the latter is dumber. ;)
Fighting BS one post at a time!
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