Weird Gaming Law of the day

http://www.wpxi.com/news/26954595/detail.html


So, in PA if you find a chip on the floor you are not allowed to keep it. You can't even keep cash you find there. Am I crazy or is this kind of crazy? Any other places have laws like this? I know in the Bellagio Heist thread we discussed the cheques belong to the casino, but to say if you find it on the floor and can be arrested if you don't turn it in?

Same in Vegas.

If the chips belong to the casino I am in major trouble for stealing 105 chips (my current collection, I hope to get more next week)

The intent of the law is to discourage unsavory folks from cruising the floor looking for "lost" chips. If you bought the chips and took them home as souvenirs (a practice encouraged by casinos), it is not a problem. The restriction is that you cannot spend them like money, nor can you transfer them to another person outside of the context of gambling in that casino.

Well, it was cash, not chips, he found. Why should he legally be able to keep cash that is not his he finds anywhere, let alone in a casino?

Why would you think if you find a chip on the floor, instead of cash, you should be allowed to keep it? This guy refused to turn the cash over when confronted - only then was he arrested. And rightly so. He had his chance.

Try playing $5 left over that's not yours in an "apparently abandoned" slot machine. You watch it for an hour, no one comes by to claim it so you decide to play it. That's theft, is it not? Of course, you'll likely only be caught when the owner of the unplayed slot play comes back 75 minutes later and complains somebody played her money.

Try cashing-out one of those abandoned pay-out tix for 6, whatever, cents that one often finds lying around. Just don't be caught doing it.

That uncashed tix for 6 cents does not belong to the casino either, I would assume. After a period of time, outstanding uncashed unclaimed pay vouchers would be turned over to the State just like how an abandoned checking acct cannot ultimately revert to the bank? The bank must send it to the State, no? People got 7 years or so to re-claim their property kind of thing.

I don't know, with checking accounts and such I thought it would be, say, maybe at least 3 years of inactivity, maybe more, before the bank would have to turn the money over as abandoned property to the State. Yet, I also think I read crap like winning Las Vegas sports bet tix would not be honored if not cashed within, like, 90 days? Maybe even 30 days? What's that about anyway?

If so, say the casino won't honor your winning sports ticket 120 days later, who ultimately gets to keep the money you bet and won since you don't? Obviously, you are getting screwed out of what I view as a cash-equivalent winning ticket that should, like cash, have no expiration date, but, surely, somebody please tell me the casino is not allowed to take that money back into income and never have to eventually revert to the State that which never belonged to them in the first place? Is this, if so, then State-Sanctioned theft allowing a casino a way to not have to pay a bet he made in good-faith?

Is it really that the Casino can effectively find your "expired" winning pay voucher on the floor and ultimately suffer no consequences, indeed benefit from it, but if you find and cash someone's winning pay voucher on the floor you have committed theft?

Back to the point - had the man returned his found $15 cash to the casino what would/should the casino have done with it? Tried to find the owner, and if ultimately unsuccessful, send the $15 to the State? Take the $15 back into casino income perhaps? Put the $15 in the pocket of the guy who is asking him for it back?
Maybe advertise the lost money for 30 days and, if no original owner comes forward, the money belongs to the person who turned it in - I think that's what supposed to happen if you are stupid enough to report money you find on a side-walk to the police?

It's probably like heads-they-win tails-you-lose kind of thing.

Surely they allow you to pick up your own money if you drop it right then and there?

If you find cash on the floor, you take out your wallet, rummage a bit and drop a bill.

Then you pick up both.

Well, don't they have to prove you didn't think you were picking up your own money?

(I don't know, just a thought)

One thing is that the woman "Threw" the money down. She didn't drop it. So we would have to know her intent. Was she accidentally throwing items? Did she have a killer session at keno and wanted to throw some cash on the floor for a lucky passerby?
So money on the floor of the gaming area is property of the casino. What about the food court? Or the bars? Shops? When Lil Wayne stops by Pure and makes it rain w 10k does everyone have to give the money to the casino at the end of the night?

Quote: rxwine

Well, don't they have to prove you didn't think you were picking up your own money?

(I don't know, just a thought)

I think the casino assumes once it hits the floor they own it. They may have a 5 second rule.

I tried to find the relevant NV gaming law, but my searches failed. I wanted to see what the specifics were?

Anyone?

http://gaming.nv.gov/stats_regs.htm

I knew a guy who picked up and pocketed at least 600 bucks at a baccarat table when a disgruntled player "Threw" his money on the floor. It's one thing if you drop it. It's another if you blatantly throw your cash around the joint like you don't give a crap. Still, 600 bucks, I would have picked it up and put it on the table in front of him. But 15 bucks? Don't the authorities have better things to do?

Quote: Curiousguy11

Try playing $5 left over that's not yours in an "apparently abandoned" slot machine. You watch it for an hour, no one comes by to claim it so you decide to play it. That's theft, is it not? Of course, you'll likely only be caught when the owner of the unplayed slot play comes back 75 minutes later and complains somebody played her money.

That once happened to me on a VP machine I tink in Canada. I legitimately wanted to play so I found an empty machine and put $20 in. $25 or so in credits showed and I was like "WTF?" The buddy I was with saw it as well. So I played for a few mninutes and cashed out. No one was near the thing and I figured worst case they had me on tape putting cash in.

I read there are street folk in LV who make their living finding unplayed credits. I do know as a kid I would check for returned change in video games and pinball machines. Got yelled at for it once. Went back the next day and got yelled at for it again, same manager. Thought he would not remember me.

There was an incident at the Motor City casino in Detroit where a woman was 86'd for picking up a nickel in a slot machine tray. Here is the full story.

Yes, there are lots of credit trolls that prowl around looking for credits people leave on machines. I don't think it rises to "making a living" but I think some homeless people do it to make a little pocket money.

>there are lots of credit trolls that prowl around looking for credits people leave on machines.
Lots???
Is this sort of a break they take from trying to find marks to whom they can tip that a certain machine is about to pay out ... in return for half the winnings?

>I don't think it rises to "making a living" but I think some homeless people do it to make a little pocket money.
Well, if its a rainy day and you are getting soaked handing out pictures of girls who are not from an agency I guess you have to take a break and go inside the casino to do something worthwhile with your life.

I think the best scam was that cocktail waitress who would bubble gum on the BOTTOM of her tray and then rest the tray on someone's humungous stack of chips while handing out all those drink glasses. Or the guy who was playing slot machines but made the mistake of standing too close to the machine and winning too often... now they shield the RNG chips from electrical interference from an electric cigarette lighter.

In Vegas, if a chip is "found" on the casino floor you can file a claim at the security office. After thirty days, its yours. Heaven help you if you just try to pick it up and keep it though.

Oh, man. Wednesday I cashed in a slot ticket for $400.00, and there was about 65 cents in quarters and nickels in the coin tray; I took it.

Do you think it's safe to go back?

Quote: Curiousguy11

Try playing $5 left over that's not yours in an "apparently abandoned" slot machine. You watch it for an hour, no one comes by to claim it so you decide to play it. That's theft, is it not?

The rare tiems I play slots, I'll often wind up having less than a dollar worth of credits. Whent hat happens, I leave the credits on the machine for the next player to use them. Some people may leave $5 the same way.

Maybe I'll place a post-it note next time, assuming that's not taken as defacement of casino property :P

Last November I was staying downtown at the Fitz. I wandered over to the Fremont for a bit and sat down at a JOB VP machine, as I went to put my money in I saw a bucket about a 1/4 full with quarters sitting right next to the machine I was playing. I looked around for a bit to see if someone was playing near by. No one around just me and my girlfriend. I told a slot attendant, his exact words were, "What do you want me to do?" "You can tell a security guard if you want or you can keep it, I don't think anyone will care." Although it was only probably 20 bucks, I was amazed at his bluntness. Anyways, I found a security guard, and after talking to him for awhile I convinced him to take it, (yes even the security guard suggested I just keep it) He took my name and asked me when I was leaving, I was driving home the next morning, so he said to stop by the security office tomorrow morning and if no one claimed it by then it would be mine. I was surprised by this, since as some have mentioned before me, I thought there was some sort of 30 day rule, or naively I thought they might actually bother looking over tape to see if they could identify the person who left it behind. However, no such effort seemed in place. Just like clock work I strolled back over to the Fremont the next morning and at the security office the bucket of quarters and a form was there for me to fill out and sign. I walked with a security guard to the cage they dumped the quarters and sure enough it came out to $20 exactly, the cashier had me sign one more form and handed me over a $20 bill and I was on my merry way with $20 in my wallet after a trip filled with loss after loss. Don't know if this is actual policy, but this was my experience, thought I would share it.

Quote: Wizard

There was an incident at the Motor City casino in Detroit where a woman was 86'd for picking up a nickel in a slot machine tray. Here is the full story.

...And it ended in her being awarded $875,000 in compensatory and punitive damages.

I guess it serves them right, but for the way the situation was handled - casinos have no business detaining people without an overwhelming reason. Still doesn't make it one's right to claim any money or chips found, but for what it's worth.

Quote: Wizard

There was an incident at the Motor City casino in Detroit where a woman was 86'd for picking up a nickel in a slot machine tray. Here is the full story.

Yes, there are lots of credit trolls that prowl around looking for credits people leave on machines. I don't think it rises to "making a living" but I think some homeless people do it to make a little pocket money.

Happened to me at the MGM 10 years ago, it was a quarter though, not a nickel.

Friend dropped me off at door to run into gift shop for cigs, as I was walking spotted a quarter in a slot tray and grabbed it, 3 minutes later there were 5 security guards in the gift shop.

I once lost $25 but gained my soul. It was just last month at the Showboat in Atlantic City. I was killing time playing a video poker machine at a bar in the center of the casino. My friends showed up so I gave up my seat and forgot all about the four kings that I had hit earlier. Some guy went up to the machine that I was playing, and I was tempted to let him know how lucky it was when he played one hand and cashed out. Then 2 minutes later, I remembered that I had left my credits in the game. That made me feel crummy at first since that money would have bought a couple of more drinks (yes, it's an expensive bar) but then it ocurred to me that I could never do that to someone else. I would have first asked who was playing that machine and then if no one answered, I would just walk away.

I may have lost some cash but the manifestation of a situation that proved that I'm a morally superior person was well worth it. It also made me more cognizant of my casual gambling.

Quote: JIMMYFOCKER

Quote: Wizard

There was an incident at the Motor City casino in Detroit where a woman was 86'd for picking up a nickel in a slot machine tray. Here is the full story.

Yes, there are lots of credit trolls that prowl around looking for credits people leave on machines. I don't think it rises to "making a living" but I think some homeless people do it to make a little pocket money.

Happened to me at the MGM 10 years ago, it was a quarter though, not a nickel.

Friend dropped me off at door to run into gift shop for cigs, as I was walking spotted a quarter in a slot tray and grabbed it, 3 minutes later there were 5 security guards in the gift shop.

The best thing for you to do is to raise a ruckus so they would detain you and you could file a Sec. 1983 lawsuit for deprivation of your constitutional rights while acting under color of state law.

By the way, that MotorCity case was wrongly decided and probably should have been overturned. I would check the procedural history on that one.

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