100xOdds
100xOdds
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April 26th, 2013 at 4:40:23 AM permalink
Quote: FleaStiff

They make enough on the terrible slots to offer an okay deal on the roulette and craps electronic version which probably seats at most twelve each and provides more advertising opportunity for them than anything else. Its not to difficult to define the dealerless devices as slot machines.



um.. no on e-craps. it seats like 100. but the same system also does Baccarat and sic bo.
plus there's 2 more machines on the upper floor (higher minimums). one seats like 100 (mainly baccarat players) and the other seats like 12.
the one on the lower floor gives out squat for points. :(

the only ok deal on roulette is single '0' and that has a higher minimum. and yes, that seats like 12. but it's usually never even half full.
Craps is paradise (Pair of dice). Lets hear it for the SpeedCount Mathletes :)
hook3670
hook3670
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April 26th, 2013 at 11:41:12 AM permalink
My understanding was theat racinos could only offer the bingo style games which people play against each other and do not have a RNG. The purpose of equating e-games to regular games are the RNG's I thought, so how are they able to offer 'real" electronic games if they are only allowed the bingo style games?
tringlomane
tringlomane
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April 26th, 2013 at 11:59:41 AM permalink
Quote: hook3670

My understanding was theat racinos could only offer the bingo style games which people play against each other and do not have a RNG. The purpose of equating e-games to regular games are the RNG's I thought, so how are they able to offer 'real" electronic games if they are only allowed the bingo style games?



From http://gaming.ny.gov/gaming/

Video Lottery Terminals and Electronic Table Games: Similar in appearance to classic slot machines or as simulated classic table games, these terminals are linked to a centralized system maintained by the Gaming Commission that tracks the game play and earnings for each game.
Video Lottery Terminals (VLTs) have the same appearance as slot machines. VLTs must receive winning outcomes transmitted by the central system.
Electronic Table Games (ETGs) offer video versions of popular casino games like roulette, craps, and baccarat. ETGs are capable of generating winning outcomes at each table. Video lottery gaming operations began in 2004 at Saratoga Gaming & Raceway in Saratoga Springs and have since expanded to eight additional facilities. As of January 1, 2013, there were 17,213 such machines operating in New York State.

It doesn't technically play out like a bingo game like Class II, instead slots/video poker have to receive winning outcomes from the central computer like a pulltab or scratch-off. For slots, this can well mimic a Vegas slot machine, but with video poker...nope.

And in the section on electronic table games, they allow winning outcomes to be generated at the table themselves, leading to a normal table game operation. It just has to be an electronic device for wagering. This will also keep better tabs on table game revenue/results.
JB
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JB
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April 26th, 2013 at 12:06:36 PM permalink
Quote: hook3670

how are they able to offer 'real" electronic games if they are only allowed the bingo style games?


That's a good question. Here is my line of reasoning:

1) Tribal casinos are only allowed to offer Class III games if the state within which they are located permits Class III gaming

2) There are tribal casinos in NY which offer Class III gaming, therefore NY state somehow permits Class III gaming

3) NY state runs the NY Lottery, and the NY Lottery runs these racinos, therefore the state runs the racinos

4) Since the state both permits Class III gaming and runs the racinos, I see no reason why they can't offer Class III gaming at them.

The table games page on the Resorts World web site says that they have single-zero (electronic) games "offering guests better winning odds than traditional double-zero roulette." This certainly makes it sound like it functions just like a physical roulette table, which would be Class III.
tringlomane
tringlomane
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April 26th, 2013 at 12:45:07 PM permalink
Quote: JB


4) Since the state both permits Class III gaming and runs the racinos, I see no reason why they can't offer Class III gaming at them.



The state was too stupid to write the law to legalize that form of gaming at racinos at the time is my best guess. Something about RNG games make gambling more dangerous to politicians? Games on Maryland VLTs are RNG-driven as well.

And Illinois's new "video gaming terminals" at bars/restaurants are also completely RNG driven. I briefly short-played a 7/5 Super Aces Bonus game after eating a meal at a family restaurant with my g/f's parents last week; no quad Aces though. :(
100xOdds
100xOdds
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April 26th, 2013 at 3:40:33 PM permalink
sigh.. there are 2 types of e-machines.

one is pure electronic. no idea about the RNG on this (RNG or bingo type) since i avoid it like the plague.

other is electronic everything but the dice (craps), cards (baccarat), and wheel/ball (roulette) are real. There's no RNG/bingo here.
The Single '0' roulette i saw is this type.
i love this type of e-Craps!
Craps is paradise (Pair of dice). Lets hear it for the SpeedCount Mathletes :)
Tanko
Tanko
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April 27th, 2013 at 3:34:49 AM permalink
deleted
Last edited by: Tanko on Mar 9, 2016
100xOdds
100xOdds
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April 27th, 2013 at 6:31:21 AM permalink
Quote: Tanko

That number is higher than others because Resorts World has much more Baccarat, Craps and Roulette than the other VLT Casinos. These games, especially Baccarat, have a much lower house edge than Slots, so the casino hold will be higher.

It is not because their slots are looser than other VLT casinos.

For example, they have around 500 Baccarat seats which are nearly all filled most the day.



interesting.. so e-machines w/real dice,cards, and ball are counted as a slot machine in payout reports?
eveything is just lumped altogether? i guess it makes reporting easy.

hm.. i should have made the connection since any win on e-machines over $1200 (including original bet) gets you a w2-G just like a slot machine.
Craps is paradise (Pair of dice). Lets hear it for the SpeedCount Mathletes :)
tringlomane
tringlomane
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April 28th, 2013 at 8:04:20 PM permalink
Quote: 100xOdds

interesting.. so e-machines w/real dice,cards, and ball are counted as a slot machine in payout reports?
eveything is just lumped altogether? i guess it makes reporting easy.

hm.. i should have made the connection since any win on e-machines over $1200 (including original bet) gets you a w2-G just like a slot machine.



Video poker is traditionally lumped in with slots as well, which I hate. So if returns are reported by denomination (available in some states), 5c, 25c, and $1 slot returns will be somewhat inflated by video poker (well, at least RNG-driven video poker).
Deck007
Deck007
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March 4th, 2014 at 8:08:54 PM permalink
Quote: JB

That's a good question. Here is my line of reasoning:

1) Tribal casinos are only allowed to offer Class III games if the state within which they are located permits Class III gaming

2) There are tribal casinos in NY which offer Class III gaming, therefore NY state somehow permits Class III gaming

3) NY state runs the NY Lottery, and the NY Lottery runs these racinos, therefore the state runs the racinos

4) Since the state both permits Class III gaming and runs the racinos, I see no reason why they can't offer Class III gaming at them.

The table games page on the Resorts World web site says that they have single-zero (electronic) games "offering guests better winning odds than traditional double-zero roulette." This certainly makes it sound like it functions just like a physical roulette table, which would be Class III.



It is amazing how technology is changing the casino business.

With the Electronic Table Games (ETGs) you don't need live dealers any more.

Even with the singe zero the e- Roulette it is an "unbelievable cash cow" to quote S. Adelson. You get 60 rounds per hour instead of the 10 rounds at a live table.

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