Quote:nicoramoneif i play shoe blackjack with 8 decks with a cut of 50 cards and i remember 20 key cards .i know the shuffle . of this 20 we lost maybe 5 and the others 15 key card and ace are in a range of 1 to 4 card distance.

Obviously, English is not your first language. Just curious, what do you mean when you say "key card". Does that mean a Ten?

When you say "15 key card and ace are in a range of 1 to 4 card distance," how many aces are you referring to?

Quote:gordonm888Obviously, English is not your first language. Just curious, what do you mean when you say "key card". Does that mean a Ten?

When you say "15 key card and ace are in a range of 1 to 4 card distance," how many aces are you referring to?

Hi gordonm888,

I don't think ("key card" mean a Ten).

"key card" is use for ACE-Tracking/ACE-Location, in AP Blackjack.

I use to do a lot of ACE-Tracking some 30 Years ago and make a lot of money from it, before I become a Games Inventor.

P.S. Back then there are only a few people know about it.

key card is the card that will be up the ace in the dischard . i am refering that 15 aces are in difference with it key card in a range of 1 to 4 cards distance after the shuffle . key card can be a ten a 3 a 4 . is the card up the ace to remember when is comming the ace in the next shoe after the shuffle.

Preguntalo en español en PM y voy a probar traducirlo, si comprendo.

la idea es secuenciar aces . se juega con zapato . penetracion zcla manual que conozco. 8 mazos . 32 ases. se ve una partida entera y se memorizan la carta que quedo sobre cada as en el descarte. luego hacen la mezcla y el corte. en el corte se pierden entre 4 y 7 ases. luego empieza la nueva partida quedando en juego 25/28 ases. con la mezcla se pierden otros 5 /8 ases . quedan en juego 20 . de esos 20 la distancia entre la carta llave q se memorizo y el as es entre 1 carta y 4/5 cartas de distancia.

uno puede jugar parado fuera de la mesa y apostar solo al ver las cartas llave a todos los jugadores que desee. el obtener un as como primera carta significa un 54% de ventaja. cual es la ecuacion para saber como es mejor jugarlo y de que ventaja hablamos . saludos.

Tentative translation.Quote:nicoramoneahi lo puse en español.

la idea es secuenciar aces . se juega con zapato . penetracion zcla manual que conozco. 8 mazos . 32 ases. se ve una partida entera y se memorizan la carta que quedo sobre cada as en el descarte. luego hacen la mezcla y el corte. en el corte se pierden entre 4 y 7 ases. luego empieza la nueva partida quedando en juego 25/28 ases. con la mezcla se pierden otros 5 /8 ases . quedan en juego 20 . de esos 20 la distancia entre la carta llave q se memorizo y el as es entre 1 carta y 4/5 cartas de distancia.

uno puede jugar parado fuera de la mesa y apostar solo al ver las cartas llave a todos los jugadores que desee. el obtener un as como primera carta significa un 54% de ventaja. cual es la ecuacion para saber como es mejor jugarlo y de que ventaja hablamos . saludos.

« Thé idea is to follow aces. Based on the shoe, whose penetration ans manual shuffle are known. 8 decks, 32 aces. You observe a full game (shoe) and memorize which card ended up on top of each ace in the discard. After the shuffle, the cut will put away 4 to 7 aces. The new game begins with 25/28 aces active. With the shuffle some further 5 to 8 aces got lost. 20 remain in play.

For these 20, the distance between the ‘key’ memorized card and the corresponding ace will be between 1 and 4/5 cards dealt.

One can prepare aside of the table and wager only when a key card is dealt to any player you determine. Getting an ace as first card is a 54% advantage. What is the equation for knowing the best way to play that, and what is the expected advantage? Thank you. »

Quote:nicoramoneso can you help me with the question please. or send me pm . thanks and yes key card is that and is for tracking aces .

Hi nicoramone,

Sorry, I don't give out my Trade Secrets.

P.S. I don't think there is many AP Players give out their Trade-Secrets here or any where that I know of.

BTW. ACE-Tracking is the most Powerful technique AP Blackjack I know of (House-Edge 51+%, if you Track it with High-cards), the second is Section-Tracking, and some others, and the last is Card-counting.

I know this, because I use them all, 30+ years ago (it lasted over 10+ years), and finally be told not to Play Blackjack All over the UK, but can still go in the Casinos.

After my AP Blackjack career. That is when I started my FIRST New Table Games (Casino Hold'em®) in 2000, The Number-1 Casino-poker play Online in 2,000+ Casinos.

The rest, shall we say is history.

i dont want any secret i count and shuffle track but i know too that ace sequencer is the best. i know the technique i only want a math ecuation to make it best only that .

i am not telling you to tell me how to play i only want help to put that on math ecuations to know with how many players to play or to play stand only betting to others. thanks for your answer. if you know aboit that you know that all before i write is correct . thanks

Quote:nicoramonewaiting for an answer or is not a math thread?

Most of the Math guys here don't know what ACE-Tracking is, and the ones that know ACE-Tracking (if any) are not Math-guys and properly don't want to share what they know.

Quote:DeMangoIt is best to figure it out by yourself. No one will share secrets on open forum. You expecting something for nothing, that does not work.

He just wanted the math formula. I think the answer is you have to sim it though.

Quote:nicoramonewaiting for an answer or is not a math thread?

Welcome to the forum. It is a math based forum. But you are asking a complicated question. There may be someone who has the requisite math skills (not me!) who will do the work for you. But I think your exact question is not clear enough.

It is easy enough to understand that you are saying that after a certain card is seen there is an increased chance the next card is an ace. For anyone to answer, based on your experience, what is the chance the ace will follow the tracked card? 1/13 would of course be without tracking. What is it with your tracking skills?

By the way, it is possible that there are members here that make their living by betting this way. And they would be unlikely to let anyone know this. They will probably be upset that this is even being discussed on this forum. Some perceive that any advantage play openly discussed here immediately makes it directly to casino management.

I assume the proposition is that if the last card of the previous hand was, in this example, Kh and you sit at the first hand, then you should increase your bet.

There are four Kh, so firstly three of these aren't the one you saw and the chance of an Ace is (presumably) about 1/13. The fourth one is and the chance of an Ace is larger than 1/13, but how likely is it the cards have stuck together? Let's say you're twice as likely to get an Ace. Then the total chance is 5/52 (=9.6%).

If the last card wasn't one of the "key cards" then chances of an Ace is less (about 6.8%) (the maths is assume on average it's 1/13 with no info, you've used up 80/2704 so have 128/2074 left among 36 cards).

So 16 times out of 52 you'd bet a bit bigger and 36 times you'd bet a bit smaller. I'll leave it to those who know whether that gives you an advantage (I'm guessing it does from the comments).

Note I've used 1/13 rather than using 16/207 for simplicity.

Half the time you have a key card +0.8%, half the time you know nothing -0.5%. So it really depends on how much variance the casino will let you have and the values seem to be similar to counting (except in your case you get a small advantage 50% of the time).

It probably works with fewer decks, but 8 makes it difficult to know whether you have a real key card or not (there's 7 chances in 8 you're wrong).