only1choice
only1choice
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June 15th, 2012 at 5:33:18 AM permalink
How about a little change of pace, no gay talk, politics, undocumented aliens etc, etc.

Let me preface this by saying I am a met fan. Watch this play. It would have been a bang-bang play at first. It could have been scored an error. However it CANNOT be reversed. And probably won't.

http://mlb.mlb.com/video/play.jsp?content_id=22271383
IF YOU PLAY "PLAY TO WIN"
WongBo
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June 15th, 2012 at 5:48:05 AM permalink
yes, it was an error.
he should have remembered that he is a gold glove award winner,
not a golden hand.
he definitely had enough time to glove it.

edit: it took a lot of courage for you to come out
as a mets fan
In a bet, there is a fool and a thief. - Proverb.
Gabes22
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June 15th, 2012 at 5:54:07 AM permalink
That is one of those 50/50 calls. It was a slow hit ground ball and the reason it was probably ruled a hit was because there was a decent shot the runner would have made it to first base safely. That being said, even if you are in the "error" camp, as a Met fan isn't this like evening things out for Johann Santana's no hitter a few weeks ago, when there was a ball ruled foul that was fair and would have been at least a double.
A flute with no holes is not a flute, a donut with no holes is a danish
only1choice
only1choice
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June 15th, 2012 at 5:56:52 AM permalink
Thats why I love this game. Let the call stand.
IF YOU PLAY "PLAY TO WIN"
WongBo
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June 15th, 2012 at 6:09:54 AM permalink
it was not a slow hit ground ball.
look at the video again,
it was a chop that was bouncing.
In a bet, there is a fool and a thief. - Proverb.
Gabes22
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June 15th, 2012 at 6:13:50 AM permalink
Ground ball, chop. Same crap, different pile. That ball took quite a while to get down to Wright. The reason it was ruled a hit, like I said earlier is there was a decent chance the runner beats it out had it been fielded cleanly. This is made clear by the fact Wright feels he needs to barehand the ball instead on fielding it with his glove, and transferring it to his hand to throw it. He was clearly trying to eliminate hundreths of a second by any means possible there.
A flute with no holes is not a flute, a donut with no holes is a danish
dwheatley
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June 15th, 2012 at 6:20:57 AM permalink
... Do we really care if the Mets care credited with a no-hitter or not? They won the game. There's no column in the standings for no-hitters. I doubt anyone on the team gets a bonus for one. Or if they do... they don't deserve it for that sloppy play.
Wisdom is the quality that keeps you out of situations where you would otherwise need it
only1choice
only1choice
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June 15th, 2012 at 6:23:37 AM permalink
Quote: dwheatley

... Do we really care if the Mets care credited with a no-hitter or not?



FORGIVE ME, I just wanted to interject a change of pace in the subject matter.
IF YOU PLAY "PLAY TO WIN"
rdw4potus
rdw4potus
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June 15th, 2012 at 6:35:01 AM permalink
Quote: only1choice

However it CANNOT be reversed. And probably won't.



No question that's a error. What makes you say that it cannot be reversed? Can't the official scorer submit a proposed scoring change to the league office within 7 days of the game's conclusion?
"So as the clock ticked and the day passed, opportunity met preparation, and luck happened." - Maurice Clarett
only1choice
only1choice
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June 15th, 2012 at 6:44:41 AM permalink
Quote: rdw4potus

No question that's a error. What makes you say that it cannot be reversed? Can't the official scorer submit a proposed scoring change to the league office within 7 days of the game's conclusion?


They did not reverse this blatant mistake.



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dp8ST0WidfA&feature=related
IF YOU PLAY "PLAY TO WIN"
vendman1
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June 15th, 2012 at 7:09:02 AM permalink
Just FYI, plays are reversed by offical scorers during the game all the time(after a second look on replay for example). But rarely, if ever, after the fact.
Also the play is clearly a hit. The reason Wright barehanded it in the first place is because he knew he had no chance at the runner if he gloved it. It would have taken an exceptional defensive play to get Upton at first. Thats why it's a hit.
WongBo
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June 15th, 2012 at 7:24:34 AM permalink
looking at the video from a different angle,
i now realize that the ball bounced TWICE,
and was likely moving fairly slowly.
so i retract my original contention that this was definitely an error.
i think it is up to the umpires to decide and call it as they see it.
i still think he might have had time to glove it and have a chance at the play.
In a bet, there is a fool and a thief. - Proverb.
Gabes22
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June 15th, 2012 at 7:31:03 AM permalink
Also that guy at the plate, BJ Upton is a fast runner. He has 12 SBs this season, putting him on pace for between 30 and 35 this year
A flute with no holes is not a flute, a donut with no holes is a danish
thecesspit
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June 15th, 2012 at 8:02:26 AM permalink
Annoyingly I cant find a clip showing the runner... how close was he to the base when the fielder missed the play?
"Then you can admire the real gambler, who has neither eaten, slept, thought nor lived, he has so smarted under the scourge of his martingale, so suffered on the rack of his desire for a coup at trente-et-quarante" - Honore de Balzac, 1829
Gabes22
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June 15th, 2012 at 8:07:55 AM permalink
I can't find one either, but judging by the evidence anecdotelly in the video. It taks a fast runner like Upton about 4.3 seconds to get down the first base line from the point of contact. Where the ball goes off his hand, is about 3 seconds from contact. So best case scenario, he has 1.3 seconds to field, cock his arm and throw the ball covering 120 feet on the money. 55mph is approximately 80 ft/sec. So to get the ball there in 1 second the ball would have to be thrown between 80-85 mph, leaving just 0.3 seconds to field the ball and get rid of it.
A flute with no holes is not a flute, a donut with no holes is a danish
WongBo
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June 15th, 2012 at 8:17:24 AM permalink
you are right.
he definitely should have bare-handed it.
i think he took his eye off the ball too soon.
i can see why they awarded this as a hit,
but i can also see why some would call it an error.
In a bet, there is a fool and a thief. - Proverb.
slyther
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June 15th, 2012 at 8:30:14 AM permalink
Per Rule 10 the Official Scorer gets 24 hours to change/update any scoring decisions. No one else can make changes. Once in a while you will hear about a manager brow-beating an official scorer to change a ruling after a game, particularly if he has a player who is in a slump, etc.

Personally I would have ruled it E5, but I'm not a member of the BBWAA so I don't get a say in the matter.

By ruling it a Hit, the scorer is essentially saying that the only way the play could have been made successfully is if it was barehanded successfully, which is no easy feat. You often see similar rulings when the 3rd baseman has to charge in and try to barehand a ball and miss.
rdw4potus
rdw4potus
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June 15th, 2012 at 9:41:53 AM permalink
Quote: slyther


Personally I would have ruled it E5, but I'm not a member of the BBWAA so I don't get a say in the matter.



Are the scorers members of the BBWAA? I'd never thought of them as writers before, but I suppose they do write a version of the story of the game.
"So as the clock ticked and the day passed, opportunity met preparation, and luck happened." - Maurice Clarett
s2dbaker
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June 15th, 2012 at 10:04:38 AM permalink
The way R.A.Dickey is pitching (are you certain this isn't a gay thread?) this season, he may not need any reviews to get his no-hitter.
Someday, joor goin' to see the name of Googie Gomez in lights and joor goin' to say to joorself, "Was that her?" and then joor goin' to answer to joorself, "That was her!" But you know somethin' mister? I was always her yuss nobody knows it! - Googie Gomez
WongBo
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June 15th, 2012 at 10:09:51 AM permalink
of course this is a gay thread.
it's sports: the ultimate sublimation of aggression and homosexual desire.
j/k
In a bet, there is a fool and a thief. - Proverb.
thecesspit
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June 15th, 2012 at 10:34:32 AM permalink
I think the MLB needs to investigate the number of no hitters this year and the last. Baseball that is pitching duels is a bit of a curate's egg.
"Then you can admire the real gambler, who has neither eaten, slept, thought nor lived, he has so smarted under the scourge of his martingale, so suffered on the rack of his desire for a coup at trente-et-quarante" - Honore de Balzac, 1829
mrjjj
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June 15th, 2012 at 10:45:05 AM permalink
What pisses me off, thats what the chalk on the ground IS FOR. When they can clearly SEE a ball imprint on the chalk......FAIR BALL.

Ken
98Clubs
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June 16th, 2012 at 2:07:55 AM permalink
No, it was a scorer's judgement call. The probability of a conventional fielded play was at best with a perfect throw 50/50.
The scorer made the correct call "Tough chance base hit." Wright made the best play he could, and again it was at very best 50/50.
Lets take the Humans out of the game except for the Players/Managers. NO, NOT.

I am a Mets fan since '65. Now Gallaraga's perfecto spoiled is totally diferent, and is a blown call. No excuse for that, and I feel it should have been overturned by the Commissioner using very special language.
Some people need to reimagine their thinking.
98Clubs
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June 16th, 2012 at 2:16:42 AM permalink
Quote:

I think the MLB needs to investigate the number of no hitters this year and the last. Baseball that is pitching duels is a bit of a curate's egg.



This just in... it seems that testing has scared off a few dozen hitters. Pitchers are taking advantage
Some people need to reimagine their thinking.
RonC
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June 16th, 2012 at 2:25:17 AM permalink
Quote: 98Clubs

No, it was a scorer's judgement call. The probability of a conventional fielded play was at best with a perfect throw 50/50.
The scorer made the correct call "Tough chance base hit." Wright made the best play he could, and again it was at very best 50/50.
Lets take the Humans out of the game except for the Players/Managers. NO, NOT.



This call, as noted above, could have been changed by the scorer or by the League President.

"The official scorer shall make all decisions concerning judgment calls within 24 hours after a game concludes or is suspended. A player or club may request that the League President review a judgment call of an official scorer made in a game in which such player or club participated, by notifying the League President in writing or by approved electronic means within 24 hours of the conclusion or suspension of such game, or within 24 hours of the official scorerís call, in the event the official scorer changes a call within 24 hours after a game concludes or is suspended, as provided in this Rule 10.01(a). "

Official RulesExample


Quote: 98Clubs

I am a Mets fan since '65. Now Gallaraga's perfecto spoiled is totally diferent, and is a blown call. No excuse for that, and I feel it should have been overturned by the Commissioner using very special language.



While it was a horrid call, there is no "real" method to overturn it save him doing something like you have suggested. It is too bad he lost a perfect game on a blown call but, without expansion of replay, calls by umpires that are in error will stand.
mrjjj
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June 18th, 2012 at 1:01:22 PM permalink
Its kind of like the narrow YELLOW fencing for home runs. Its there for a REASON, correct? On one side, a HR....the other side, not a HR.....if it hits the YELLOW, its a HR. This isn't tough fellas.

The chalk is there for a REASON.

TERRIBLE, TERRIBLE.....call.

A no hitter? (LMAO) Hell no.

Ken
slyther
slyther
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June 19th, 2012 at 8:23:08 AM permalink
Quote: rdw4potus

Are the scorers members of the BBWAA? I'd never thought of them as writers before, but I suppose they do write a version of the story of the game.



Oops I stand corrected, it appears the BBWAA membership is no longer required. (Originally the official scorers were the local beat writers, etc)

I learned how to score games at a very young age for my dad's fastpitch softball team. I never had to 'prove' the box score though so I never learned that skill. I imagine computers do that now.

I applied to be a Stats Stringer for the Seattle Mariners one summer but did not get a call back.
thecesspit
thecesspit
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June 19th, 2012 at 9:33:06 AM permalink
Quote: mrjjj

Its kind of like the narrow YELLOW fencing for home runs. Its there for a REASON, correct? On one side, a HR....the other side, not a HR.....if it hits the YELLOW, its a HR. This isn't tough fellas.

The chalk is there for a REASON.

TERRIBLE, TERRIBLE.....call.

A no hitter? (LMAO) Hell no.

Ken



Bad calls happen. It's the human part of the game. It was a terrible call. But if automate everything, is it still the same game? Players drop catches, umpires drop decisions.

Not as terrible as Galarraga being robbed of his perfect game :

http://detroit.tigers.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20100602&content_id=10727590&vkey=recap&fext=.jsp&c_id=det
"Then you can admire the real gambler, who has neither eaten, slept, thought nor lived, he has so smarted under the scourge of his martingale, so suffered on the rack of his desire for a coup at trente-et-quarante" - Honore de Balzac, 1829
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